Is my repair tech correct?

[fear92]

Unfortunately my mobo went bad ( probably something fried up) so I went to get it checked up at my local repair store, and the verdict is the motherboard.

 

System:

 

-Motherboard Asus Z97m Plus

-Cpu Intel 4690k

-Ram G Skill Sniper 8gb 1866mhz

-Gpu Nvidia 760 Asus 2gb

-Psu Antec 650w Silent Edge (which we tested and found to have perfect wattage and voltage)

-Storage 2 hdds 1 ssd 

 

Since motherboards with this chipset are a little hard to come by he is looking for a new one to replace the bad one.

 

While we were talking I expressed my interest in buying an Nvidia 1080 (or wait for the new series) and then buy am Oculus Rift, at that point he raised his eyebrows saying that a 650w would never cut it for a 1080, and that it would always be near maximum load, now how correct is he about this statement?

 

I always read about people running a 1080 with a 500w or 650w, is going for a 750w (like he suggests) overkill?

[WereCat]

650W is way more than enough for GTX 1080.

[Davidwr80]

650w is fine for a 4690l+1080

[Majestic]

The PSU will be fine, that i5 will struggle to maintain 90fps though.

[johnukguy]

He's being a bit dramatic, unless you are intending on running two 1080's at the same time, but has a point. The 1080 requires around 600w but, if you overclock and are adding more bits to the PC then it's worth moving up to a 750w PSU I would think.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-review,8.html

[fear92]

13 minutes ago, Majestic said:

The PSU will be fine, that i5 will struggle to maintain 90fps though.

Would it be smarter to just idle on this system and at some point in the future (1-2 years down the line) do the whole cpu+gpu+mobo+ram upgrade?

 

14 minutes ago, johnukguy said:

He's being a bit dramatic, unless you are intending on running two 1080's at the same time, but has a point. The 1080 requires around 600w but, if you overclock and are adding more bits to the PC then it's worth moving up to a 750w PSU I would think.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-review,8.html

 

So my take from the article is that a 650w might be fine, but adding a safety net of 750w would be the best choice, especially in the case that the gpu might come with a factory overclock and a higher tdp than a stock one.

[johnukguy]

3 minutes ago, fear92 said:

Would it be smarter to just idle on this system and at some point in the future (1-2 years down the line) do the whole cpu+gpu+mobo+ram upgrade?

 

 

So my take from the article is that a 650w might be fine, but adding a safety net of 750w would be the best choice, especially in the case that the gpu might come with a factory overclock and a higher tdp than a stock one.

For the first, maybe wait until March when the new Ryzens will be generally available and then decide. For the PSU, I'd recommend a 750W yes.

[Sakkura]

27 minutes ago, Majestic said:

The PSU will be fine, that i5 will struggle to maintain 90fps though.

VR games have generally less CPU load per frame. The CPU will be fine.

24 minutes ago, johnukguy said:

He's being a bit dramatic, unless you are intending on running two 1080's at the same time, but has a point. The 1080 requires around 600w but, if you overclock and are adding more bits to the PC then it's worth moving up to a 750w PSU I would think.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-review,8.html

He does not have a point. It's a 180W graphics card and an 88W CPU. Nvidia's official recommendation is a 500W power supply, but they tend to exaggerate what's needed.

8 minutes ago, fear92 said:

Would it be smarter to just idle on this system and at some point in the future (1-2 years down the line) do the whole cpu+gpu+mobo+ram upgrade?

 

 

So my take from the article is that a 650w might be fine, but adding a safety net of 750w would be the best choice, especially in the case that the gpu might come with a factory overclock and a higher tdp than a stock one.

Just keep what you have now, it's fine for current VR games. It might come up short 2-3 years from now, but then there'll be even better (or cheaper) upgrade options available than today.

 

650W already has a huge safety margin, 750W is just plain overkill and a waste of money.

[johnukguy]

6 minutes ago, Sakkura said:

650W already has a huge safety margin, 750W is just plain overkill and a waste of money.

Try reading the article. An extra 50W isn't a 'huge safety margin,' 

"GeForce GTX 1070 / 1080 - On your average system the card requires you to have a 600 Watts power supply unit...

If you are going to overclock your GPU or processor, then we do recommend you purchase something with some more stamina.

There are many good PSUs out there, please do have a look at our many PSU reviews as we have loads of recommended PSUs for you to check out in there. What could happen if your PSU can't cope with the load is:

• Bad 3D performance
• Crashing games
• Spontaneous reset or imminent shutdown of the PC
• Freezing during gameplay
• PSU overload can cause it to break down"
  
  The 520W minimum requirement for the GTX 1080 is for the reference design originally. Custom cards draw more power. 

 

[Sakkura]

2 minutes ago, johnukguy said:

Try reading the article. An extra 50W isn't a 'huge safety margin,'

It's not just an extra 50W. It's 50W on top of their already very generous (exaggerated) safety margin. It's 150W on top of Nvidia's already generous safety margin.

 

It's a 180W GPU and an 88W CPU. Even with overclocking, that's not going to push a system past 600W at peak CPU+GPU load. It's not even going to reach 500W.

[johnukguy]

1 minute ago, Sakkura said:

It's not just an extra 50W. It's 50W on top of their already very generous (exaggerated) safety margin. It's 150W on top of Nvidia's already generous safety margin.

 

It's a 180W GPU and an 88W CPU. Even with overclocking, that's not going to push a system past 600W at peak CPU+GPU load. It's not even going to reach 500W.

Again, try reading the article:

 

"GeForce GTX 1070 / 1080 - On your average system the card requires you to have a 600 Watts power supply unit...

If you are going to overclock your GPU or processor, then we do recommend you purchase something with some more stamina."

If you know better, by all means contact Guru3d and let them know they're wrong. If you want the contact details for the author, who is also the editor in chief, they're freely available on the web site. When you do, say hi for Hilbert for me and remind him that he owes me a beer.

[Sakkura]

Just now, johnukguy said:

Again, try reading the article:

 

"GeForce GTX 1070 / 1080 - On your average system the card requires you to have a 600 Watts power supply unit...

If you are going to overclock your GPU or processor, then we do recommend you purchase something with some more stamina."

If you know better, by all means contact Guru3d and let them know they're wrong. If you want the contact details for the author, who is also the editor in chief, they're freely available on the web site. When you do, say hi for Hilbert for me and remind him that he owes me a beer.

Try reading my post. Their recommendation is exaggerated. They use an overclocked 5960X in their "average" system and don't even measure the GPU power consumption.

 

Even with a big overclock, you're not going to get a GTX 1080 to draw 300W. And you're not going to get a 4690K much past 150W (if it even gets that high). So even at the very rare combination of 100% CPU load and 100% GPU load, they will combine for no more than 450W power draw, and probably considerably less. And no, the rest of the system is not going to draw >150W.

[johnukguy]

14 minutes ago, Sakkura said:

Try reading my post. Their recommendation is exaggerated. They use an overclocked 5960X in their "average" system and don't even measure the GPU power consumption.

 

Even with a big overclock, you're not going to get a GTX 1080 to draw 300W. And you're not going to get a 4690K much past 150W (if it even gets that high). So even at the very rare combination of 100% CPU load and 100% GPU load, they will combine for no more than 450W power draw, and probably considerably less. And no, the rest of the system is not going to draw >150W.

I read your post, if it comes down to choosing between the editor of Guru3d, the tech guy that the OP has already spoken to, and randoms on here who repeat the idea that was around when 1080 custom cards first came out, that you really can do just fine with a 500W PSU (and then wonder why other problems start coming up), then it's up to the OP to decide. Hard one that. 

[fear92]

9 minutes ago, johnukguy said:

I read your post, if it comes down to choosing between the editor of Guru3d, the tech guy that the OP has already spoken to, and randoms on here who repeat the idea that was around when 1080 custom cards first came out, that you really can do just fine with a 500W PSU (and then wonder why other problems start coming up), then it's up to the OP to decide. Hard one that. 

Sorry to  if I'm interrupting the discussion, but I checked out Guru3ds review on the Asus Strix 1080 and in the power consumption page he mentioned this

 

"Power consumption is a fair amount higher compared to the reference card. Here is Guru3D's power supply recommendation:

• GeForce GTX 1080 - On your average system we recommend a 500 Watt power supply unit.
• GeForce GTX 1080 SLI - On your average system we recommend a 750 Watt power supply unit.

If you are going to overclock your GPU or processor, then we do recommend you purchase something with some more stamina. Also, at half the PSU load (50% usage) your PSU is the most energy efficient.

 

Are you sure that you copied that correctly ( or maybe that you didnt' look at an old review? Might it be that he suggest a higher wattage for power efficiency?

[johnukguy]

You can read it for yourself on the page of the review link given, it says 600W, which I would agree with. 500W may be the minimum, but I really wouldn't advise it for any system running a 1080.

[fear92]

Sorry I was reading the discussion and I forgot to check the linked review.

[Sakkura]

32 minutes ago, johnukguy said:

I read your post, if it comes down to choosing between the editor of Guru3d, the tech guy that the OP has already spoken to, and randoms on here who repeat the idea that was around when 1080 custom cards first came out, that you really can do just fine with a 500W PSU (and then wonder why other problems start coming up), then it's up to the OP to decide. Hard one that. 

The editor of Guru3d is making recommendations based on deeply flawed evidence, as they do not even measure the GPU's power consumption. This also belies their flawed methodology.

 

But sure, get your editor friend over here to explain how 180W + 88W turns into >600W.

[johnukguy]

The fact is that yes, a 500W is the theoretical minimum, but with overclocking above  a 650W may be better to be on the safe side. Not that I'm advising the OP to rush out and buy a 750W right now. This would be for further on down the line. As I said, the tech was being dramatic. But you go tell Hilbert that he's wrong. I'm sure you know better than those who do this for a living.  In fact, why haven't you fired off an email already? 

[Sakkura]

3 minutes ago, johnukguy said:

You tell Hilbert that. I'm sure you know better than those who do this for a living.

I don't care about him, you seem to be making an appeal to authority. I'd rather rely on evidence than logical fallacies, and all evidence clearly shows that a 650W power supply is plenty for a GTX 1080 and Core i5-4690K.

[johnukguy]

Why yes, I am making an appeal to authority. Well spotted. You get a gold star. This is a technical subject, so a review from a professional is relevant, not a debate in high school. But do go email Hilbert. I'm sure he loves getting email from randos who think they know it all. I know I do.  The main point though is that this little argument that you are so invested in is profoundly irrelevant. It's up to the OP to decide, and, as I said, yet again, the tech was being dramatic, there is no need to rush out and buy a 750W or somesuch right now. But you carry on arguing for the sake of it. Knock yourself out kid. See how that works out for you.

[seon123]

1 hour ago, johnukguy said:

You can read it for yourself on the page of the review link given, it says 600W, which I would agree with. 500W may be the minimum, but I really wouldn't advise it for any system running a 1080.

Recommending am overkill PSU is stupid, especially based on a review that doesn't actually test power draw, and basing it on Nvidia's numbers, which assume the worst case scenario (incredibly bad group regulated PSUs). If you look at actual reviews that test the power consumption, you'll find this:

Spoiler

https://www.anandtech.com/show/10325/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-and-1070-founders-edition-review/30

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/GeForce-GTX-1080-8GB-Founders-Edition-Review-GP104-Brings-Pascal-Gamers/PC-Pe

 

Even assuming that overclocking will increase the power draw by a ridiculous 50%, you still end up at under 500W. 

[johnukguy]

Like I said, yet again, the tech was being overly dramatic and no, there is no urgent need to rush out right now and get a higher wattage PSU. However, I would still recommend a higher wattage PSU than the base 500W. You might think that's stupid. I really don't care. You and most of those commenting don't do this for a living and it's really up to the OP what he decides to do. We are not him. It's his decision alone. Just saying, 'it's stupid,' or 'I don't agree' is fine of course but there's nothing to really back that up and it's essentially meaningless. If the OP decides to play it safe and get another PSU, great. If he doesn't, then that's great too. 

[johnukguy]

Just now, seon123 said:

I did have sources that tested the load of both the system, and just the GPU. But oh well, facts are apparently meaningless.

  Reveal hidden contents

Ignorance intensifies

 

Oh you mean for founders edition cards that draw less power, just after launch...gotcha. Now, try and keep up, I'm going to say this one more time, it's not up to us to decide and arguing for the sake of it doesn't move anything forward and doesn't help the OP (remember him?). We've put forward our opinions and it's now up to the OP to decide. But if you want to keep arguing for the sake of it, and producing 'facts' for founders edition cards, hey go for it, you have the time to waste obviously.  Lucky you. The main possible outcomes are that in a few months or whatever, the OP decides he does want to get say a 700 or 750W PSU, which is great. Or, he decides that he's fine as he is, which is also great. Do you follow that? Does it sink in? There is no real argument there, it's up to the OP now. He's an adult and will make his own decisions. 

[seon123]

5 minutes ago, johnukguy said:

Oh you mean for founders edition cards that draw less power, just after launch

So a custom 1080 would draw 300W more than a FE 1080. Gotcha. And the power draw is going to increase after launch. Gotcha. 

All I'm doing is trying to make sure OP doesn't make a choice based on misinformation. 

[STRMfrmXMN]

On 12/27/2017 at 3:58 AM, johnukguy said:

He's being a bit dramatic, unless you are intending on running two 1080's at the same time, but has a point. The 1080 requires around 600w but, if you overclock and are adding more bits to the PC then it's worth moving up to a 750w PSU I would think.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-review,8.html

A 750W PSU is what I'd recommend for two 1080s with something like a 7700k.

 

On 12/27/2017 at 4:58 AM, johnukguy said:

I read your post, if it comes down to choosing between the editor of Guru3d, the tech guy that the OP has already spoken to, and randoms on here who repeat the idea that was around when 1080 custom cards first came out, that you really can do just fine with a 500W PSU (and then wonder why other problems start coming up), then it's up to the OP to decide. Hard one that. 

No problems will come from using a 500W PSU with a 1080 unless you pair it with something like a 6950X overclocked, so long as the unit is of decent quality.

 

On 12/27/2017 at 3:45 AM, fear92 said:

Unfortunately my mobo went bad ( probably something fried up) so I went to get it checked up at my local repair store, and the verdict is the motherboard.

 

System:

 

-Motherboard Asus Z97m Plus

-Cpu Intel 4690k

-Ram G Skill Sniper 8gb 1866mhz

-Gpu Nvidia 760 Asus 2gb

-Psu Antec 650w Silent Edge (which we tested and found to have perfect wattage and voltage)

-Storage 2 hdds 1 ssd 

 

Since motherboards with this chipset are a little hard to come by he is looking for a new one to replace the bad one.

 

While we were talking I expressed my interest in buying an Nvidia 1080 (or wait for the new series) and then buy am Oculus Rift, at that point he raised his eyebrows saying that a 650w would never cut it for a 1080, and that it would always be near maximum load, now how correct is he about this statement?

 

I always read about people running a 1080 with a 500w or 650w, is going for a 750w (like he suggests) overkill?

Yes, 750W is overkill. Your Antec Edge is a good unit and is plenty for a 1080 or 1080 Ti.