Swiss government wants universal charger for Smartphones in 2017

[theereal]

yeah i take offense to people like you! words are hurtful and you need to know that. what you say or write has an impact on people. now you are on the defense because someone called you out on it. i dont take calling people "dumb", "retarded", or "idiot" jokingly. they are serious matters and should be addressed seriously

[jaggysnake57]

capacitive touch: IBM 1960s (if you meant multi-touch, multi-touch: LG Prada)

high res display: LG GC900 Viewty Smart April 2009

fingerprint scanner: Pantech GI100 Q2 2004

apps: every symbian based phone could run java apps, every symbian based phones had a good enough browser to download said apps

really good phone cameras: Samsung i8910 Omnia HD May 2009

That's nice now show me where I said they were the first. When you take an idea and improve it that's called inovate, when you take an idea and just add it, that's copying

[dalekphalm]

They lead in the sense that they create and everyone else copies

 

 

That's nice now show me where I said they were the first. When you take an idea and improve it that's called inovate, when you take an idea and just add it, that's copying

I've quoted the post above. They "create", and everyone else copies. "Create" implies invention, or first to do so.

 

When you take an idea and improve it, you're not creating that idea.

[warmmilk]

I'm all for a standardized connector as long as its something durable...  as much as USB Type C is promising, it still looks pretty fragile...

 

I know LTT is full of apple haters, but honestly the Lightning connector is awesome.  if its something like that I can get behind it.

[Trixanity]

I never really understood the "usb is fragile". I've never broken any usb connectors nor have I heard/seen anyone break one in real life (ie not online). But I hear it so often online. Do people jam their cables into the socket or try to force it in the wrong way or something?

As far as I know they're also rated for 5k-10k insertions.

[suicidalfranco]

That's nice now show me where I said they were the first. When you take an idea and improve it that's called inovate, when you take an idea and just add it, that's copying

in·no·vate  (ĭn′ə-vāt′)

v. in·no·vat·ed, in·no·vat·ing, in·no·vates

v.tr.

To begin or introduce (something new) for the first time.

v.intr.

To begin or introduce something new.

[QueenDemetria]

I never really understood the "usb is fragile". I've never broken any usb connectors nor have I heard/seen anyone break one in real life (ie not online). But I hear it so often online. Do people jam their cables into the socket or try to force it in the wrong way or something?

As far as I know they're also rated for 5k-10k insertions.

I don't, but out of all of the connectors I have ever used, Micro USB has been the one connector that has failed me the most within the shortest amount of time.

[Guest]

In this thread we have witnessed a new Pokémon evolution.

'Charger cable discussion' evolved into...

*evolving music from the Pokémon games*

' Apple flame war/discussion!'

'Apple flame war/discussion' wants to learn the move 'torches and pitchforks'

[dizmo]

I find it pretty amusing that their whole idea behind this is to reduce unneeded waste.

Can someone tell me, though, how this will accomplish that?

Will you buy one charger, and then every device will come without one?

That wouldn't really make much sense. You'd have added waste from the packaging that the charger would have to come in.

Not only that, this is only for phones is it not? That makes even less sense in a market where there are only really 2 kinds of chargers.

 

I don't see this going in their favor, at all.

 

 

This could have really bad implications. What if the industry doesn't respond fast enough? Who makes the call to decide which new connector to implement? What if a superior-in-every-way connector is invented, but not adopted by the EU? *Cough* HDMI on TV's even though DP is better *cough*

 

As much as I'm not a big Apple Fan, the Lightning connector is awesome. It's just a tad expensive - though if everyone and their mother used Lightning, I bet the costs would come down at least some.

 

My major fear is that this will actually cause stagnation. We might end up being stuck on USB 3.0/3.1 C for years or decades because no one wants to invest in a connector that has no guarantee of even being allowed to be used on a phone.

 

It might also give the USB consortium a defacto monopoly, if they are the ones who "decide" (Granted, they pretty much already have one, but as it stands right now, new and innovative connectors (eg: Lightning) are still able to come out).

Please, Apple would never reduce the cost of the connector.

Remember, they cater to a "premium consumer".

I don't see this "law" passing in many places.

 

Oh please. Show me this arbitrary iPod touch replacement that has Android on it.

Oh wait, it doesn't exist? Now shut your damn mouth because your statement makes no sense.

 

Calling an entire product base "dumb" just makes you look like a fanboyish twat.

There are lots of excellent PMP's out there, though they don't run on Android.
Apple had the camp locked down for a long time but companies like Fiio are coming along very nicely. So don't be so arrogant thinking Apple is the only one in the game...

 

Uhhh... What? You actually think Apple will ditch Lightning for USB-C? Apple isn't exactly well known for going with what everyone else uses.

 

What makes you think that is likely?

Hah, they won't.

The people will rise up and the government will be forced to reverse the decision.

Extreme case, but most likely to happen.

 

-snip-

 

 

Edit:

They apparently did it only because 

 

 

What kind of logic is that? Make everyone throw away their non-micro usb connectors for the sake of reducing E-waste? 

See, that doesn't make any sense. You'd still have to include a charger with the phone...so where's the waste savings?

 

-snip-

Although I actually like Apple products and hate all phones Samsung has put out in the last 4 years.

I think he meant by profits, where they definitely lead. by an absolutely crushing margin.

Really? Tried the Note5? I haven't owned a Samsung phone since a slider in 2007, but I quite enjoy it.

Though I have come across more issues than the last 2 phones I've had. Thanks, TouchWiz.

 

And their phones receive updates for much longer on average than most competitors. 

Eh, it's not that hard when you put out maybe 2 devices a year.

I have many friends who have had their devices become unusable after the updates.

 

Apple are the only ones arrogant enough to not be doing that already. I wouldn't be surprised if they just stopped selling their stuff in Switzerland, they hardly need the market. I hope they standardize to type c though and not micro usb

I honestly think that's exactly what they'd do, and rightly so.

I also think that if the same thing happened in a more Applecentric area, the people would simply complain until they reversed the law.

Governments are elected in most places; you don't want to lose votes over something as stupid as a cell phone charger.

 

I'm not talking about the connector on the phone, it the one on the charger (USB type A female) the is universal.

It's not, though. For example the charger on my Nokia 520 is simply a cable with a wall wart on the end, with no USB end other than the one for the phone.

 

captive touch, hi res screens, premium finish, fingerprint scanners, apps, really good phone cameras, force touch.....all things apple pushed forward and all things that everyone started jumping on the band wagon with. they lead and people follow.

Force touch was out before Apple. So were good camera phones.

If you haven't noticed, all manufacturers borrow from each other. From automobiles to cell phones.

It's nothing new, and it's certainly not something only Apple does.

[jaggysnake57]

in·no·vate  (ĭn′ə-vāt′)

v. in·no·vat·ed, in·no·vat·ing, in·no·vates

v.tr.

To begin or introduce (something new) for the first time.

v.intr.

To begin or introduce something new.

 

i dont know what back water dictionary you pulled that from but oxford english

 

 

innovate

ˈɪnəveɪt/

verb

 

1. make changes in something established, especially by introducing new methods, ideas, or products.

   "the company's failure to diversify and innovate competitively"

   • introduce (something new, especially a product).

     "we continue to innovate new products"

 

you cant innovate something for the first time thats invention.

[ShadowCaptain]

Standardised chargers, yes please, micro usb, no

 

Please create some sort of GOOD standard, maybe like USB C mixed with Lightning 

[dalekphalm]

i dont know what back water dictionary you pulled that from but oxford english

 

 

you cant innovate something for the first time thats invention.

You do realize that the 2nd part of your definition is basically the same thing as what he posted, right?

 

Your quote:

 

introduce (something new, especially a product).

 

His quote:

 

v.tr.

To begin or introduce (something new) for the first time.

v.intr.

To begin or introduce something new.

So... yeah. Don't know what you're arguing about at this point.

 

Nobody ever claimed that Apple has never innovated. But they don't create or invent stuff very often.

[alpenwasser]

Since I was curious, this is the actual text in the law:

 

a. die Anlagen müssen mit bestimmtem Zubehör, insbesondere mit einheitlichen Ladegeräten, kompatibel sein;

p.5, Art.7. par. 3a.

source (pdf)

Which translates to:

a. The devices must be compatible with certain accessories, specifically with standardized charging devices;

As has been said earlier, the requirement apparently isn't specifically about which plug has to be on the phone itself, merely about the phone being compatible with a standardized charger. How that is actually accomplished is up to the manufacturer it seems. I haven't been able to find out which plug is the actual standard though. Not sure if this is not yet defined, or if it is in a technical document somewhere for which you have to pay money to gain access (not uncommon).

And yes, their rationale seems to be "fewer charging devices will be in existence, hence less e-waste". Though unless manufacturers stop bundling chargers with phones I'm not sure how they imagine that happening. Lawmakers can be silly like that. We shall see I suppose.

As for those arguing about "regulations stifling innovation": There are a crapload of norms and standards which have to be complied with if you want to be able to sell a device legally in any country (or most, at least, I reckon) anyway, this is absolutely nothing new. Hell, the pdf I linked from which that one paragraph is 34 pages long, and that doesn't actually have any detailed technical information in it at all, it's all as general and vague as the quote from above. The technical norms you have to comply with if you actually want to sell a device are far longer (and as said, usually you can only get access to them for money, they're rarely publicly available).

Now, this may or may not stifle innovation, but this has been going on for decades already. Sometimes it does more harm than good, sometimes more good than harm, c'est la vie.

[NuclearPeace]

I don't get why people get so caught up with who did it first or whether Apple invents things or not. It doesn't really matter. Everyone copies off or takes cues from other people. Being first doesn't have any more value than just that; being first. Yeah, the Motorola Atrix 4G came out with fingerprint scanner first, but it was just a novelty as Motorola didn't integrate it with the phone as a whole well enough for it to be used often. It was also made into a novelty in the fact that Motorola just fit the scanner in an awkward position instead of a place that was convenient.

 

Anyway, I wouldn't mind a standard phone port. Even though Lightning is probably technically superior, but USB C does the job while being royalty free.

[Lethal Seraph]

A universal fast charger 2.0? Hell yes.

[snes]

Nintendo did the exact same thing and everyone freaked out, bitched and complained that the 3DS didn't come with a charger.

[Guest Kloaked]

Dude, calm down It was a joke, Apple Isnt all bad, they do have for example a very good OS. OSX Is usually much more stable than Windows and their computers are tested to be stable before they are shipped... Learn to take a joke... damn.... Butthurt lvl 100...

YEAH CHILL OUT GUYS ITS JUST A PRANK BRO ITS JUST A PRANK XDDDDDD

[SydneySideSteveSomewheres]

Since I was curious, this is the actual text in the law:

 

p.5, Art.7. par. 3a.

source (pdf)

Which translates to:

As has been said earlier, the requirement apparently isn't specifically about which plug has to be on the phone itself, merely about the phone being compatible with a standardized charger. How that is actually accomplished is up to the manufacturer it seems. I haven't been able to find out which plug is the actual standard though. Not sure if this is not yet defined, or if it is in a technical document somewhere for which you have to pay money to gain access (not uncommon).

And yes, their rationale seems to be "fewer charging devices will be in existence, hence less e-waste". Though unless manufacturers stop bundling chargers with phones I'm not sure how they imagine that happening. Lawmakers can be silly like that. We shall see I suppose.

As for those arguing about "regulations stifling innovation": There are a crapload of norms and standards which have to be complied with if you want to be able to sell a device legally in any country (or most, at least, I reckon) anyway, this is absolutely nothing new. Hell, the pdf I linked from which that one paragraph is 34 pages long, and that doesn't actually have any detailed technical information in it at all, it's all as general and vague as the quote from above. The technical norms you have to comply with if you actually want to sell a device are far longer (and as said, usually you can only get access to them for money, they're rarely publicly available).

Now, this may or may not stifle innovation, but this has been going on for decades already. Sometimes it does more harm than good, sometimes more good than harm, c'est la vie.

@alpenwasser, those regulations are called patents (sometimes known as licencing) e.g. Xiaomi the largest mobile phone manufacturer in China wants to start selling their devices in the lucrative United States domestic market. Without the licence, they are not able to yet, when they do buy one it will be interesting to see who's fur gets riled.

The Japanese economy on average receives one Trillion per year in patent royalties and licencing from mostly China.

Link

The National Bureau of Asian Research.