Yet another, probably terrible idea

[ZcanKal]

Ok, so you know how there has been a trend with motherboards and CPU's to move all the extra chips into the CPU package? there's a CPU, GPU and North bridge in there, and the CPU has small amounts of RAM in there.

I was thinking, more towards Intel but AMD could also do it, putting a small amount of storage on there (optane for Intel.) that you could put a Windows installation on (or any OS) that would be ridiculously quick because it's right there on the CPU, pretty much nothing else would be able to fit but you'd have some amazing boot times.

[Himommies]

1 minute ago, ZcanKal said:

Ok, so you know how there has been a trend with motherboards and CPU's to move all the extra chips into the CPU package? there's a CPU, GPU and North bridge in there, and the CPU has small amounts of RAM in there.

I was thinking, more towards Intel but AMD could also do it, putting a small amount of storage on there (optane for Intel.) that you could put a Windows installation on (or any OS) that would be ridiculously quick because it's right there on the CPU, pretty much nothing else would be able to fit but you'd have some amazing boot times.

Isn't this basically what Qualcomm does

There called system on a chip or SoC's

[Nena Trinity]

Install the OS on the SoC? Phones does it sorta so its probably coming.

[ZcanKal]

1 minute ago, Himommies said:

Isn't this basically what Qualcomm does

There called system on a chip or SoC's

Oh yeah, I forgot that they already did that with ARM chips, I know it wouldn't make much sense for Intel to do it, but why has nobody done it with x86(64)?

[Himommies]

1 minute ago, ZcanKal said:

Oh yeah, I forgot that they already did that with ARM chips, I know it wouldn't make much sense for Intel to do it, but why has nobody done it with x86(64)?

Why would we need too?

Space isn't usally too big of a concern for most manufacturers and laptops with ARM cpu's are in the making,but at this point just buy a tablet or phone

[ZcanKal]

1 minute ago, Himommies said:

Why would we need too?

Space isn't usally too big of a concern for most manufacturers and laptops with ARM cpu's are in the making,but at this point just buy a tablet or phone

On the quest for faster storage, and the quest for chip integration, it would also make ITX builds even smaller. (though, Intel kinda failed on integrating proper graphics until AMD helped them.(

[Radium_Angel]

5 minutes ago, ZcanKal said:

Oh yeah, I forgot that they already did that with ARM chips, I know it wouldn't make much sense for Intel to do it, but why has nobody done it with x86(64)?

What happens when you run out of space? Or need to patch the system, or firmware?

This is all kinds of bad idea.

[knightslugger]

11 minutes ago, ZcanKal said:

amazing boot times.

because 10 seconds is better than 15 just think of all the added productivity! Also, Solid state storage has a finite lifespan of writes. as small as the storage package would have to be, you'd burn through that TBW in no time.

[ZcanKal]

1 minute ago, Radium_Angel said:

What happens when you run out of space? Or need to patch the system, or firmware?

This is all kinds of bad idea.

With how large NAND chips are getting, enough space for Windows 10 probably wouldn't be a problem.
Optane is probably going to be getting bigger soon enough.
Or do you mean physical space?  Because I think Threadripper and modern Xeons have showed us that CPU's can be MUCH bigger.

[ZcanKal]

1 minute ago, knightslugger said:

because 10 seconds is better than 15 just think of all the added productivity! Also, Solid state storage has a finite lifespan of writes. as small as the storage package would have to be, you'd burn through that TBW in no time.

At this point, it screw logic, because speed.

Weren't one of the benefits of Optane that it had a much longer lifespan?  Even with NAND chips, it takes hundreds of terabytes before it gets burnt, and it's only for the OS anyways.

[Fraser Cow]

If you do that you may as well eliminate the socket entirely and just buy a motherboard with the RAM storage and CPU you want. Make desktops like smartphones, one size fits all.

[ZcanKal]

1 minute ago, Fraser Cow said:

If you do that you may as well eliminate the socket entirely and just buy a motherboard with the RAM storage and CPU you want. Make desktops like smartphones, one size fits all.

Or the even better idea that will never happen, Intel and AMD share sockets again.

[KenjiUmino]

SSD/eMMC storage integrated into the CPU ? please, NO !!!!

 

i already hate it when RAM and storage is soldered onto laptop mainboards.

 

good luck with data recovery if that drive decides to crap out.

 

yes it MIGHT make smaller devices possible but how much smaller do you want it?

[ZcanKal]

5 minutes ago, KenjiUmino said:

yes it MIGHT make smaller devices possible but how much smaller do you want it?

I want to play crysis on something the same size as your average electrolytic capacitor, is that too much to ask?


/s

[mariushm]

Can't happen for various reasons.

 

The cpu and gpu dies (the silicon rectangles) are made using a specific manufacturing process very optimized for processors which isn't suitable for making SSD or Optane memory and isn't great for making memory chips (ram, ddr4, ddr5 etc)

 

Flash memory chips and Optance chips are made of silicon dies which are stacked one on top of the other, up to around 64 layers or chips stacked on top of each other, and in the case of ssd on chip devices, the bottom layer is the actual ssd controller die.

 

So if you want to have some storage inside the processor, they'd basically have to go the way AMD went with Vega or the way Intel went with the latest NUC ... with Vega, they have a huge silicon chip that has only the "wires" which make the connections between the gpu chip and the HBM memory chips and the gpu chip and the memory chips are glued on top of that large silicon chip

For the latest NUC, Intel uses a similar technology where there's a "bar" like silicon chip and on one side of the bar all the pins from the processor chip are connected and on the other side of this silicon chip the radeon and hbm memory is connected.

 

Even if you could glue down on such a "interposer" a SSD on chip, this would be very sensitive to the temperature of the processor, if you think about this SSD being under the cpu metal lid and potentially working at 80 degrees Celsius... it's problematic.

Problem is these interposers add cost to processors and people don't want to pay more.

 

Also keep in mind that basically if you have lots of RAM, the operating system caches all the files into ram as soon as they're read, so once the OS is loaded, the ssd doesn't matter that much.

 

[KenjiUmino]

2 minutes ago, ZcanKal said:

I want to play crysis on something the same size as your average electrolytic capacitor, is that too much to ask?


/s

could already be a thing if a modder would try hard enough.

 

filter capacitors used in many guitar/bass tube amps are large enough to fit a compute stick inside.

 

now all we need is a somewhat decent graphics card the size of an m.2 drive so we can shove a dedicated GPU in there along with the compute stick 

 

[ZcanKal]

1 minute ago, KenjiUmino said:

could already be a thing if a modder would try hard enough.

 

filter capacitors used in many guitar/bass tube amps are large enough to fit a compute stick inside.

 

now all we need is a somewhat decent graphics card the size of an m.2 drive so we can shove a dedicated GPU in there along with the compute stick 

 

*cough* Vega 8 *cough*

[KenjiUmino]

Just now, ZcanKal said:

*cough* Vega 8 *cough*

something as powerful as vega 8 on an m.2 stick ? YES PLEASE 

 

i can see it in my head already ...