RX5700XT vs RTX 2080 vs RTX 2080 Super

[Princess Luna]

Hello there!

 

So here is the situation(US Market), a gaming specific build aiming 3440x1440p100hz which of these cards would you go for?

 

Right now you can find discounted vanilla 2080's down to 650$ and it should still go down a little bit more I believe,

 

The 2080 Super FE is 699$ which is decent enough, kinda hard get one in stock at nVidia though it's looking like, but that should still push decent models at 699$ as well specially after this initial first two weeks.

 

RX5700XT is this amazing value card that can go many ways still, maybe aftermarket cards are decent enough priced and OC'ing really manages to push it to be on pair with the 2080... these might even push the reference card price lower who knows, one way or another I only see value getting better when aftermarket happens for it.

 

The desire is obviously keep as much eye candy as possible but often try to keep above 75fps on all games taking advantage of the monitor's FreeSync. As much as I would like to go 2080 Ti... saw a seahawk going for 1k round up, very tempting but it'd blow up the system budget.

 

Oh yes, just to make sure I am not interested on the Radeon 7, I know it's on the pricepoint and it's an amazing card if you have use for its workstation side however this PC is really only for gaming.

[Jurrunio]

Spoiler

Titan V:

I'd wait till 2080S gets some real pricing before picking between 2080 and 2080S. Navi seems to show worse performance drop off as resolution increases relative to Turing cards (basically the opposite architectural advantages and disadvantages of GCN) so unless there's a RX 5800 coming up I dont see the point for Navi at this resolution.

[WallacEngineering]

@Princess Luna

This comparison makes no sense.

 

The RX 5700 and XT compare and compete with the RTX 2060 and RTX 2070 as well as their Super editions as all 6 of these cards are in the same "tier" or group with somewhat similar pricing and performance. Nvidia has RT and AMD has far better overclocking. The end, its that simple.

 

What makes this comparison weird is that the RTX 2080 and RTX 2080-Super are in a totally different "class" of price and performance, with the 2080-S now making the standard 2080 a pointless purchase as the other Super cards have. Nobody wanting to spend $700 on a GPU is going to consider an RX 5700 or XT lol.

 

While my new thread below shows that the RX 5700-XT is capable of Ultra-Wide 3440x1440p gaming at high settings with good frame rates, it is NOT recommend for 4K 3440x2160p gaming where as the 2080-S is recommended for that resolution.

 

So if ur gaming at either aspect ratio of 1440p, the AMD cards present a more affordable option. But 4K? Your only real options are the 2080-S or 2080 TI.

 

 

[xAcid9]

Maybe you should consider 2070s instead of 5700XT for that resolution, so far 5700XT only look promising at 1080p. 

 

I mean if you compare it to Radeon VII, at 1080p it only 2.5% slower but at 4K it 12% slower.

 

1080p

Spoiler

4K

Spoiler

Radeon VII scale linearly compare to 2080S AMP Extereme on 3 all resolutions. 

[MMKing]

I would give it a couple months. Check out the offerings from MSI, Sapphire and other board partners.

[Princess Luna]

10 hours ago, Jurrunio said:

Titan V:

Trust me she's alright hehehe, the one crying is the 1080 Ti as she'll be the one being replaced... I'm shifting my current personal gaming rig to the living room for couch gaming/HTPC for everyone else and I plan to put together a brand new gaming rig for my bedroom.

11 hours ago, Jurrunio said:

so unless there's a RX 5800 coming up I dont see the point for Navi at this resolution.

I suppose I just didn't want to seem too much of an elitist and completely disregard the 5700XT because the card does show a lot of potential but the more I looked about this the more I realized that it would hold me back, specially as I'm coming from the 1080 Ti it's a sad reality AMD got nothing for me...

 

Even the 2080 Super end up being disappointing performance wise and as per Hardware Unboxed 35 games average it's only 9% faster than the 1080 Ti... Could still watercool that FE for extra OC and match the 2080 Super stock... The 1080 Ti is very good for my display but being able to go back ultra'ing stuff is an idea I fancy and the more I thought about it the more I end up shifted to this one time deal on a MSi Seahawk RTX 2080 Ti for 999$ msrp.

 

10 hours ago, WallacEngineering said:

. But 4K? Your only real options are the 2080-S or 2080 TI.

Never mentioned 4k... my screen as per OP is 3440x1440p100hz, but like I said above I just thought the 5700XT aftermarket might have been close enough to the 1080 Ti to where I wouldn't mind, but in the end I decided to stick with nVidia and afford the premium tax.

 

8 hours ago, xAcid9 said:

I mean if you compare it to Radeon VII, at 1080p it only 2.5% slower but at 4K it 12% slower.

Yes I realized this trend as per @Jurrunio also mentioned, the 5700XT doesn't like high resolutions and even though 3440x1440p is not 4k it's still pretty much the closest to it... I originallly wanted to make a value purchase but the more I cracked my head around this the more I end up shifting to "you know what lets just pick the best and thats it"

 

7 hours ago, MMKing said:

I would give it a couple months.

Ah nah I waited enough already, now that I'm living with my boyfriend and a common friend the couch gaming PC for living room for us and other friends to come over is more required than ever

 

11 hours ago, Queen Chrysallis said:

you have more self control than i do lol

Funny thing is that in the end you're right... I just decided to screw it and I bought the discounted $999.99 RTX 2080 Ti MSi Seahawk lol... ultras here I go.

[WallacEngineering]

On 7/24/2019 at 6:51 AM, Princess Luna said:

Never mentioned 4k... my screen as per OP is 3440x1440p100hz, but like I said above I just thought the 5700XT aftermarket might have been close enough to the 1080 Ti to where I wouldn't mind, but in the end I decided to stick with nVidia and afford the premium tax.

Yea its just good to cover all of the bases. Yea if you wanted to max out that 100hz display then be glad you went with the monster 2080 TI card.

 

Being able to have no compromises at all will be nice. That and you wont need to upgrade for many years to come.

[WallacEngineering]

On 7/23/2019 at 10:00 PM, xAcid9 said:

Maybe you should consider 2070s instead of 5700XT for that resolution, so far 5700XT only look promising at 1080p. 

 

I mean if you compare it to Radeon VII, at 1080p it only 2.5% slower but at 4K it 12% slower.

 

1080p

  Reveal hidden contents

4K

  Reveal hidden contents

Radeon VII scale linearly compare to 2080S AMP Extereme on 3 all resolutions. 

Not sure why you say that the XT is only good for 1920x1080p when its clearly capable of 2560x1440p Ultra at 70-80 FPS in nearly all cases and will shoot over 100 FPS with a few small settings tweaks down to "High". And these aren't even the titles that favor AMD lol.

 

As my linked thread earlier shows, its even capable of a smooth experience at 3440x1440p high settings, but I would recommend Overclocking the card at this point to really make it a fully desirable experience with better 1% lows.

 

The RX 5700-XT is hardly any slower than the RTX 2070-S. We all know this already, they are both 1440p gaming cards. Im not sure why people still don't understand this. If a card can hold a stable frame rate over 60 FPS with 1% lows at or above 50 FPS, then the card is a perfectly reasonable choice designed for that game at that resolution and those settings. Its as simple as that.

 

I mean Im currently 2560x1440p gaming at medium/high settings on a MSI Twin Frozr GTX 980 4GB and Im getting 70-80 FPS. I mean yea it could do High settings with a drop of a few frames but the VRAM is the problem. So even the GTX 980 is VERY NEARLY a promising 1440p card and its about 40% slower than the XT with 25% less cores lol.

[xAcid9]

1 hour ago, WallacEngineering said:

Not sure why you say that the XT is only good for 1920x1080p when its clearly capable of 2560x1440p Ultra at 70-80 FPS in nearly all cases and will shoot over 100 FPS with a few small settings tweaks down to "High". And these aren't even the titles that favor AMD lol.

What i meant was the 2070S is the more capable card at that resolution and also when i commented that i saw this 2070S for $535. https://bit.ly/2K0vbs2

For $135 more you get better thermal, noise and better performance >1440p + free games. 

[Jon Jon]

On 7/24/2019 at 7:51 AM, Princess Luna said:

Funny thing is that in the end you're right... I just decided to screw it and I bought the discounted $999.99 RTX 2080 Ti MSi Seahawk lol... ultras here I go.

WOW! That's a crazy good price!

[WallacEngineering]

8 hours ago, xAcid9 said:

What i meant was the 2070S is the more capable card at that resolution and also when i commented that i saw this 2070S for $535. https://bit.ly/2K0vbs2

For $135 more you get better thermal, noise and better performance >1440p + free games. 

Ya but in 3 weeks when custom XT cards launch they will be a WAY better value. That and when both cards are overclocked the XT actually beats the 2070-S because it can OC so much farther so...

[xAcid9]

1 hour ago, WallacEngineering said:

Ya but in 3 weeks when custom XT cards launch they will be a WAY better value.

We don't know what the AIB price will be, they might see this as an opportunity to raise the price because the performance is better than expected. 

 

Right now with 2 free games on 2070s, it actually better value if it cost <$150 extra. Upcoming AAA games mind you, not some older game that already have some huge price cut. 

1 hour ago, WallacEngineering said:

That and when both cards are overclocked the XT actually beats the 2070-S because it can OC so much farther so...

Most XT already boost around 1.9ghz similar to 2070s, currently i view both card to have similar clock per clock and overclock performance. 

[WallacEngineering]

6 hours ago, xAcid9 said:

We don't know what the AIB price will be, they might see this as an opportunity to raise the price because the performance is better than expected. 

 

Right now with 2 free games on 2070s, it actually better value if it cost <$150 extra. Upcoming AAA games mind you, not some older game that already have some huge price cut. 

Most XT already boost around 1.9ghz similar to 2070s, currently i view both card to have similar clock per clock and overclock performance. 

Well I guess you haven't heard the news then. Toms hardware figured out how to remove the power limitation. And even with the same mod on the 2070-S, it doesn't even come close.

 

The power limit mod allows the XT to reach 2.2-2.3GHz depending on your luck in the silicon lottery, making the XT nearly match even an overclocked RTX 2080 (NON-Super).

 

But yea Ill obviously admit that free games is always nice. What if you play other types of games tho and aren't much interested in modern AAA titles? Im not really into AAA, I like clever games like From the Depths and Kerbal Space Program. If you ask me COD has literally been the same exact game that maybe gets a new skin once a year for the past decade. I finally picked up Black Ops 4 last year because of the changes to Zombies and its the first COD I have purchased in 6 years lol. And even with the changes it still feels the same lol.

 

See the thread for more information on XT power limit mod with a benchmark:

 

 

[Shin-Gouki]

Yeah the AMD Cards are on par with the 2060 and 2070 cards. Comparing them with a 2080 is a complete mismatch. 

[xAcid9]

7 hours ago, WallacEngineering said:

Well I guess you haven't heard the news then. Toms hardware figured out how to remove the power limitation. And even with the same mod on the 2070-S, it doesn't even come close.

 

The power limit mod allows the XT to reach 2.2-2.3GHz depending on your luck in the silicon lottery, making the XT nearly match even an overclocked RTX 2080 (NON-Super).

 

But yea Ill obviously admit that free games is always nice. What if you play other types of games tho and aren't much interested in modern AAA titles? Im not really into AAA, I like clever games like From the Depths and Kerbal Space Program. If you ask me COD has literally been the same exact game that maybe gets a new skin once a year for the past decade. I finally picked up Black Ops 4 last year because of the changes to Zombies and its the first COD I have purchased in 6 years lol. And even with the changes it still feels the same lol.

Both free games will have RTX support so buyers don't need to waste more of their money just to buy game with this niche feature. kek. 

OP already decided on 2080 Ti anyway. lol

I might've missed that thread. /s

2.2ghz-2.3ghz? Empty

Spoiler

 

 

Gamer Nexus video on slapping a hybrid cooler + overclocking + power play mod. SOTTR 1440p

 

Hardwareunboxed video on overclocking to 2.1ghz with a sexy af EK waterblock. SOTTR 1440p

 

 

 

[MeatFeastMan]

Just get 5700XT. At $400 who cares whether you'll lose performance when you go up resolutions. 2080 Super costs 75% more, it's simply not worth it. You should be in the ballpark of 60fps at ultra on most games (Other than maybe Assasins Creed Odyssey and garbage like that). You can easily reach that 100hz at low/medium, and even ultra on older games or esports titles.

 

The 2080 Super just doesn't pull far enough ahead to be worth buying. It's what...20% at best? $300 for 20%, I don't think so. 2070 Super is still an option but even that should only really be considered if you really really really really really need ray tracing or cuda cores. Otherwise it just doesn't compete from a value perspective.

 

 

[aisle9]

So, grand scheme of things because I keep seeing different answers for this. I want to play older games in 4k ultra, prettified, all that. When I say "older", I mean stuff like Skyrim, Far Cry 4, Fallout 4, Cities: Skylines, GTA 5, Witcher 3 and Rust. If I have to tune down the superfluous prettification for some of those games and just go with stock high or ultra, fine. I'd like to have the door open to play more modern titles at 4k high/medium, and at 1440p ultra/high. Elder Scrolls 6 is a big one for me, because I know I'll want at the very least 1440p ultra out of it, maybe 4k high.

 

My previous approach had been wait for the custom AIB 5700 XT cards to show up, grab one of those, and be good for 2-3 years. The 2070S is also within the realm of reason. I do not have the scratch for a 2080S right now, let alone a 2080 Ti, and I don't anticipate having that kind of money lying around anytime soon unless I want my soon to be ex-wife crawling down my back about why I dropped $400+reward points on a graphics card when we'd only discussed the $300+reward points mark previously.

[WallacEngineering]

1 hour ago, xAcid9 said:

Both free games will have RTX support so buyers don't need to waste more of their money just to buy game with this niche feature. kek. 

OP already decided on 2080 Ti anyway. lol

Ya I know and yea nothing compares to the RTX 2080 TI and we all know that, but its still fun to discuss GPUs.

 

Little bit surprising that they only managed 2.1 GHz when there has already been several 2.2 and 2.3 GHz successes. I figured Gamers Nexus would get one of the best OCs but I guess he lost the silicon lottery, which sucks.

 

Ya I think RTX is still entirely useless. I don't really want it. I want support on like 50% of modern titles and I want to be able to enable it and not completely tank my FPS, so I just don't see the point, at all.

 

It makes your game look better yes, but it's not enough to notice as you are actually playing the game. Yea if you run off in a scene and take time to admire the details, then yes the difference becomes obvious; but actually playing the game? Not really. You basically cut your FPS nearly in half for some better lighting and reflections. Woopdie-freaking-doo, not worth it. Ill take a resolution bump or settings bump over RT any day of the week.

 

Ill give RT 3-5 years to mature and get refined and optimized. Once it can run with far less of a performance hit, I might consider trying it out at that point.

[xAcid9]

1 hour ago, WallacEngineering said:

Little bit surprising that they only managed 2.1 GHz when there has already been several 2.2 and 2.3 GHz successes. I figured Gamers Nexus would get one of the best OCs but I guess he lost the silicon lottery, which sucks.

2.3Ghz? Where? 

Most i've seen is around 2.1Ghz. Some with stock blower and some with custom mod cooler. I feel like both Radeon VII and Navi hit similar frequency wall like Pascal and Turing around 2.1Ghz.

1 hour ago, WallacEngineering said:

Ya I think RTX is still entirely useless. I don't really want it. I want support on like 50% of modern titles and I want to be able to enable it and not completely tank my FPS, so I just don't see the point, at all.

Agree but..

1 hour ago, WallacEngineering said:

It makes your game look better yes, but it's not enough to notice as you are actually playing the game. Yea if you run off in a scene and take time to admire the details, then yes the difference becomes obvious; but actually playing the game? Not really. You basically cut your FPS nearly in half for some better lighting and reflections. Woopdie-freaking-doo, not worth it. Ill take a resolution bump or settings bump over RT any day of the week.

It actually noticeable especially in games that have bad ambient occlusion or shadow. I don't really care about reflection but having improper or poor ambient occlusion and shadow really ruin the immersion. Ray tracing is expensive so performance drop is expected.  

 

I actually waiting for Reshade ray tracing to be public so i can enable it in some older games. Although Reshade already have a good MXAO but i think this RT shader will bring it to another level. It's only screen space path tracing but good enough for me. 

 

 

 

 

 

[WallacEngineering]

22 hours ago, xAcid9 said:

2.3Ghz? Where? 

Most i've seen is around 2.1Ghz. Some with stock blower and some with custom mod cooler. I feel like both Radeon VII and Navi hit similar frequency wall like Pascal and Turing around 2.1Ghz.

Well if you take a look at my thread that I linked talking about the Max OC of the 5700XT beating the Max OC of the 2070-S, you will see in the video that people have reported 2.3GHz, but thats if you won the silicon lottery. Most people can get to around 2.2 GHz fairly safely on good cooling.

 

RDNA is almost an entirely new architecture in comparison to Radeon VII and older so its considerably different in terms of behavior.

 

The results in the video show the XT pushing up to just barely 3-4% under an RTX 2080 thats been overclocked as far as it will go (of course this was NOT a super 2080). So yea, Navi overclocks like a beast if you do it correctly. OC XT Maximum performance gains in Shadow of the Tomb Radier were as high as 19%!!!

 

JaysTwoCents didn't even do the power limit mod when he overclocked his XT. He just stuck the new EK block on and did standard overclocking, I would even call it lazy overclocking. It requires an actual modification to unlock the power limit for 2.2+GHz, you are just going to have to watch the video in my thread to figure it out.

 

EDIT: Ah screw it, here is the video:

 

 

[xAcid9]

3 hours ago, WallacEngineering said:

Well if you take a look at my thread that I linked talking about the Max OC of the 5700XT beating the Max OC of the 2070-S, you will see in the video that people have reported 2.3GHz, but thats if you won the silicon lottery. Most people can get to around 2.2 GHz fairly safely on good cooling.

There was zero mention about people getting 2.3ghz in that video, it only show 2.3ghz "target core clock" but Igor's barely get 2.2Ghz like shown in his frequency chart. Video mentioned that too. 

3 hours ago, WallacEngineering said:

The results in the video show the XT pushing up to just barely 3-4% under an RTX 2080 thats been overclocked as far as it will go (of course this was NOT a super 2080). So yea, Navi overclocks like a beast if you do it correctly. OC XT Maximum performance gains in Shadow of the Tomb Radier were as high as 19%!!!

Watch the video again, 2080 is not overclocked and it didn't beat 2080 like mentioned in that video. In GNexus video it show 2070s is 4% faster at 1080p but 8% faster at 1440p which support my original post in this thread, 2070s performance scale better the higher the resolution compare to 5700 series. 

 

 

Anyway this is off topic now since OP already decided on 2080Ti, if you want to continue the discussion just tag me in your thread. 

[Dacien]

On 7/25/2019 at 10:40 AM, xAcid9 said:

What i meant was the 2070S is the more capable card at that resolution and also when i commented that i saw this 2070S for $535. https://bit.ly/2K0vbs2

For $135 more you get better thermal, noise and better performance >1440p + free games. 

Honestly $135 is actually quite a lot for the slight increase over the 5700XT. Noise and thermals need to be very important to a person in order to justify the cost, particularly when a simple repaste helps a lot.

 

Free games come with the 5700XT also so that's not a factor (Xbox for PC).

[xg32]

A bit late but i've yet to see a 2080 vanilla for 600usd, that's what'd get me to consider one atm, so i'd say it's between the 5700xt and the 2080s (however crappy a deal it is overall it's still better than buying a 2080 imho).

[hollyh88]

dont expect the 5700xt to really reach the 2080 with third party cards, the powertable mod and water cooled oc benchmark that was going around really pushed the 5700xt far.

 

 

Do keep in mind, this is at 1080p you can see that yes the 5700xt shows an impressive feat, it still doesnt touch the rtx 2080 fe (non s).

 

this is about as far as it can really be pushed. personally yeah its amazing but as i said dont expect it to come close with third party cards that are over clocked. 

and since you said "3440x1440p100hz" this feat of the 5700xt means nothing. 

 

i would go for the rtx 2080 super. its expensive but it is the best for that res. 

 

source : 

 

and here is one of the regular 2080 at that res (with ryzen 2600 tho) 

so the 2080 super will have about a 4-8% increase over the 2080 in those benchmarks. 

 

all in all i would suggest the 2080 super.