Best Value for Money

[Canoas]

When it comes to computer parts it's easy to find out which parts have better value for money, since it's all benchmarked, but when it comes to audio I'm completely clueless so I was hoping you could enlighten me. Basically, is there any particular cost range that has better value for money when it comes to headphones+mic+dac/amp?

My siberia v2 (non-usb) cost me 54€ a couple years ago, but the sound control seems to be dying as in some levels the sound is stronger on the right or left and forces me to have to re-find that properly working level. It's also causing me paranoia, as sometime the clip's voice isn't exactly centered and I start to think it's my headphones, and then I end up to unbalancing it.

This means that I'll probably have to buy a new headset soon. Maybe tomorrow, maybe in 6 months, but either way I should be paying attention to possible good deals and that brings me to the question, what exactly should I be looking for?

 

I mainly play games, but also listen to music when not playing/working. I don't have a budget, if the best value for money is 200€ then I can afford 200€, but if it's 60€ then I'll gladly settle for a 60€ headset. I have no dac/amp or external microphone either, so if those are needed please take them into account for the budget. You can check my profile for my current parts/periferals, but basically I don't mind not having the best even if I can afford it.

 

Also, right now I can get a new pair of Siberia V2 USB for 60€.

[ShearMe]

Price is not indicative of audio or build quality when it comes to headphones.

 

The best price to performance I've seen is the Pioneer SE-A1000. It's MSRP is $150 but only costs 50-60 bucks in the US, and usually under a hundred in Europe if you can find it. Sounds like a Sennheiser HD 650 minus the veil.

[Canoas]

Price is not indicative of audio or build quality when it comes to headphones.

 

The best price to performance I've seen is the Pioneer SE-A1000. It's MSRP is $150 but only costs 50-60 bucks in the US, and usually under a hundred in Europe if you can find it. Sounds like a Sennheiser HD 650 minus the veil.

But surely the best 200$ headphones is better than the best 100$ ones.

 

Hmm.. that one has 45 ohms though. The siberia v2 only have 32 ohm and usually I need everything at max volume to properly hear youtube videos. In games I have to lower the sound to like 10% or even less, so it wouldn't be a problem, but the sound would surely be too low on youtube.

 

EDIT: it seems they're also open, so they're unusable for me.

[ShearMe]

But surely the best 200$ headphones is better than the best 100$ ones.

 

Depends on what you personally prefer and what the prices look like at the time of buying. And, does a 5% increase in audio quality justify a 100% increase in cost? What about which is more comfortable? More durable?

 

There's too many factors to base a purchase off of cost.

 

Hmm.. that one has 45 ohms though. The siberia v2 only have 32 ohm and usually I need everything at max volume to properly hear youtube videos. In games I have to lower the sound to like 10% or even less, so it wouldn't be a problem, but the sound would surely be too low on youtube.

 

EDIT: it seems they're also open, so they're unusable for me.

 

Ohms isn't indicative of how loud they can get. If you need 100% volume on YouTube, but only 10% volume in a game, something is messed up in your settings for sure.

 

For a closed option, best one I've had so far is the CHC Silverados. Writing a review now if you're interested, but I don't know how easily you can get them in Europe.

[Canoas]

And, does a 5% increase in audio quality justify a 100% increase in cost?

No, and that's the point of this thread. I can look at graphic cards and say that the 770 is 40% more expensive than the 760 but offers only 20% better performance, therefore it is not better is terms of value for money. What I want to know is how much better sound quality do the best 150$ headphones have when compared to the best 100$ ones? Are they 100% better? 50%? 20%? 5%? After I know that I'll decide between the recommended ones for that price range and start paying attention to headphones in the next "tier" that might come down in price.

 

I'll see if I can find any problems with youtube/flash or my browser. Maybe that can be fixed.

 

And how is ohms not indicative of how loud they get? As far as I know headphones do not have the ability to magically contradict ohm's law.

 

Hmm, what's the price of the silverados over there?

[Krillin]

@ShearMe recommended me these and I read/watched reviews saying these are really good value for $80  http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0093PVTPS/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3QWSZ44N8P3 

[ShearMe]

And how is ohms not indicative of how loud they get? As far as I know headphones do not have the ability to magically contradict ohm's law.

 

It's a combo of ohms and sensitivity. Higher impedance means the amp can't push as many watts into the headphones, but sensitivity determines how loud the headphone can get per volt. My 250 ohm Beyerdynamic DT 990 is less sensitive than my 300 ohm Sennheiser HD 650, and the 50 ohm AKG K 701 is even less sensitive than that. You need a beefy amp for the K 701 and DT 990 but not necessarily for the HD 650.

 

 

No, and that's the point of this thread. I can look at graphic cards and say that the 770 is 40% more expensive than the 760 but offers only 20% better performance, therefore it is not better is terms of value for money. What I want to know is how much better sound quality do the best 150$ headphones have when compared to the best 100$ ones? Are they 100% better? 50%? 20%? 5%? After I know that I'll decide between the recommended ones for that price range and start paying attention to headphones in the next "tier" that might come down in price.

 

Right, but my point is that it's not just about sound - there's too many variables and also a subjective preference on each one. A lot of people on this forum think the $1500 HD 800 is overpriced by 50%, but elsewhere some people think full price is the right price. For the general consumer, spending over $50 on headphones is plain fucking stupid. Some people genuinely love their $300 plastic distortion-ridden boom boom Beats by Dre.

[Canoas]

The silverado look really good and from the comments I've seen they're exactly what I'm looking for, with the exception of some people claiming it's somewhat thight and therefore not optimal for extended use. Did you have this problem?

 

@ShearMe recommended me these and I read/watched reviews saying these are really good value for $80  http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0093PVTPS/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3QWSZ44N8P3 

Ok, those and the silverados seem to be at a good price point, I'll see if I can find them over here but so far I'm not having much luck.

[ShearMe]

The silverado look really good and from the comments I've seen they're exactly what I'm looking for, with the exception of some people claiming it's somewhat thight and therefore not optimal for extended use. Did you have this problem?

 

Ok, those and the silverados seem to be at a good price point, I'll see if I can find them over here but so far I'm not having much luck.

 

They are tight, but stretch out nicely across a PC case. My review here: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/94057-review-california-headphone-company-silverado/

 

Those NVX's are a good option if you can't find the Silverados.

[Aphexx]

 Are they 100% better? 50%? 20%? 5%?

 

 

taste is not something that you can attribute numbers to across a stretch of people.

 

I may like coke 30% more over pepsi but does that mean you do as well? I prefer apple pie 10% over pumpkin but does everyone?

 

also tastes vary over time. 2 months ago I favored my dt770 20% over my ath M50 but today that number is in the opposite direction

 

 

also..... how the fuck did I just attribute a %based number on something as abstract as taste?

[tehsprayer]

dt 990 and e10

[Canoas]

They are tight, but stretch out nicely across a PC case. My review here: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/94057-review-california-headphone-company-silverado/

 

Those NVX's are a good option if you can't find the Silverados.

Thanks for the review. I think It'll be even harder finding the NVX though.

 

There are some silverados listed on ebay as excelent condition and are pretty cheap. I've sent him a message asking how long it was used for and such.

 

 

 

taste is not something that you can attribute numbers to across a stretch of people.

 

I may like coke 30% more over pepsi but does that mean you do as well? I prefer apple pie 10% over pumpkin but does everyone?

 

also tastes vary over time. 2 months ago I favored my dt770 20% over my ath M50 but today that number is in the opposite direction

 

 

also..... how the fuck did I just attribute a %based number on something as abstract as taste?

Sound can be qualified objectively. It's all about frequency response, impulse response, phase and impedance variations, THD, noise to signal ratio, isolation, sine and square waves per frequency. etc, which in turn are "translated" into distortion, isolation, base, mids, treble, noise, etc, which are very easily measured qualities by human ears without any proper measuring equipment. Everything about the output of an headphone or headset can be objectively measured.

Sound is not about taste. Which headphones you pick based on the sound will be about taste but your taste should not in any way influence the headphones you recommend to people. I can try some headphones with a lot of bass and say I don't like them yet I could recommend them to someone who actually wants a lot of bass. Whether I like it or dislike it has nothing to do with it.

And I can very well say these headphones have 20% more bass and 10% less trebble or 20% more noise than some other pair. It's an incredibly valid and easy to do comparison. I'm completely baffled by how you somehow think this is impossible. Learn to use your ears and your tongue as well while you're at it, because palate can be objectively quantified too.

[ShearMe]

Thanks for the review. I think It'll be even harder finding the NVX though.

 

There are some silverados listed on ebay as excelent condition and are pretty cheap. I've sent him a message asking how long it was used for and such.

 

Cool, they're a good set to get used due to the metal construction.

 

Sound can be qualified objectively. ... Sound is not about taste. 

 

Yes, you can objectively measure what comes out of a headphone, but whether or not you'll like that compared to what comes out of another headphone depends on your preference. Most people haven't tried lots of different headphones, so numbers on a chart don't make sense to them. You have to say why you subjectively liked or disliked about a headphone or else they wont know what you're talking about.

[Canoas]

Cool, they're a good set to get used due to the metal construction.

 

 

Yes, you can objectively measure what comes out of a headphone, but whether or not you'll like that compared to what comes out of another headphone depends on your preference. Most people haven't tried lots of different headphones, so numbers on a chart don't make sense to them. You have to say why you subjectively liked or disliked about a headphone or else they wont know what you're talking about.

The cord can be disconnected and replaced, right? If so then I think I'll order these.

 

Obviously you need to know what you like in order to get the right headphones for you, but the sound is still objectively measured. But as long as you have a reference, the frequency response for your pair of headphones, then you'll be able to tell more or less what you like.

[ShearMe]

The cord can be disconnected and replaced, right? If so then I think I'll order these.

 

Yes, I think they sell for $20 straight from CHC's website. There should be other cables you can use as a replacement. In a pinch, you can use a 3.5m splitter and two 3.5mm cables

[Canoas]

How is the silverado in comparizon to the m50? It's 130€ over here so it's only a little more for brand new headphones as opposed to a used silverado.

[ShearMe]

How is the silverado in comparizon to the m50? It's 130€ over here so it's only a little more for brand new headphones as opposed to a used silverado.

 

M50's are highly overhyped. They're a good studio monitoring headphone for around a hundred bucks, but I don't think they're all that great for music listening. There's some who would disagree with me, of course.

[Canoas]

M50's are highly overhyped. They're a good studio monitoring headphone for around a hundred bucks, but I don't think they're all that great for music listening. There's some who would disagree with me, of course.

 

The dude just replied:

 

Thanks for your message. I'm selling the Silverados because I've upgraded to a pair of M-100s and am looking to downsize. They were used off and on for the course of a month or so. Virtually no signs of wear that I can see, especially since the Silverados are built like a tank. Really ideal for home listening or computer games. They were part of the original Kick starter campaign which I believe were delivered in Oct. 2012. They've spent most of the time since then packed up and waiting for a new home.

 

Do you know if the original kick starter ones have anything special on them or if there has been an update to the silverados since?

[ShearMe]

The dude just replied:

 

 

Do you know if the original kick starter ones have anything special on them or if there has been an update to the silverados since?

 

They should all be the same.

[Canoas]

Just bought it, but now I'll need a mic. I'll probably get the ZM-MIC1 for 13€, but I'm wondering if they'll pic up sound properly since it'll be stuck to the cord and not near my mouth nor in the direction of my voice.

 

Also, is a cheap soundcard like xonar dg/dgx any good? I have a cheap motherboard with the alc892. If it had the alc898 I wouldn't even think of buying one, but the 892 only has a SNR of 90 dB which theoretically should be noticeable.

[EmoRarity]

Just bought it, but now I'll need a mic. I'll probably get the ZM-MIC1 for 13€, but I'm wondering if they'll pic up sound properly since it'll be stuck to the cord and not near my mouth nor in the direction of my voice.

 

Also, is a cheap soundcard like xonar dg/dgx any good? I have a cheap motherboard with the alc892. If it had the alc898 I wouldn't even think of buying one, but the 892 only has a SNR of 90 dB which theoretically should be noticeable.

Onboard is fine unless its broken. 

[Canoas]

Onboard is fine unless its broken. 

At what point does the SNR become irrelevant?

[EmoRarity]

At what point does the SNR become irrelevant?

94 is the cap (No point going higher), 80 something is shit, so you're in the middle. 

If you have to have something, an E10 is your best bet.

[Canoas]

94 is the cap (No point going higher), 80 something is shit, so you're in the middle. 

If you have to have something, an E10 is your best bet.

Nvm, it's the input SNR that is 90, the output is 97, so it's useless to get a soundcard since I'll use a crappy mic and it's just for voip anyway. E10 wouldn't help either and I don't need an amp so there's really no benefit.

 

I still don't know why the youtube videos are so low though. Usually I leave the volume slider in the middle with both windows and mic volume control in max for it to be ok, and in some particular videos even max isn't enough. In games if I put everything at max I'll become deaf, and I just checked some flash games and they're unbearebly loud as well. Maybe youtube videos just tend to be quieter?

[EmoRarity]

Nvm, it's the input SNR that is 90, the output is 97, so it's useless to get a soundcard since I'll use a crappy mic and it's just for voip anyway. E10 wouldn't help either and I don't need an amp so there's really no benefit.

 

I still don't know why the youtube videos are so low though. Usually I leave the volume slider in the middle with both windows and mic volume control in max for it to be ok, and in some particular videos even max isn't enough. In games if I put everything at max I'll become deaf, and I just checked some flash games and they're unbearebly loud as well. Maybe youtube videos just tend to be quieter?

So videos are encoded differently, some loud, some not. Though check the YouTube volume slider, that may or may not be low. 

Being the technicality Nazi that I am, you already have an amp.