what does "over kill" even means?

[Maist]

Hi guys,

 

I know it's a noob question, but what does over kill even means?

Im playing on1080P and considering buying either the GTX1070 or the GTX1080 and i keep hearing that the GTX1080 is an over kill. But, i mean, doesnt getting a GTX1080 means that i'll get better preformance for a longer time peroid?

 

Thanks

[aisle9]

Overkill is like dropping a nuke to take out one person. Yeah, you got them, and you got a million people with them. Overkill.

[Maist]

2 minutes ago, aisle9 said:

Overkill is like dropping a nuke to take out one person. Yeah, you got them, and you got a million people with them. Overkill.

But doesnt it mean that with the 1080 i'll get better preformance in a longer time period?

[Volbet]

To ´over kill´ means to use excesive means to achieve a goal. 

 

In your case, your goal is to achieve playable a framerate at 1080p.

The GTX 1080 will surely deliver that, but so will a lower end card. 

By using a GTX 1080 for playing games at 1080p you are also throwing money at potential that you can't utilize.

 

And sure, the GTX 1080 will perform better for a longer periode of time, but you will still be better off buying a lower end card now and then buying a new card 2-3 years down the line.

 

And to help me explain ´over kill´, here is Graham Chapman

 

Overkill is also a kick ass Motörhead song.

[The Realist]

1 minute ago, Maist said:

But doesnt it mean that with the 1080 i'll get better preformance in a longer time period?

Yea but eventually 1080p is gonna become older and you would wanna play at 4k which the 1080 is capable at high settings 60fps so your just future proofing your PC its not over kill to future proof your pc but it is over kill to game at a low resolution get the most powerful card at the time and then just upgrade in a year

[forthe48]

3 minutes ago, Maist said:

But doesnt it mean that with the 1080 i'll get better preformance in a longer time period?

Yes, the 1080 will "last longer" if you make it last longer, since it'll compete better with future series cards. That doesn't mean that it isn't still 'overkill' for what you're doing right now.

 

That's why people say it's overkill, because what you're trying to do right now could be accomplished easily by a lesser card.

[AresKrieger]

2 minutes ago, Maist said:

But doesnt it mean that with the 1080 i'll get better preformance in a longer time period?

Yes, but it might be overkill if say you plan to play 1080p since a card at about 50% the performance could achieve good fps at that resolution, unless you plan to get a 100+ fps monitor, just an example, if you have the money and are willing to spend it go for the better card if you want, no one is stopping you.

[aisle9]

2 minutes ago, Maist said:

But doesnt it mean that with the 1080 i'll get better preformance in a longer time period?

That's one way of looking at it, and it's a valid one. Witcher 3 proves that over time, games catch up to existing technology, and the same graphics card that could handle Crysis 2 at 1080p would now struggle with Witcher 3 at 1080p.

 

That said, buying a 1080 to play 1080p now seems kind of unnecessary. If you buy a $230 RX 480 today and a midrange card in two or three years to keep up at 1080p, you're still better off than had you purchased a single 1080. Basically, if all you're playing is 1080p, you probably won't have to 1080 long enough to even out the cost.

[Maist]

3 minutes ago, aisle9 said:

That's one way of looking at it, and it's a valid one. Witcher 3 proves that over time, games catch up to existing technology, and the same graphics card that could handle Crysis 2 at 1080p would now struggle with Witcher 3 at 1080p.

 

That said, buying a 1080 to play 1080p now seems kind of unnecessary. If you buy a $230 RX 480 today and a midrange card in two or three years to keep up at 1080p, you're still better off than had you purchased a single 1080. Basically, if all you're playing is 1080p, you probably won't have to 1080 long enough to even out the cost.

Oh i see.

So buttom line is - buying a GTX1080 now will give me more FPS than a GTX1070, but i wont notice anyways since 100FPS and 115FPS feels the same. But in three years, lets say witcher 4 will run bad on both, did i get it right?

[The Realist]

theres a difference between future proofing and overkill

-Future Proofing = When you buy at the time the highest end hardware you can and hope to use it to its maximum potential

-Overkill = You buy something you dont need=You buy a GTX 1080 for 1080p and then just upgrade in a year

[aisle9]

2 minutes ago, Maist said:

Oh i see.

So buttom line is - buying a GTX1080 now will give me more FPS than a GTX1070, but i wont notice anyways since 100FPS and 115FPS feels the same. But in three years, lets say witcher 4 will run bad on both, did i get it right?

Eh, not quite. A 1080 costs, what, $600? An RX 480 costs $230 and will handle 1080p for a couple of years. Let's say a hypothetical RX 680 drops in a couple of years priced at $250, and you purchase it to take over at 1080p/1440p. You've now purchased two cards for less than the price of one GTX 1080. If you see yourself going to 4K in the near future, then a 1080 is for you, but 1080p, even 1440p doesn't really require that level of expenditure.

[JefferyD90]

23 minutes ago, Maist said:

But doesnt it mean that with the 1080 i'll get better preformance in a longer time period?

What do you mean by "I'll get better performance in a longer period of time?"

 

If you mean that it will "future proof" your system, no not really.

[Maist]

3 minutes ago, JefferyD90 said:

What do you mean by "I'll get better performance in a longer period of time?"

 

If you mean that it will "future proof" your system, no not really.

why not?

 

[Maist]

5 minutes ago, aisle9 said:

Eh, not quite. A 1080 costs, what, $600? An RX 480 costs $230 and will handle 1080p for a couple of years. Let's say a hypothetical RX 680 drops in a couple of years priced at $250, and you purchase it to take over at 1080p/1440p. You've now purchased two cards for less than the price of one GTX 1080. If you see yourself going to 4K in the near future, then a 1080 is for you, but 1080p, even 1440p doesn't really require that level of expenditure.

Oh i see.

Well i didnt mention it but i only play on ultra, thats why i dont want to upgrade to 4k.  RX480 will start running medium or so in a year when the 1080/1070 wont, am i right?

[JefferyD90]

2 minutes ago, Maist said:

why not?

 

Video cards don't really work that way, no computer component does.  You're better off buying a $1000 computer today and another next year, than buying a $2000 computer today.

[Maist]

8 minutes ago, JefferyD90 said:

Video cards don't really work that way, no computer component does.  You're better off buying a $1000 computer today and another next year, than buying a $2000 computer today.

Well, that makes sense, but on the other hand it doesnt.

i bought a rig with an i7 2600k, 8GB ram and gtx570 about 5 years ago. costed me about 1500USD at the time. I only upgraded the GPU to GTX770 and overall it ran pretty damn good up untill lately. so basicly i paid about 1800USD total (sold the 570 and made some money of it) and had a pc that ran almost everything on very high - ultra for 4 years or so before starting to go medium on the fith year. 

 

 

[Delicieuxz]

Overkill simply means 'more than necessary or practical.' There's no point in overkilling something, because once it's killed, it's dead. Doing more isn't going to accomplish anything further, unless you're going to necro or something.

 

A GTX 1070 or 980ti is not overkill for 1080p gaming, and are probably the bare-minimum required in order to be able to play all currently-released games at max settings at 1080p. A GTX 970 cannot get 60 FPS in all currently-released games at maxed-settings 1080p, and so is not a future-proofed card for anyone planning to play graphically-intensive AAA games. The same is true of the GTX 980.

 

If a person wants to be maxing out AAA game graphics for the next couple of years at 1080p, a GTX 980ti or GTX 1070 will be needed.

[Mick Naughty]

People also tend to call things over kill based on a res and that's it. Not all games are created equal.

[Megazero]

As far as value goes like @aisle9 and @JefferyD90 said, the top of the line card will always be bad in that kind of sense. So for such resolution you are play it, something like a 480 or 1060 (when it come and when we know how it perform) or a 1070 would be a much better value compare to a 1080. a GTX 1080 is basically for people who want to BEST performance available NOW, if you go for value the x70 from Nvidia or AMD's card always provided a better one (learning my lesson after the 780)

Also another thing to keep in mind is the price you will be able to sell the old card when you decided to upgrade. For example in my case I was buying the 780 back then for like ~ 22000 baht in my country, 2-ish years later I sold it for ~ 10000 baht. I lost about 12000 baht in value there. I bought a 970 after I sold my 780, for around 12000 baht, And I just sold it a few weeks ago for ~ 9000 baht, losing only about 3000 in value. 

[JefferyD90]

5 minutes ago, Megazero said:

As far as value goes like @aisle9 and @JefferyD90 said, the top of the line card will always be bad in that kind of sense. So for such resolution you are play it, something like a 480 or 1060 (when it come and when we know how it perform) or a 1070 would be a much better value compare to a 1080. a GTX 1080 is basically for people who want to BEST performance available NOW, if you go for value the x70 from Nvidia or AMD's card always provided a better one (learning my lesson after the 780)

Also another thing to keep in mind is the price you will be able to sell the old card when you decided to upgrade. For example in my case I was buying the 780 back then for like ~ 22000 baht in my country, 2-ish years later I sold it for ~ 10000 baht. I lost about 12000 baht in value there. I bought a 970 after I sold my 780, for around 12000 baht, And I just sold it a few weeks ago for ~ 9000 baht, losing only about 3000 in value. 

Yea I'd be willing to say in 2 generations the 1080 will be a card hardly anyone will talk about.  I mean just think of 2 generations ago, that would have been the GTX 780...  While its still a nice card, everyone knows it has short comings and cant run the newest games at full tilt.

[Stoggy26]

if your running a 144hz monitor that can take advantage of the FPS then i dont think its really overkill outta a 15 game average it ran 134 FPS at 1080p some higher some lower 

[RedJamaX]

15 hours ago, The Realist said:

theres a difference between future proofing and overkill

-Future Proofing = When you buy at the time the highest end hardware you can and hope to use it to its maximum potential

-Overkill = You buy something you dont need=You buy a GTX 1080 for 1080p and then just upgrade in a year

Not true...  If you play at Ultra Settings with the latest most graphically demanding games, and you want frame rates above 60 ALL the time... , the GTX 1080 is not overkill.

But... the GTX 1070 does make more sense in a Bang-4-Buck comparison for 1080p game play.

[SkilledRebuilds]

GTX 1080 isn't overkill when you have DSR

 

You can do better with less,... but you don't have to..

 

Really depends on what you plan to do.. YOUR needs as always...

High-Refresh Panels Interest you? High-Resolution Panels? DSR can be used @ 1080p in the meantime, until you get a better suited setup.

 

I got my GTX 970 for 1080p+other reasons,... since release it was overkill to many people @ 1080p (esp OC'd), but now people would call the GTX970/980/R9-390/390x the sweetspot for 1080p gaming @ higher refresh rates, and almost 'needed' for brute forcing the performance from bad PC-ports.

 

[RedJamaX]

46 minutes ago, SkilledRebuilds said:

GTX 1080 isn't overkill when you have DSR

 and almost 'needed' for brute forcing the performance from bad PC-ports.

 

^^^ This

[othertomperson]

19 hours ago, Maist said:

But doesnt it mean that with the 1080 i'll get better preformance in a longer time period?

People have made that argument. You could spend £600 now, and then keep it for years and years. However, if you did that you would miss out on new features and possible driver optimisations. Imo it makes much more sense to spend £200, then in two years time spend another £200, and make some back by selling your old card. If you only upgrade to the newest mid-range card every other year and always have one of the most up to date products it will still take you six years to spend as much as you would have done on that one 1080.

 

Also an issue I had doing exactly this with dual 580s for years and years is that technology changes, and this approach leaves you behind. You might decide to buy a higher res monitor, but feel locked into a GPU combination that doesn't really suit it. You might find that even if the GPU itself is perfectly capable of it in terms of performance alone, it now lacks the up to date connectors to make it work. (For example a GTX 580 ought to be able to play something light like LoL at 4K, but you won't get more than 30fps purely because of the old DisplayPort/HDMI on it.) You might find some future Directx feature becomes prominent and your card just doesn't support it, regardless of how powerful that might still otherwise be. You are much better off splitting that massive £600 payment up across the years you intend to be using it with regular upgrades if you don't actually need the performance of the top tier card.