My experience with Overclocking DDR4 and Locked Skylake SKU's

[MageTank]

Well, Asrock just released their BIOS today to overclock locked Skylake SKU's. I figured I would give it a test, but was a little reluctant because it meant had to lose all the progress made on my DDR4 overclocking. For the sake of science, I gave in and flashed the bios, and took it for a spin. I sat out to overclock my Pentium G4400.

 

4.8ghz booted at 1.39V, and even prime95'd. However, on the stock intel cooler in my ITX case, temps got out of control, and i stopped the test at 90C. I then gave 4.7ghz a shot. Took 1.33V to boot it and run prime95, temps hit 86C under the same load conditions, but overall, it was nice. Problem was, when i started overclocking memory, temps again went beyond 90C. 

 

This time, i gave 4.6ghz a shot. Took me 1.26V to boot into it and run prime95. However, i was able to get close to my old memory clock of 3200mhz, by running 3160mhz (BCLK 139.3). A 39.3% overclock on the G4400. Not bad if I do say so myself, given this chip is on sale for $52 (I paid $70 for it). I thought since i had lost 40mhz on my memory overclock, that it would have a negative impact on my memory performance. Boy, was I shocked when i compared the results. 

 

Before: 3200 CL15-15-15-30-CR1 (All timings tight, including secondary and tertiary)

 

After: 3158 CL15-15-15-30-CR1 (All timings tight, including secondary and tertiary)

 

Apparently, my CPU was too slow before, holding back the memory's potential. After overclocking the CPU, and even losing 42mhz off the memory clock, its bandwidth still improved quite a bit. The latency even lowered down by a whole 3.5ns! 

 

I started toying around with more tests, just to see where this Pentium stands. 

 

Aida 64 Memory Read test:

 

Aida 64 Photoworx: 

 

As you can see, these tiny CPU's can boogie! However, I would not run out and grab them if you are attempting to game on them. They are still just dual cores after all. Besides. You can overclock i3's and locked i5's too. You would be much better off with one of those if gaming was your intention. Let me know what you guys think of these little Pentiums, and DDR4 in general. That latency is lower than most XMP DDR3 kits you see on the market

[TheRandomness]

Stop using prime95. Get Aida64 instead. prime95 put too much voltage through haswell and I wouldn't be surprised if it was the same case with skylake.

[PlayStation 2]

how much money do you have to spend

that's a damn good oc on that pentium tho

[MageTank]

Stop using prime95. Get Aida64 instead. prime95 put too much voltage through haswell and I wouldn't be surprised if it was the same case with skylake.

No. Prime95 was not too much voltage for Haswell. People are just sissies and are afraid of a little AVX2 and FMA3. If you set your voltage to fixed and not adaptive, and keep it cool, Haswell will run Prime95 just fine. Source? I've been running Prime95 and custom Linpacks for years now, no issues and no fried chips. Also, Skylake can run Prime95 on adaptive just fine, voltage regulation has changed since Haswell.

 

 

how much money do you have to spend

that's a damn good oc on that pentium tho

This ITX board cost me $165 (It was on sale for $130 after i bought it) and the chip cost me $70 (It's now on sale for $52). You can get a normal, non-ITX Z170 board for $100 though, without paying the ITX premium. 

[Senzelian]

People are just sissies and are afraid of a little AVX2 and FMA3.

What do you mean with that exactly?

I just looked a bit into what AVX2 and FMA3 actually are. My knowledge of these features is by far not as large as yours.

[MageTank]

What do you mean with that exactly?

I just looked a bit into what AVX2 and FMA3 actually are. My knowledge of these features is by far not as large as yours.

AVX2 and FMA3 are what causes Haswell to get really REALLY hot in Prime95. People will often use stress tests that do not use these instruction sets, because it makes them feel better. "I'm cinebench stable" is like saying "I couldn't pass prime95, but i feel better knowing i passed this". After all, if you want to be able to claim true 100% stability, you have to do it under the most brutal loads. 

[Senzelian]

AVX2 and FMA3 are what causes Haswell to get really REALLY hot in Prime95. People will often use stress tests that do not use these instruction sets, because it makes them feel better. "I'm cinebench stable" is like saying "I couldn't pass prime95, but i feel better knowing i passed this". After all, if you want to be able to claim true 100% stability, you have to do it under the most brutal loads.

Thanks, that helped a lot!

Btw.: Nice work with your Pentium

[MageTank]

Slight update! I just finished 8 hours of Prime95 blend, and it has proven to be stable so far. 

 

 

Before anyone says it, yes, the temps are extremely high. I already know this, and there are many factors as to why its so hot. First of all, i am using a stock intel heatsink and stock thermal paste. Secondly, it's in an Azza Z ITX case. Thirdly, i am running a synthetic stress test on it, in which i will NEVER produce this level of heat under normal usage. Lastly, i am running at 1.3Vcore. There is not a doubt in my mind that I can get this thing to be stable at 1.27Vcore, maybe even 1.26. I increased the Vcore before hand, in anticipation of overclocking my ram to ensure it would not fail. Now that i have a profile that I know is stable, i will continue to lower both the CPU and DRAM voltages until they are stable and running cool. I can guarantee that temps will not exceed 80C by the time i am finished.

 

That being said, I would like to warn people that may be intending to overclock locked i3's or i5's after seeing this thread. Pentium's do not have AVX2 instruction sets. Core i3's, i5's, and i7's do. If you attempt to run the same kind of OC i am, on the same type of cooling, using Prime95, I promise you that you will fail immediately. AVX2 will get your CPU far too hot for it to be stable on the stock cooler at similar settings, just trust me on that. AVX2/FMA3 is the reason people fear Prime95 in the first place, as it is a true test of mettle in which your cooling solution and stability are put to the test.

 

Those of you looking to have the best budget build, i suggest not trying to exceed 4.2-4.3ghz on stock cooler on SKU's with AVX2 instruction sets. If you can pair it with a cheap Hyper 212 Evo, you might be able to make it work, just be mindful of your temperatures and voltages. Exceeding 1.3V on this Pentium with the stock cooler causes temperatures to get too far out of control. 

[runit3]

-snip-

Since when was 80C high? :huh: If you were pissing on 90C for 8 hours I'd be a little concerned, but I'll scrape 85C on a 10+ encoding batch fairly regularly. 

 

Which ASRock board are you using? This might be a fun project for my vacation coming up. Also never had my hands on an ASRock

[DunePilot]

So apparently after the SeaMicro deal most other manufacturers  are rolling out BIOS updates with unlocked BCLK? Is the max 145 BCLK like on the SeaMicro, that is awesome...

Is there a thread over on OCN tracking which manufacturers have rolled out BIOS updates with this feature?

[MageTank]

Since when was 80C high? :huh: If you were pissing on 90C for 8 hours I'd be a little concerned, but I'll scrape 85C on a 10+ encoding batch fairly regularly. 

 

Which ASRock board are you using? This might be a fun project for my vacation coming up. Also never had my hands on an ASRock

Using the Asrock Z170 Fata1ity Gaming ITX/AC: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157650&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker,%20LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID=

 

Very easy to use bios, and its memory traces are absolutely fantastic. I've beaten this poor thing to death with my memory overclocks, and it still handles it like a champ. If you do not want an ITX board, here is it's bigger brother, for cheaper: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157634&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker,%20LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID=

 

ITX boards generally have a price premium, due to the extra engineering required for trace topology. The bios for overclocking non-K CPU's is currently a beta BIOS under Asrock's Beta Zone for whichever board you choose, but it should be officially released very soon.

[MageTank]

So apparently after the SeaMicro deal most other manufacturers  are rolling out BIOS updates with unlocked BCLK? Is the max 145 BCLK like on the SeaMicro, that is awesome...

Is there a thread over on OCN tracking which manufacturers have rolled out BIOS updates with this feature?

I have already booted into 146 (4,810mhz) and ran a stress test for about 10 minutes. 90C temps scared me, and i shut it down (Didn't even make it to 32-42k FFT's, which was the real heater, so I knew i was in for a world of hurt). I would say 145BCLK is easily manageable on this board. 

 

As for OCN, i don't know, never looked in to it. If such a thread exists, i'll give my results to them so they have something to compare against.

[DunePilot]

I have already booted into 146 (4,810mhz) and ran a stress test for about 10 minutes. 90C temps scared me, and i shut it down (Didn't even make it to 32-42k FFT's, which was the real heater, so I knew i was in for a world of hurt). I would say 145BCLK is easily manageable on this board. 

 

As for OCN, i don't know, never looked in to it. If such a thread exists, i'll give my results to them so they have something to compare against.

Oh wow, so its completely unlocked... I don't have the SeaMicro but when the dude from the Phillipeans got this info out a few weeks ago it was my asumption that they had a cap at 145 BCLK which means 45% OC max, which is a dang good target for something that is meant to be locked anyways lol. If you can set yours to 146 I guess that answers that question. Hopefully Giga and Asus roll out updates too.

[ProKoN]

cinebench plz

 

thanks for sharing

[MageTank]

cinebench plz

 

thanks for sharing

I've never ran Cinebench before, but here is the result: 

 

Oddly enough, it's reporting my CPU at 2.31ghz, which i can assure you it's running at 4.6. I can post CPU-Z results or more Aida64 results for proof. I don't know if the score i have is normal or not, but I'm sure you know more about cinebench than i do.

[runit3]

I've never ran Cinebench before, but here is the result: 

Oddly enough, it's reporting my CPU at 2.31ghz, which i can assure you it's running at 4.6. I can post CPU-Z results or more Aida64 results for proof. I don't know if the score i have is normal or not, but I'm sure you know more about cinebench than i do.

Cinebench only reports base (don't know why they haven't enabled better functionality after years of iterations).

 

You just wrecked Haswell i3's and matched up with some 5GHz G3258's. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1sxzGshuqVtFe_2zgRhN3gXCraR7d8p-NazJ6z0nsGGc/edit#gid=5

She's workin juuuuust fine.

[ProKoN]

I've never ran Cinebench before, but here is the result: 

 

Oddly enough, it's reporting my CPU at 2.31ghz, which i can assure you it's running at 4.6. I can post CPU-Z results or more Aida64 results for proof. I don't know if the score i have is normal or not, but I'm sure you know more about cinebench than i do.

ya thats certainly at 4.6

 

comparable to a g3258 at 4.9-5.0ghz

 

are you able to run the xtu benchmark? I heard you cant if you oc a locked skylake chip. ( heard it scores really low)

 

have you optimized your cache at all?

[ProKoN]

@runit3

 

battle of the pentiums redux?

[runit3]

@runit3

 

battle of the pentiums redux?

Just sent you a PM. I could throw down on a DC while I'm at the master plan

[ProKoN]

fyi that was the fastest g4400 cinebenched and recorded at this date

 

 

 

go collect your 2 hw points

[MageTank]

fyi that was the fastest g4400 cinebenched and recorded at this date

 

 

 

 

go collect your 2 hw points

 

Looks like i did worse. 

 

Also, 100C? lol. XTU does not like my Pentium it seems. 

[ProKoN]

Looks like i did worse. 

 

Also, 100C? lol. XTU does not like my Pentium it seems. 

 

 

lol your cache is optimized 1:1

 

ya xtu doesnt like these overclocked locked skylakes for some reason. your score should be similar to your cinebench score 380+

 

xtu is a tough benchmark. it runs hot and heavy...ohhh ya    make sure your using manual voltage when benching xtu. adaptive voltage will overvolt on this benchmark.  you should be able to click the lil blue wrench and check off the core voltage box so you can monitor that while the benchmark is running.

 

try and get a run in without hitting 100c and thermal throttling

 

you will do good on every benchmark. except xtu. unsure if there will be a fix at some point.

 

intels gotta be pissed, but all the board partners dont seem to care lol

 

 

lololol according to the graph you ran at 100C 4.6ghz and never thermal throttled   lolololol   100c is not a good idea for sustained periods. might wanna confirm temps with another program.

[SkilledRebuilds]

^Well he isn't throttling there anyway even with 100*c...

Normal usage scenario's wouldn't be as intensive or as hot (But yeah, still a little warm if it was my CPU I'd knock it back to save a few degrees)

[MageTank]

lol your cache is optimized 1:1

 

ya xtu doesnt like these overclocked locked skylakes for some reason. your score should be similar to your cinebench score 380+

 

xtu is a tough benchmark. it runs hot and heavy...ohhh ya    make sure your using manual voltage when benching xtu. adaptive voltage will overvolt on this benchmark.  you should be able to click the lil blue wrench and check off the core voltage box so you can monitor that while the benchmark is running.

 

try and get a run in without hitting 100c and thermal throttling

 

you will do good on every benchmark. except xtu. unsure if there will be a fix at some point.

 

intels gotta be pissed, but all the board partners dont seem to care lol

 

 

lololol according to the graph you ran at 100C 4.6ghz and never thermal throttled   lolololol   100c is not a good idea for sustained periods. might wanna confirm temps with another program.

I do not believe i am throttling. In fact, Intel XTU dislikes my Pentium so much that its locked at 100C reporting always, even with 0 CPU load. HWinfo64 showed a max load temp of 82C, with it averaging 78C. Not as brutal as my 8 hour Prime95 run (88C peak), so i can tolerate it. 

 

 

Under gaming load, i have yet to pass 70C (Using Elder Scrolls Online as a test) 

[ProKoN]

I do not believe i am throttling. In fact, Intel XTU dislikes my Pentium so much that its locked at 100C reporting always, even with 0 CPU load. HWinfo64 showed a max load temp of 82C, with it averaging 78C. Not as brutal as my 8 hour Prime95 run (88C peak), so i can tolerate it. 

 

 

Under gaming load, i have yet to pass 70C (Using Elder Scrolls Online as a test) 

i dont think you throttling either, xtu is just being fucky

when i first saw and heard 100c i was like damn...thats hot. at 100c throttling occurs whether or not we like it.

 

but after seeing your core frequency pegged at 4.6, theres no way it throttled.

 

you can also monitor individual core temps in xtu if you select the lil blue wrench. im not sure if that data is bugged as well.

 

i would be inclined to believe the hwinfo values as you have illustrated