MrSpeakers Mad dogs and Schiit Stack(Magni/Modi) or others?

[geogga]

Hey guys, so I am looking for an audio setup for headphones. I choose the Mad dogs because of their all around possibility and praise from tons of people. I recently was using my Beats Studio, which are quite bassy instead of my crappy monitor audio. I listen to Techo/some dubstep like Martin Garrix's Animals and orchestral mixes (like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7zPiF149q8). Audiomachine's tracks as well as Two steps from Hell. I love my beats and imagined, if these crappy beats can do this, what can real headphones with DACs and Amps do? 

 

Little note:I wear glasses so hopefully the mad dogs and their alphapads will continue to isolate the music and keep comfort to me...if not, well that'll be a bummer. A real bummer. With the Beats on I feel comfortable and fine.

 

AMP/DAC

I'm primarily looking at the Schiit stack (Modi/Magni). I don't think I need to go overkill on the DAC and think the Modi is perfect for me. The Magni on the other hand has other options to be replaced.

There is the Vali, which is $20 more than the magni from Schiit ($120). Then there's the 02 from JDS labs ($129). Lastly I was looking at the Matrix M-stage for the highest cost of the 4 amps($200).

A head-fi'er said synergy from the magni and mad dogs are great. The Vali, from FAQ of Schiit, "ultimate power output is lower, so it's less suitable to orthodynamics and other hard-to-drive headphones." Although on both FAQs it says it can drive orthos such as the mad dogs for example very well. The Vali also will give a small noise when plugging in your headphone and will take a while to go away.

Others said they switched the magni with the 02 so some had a modi-->magni/02 setup. Then a Matrix M was recommended over both but it costs twice of the magni.

 

So what I'm really asking is, "Out of the 4 amps mentioned, which would better suit me for my types of music? I'm am mainly looking at the Magni because it is the cheapest and performs as well as others.

Please leave feedback/responses on my question and setup, thank you LTTers!

Will probably pull the plug tonight eventhough I may not get as much replies, or in the morning tommorrow.

[EmoRarity]

Well, in your position, I wouldn't both with anything, save your dollar bills for something else.
More so if you have to get something don't get anything Schiit, because unless your motherboard is really old, your onboard will do. 

[h264]

An E10 is really all you need in the AMP/DAC category for those headphones.  Onboard will even work.

 

I'd say O2 over Schiit's products, but everyone knows I'm just biased because of certain "issues" they've had with a FEW of their products.  A perfectly Objective reason?  The Magni's gain is much too high for a mad dog.

[MayflowerElectronics]

Word to the wise, take everything headfi says with a grain of salt. Everyone knows my thoughts about schiit, and most of the people on this forum don't like them.

[ShearMe]

Schiit is shit and synergy is a myth.

[h264]

Schiit is shit and synergy is a myth.

 

other myths include:

slam

sibilance

warmth

clincalness

musicality

etc.

 

all of which describe VOLUME and nothing more.  Volume matching is very hard to do properly, though, and so many people (me included!) have been fooled.

[geogga]

I looked around and read about them. hmm, I did not know such things.

So let's say I were to get the ODAC/02 combo which is in a single enclosure. Will there be any difference if I get seperate units other than the lower cost (probably BC of the combo)?

 

Does the 02/ODAC have a lower gain (don't really know much about high/low gain etc) than the magni? And from the context it seems that the mad dogs will benefit from the 02+ODAC?

 

 

 

Also, I was confuzzled with the talk of warm, dark, bright, etc bullshit things I was getting mind f'ed with with all the reviews.

I was doing more research and discovered Nwavguy was banned. LOL. Now that means something. And also, before banning him, Jason decided to do some decisions with the relay delay etc, which probably ment there was actually a problem and jason tried to stealthy play it off like nothing and get the solution. 

[MayflowerElectronics]

No, no difference.

 

o2/ODAC has 2x and 6.5x gain as standard. All headphones will benefit from a good amp/DAC.

[h264]

I looked around and read about them. hmm, I did not know such things.

So let's say I were to get the ODAC/02 combo which is in a single enclosure. Will there be any difference if I get seperate units other than the lower cost (probably BC of the combo)?

 

Does the 02/ODAC have a lower gain (don't really know much about high/low gain etc) than the magni? And from the context it seems that the mad dogs will benefit from the 02+ODAC?

 

 

 

Also, I was confuzzled with the talk of warm, dark, bright, etc bullshit things I was getting mind f'ed with with all the reviews.

I was doing more research and discovered Nwavguy was banned. LOL. Now that means something. And also, before banning him, Jason decided to do some decisions with the relay delay etc, which probably ment there was actually a problem and jason tried to stealthy play it off like nothing and get the resolution. 

 

Yes, it's one of the most interesting forum bans I've ever encountered both in membership and leadership reaction.  Looking at how things on head-fi have changed (SLIGHTLY for the better), it's one of the most significant bans on a forum board.  Not that nwavguy is the only audio engineer ever banned from an audiophile board (not by a LONG SHOT), but because what he did AFTER being banned that is something of a lesson to other forum admins and forum users about what the social contract on a forum REALLY is:  A contract of free speech between a member and an admin.  It can't be simply denied to the member by the rules, since the forum admin only controls their own forum, and nobody uses the internet in a bubble.  Jude violated this rule with nwavguy (like most people that he bans), and he paid dearly for it.  Google "head-fi sucks" or "banned on head-fi" sometime.  It's a fun read.  Remember that head-fi exists to make money for Jude (in the form of BOTH dollars and free audio gear from sponsers!) and nothing more.

 

Contrast Linus's forum for a moment.  Nobody is banned for:

 

-"bad-mouthing" a product

-stating their opinions about a products merits or demerits

-using a scientifically valid test that proves two signals/frames/clocks/etc are identical or nearly identical (ABX testing)

 

and he has no reason to ban anyone for these things because nobody on this forum PAYS for the right to look good on it.

 

At least not yet

 

 

No, no difference.

 

o2/ODAC has 2x and 6.5x gain as standard. All headphones will benefit from a good amp/DAC.

 

note that, however, reaching the "good" level is a very low bar.  Amazing how many designs trip right over it though.

[geogga]

Yea, really makes me skeptical.

So the schiit stack will somewhat benefit the mad dogs, but the 02/odac make the mad dogs benefit even more from the JDslabs combo.

If I were to get the JDS combo, would I set it to low or high gain? Also, should I mainly use the amp's knob or my desktop's volume? Like should I max one out and then use the other to adjust?

Sorry if I am asking too much questions, just want my setup to work fine without spending too many hours configuring it.

thanks again Mayflower and h264

[h264]

Yea, really makes me skeptical.

So the schiit stack will somewhat benefit the mad dogs, but the 02/odac make the mad dogs benefit even more from the JDslabs combo.

If I were to get the JDS combo, would I set it to low or high gain? Also, should I mainly use the amp's knob or my desktop's volume? Like should I max one out and then use the other to adjust?

Sorry if I am asking too much questions, just want my setup to work fine without spending too many hours configuring it.

thanks again Mayflower and h264

 

 

Any amp would sound about the same given that it's well designed.  It's better to use the analog volume pot and max your computer's volume, yes.  Which is the problem the Magni presents, it's too loud for most headphones at even very low volumes and the gain can't be adjusted to match.

[geogga]

Any amp would sound about the same given that it's well designed.  It's better to use the analog volume pot and max your computer's volume, yes.  Which is the problem the Magni presents, it's too loud for most headphones at even very low volumes and the gain can't be adjusted to match.

Thank you for clarifying! So the magni is too powerful, but the JDS has the highlow gain switch which helps for volume.

Would I set it to low or high in this situation?

[tehsprayer]

The T50RP should be on low gain. Actually it should always be on low gain unless your headphones really need the high gain to drive them!

 

http://www.headfonia.com/headfonia-tips-keep-your-amps-at-low-gain/

[h264]

The T50RP should be on low gain. Actually it should always be on low gain unless your headphones really need the high gain to drive them!

 

http://www.headfonia.com/headfonia-tips-keep-your-amps-at-low-gain/

 

The 6.5x gain only exists to use with low-power portable players to begin with.  The ODAC has a 2VRMS output, so it's going to output quite a bit at 6.5x gain.

[ShearMe]

other myths include:

slam

sibilance

warmth

clincalness

musicality

etc.

 

all of which describe VOLUME and nothing more.  Volume matching is very hard to do properly, though, and so many people (me included!) have been fooled.

 

Simblance is very real with Beyerdynamics, so I assume it can happen with other headphones as well.

[geogga]

Hey guys, so other than the schiit, how is the o2 compared to the emotiva and matrix mstage?

[EmoRarity]

Simblance is very real with Beyerdynamics, so I assume it can happen with other headphones as well.

ED10.

[MayflowerElectronics]

Hey guys, so other than the schiit, how is the o2 compared to the emotiva and matrix mstage?

It's measurably and audibly better.

[tehsprayer]

I wonder how the mad dogs run on the schiit vali!

[EmoRarity]

Poorly, Schiit is shit. 

[tehsprayer]

Poorly, Schiit is shit. 

I think they're a decent product, the only people that seem to disagree is this forum

[EmoRarity]

I think they're a decent product, the only people that seem to disagree is this forum

They measure poorly, they were built by Luddites that have no clue what they're doing, and represent whats wrong in the "audiophile" world. 

[tehsprayer]

They measure poorly, they were built by Luddites that have no clue what they're doing, and represent whats wrong in the "audiophile" world. 

Can you compare measurements between o2, magni and vali and explain? People are saying magni and o2 sound very similar and pick the better looking one.

[LinusTech]

I'm going to order a Schiit Stack today. Review forthcoming.

 

We'll put this to rest.

[EmoRarity]

Can you compare measurements between o2, magni and vali and explain? People are saying magni and o2 sound very similar and pick the better looking one.

Most Schiit products have a really high gain and output impedance, the Vali more so since its part tube amp, which is...bad. 

 

I'm going to order a Schitt Stack today. Review forthcoming.

 

We'll put this to rest.

No point its been done before, and ignored because hail the shiny square thing thats good because Schiit said its good. 

Save your dollar bills and just get the Magni if you ignore this, which I'm expecting you to do. 

Don't need the dac which makes zero impact on tonality.