Kinguin Official Thread - contact a site representative.

[ItsMitch]

1 minute ago, Canada EH said:

 

So what are buyers not getting refunds?

I never raised that complaint? Why are you asking me? I only said about the "protection" paywall is utter bullshit. 

e: you might be getting me confused tho, i'm confused but it's all ok  

[AshleyAshes]

1 minute ago, aisle9 said:

Ever had someone claim INAD on a motherboard listed as "For Parts or Not Working" because it doesn't work, and eBay takes your money back anyway?

I had no idea you could get a refund on Parts Not Working stuff on eBay.   I saw a few CPUs listed 'cheapish' but 'untested, so for parts only' and I opted not to buy them assuming the risk of them being DOA vs the cost involved would be too high.

[aisle9]

2 minutes ago, valdyrgramr said:

Yes, they do.  However, ebay and amazon still allow relisting of the item.  You can find plenty of fake 970s and other GPUs all throughout ebay that don't get removed or are relisted.  Amazon knowingly has sellers listing bootlegs anime box sets from Malaysia.  Every one of these markets is flawed in some manner with illegal and shady practices.  

eBay and Amazon have countless thousands of sellers, they refund buyers almost without question, and they can and do ban them for enough policy violations. Kinguin has, like, six, and they don't care.

2 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

I had no idea you could get a refund on Parts Not Working stuff on eBay.   I saw a few CPUs listed 'cheapish' but 'untested, so for parts only' and I opted not to buy them assuming the risk of them being DOA vs the cost involved would be too high.

You're not supposed to be able to, and the hell if I'm going to tell you how they did it lol. I don't ever want to see that in my inbox again.

[Kinguin Official]

Hello.

 

Thank you for all your comments and inquiries.

In order to be granted a Merchant status, every candidate must go through a verification. Moreover, to be allowed to sell software at our store, sellers are required to undergo an additional product verification. We carry it out to authenticate the source and validity of the uploaded keys. These procedures are crucial to us and we take it very seriously as we want to ensure that only valid items are put on sale. From that point we would like to emphasize this, that we attach huge importance to the quality of sold products.
 

The only exception from verification are Community Sellers (C2C / Customer 2 Customer), who have limited options and as such they are not allowed selling softwares. Apart from that, they can put on sale up to 5 items at the same time. Such customers have also a dedicated tag which makes it easier to recognize offers from this kind of sellers:

This is why, we recommend choosing Merchants with the best feedbacks rating which is visible right next to the Merchant name. Sadly, despite our best efforts we are all humans and mistakes might happen. However, we would like to highlight that thanks to our internal security procedures, it is an extremely rare situation comparing to the vast majority of flawless orders. What is more, we are offering 24/7 support on our site to help in such circumstances and are always more than happy to assist with any trouble regarding activation. If the issue with the product is confirmed, one is offered either a refund or a replacement item.
 

When it comes to phone activation, it is simply another method of authenticating your Windows key. We do not conduct it on customer’s behalf thus we do not have access to client’s phone number - but we can of course guide the user through that process if he requests our assistance. We bring up this method as such feature helps with most of the hiccups with an activation that may appear due to, for example, incorrect system file installed. 
 

Regarding Buyer Protection, we offer it to enable more solutions which are not available without it - such as a guarantee of a refund for an already owned Random product or an even faster support assistance. We appreciate all the comments concerning it and we will most certainly take the made points into consideration. 

Like it has been mentioned - and we would really like to stress it - issues with activation concerns the huge minority of sold products. We have dedicated unit that makes sure only verified sellers are allowed to sell software products and they do their best to make certain the sold items come from authenticate source. 
 

[ItsMitch]

46 minutes ago, Kinguin Official said:

When it comes to phone activation, it is simply another method of authenticating your Windows key. We do not conduct it on customer’s behalf thus we do not have access to client’s phone number - but we can of course guide the user through that process if he requests our assistance. We bring up this method as such feature helps with most of the hiccups with an activation that may appear due to, for example, incorrect system file installed. 

So you let your market sellers have access to our phone numbers? Where's the security for our phone numbers? Doesn't this seem unethical to you? There's nothing in your ToS that I can see that guarantees that our phone numbers are secure. Why should we need to hand over our private contact numbers to your clients because you're unable to locate the correct system file? 

 

49 minutes ago, Kinguin Official said:

Regarding Buyer Protection, we offer it to enable more solutions which are not available without it - such as a guarantee of a refund for an already owned Random product or an even faster support assistance. We appreciate all the comments concerning it and we will most certainly take the made points into consideration. 

Why not just offer free fast support to everyone? Surely it can't be hard to treat all  your customers as one instead of picking and choosing because they've paid you more. And for the "we'll be most certainly taking points into consideration" That's a lot of BS, Think we all know that it'll fall on deaf ears. 

[AshleyAshes]

Really, if anything, Kinguin's unwillingness to provide sufficient consumer protections without the consumer paying extra for them shows that they are so unsure about the reliability of purchases that they need that extra cost to cover it.

 

If they're unwilling to stand by their own sales platform without extra fees you won't see me willing to spend money there.

[dalekphalm]

27 minutes ago, SC2Mitch said:

So you let your market sellers have access to our phone numbers? Where's the security for our phone numbers? Doesn't this seem unethical to you? There's nothing in your ToS that I can see that guarantees that our phone numbers are secure. Why should we need to hand over our private contact numbers to your clients because you're unable to locate the correct system file? 

 

Why not just offer free fast support to everyone? Surely it can't be hard to treat all  your customers as one instead of picking and choosing because they've paid you more. And for the "we'll be most certainly taking points into consideration" That's a lot of BS, Think we all know that it'll fall on deaf ears. 

While I largely agree with your points:

 

Re: phone activation. 

 

I’m 99% sure they’re talking about Microsoft Phone activation of the product key. 

 

In such a case, neither the seller nor Kinguin would get your phone number.

 

You would have to call Microsoft and perform a standard “over the phone” activation sequence. 

[ItsMitch]

2 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

While I largely agree with your points:

 

Re: phone activation. 

 

I’m 99% sure they’re talking about Microsoft Phone activation of the product key. 

 

In such a case, neither the seller nor Kinguin would get your phone number.

 

You would have to call Microsoft and perform a standard “over the phone” activation sequence. 

Maybe @Kinguin Official don't mind commenting on the potential confusion I'm having? 

[aisle9]

1 hour ago, Kinguin Official said:

Regarding Buyer Protection, we offer it to enable more solutions which are not available without it - such as a guarantee of a refund for an already owned Random product or an even faster support assistance. We appreciate all the comments concerning it and we will most certainly take the made points into consideration.

Why would you not make those solutions available to anyone? eBay does not charge me for their Buyer Protection Guarantee. Amazon does not charge me extra to cover a purchase under their policy. Why do you feel that it's necessary to charge a buyer more for what amounts to basic buyer protections against fraud?

 

You mention that sellers and keys are verified...how? What do you do to satisfy yourselves that a seller is not fraudulent and a key is not garbage? What about before reselling it?

 

You say that "if the issue with the product is confirmed," you offer a refund or replacement. How does one confirm a junk key? What is required for you to accept a claim from a person, covered by buyer protection or not, that a key is fraudulent or already used?

[AshleyAshes]

8 minutes ago, aisle9 said:

Why would you not make those solutions available to anyone? eBay does not charge me for their Buyer Protection Guarantee. Amazon does not charge me extra to cover a purchase under their policy. Why do you feel that it's necessary to charge a buyer more for what amounts to basic buyer protections against fraud?

Because so much fraud takes place on Kinguin that fraud protection would make the company loose money unless they charged extra for it.

[Atmos]

10 minutes ago, SC2Mitch said:

Maybe @Kinguin Official don't mind commenting on the potential confusion I'm having? 

There's not really much to comment on, you just had the wrong idea of what Phone activation was in concerns to windows.

You just receive the product key, then start the installation process, and when prompted call a particular number at microsoft to activate the copy. The reason that phone activation has been shady in the past is because it can sometimes be used to activate illegitimate keys.

[dalekphalm]

 

1 hour ago, SC2Mitch said:

Maybe @Kinguin Official don't mind commenting on the potential confusion I'm having? 

Yeah I'm in agreement with @Atmos. When I read the phone activation statement by them, I was not confused in the slightest.

 

Maybe you've never dealt with the phone activation system before? It was much more common to need to use it back in Windows XP, and to a lesser degree, Windows Vista/7.

 

I've never had to use it with Windows 10.

1 hour ago, Atmos said:

There's not really much to comment on, you just had the wrong idea of what Phone activation was in concerns to windows.

You just receive the product key, then start the installation process, and when prompted call a particular number at microsoft to activate the copy. The reason that phone activation has been shady in the past is because it can sometimes be used to activate illegitimate keys.

Agreed - I would be super INCREDIBLY shocked, if this wasn't what they were talking about.

[ItsMitch]

1 minute ago, dalekphalm said:

Yeah I'm in agreement with @Atmos. When I read the phone activation statement by them, I was not confused in the slightest.

 

I think I must be confused with another site where if your key gets flagged for suspicious purchase, then you need to provide a number

2 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Maybe you've never dealt with the phone activation system before? It was much more common to need to use it back in Windows XP, and to a lesser degree, Windows Vista/7.

 

No good sir, most of my machines have been from other companies so it was already setup for me. 

[dalekphalm]

2 minutes ago, SC2Mitch said:

I think I must be confused with another site where if your key gets flagged for suspicious purchase, then you need to provide a number

No good sir, most of my machines have been from other companies so it was already setup for me. 

Even if it was already setup, if you had to reinstall Windows - especially if you had to swap a major component due to failure, it would often pick your computer up as a "new" machine, forcing phone activation.

 

Plus I did PC repairs for many years, personally, and at various businesses - and this was incredibly common back then.

 

Now a days, I work in corporate IT for a Library, so I've never needed to do a phone activation since then.

[Kinguin Official]

Hello,

 

We understand your concerns, please be assured that none of your personal details are being used during the phone activation process. 

 

As mentioned before, we guide through the process. While performing it you will be contacting Microsoft free of charge line which is specified for this purpose. Bot available on it will provide you with the code to activate your serial. It is a recommended alternative key authentication, instead of verifying through the Internet. It helps if there was an unexpected error during the installation. 

 

We would like to also emphasize that regardless of the purchased Buyer Protection we will still help every Customer in need. By no means, the lack of Buyer Protection will discard the Customer from our assistance in case of a faulty product. However, should the Customer change his mind about the purchased item, we might not accept a return of it without Buyer Protection. The lack of Buyer Protection may also lead to a slower response time.

 

Sadly, due to safety reasons, we are unable to share specific details of our procedures. However, among our biggest assets, we have dedicated teams of experts in according fields. Our experienced specialists make sure to thoroughly examine every case and bring a solution as quickly as possible. Customer satisfaction is the most important goal for us, so we always work in sweat to provide with the smoothest and fastest service.

 

We would like to also mention that we are constantly improving our store. Therefore, we keep on advancing our security each day. 

 

We also appreciate the feedback which came from this conversation. It has been already noted and we are glad to know the community perspective on our site. 

[AshleyAshes]

13 minutes ago, Kinguin Official said:

We would like to also emphasize that regardless of the purchased Buyer Protection we will still help every Customer in need. By no means, the lack of Buyer Protection will discard the Customer from our assistance in case of a faulty product.

See, that's not very specific at all, you only say 'assistance' as the the level of customer service you will offer without Buyer Protection.  Meanwhile your own Buyer Protection documentation is a lot more specific;

 

 

"Fakes, cheats and trolls." a pretty clear statement that Buyer Protection offers fraud protection.  Can you answer in detail as to what level of fraud protection is provided for those who do not pay for Buyer Protection?  If you don't offer fraud protection as part of your 'Buyer Protection' scheme, exactly what 'assistance' can be offered in cases of fraud?

 

And if you do offer fraud protection for those who do not pay for Buyer Protection, then why is it only stated as being a feature of Buyer Protection and not being available to all purchases?  Wouldn't that be misleading, as part of an attempt to draw in Buyer Protection purchases by falsely advertising it's 'features' even if they are standard on all purchases?

[Egg-Roll]

I've never used this site but coming from G2A, assuming they function like them the ones with the highest ratings will likely be the most legit, that said it's windows, I've heard sketchy things about windows copies (from G2A) coming from cheap student only sources or something along those lines, 100% legit copies but their purpose was not being used as intended and MS invalidating them.

 

For those who want a cheap windows key run out and buy a dirty refurb computer... I have 2 as is ASUS which cost $70 a piece both with legit copies of windows 10 that's not associated with hardware... No offense to OP, but that is literally the safest route.

 

I've stopped using G2A and switched over to Humble Monthly/etc for obvious reasons.

 

22 hours ago, AshleyAshes said:

Who the heck at LMG thought that -this- was a good idea?

[ItsMitch]

18 minutes ago, Kinguin Official said:

Sadly, due to safety reasons, we are unable to share specific details of our procedures. However, among our biggest assets, we have dedicated teams of experts in according fields. Our experienced specialists make sure to thoroughly examine every case and bring a solution as quickly as possible. Customer satisfaction is the most important goal for us, so we always work in sweat to provide with the smoothest and fastest service.

 

So which is it? As @AshleyAshes posted, it's not clear at all and instead of answering the question, you dodge it like a curveball. 

[MedievalMatt]

Can I just take a moment to say something.  If you guys dont like Kinguin, or have concerns, or apprehensions.  Why not take your business elsewhere?  I have used their keys multiple times, and the only problems I have had are my own damn fault.

 

I dont think ripping them apart on their policies is the best way to go about things.  Theres clearly a store that aligned better with your personal viewpoints.

 

If you dont like how a company does business....dont do business with said company.

 

/s

[AshleyAshes]

Just now, MedievalMatt said:

If you guys dont like Kinguin, or have concerns, or apprehensions.  Why not take your business elsewhere?  I have used their keys multiple times, and the only problems I have had are my own damn fault.

If the Kinguin does not want to face questions from the users of this forum they are free to 'take their business elsewhere' and refrain from posting on this forum.

[ItsMitch]

Just now, AshleyAshes said:

If the Kinguin does not want to face questions from the users of this forum they are free to 'take their business elsewhere' and refrain from posting on this forum.

 

2 minutes ago, MedievalMatt said:

/s

 good baiting

[Egg-Roll]

9 minutes ago, MedievalMatt said:

Can I just take a moment to say something.  If you guys dont like Kinguin, or have concerns, or apprehensions.  Why not take your business elsewhere?  I have used their keys multiple times, and the only problems I have had are my own damn fault.

 

I dont think ripping them apart on their policies is the best way to go about things.  Theres clearly a store that aligned better with your personal viewpoints.

 

If you dont like how a company does business....dont do business with said company.

 

/s

My biggest question is why would a LMG employee permit them to even be classified as a Industry Affiliate? While we are at it why not G2A Ebay Aliexpress... Hell why not PornHub too?

 

Also just because you've not had issues doesn't make their products legal... Even if it's a legal key if you're not the intended audience for that key type (as mentioned above like a student) your key can be deactivated by MS. To save a buck, yes. But IMO unlike steam keys and such Windows keys are more susceptible to being lost/deactivated.

 

7 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

If the Kinguin does not want to face questions from the users of this forum they are free to 'take their business elsewhere' and refrain from posting on this forum.

Very disconcerting... When a company diverts things it's signs to avoid them...

Edited February 22, 2018 by Egg-Roll
Bad me... (Spelling)

[MedievalMatt]

1 minute ago, Egg-Roll said:

My biggest question is why would a LMG employee permit them to even be classified as a Industry Affiliate? While we are at it why not G2A Ebay Aliexpress... Hell why not PornHub too?

 

Also just because you've not had issues doesn't make their products legal... Even if it's a legal key if you're not the intended audience for that key type (as mentioned above like a student) your key can be deactivated by MS. To save a but, yes. But IMO unlike steam keys and such Windows keys are more susceptible to being lost/deactivated.

 

Very disconcerting... When a company diverts things it's signs to avoid them...

To be fair.  I have in current use 3 windows licenses from them.  All purchased with the mindset of "well its $30, even if they get nuked in a year it at least delays the $100 dick up the ass the MS wants me to take.  100% worth it."

 

All 3 are still working 2+ years later.  While I understand i am an individual, and not representative about the whole.  I felt like i should share my story and as least lend this conversation a small shred of positivity toward Kinguin.

 

A constructive Dialogue requires thinking critically, and you cant do that if your just brow beating them.

[AshleyAshes]

13 minutes ago, Egg-Roll said:

Very disconcerting... When a company diverts things it's signs to avoid them...

My real concern is the language involved.  When they say this;

 

Quote

By no means, the lack of Buyer Protection will discard the Customer from our assistance in case of a faulty product.

They are trying to 'hint' that lack of Buyer Protection offers anti-fraud measures but not actually saying that.  This means that users can assume that there will be fraud protections when there are not.  By not saying it directly, they can say that they NEVER said that there would be fraud protection only 'customer assistance' which likely doesn't go beyond customer support suggesting the user pay for buyer protection next time.

 

Unless I'm wrong and Kinguin outright states that fraud protection is offered without paying for Buyer Protection, that would that Kinguin has been utilizing this forum for the express purpose of misleading it's users.

 

WHICH I'M SURE THAT LMG, THE MODS, AND @LinusTech ARE TOTALLY NOT OKAY WITH, RIGHT?

[ItsMitch]

1 minute ago, Keith W said:

Who at LMG gave clearance for this?

 

According to Colt, he said "Any company can apply for the program" in a DM when I expressed concern over it.