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Yoshi Moshi

RTX 3090 Gaming Benchmarks Leaked ~ 10 % Better @ 115 % Increase in Cost!

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Posted · Original PosterOP

For those who don't know, the same Chinese company hat leaked the RTX 3080 gaming benchmarks before the review embargo was officially lifted, have now leaked RTX 3090 gaming benchmarks. The benchmarks reveal that the RTX 3090 provides about an additional 10 % FPS gain over the RTX 3080 at 4K. This is pretty underwhelming performance gain for the RTX 3090 of 10 % over the RTX 3080 considering that it costs ~ 115 % more. The difference in performance is so small, that in some games it's less than 10 FPS difference, single digits. Such a difference in performance would most likely be not noticeable to most people.

 

Seems to me that the only reason to get the 3090 is the additional VRAM. The consensus seems to be that 10 GB is "just enough" for 4K gaming on ultra settings for AAA, games for now. If what happens last generation occurs this generation, this generation of cards will last for two years. With refresher cards coming out in 2021, but the top gaming card, RTX 3090, will remain the top card for the whole generation. The RTX 2080 Ti was the top gaming card for two years, even with the Super cards. The leaks suggest that this will happen again. Except this time we will have "Ti" and not "Super" cards.  Super cards for the 2### series had the same price as the original cards, however "Ti" cards have yet to have the same price as the original cards. Meaning the price of the 2080 Ti was not the same price of the 2080. However the price of the RTX 2080 Super was the same price as the RTX 2080. The naming of RTX 3070 Ti has leaked, so this confirms this if it's true. The leak suggests that the cards will have double the VRAM. This is probably necessary, because AAA games between now and the 4### series cards will require more than 10 GB of VRAM.

 

What is the the big marketing scheme behind the 3### series? Same cost as the 2### series but much more performance. Lets look at the historical MSRP, and we will see that this is true.

 

RTX 2060 = RTX 2060 Super = $349

RTX 2070 = RTX 2070 Super = RTX 3070 = $499

RTX 2080 = RTX 2080 Super = RTX 3080 = $699

RTX 2080 Ti = $1,199

RTX 3090 = $1,499

RTX Titian = $2,499

 

Well this suggests that the RTX 3080 Ti with 20 GB will have the same price as the RTX 2080 Ti perhaps of $1,199.

 

So what do you think of the underwhelming 10 % performance improvement of the RTX 3090 over the RTX 3080 at a ~ 115 % increase in cost. Are you persuaded to get a RTX 3090 knowing that it will have more than enough VRAM until the RTX 4### series comes out, while the RTX 3080 probably won't have enough VRAM at 4K ultra, creating a need for 20 GB RTX 3080 Ti? If following along with the scheme of the RTX 3### series of being the same cost as the RTX 2#### series, but so much more performance, and the RTX 3080 Ti is $1,199, do you think you should just get a RTX 3090 now and not have to get another card in a year? Do you consider the difference between the RTX 3090 and the alleged price of the RTX 3080 Ti of only $300? Do you consider the RTX 3080 will drop in value like a rock when the RTX 3080 Ti comes out. Perhaps it makes more sense, in terms of saving the most money, to just get a RTX 3090 now and sell it when the RTX 4### series comes out, instead of getting a RTX 3080 now, selling it for a great loss in a year for a RTX 3080 Ti, than taking another hit a year later when the RTX 4### series comes out?

 

What are your thoughts on the leaked benchmarks? If you should get a RTX 3090 now and sell it in two years, instead of a RTX 3080 and sell it in a year + a RTX 3080 Super and sell it in a year?

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The 3090 is a supposed Titan replacement. GTX/RTX Titan cards were pretty much never meant for gaming, and that was made fairly clear even by Nvidia themselves.

Therefore.. I think you know where I'm going with this.

 

Also, a 20GB 3080 is not going to cost $1200 (MSRP), if the memory capacity is the only difference compared to the vanilla 3080.


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sounds like the 3080 should be a fine card, yall overthink stuff too much lol. perhaps it's not a miracle card thatll last 10 generations but it should be as good a card as any other xx80 sku. 

 

considering the 3080 sports a very, very slightly trimmed down 3090 die, the main performance boost is from the extra memory bandwidth. thus i'm not sure what they can do for a 3080ti performance-wise, unless theyve got a real titan die on the backburner waiting to crap on rdna 2. if they do have a 3080ti it's unlikely that they'd charge 1200 bucks for it, as this gen seems to go back to traditional nvidia pricing. if they start a line of high vram card variants (which would cut into 3090 sales for any card with over 16gb) they would likely either drop prices on current cards like in normal ti releases or start a new naming scheme and tack on 100 bucks or something.

 

i remain skeptical of a 20gb 3080 as that blurs the distinctions between their product stack. youve got normal consumer cards for gamers and typical users, titans for prosumers and some professionals, and quadros for professionals using software that requires the fancy driver support. a 20gb consumer card wouldnt fit in anywhere, or would fit in too well as a prosumer card and hurt the 3090's sales too much. 12-14gb seems reasonable for a 3080ti or whatever itll be. 


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Posted · Original PosterOP
Just now, Mateyyy said:

The 3090 is a supposed Titan replacement. GTX/RTX Titan cards were pretty much never meant for gaming, and that was made fairly clear even by Nvidia themselves.

Therefore.. I think you know where I'm going with this.

 

Also, a 20GB 3080 is not going to cost $1200 (MSRP), if the memory capacity is the only difference compared to the vanilla 3080.

I was also thinking this, but we know the "Ti" nomenclature exists for the #3000 series and not "Super", right? Have "Ti" cards ever cost the same as non-Ti variants? No. We have only seen the same cost for "Super' cards over the regular version. I would really like to believe that the RTX 3080 Ti with 20 GB of VRAM cost the same as the RTX 3080 of $699. But looking at the scheme so far, I'm afraid that the RTX 3080 Ti will equal the cost of the RTX 2080 Ti.

 

But lets say your right, it costs the same, which I'm still not convinced that it will. You pay $699 now for a RTX 3080. The RTX 3060 Ti is released a year from now with 10 GB of VRAM for $349. This would tank the value of the RTX 3080. So would sell it for probably a little less than $349, and buy a RTX 3080 Ti with 20 GB of VRAM for $699. Then a year after that the RTX 4### series is released and you take another hit on the RTX 3080 Ti. Or you could just get a RTX 3090 now for $1,499, have it last the whole generation until 2022. Take the hit on a single graphics card, instead of two between now and the RTX 4### series.

 

Not sure, it's a very interesting thing to ponder, what is the best thing to do.

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5 minutes ago, Yoshi Moshi said:

You pay $699 now for a RTX 3080. The RTX 3060 Ti is released a year from now with 10 GB of VRAM for $349.

this mental jump is a bit much lol, whens the last time there was even a ti version of an xx60 card?? my old 660 ti is the most recent i can think of... we dont even have a 3060 yet to make unfounded judgements about lmao


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Posted · Original PosterOP
8 minutes ago, VeganJoy said:

this mental jump is a bit much lol, whens the last time there was even a ti version of an xx60 card?? we dont even have a 3060 yet to make unfounded judgements about lmao

Your right I jumped the gun a bit. I'm sure you have seen this article?

 

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/75244/gigabyte-confirms-geforce-rtx-3080-with-20gb-model-3070-16gb/index.html

 

RTX 3070 Ti with 16 GB of VRAM is confirmed by Gigabyte by accident. This will likely be released in 2021. When it does, it will tank the value of the RTX 3080 with 10 GB of VRAM. I still would not be surprised if the RTX 3070 Ti 16 GB is released for $499 (although I still think it will cost more because it's a "Ti" card and not a "Super" card) in 2021, that a RTX 3080 with 10 GB VRAM would take a hit to the less than $400 range, but this all speculation. The 3070 Ti would have 60 % more VRAM than the RTX 3080, which is significant, so I suspect a good hit in the value of the card. Or could just avoid this issue all together for the whole generation by spending $1,499 on the RTX 3090, taking the hit on only a single graphics card, and not two.

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8 minutes ago, Yoshi Moshi said:

I was also thinking this, but we know the "Ti" nomenclature exists for the #3000 series and not "Super", right? Have "Ti" cards ever cost the same as non-Ti variants? No. We have only seen the same cost for "Super' cards over the regular version. I would really like to believe that the RTX 3080 Ti with 20 GB of VRAM cost the same as the RTX 3080 of $699. But looking at the scheme so far, I'm afraid that the RTX 3080 Ti will equal the cost of the RTX 2080 Ti.

 

But lets say your right, it costs the same, which I'm still not convinced that it will. You pay $699 now for a RTX 3080. The RTX 3060 Ti is released a year from now with 10 GB of VRAM for $349. This would tank the value of the RTX 3080. So would sell it for probably a little less than $349, and buy a RTX 3080 Ti with 20 GB of VRAM for $699. Then a year after that the RTX 4### series is released and you take another hit on the RTX 3080 Ti. Or you could just get a RTX 3090 now for $1,499, have it last the whole generation until 2022. Take the hit on a single graphics card, instead of two between now and the RTX 4### series.

 

Not sure, it's a very interesting thing to ponder, what is the best thing to do.

I never said that I think the 20GB variant would be the same price.

 

Honestly, my initial prediction before launch, just going by some vague rumours of potentially higher VRAM cards popping up at a later date, was that there'd be a 3080Ti with 3090 levels of performance, with ~16GB of VRAM at $999. 

Now, after this leak (or accidental confirmation), in a way I think they'll be the exact same GPU just with more VRAM, but at the same time the "S" in the SKUs probably means that these will be called "Super" again (I hate that that branding's coming back) and will most likely have a performance bump over the vanilla non-Super GPUs.

 

That being said, I don't see Nvidia killing off the 3080 three months after release (if these "Super" cards were to come out in early 2021, so January let's say). 

A potential 3070Ti/Super, with 16GB of VRAM and 90-95% of the 3080's performance, would be a no-brainer purchase against a more expensive 3080 for most people, since in the long run that extra VRAM will be a lot more handy than an extra bit of GPU power.

 

I don't know if all of that made any sense since I'm barely awake but either way, we're just speculating here. At least, let's see if AMD has anything that beats the 3070 or matches it at $100 less, since that's what got Nvidia to launch the Super lineup.


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2 minutes ago, Yoshi Moshi said:

Your right I jumped the gun a bit. I'm sure you have seen this article?

 

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/75244/gigabyte-confirms-geforce-rtx-3080-with-20gb-model-3070-16gb/index.html

 

RTX 3070 Ti with 16 GB of VRAM is confirmed by Gigabyte by accident. This will likely be released in 2021. When it does, it will tank the value of the RTX 3080 with 10 GB of VRAM. I still would not be surprised if the RTX 3070 Ti 16 GB is released for $499 (although I still think it will cost more because it's a "Ti" card and not a "Super" card) in 2021, that a RTX 3080 with 10 GB VRAM would take a hit to the less than $400 range, but this all speculation. The 3070 Ti would have 60 % more VRAM than the RTX 3080, which is significant, so I suspect a good hit in the value of the card.

i disagree with your opinion on the 3080 being tanked. the 3070ti Is more then likely going to be 16 GB of GDDR6 not GDDR6x. Plus the performance is still going to be a fair bit higher on the 3080. The 3070 is going to be just below the 2080ti in performance more then likely if not win in some games, lose in other games. VRAM Beyond 10 GB does not matter for the 3070, its limiting factor is going to be the Core well before VRAM becomes the limit for 98% of games. The games that do need more then the 10 are going to require a better card regardless to run at decent frames. Unless you do other workloads that benefit from a massive frame buffer, it doesn tmake sense.

 

Its all about Cost. 10 GB of GDDR6X probably costs around 150-250$ so 20 GB is going to cost 300-500$. This is based on the Cost of GDDR5 Costing 6$ per GB and GDDR6 14Gb Costing nearly 12$ per GB. 

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2 minutes ago, Yoshi Moshi said:

Your right I jumped the gun a bit. I'm sure you have seen this article?

 

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/75244/gigabyte-confirms-geforce-rtx-3080-with-20gb-model-3070-16gb/index.html

 

RTX 3070 Ti with 16 GB of VRAM is confirmed by Gigabyte by accident. This will likely be released in 2021. When it does, it will tank the value of the RTX 3080 with 10 GB of VRAM. I still would not be surprised if the RTX 3070 Ti 16 GB is released for $499 (although I still think it will cost more because it's a "Ti" card and not a "Super" card) in 2021, that a RTX 3080 with 10 GB VRAM would take a hit to the less than $400 range, but this all speculation. The 3070 Ti would have 60 % more VRAM than the RTX 3080, which is significant, so I suspect a good hit in the value of the card.

until these cards are actually announced and released i remain skeptical, spending my brainpower worrying about leaks leads to too much confusion. these amounts of vram make no sense, no game actually uses more than the 10 available on the 3080 let alone 20 being foreseeably used. inb4 someone starts up a game on their 3090 and sees 24gb allocated lol

 

besides, vram isnt the sole value point of a card. 1080tis sell for less than 2070 supers, 2080s, and 2080 supers on the used market. if they had made a gtx 1060 ti with 12 gb vram it would have made no sense for 99% of uses compared to a 1070, or even a 980ti. 


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CPU: Ryzen 5 3600 (placeholder)

GPU: Gigabyte 980ti Xtreme (also placeholder), deshroud w/ generic 1200rpm 120mm fans x2, stock bios 130% power, no voltage offset: +70 core +400 mem 

Memory: 2x16gb GSkill Trident Z RGB 3600C16, 14-15-30-288@1.45v

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7 minutes ago, Yoshi Moshi said:

.

i was expecting 20%, no amount of mental gymnastic can be done for 10% lol, gonna wait for official benchmarks before i make my decision, it's either keeping the 2080 ti or the 3090, no 3080 for me.


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Posted · Original PosterOP

Buy RTX 3080 now in 2020 for $699, sell for $X when RTX 3070 Ti comes out = Loss of $699 - $X

Buy a RTX 3080 Ti in 2021 for $699 (I think it will cost more)

Sell RTX 3080 Ti in 2022 for $Y to buy a RTX 4080 = Loss of $699 - $Y

Total Loss = $699 - $X + $699 - $Y

 

Buy a RTX 3090 now in 2020 for $1,499

Sell RTX 3090 in 2022 when RTX $4### is announced for $Z = Loss $1,499 - $Z

 

Will this be true???

$699 - $X + $699 - $Y > $1,499 - $Z

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Posted · Original PosterOP
7 minutes ago, VeganJoy said:

until these cards are actually announced and released i remain skeptical, spending my brainpower worrying about leaks leads to too much confusion. these amounts of vram make no sense, no game actually uses more than the 10 available on the 3080 let alone 20 being foreseeably used. inb4 someone starts up a game on their 3090 and sees 24gb allocated lol

 

besides, vram isnt the sole value point of a card. 1080tis sell for less than 2070 supers, 2080s, and 2080 supers on the used market. if they had made a gtx 1060 ti with 12 gb vram it would have made no sense for 99% of uses compared to a 1070, or even a 980ti. 

10 GB of VRAM at 4K ultra is fine for now, but do you think it will be in 2021? The consoles have 16 GB of RAM total. I know that this is total system memory. But how much of that RAM do you think is used for something other than rendering images on the display? I fear that the consoles having 16 GB of RAM total will allow games to be developed for console using more than 10 GB of VRAM, and then even more so on PC if you play 4K ultra. I agree it's fine for now, but I don't think this will be the case next year. I'm even worried that CyberPunk 2077, which is supposed to have the most RTX features and more graphically demanding than Control, might take up more than 10 GB of VRAM on 4k Ultra. Andy CyberPunk 2077 is coming out in November of this year.

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3 minutes ago, Yoshi Moshi said:

10 GB of VRAM at 4K ultra is fine for now, but do you think it will be in 2021? The consoles have 16 GB of RAM total. I know that this is total system memory. But how much of that RAM do you think is used for something other than rendering images on the display? I fear that the consoles having 16 GB of RAM total will allow games to be developed for console using more than 10 GB of VRAM, and then even more so on PC if you play 4K ultra. I agree it's fine for now, but I don't think this will be the case next year. I'm even worried that CyberPunk 2077, which is supposed to have the most RTX features and more graphically demanding than Control, might take up more than 10 GB of VRAM on 4k Ultra. Andy CyberPunk 2077 is coming out in November of this year.

min and rec hardware for cp2077 was released yesterday, a 1060 6gb is recommended for high settings 1080p. which means the textures should be optimized such that 10gb of vram should be fine as resolution /= texture size. and considering how much system ram current games use its unlikely that console games will utilize all of the 16gb allotted just for textures lol


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my "oops i bought intel right before zen 3 releases" build

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600 (placeholder)

GPU: Gigabyte 980ti Xtreme (also placeholder), deshroud w/ generic 1200rpm 120mm fans x2, stock bios 130% power, no voltage offset: +70 core +400 mem 

Memory: 2x16gb GSkill Trident Z RGB 3600C16, 14-15-30-288@1.45v

Motherboard: Asus ROG Strix X570-E Gaming

Cooler: Noctua NH-D15S w/ white chromax bling
OS Drive: Samsung PM981 1tb (OEM 970 Evo)

Storage Drive: XPG SX8200 Pro 2tb

Backup Storage: Seagate Barracuda Compute 4TB

PSU: Seasonic Prime Ultra Titanium 750W w/ black/white Cablemod extensions
Case: Fractal Design Meshify C Dark (to be replaced with a good case shortly)

basically everything was bought used off of reddit or here, only new component was the case. absolutely nutty deals for some of these parts, ill have to tally it all up once it's "done" :D 

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33 minutes ago, VeganJoy said:

his mental jump is a bit much lol, whens the last time there was even a ti version of an xx60 card??

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