Ram question

[Jason 57]

Planning my next upgrade. 

I wanted to go 64GB since I do workload work more than gaming.

which is more important,

High speed (thinking of 3600)

or lower CAS latency?

 

Most likely getting a Ryzen 5 3600 for my CPU. 

 

i appreciate the feedback. 

[Haro]

15 minutes ago, Jason 57 said:

High speed (thinking of 3600)

or lower CAS latency

High speeds compared to what?

And what cas latency ?

[Bombastinator]

My limited understanding is speed narrowly trumps cas but there is a limit.  I base this on me noticing that cas has gone up with speed but machines get faster.  It’s not a one or the other thing.  If it was they wouldn’t display both.

[SH0607]

Ryzen does benefit from higher memory speeds (to a certain degree, I certainly wouldn't waste my money on a 4000Mhz kit for an R5 3600), and you can definitely get (assuming we weren't in the midst of a pandemic) a good high speed kit for reasonable prices...

I'm not sure how much you'd notice the difference, for example, between C16 and C18 on a daily basis, but I guess that depends on the workload.

It's really a budget and purpose question, how much can you spend? what are you working with? (I think 3600 C18 is good on a tighter budget, but you could go for C16, or tighten the timings yourself)

I wouldn't spend money on anything better than 3600 CL16 though, unless you decide on a more powerful CPU (and therefore a higher-end system in general).

 

*I would make sure that whatever you get is compatible/ tested for Ryzen, just for peace of mind. you can run the model number here:

https://www.amd.com/en/products/ryzen-compatible-memory/ready-for-3rd-gen-amd-ryzen

You should also run the memory by the motherboard manufacturer's Qualified Vendors List, to make sure it's been tested.

 

**I'll note that most of what I said here mostly comes from watching Linus, Gamers Nexus, Paul's Hardware and others.... not from personal experience.

 

[Haro]

Just now, SH0607 said:

I'm not sure how much you'd notice the difference, for example, between C16 and C18 on a daily basis, but I guess that depends on the workload

Depends.

For example

3200 at cl 16 will perform about the same as cl 18 

It depends on what cas latency we're comparing and what frequency.

[Bombastinator]

2 minutes ago, SH0607 said:

Ryzen does benefit from higher memory speeds (to a certain degree, I certainly wouldn't waste my money on a 4000Mhz kit for an R5 3600), and you can definitely get (assuming we weren't in the midst of a pandemic) a good high speed kit for reasonable prices...

I'm not sure how much you'd notice the difference, for example, between C16 and C18 on a daily basis, but I guess that depends on the workload.

It's really a budget and purpose question, how much can you spend? what are you working with? (I think 3600 C18 is good on a tighter budget, but you could go for C16, or tighten the timings yourself)

I wouldn't spend money on anything better than 3600 CL16 though, unless you decide on a more powerful CPU (and therefore a higher-end system in general).

 

*I would make sure that whatever you get is compatible/ tested for Ryzen, just for peace of mind. you can run the model number here:

https://www.amd.com/en/products/ryzen-compatible-memory/ready-for-3rd-gen-amd-ryzen

You should also run the memory by the motherboard manufacturer's Qualified Vendors List, to make sure it's been tested.

 

**I'll note that most of what I said here mostly comes from watching Linus, Gamers Nexus, Paul's Hardware and others.... not from personal experience.

 

4000mhz memory has a different problem with ryzen revolving around infinity fabric stepping speeds.  3600 is as fast as you want to go with ryzen2 currently.  I understand the stepping thing can be overcome with higher speed memory, but one has to get well past 5000mhz to make that happen.

[SH0607]

1 minute ago, TofuHaroto said:

Depends.

For example

3200 at cl 16 will perform about the same as cl 18 

It depends on what cas latency we're comparing and what frequency.

For argument's sake, 3600MHz is the frequency, since he did mention it.
and as @Bombastinator pointed out, that would be the highest to really get for ryzen becasue of the inf. fabric coupling, which I'm hardly an expert on, and also forgot about

so yeah, 3600

[SH0607]

6 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

ryzen2

Also, I don't want to be an ass... but do you mean Ryzen 2000 or Zen 2 architecture (Ryzen 3000)? It would be good to know, for future reference

[Bombastinator]

4 minutes ago, SH0607 said:

Also, I don't want to be an ass... but do you mean Ryzen 2000 or Zen 2 architecture (Ryzen 3000)? It would be good to know, for future reference

I meant the chips labeled ryzen2 which would be 3000.  You’re not the ass.  Whoever set up the ridiculously confusing ryzen naming scheme is.

[Guest]

57 minutes ago, Jason 57 said:

Planning my next upgrade. 

I wanted to go 64GB since I do workload work more than gaming.

which is more important,

High speed (thinking of 3600)

or lower CAS latency?

 

Most likely getting a Ryzen 5 3600 for my CPU. 

 

i appreciate the feedback. 

Since running 64gb at higher frequency is more difficult that running 16gb, you lower your frequenxy expectation.

 

So with that quantity of memory, 64gb, it'll be a head ache trying to run 3600mhz.

 

So my advice is to look for only up to 3200mhz memory kits. And even running this frequency can be sketchy with that much memory installed.

 

Never mind the Infinity Fabric talk here, you wont be running it that high to worry about it when having 64gb of memory installed.

[gloop]

Considering you have a more workload orientated PC, wouldn’t a 3600 be a little underpowered?

[Jason 57]

On 7/4/2020 at 12:39 PM, gloop said:

Considering you have a more workload orientated PC, wouldn’t a 3600 be a little underpowered?

Yes it would be underpowered. But I can only afford so much. Still not positive on my final budget either. It depends on how deep I want to charge my CC. Lol

 

My 2012 build has 32GB of DDR3 at 1833 with a CAS of 16. 

 

The reason for the question is the big difference in price. I can find 32GB 360p kits with C18 or C19 at a decent price. But going to C16 is expensive at that size. 

When I put my son's build together I only out in 16GB of 3200 (I think C18 not C16 like I would have liked) 

Don't get me wrong, I would love to put a Ryzen 7 3700X or 3700XT, but I simply can't go that high. 

And the argument of doing a B450 MB doesn't help me, because I like to have my MB last for years. Typically 6 to 10 if possible, well the 2 have lasted that long per upgrade. Lol

[Estiar]

Somewhat unrelated to OP, But do Intel processors benefit from higher ram speeds?

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, estiar said:

Somewhat unrelated to OP, But do Intel processors benefit from higher ram speeds?

Yes.

[Bombastinator]

Just now, estiar said:

Somewhat unrelated to OP, But do Intel processors benefit from higher ram speeds?

Depends.  Some more than others.  Iirc coffee lake didn’t particularly.  As a rule less than ryzen.  The latest ones don’t have some of the effective limits on top speed ryzen’s infinity fabric imposes so they can use 4000mhz memory while ryzen is effectively performance limited to 3600mhz (or 5000 which isn’t out yet) 

[Jason 57]

I really appreciate the help with this everyone! It has my build juices flowing again! LOL

 

Now to decide, do I get rid of the optical drive in my new build.

If I do, I have about 70 DVDs and Blu-rays to copy and convert first! LOL

Hence the whole reason why I need to upgrade!

 

It is literally just a circle problem to solve.

 

And with no supply, why bother.

[Haro]

10 hours ago, estiar said:

Somewhat unrelated to OP, But do Intel processors benefit from higher ram speeds?

Even tho there's one CCD 

There is still latency.

[Jason 57]

So it would seem, with Linus' video from last night about his personal rig upgrade again! LMAO

 

That lower CAS latency would be better than higher frequency for memory.

 

So looks like I will keep with the C16 at 3200

Or if I could find some C14, that would be even better. Of course I don't think I could afford it.

[Jason 57]

On ‎7‎/‎4‎/‎2020 at 11:16 AM, Bombastinator said:

4000mhz memory has a different problem with ryzen revolving around infinity fabric stepping speeds.  3600 is as fast as you want to go with ryzen2 currently.  I understand the stepping thing can be overcome with higher speed memory, but one has to get well past 5000mhz to make that happen.

And since I can only afford <4000, and don't have manufacture's giving me high end samples to test.

Also, to see what goes on sale at time of purchase for my equipment. Because I know if I buy it on sale now, and it dips further, then I will hate myself for spending early.

Don't get me wrong, my money burns a hole in my pocket, once I have made a decision. But I want to do this right. (technically I think this would be build #12? in 25 years of building/computer hardware love/obsession.