Sapphire 390 vs MSI 970. Reliability vs FPS

[App4that]

You're mistaken, no one is defending AMD. You've already seen, I call out AMD if they pull bullshit. Same for Nvidia.

Now the problem here is, you're making a pretty hefty statement but...

1. You have no proof

2. No one else is experiencing the same

If you could share evidence of your findings, that be nice. But just plainly sharing empty words isn't gonna cut it. How would one know if you're just spouting bullshit?

It's actually quite easy, critical thinking. What do I have to gain, the forum supports the 390. I gain nothing offering evidence of flaws with the 390. I spend 330us dollars and when faced with not being able to crossfire sold the 390 not the 290. Now this could show that the 390 was easier to sell and I could get more of my money back with the 390. And I did have both for sale (I'm a sucker for fate having a say) but I kept the 290 rather than selling it. I could have sold the 290 and bought any number of better GPUs, I didn't. The only thing I have to gain with sharing my findings is a headache and forum warnings. Because saying anything negative about the 390 does not end well.

So, why would I? I've never said the 390 is a bad card and have personally talk people into choosing it, ask Don. Read carefully as I choose my words carefully and you'll see all I've done is vent my frustration on the situation of driver support holding the 390 back, never that the hardware was to blame.

OK, I do pick on the whole 8g of memory but come on LOL. That such a marketing ploy and you know it.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

It's actually quite easy, critical thinking. What do I have to gain, the forum supports the 390. I gain nothing offering evidence of flaws with the 390. I spend 330us dollars and when faced with not being able to crossfire sold the 390 not the 290. Now this could show that the 390 was easier to sell and I could get more of my money back with the 390. And I did have both for sale (I'm a sucker for fate having a say) but I kept the 290 rather than selling it. I could have sold the 290 and bought any number of better GPUs, I didn't. The only thing I have to gain with sharing my findings is a headache and forum warnings. Because saying anything negative about the 390 does not end well.

So, why would I? I've never said the 390 is a bad card and have personally talk people into choosing it, ask Don. Read carefully as I choose my words carefully and you'll see all I've done is vent my frustration on the situation of driver support holding the 390 back, never that the hardware was to blame.

OK, I do pick on the whole 8g of memory but come on LOL. That such a marketing ploy and you know it.

 

You gain nothing yes. I gain nothing for questioning your statement as well. What you sell, or what you kept, I don't care. That's not my concern. 

 

Look back at my post and notice, I've never once said anything bad about you not recommending the 390. I'm very simply questioning your statement. And the lack of any evidence. Don't turn this into a "oh, they're attacking me cause I said something bad about the 390". Sorry dude, but you really evidence to back that claim of yours. 

 

We didn't talk anything about hardware. I'm still questioning that clam claim of yours.

[App4that]

You gain nothing yes. I gain nothing for questioning your statement as well. What you sell, or what you kept, I don't care. That's not my concern.

Look back at my post and notice, I've never once said anything bad about you not recommending the 390. I'm very simply questioning your statement. And the lack of any evidence. Don't turn this into a "oh, they're attacking me cause I said something bad about the 390". Sorry dude, but you really evidence to back that claim of yours.

We didn't talk anything about hardware. I'm still questioning that clam of yours.

Sorry, you missed what I was saying. I was only offering evidence as to why I wouldn't have a reason to falsify evidence. Which I could do with a video too. You're welcome to think what you will, you're not my goal. My goal is offering what I found to those still undecided in what graphics card to buy because I could have saved a lot of time and energy if someone had done that for me.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

Sorry, you missed what I was saying. I was only offering evidence as to why I wouldn't have a reason to falsify evidence. Which I could do with a video too. You're welcome to think what you will, you're not my goal. My goal is offering what I found to those still undecided in what graphics card to buy because I could have saved a lot of time and energy if someone had done that for me.

 

I've already said, I don't care. So what if you say you won't falsify evidence? You can't even provide any sort of evidence to begin with. 

 

Empty claims mean nothing, it will just plainly lead you to spreading misinformation yet again. I hope you don't do that. Continue going around and spreading that claim and someone else will question you again.

[App4that]

I've already said, I don't care. So what if you say you won't falsify evidence? You can't even provide any sort of evidence to begin with.

Empty claims mean nothing, it will just plainly lead you to spreading misinformation yet again. I hope you don't do that. Continue going around and spreading that claim and someone else will question you again.

I have never spread misinformation, that's strike two. Information you don't like does not equal misinformation. I am not held by any rule to offer video evidence, unless you'd like to show me where in the TOS of this forum it says that only video evidence is admissible?

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

I have never spread misinformation, that's strike two. Information you don't like does not equal misinformation. I am not held by any rule to offer video evidence, unless you'd like to show me where in the TOS of this forum it says that only video evidence is admissible?

 

No, the TOS of this forum does not say you need to provide one. But this is really disappointing. I had really hope you won't use this manner of reasoning. The claim you made is a big one. But you refuse to provide any evidence and you cannot find someone with the same symptoms. 

 

Look over at the the Nvidia Shady image quality thread. As ridiculous as that claim was, OP managed to provide some evidence to back his claim. But you, you do not back your claim and now you're saying you won't provide one since you're not at liberty to? Disappointing.

[App4that]

No, the TOS of this forum does not say you need to provide one. But this is really disappointing. I had really hope you won't use this manner of reasoning. The claim you made is a big one. But you refuse to provide any evidence and you cannot find someone with the same symptoms.

Look over at the the Nvidia Shady image quality thread. As ridiculous as that claim was, OP managed to provide some evidence to back his claim. But you, you do not back your claim and now you're saying you won't provide one since you're not at liberty to? Disappointing.

And how do you expect me to offer the type of evidence you request? I no longer own that GPU. I wasn't comparing the two cards for you, but for me to see which to keep. It is you that is not looking at this correctly, or in a fair manner. I have been as accommodating as one could be expected with any information I have to share. So are you trying to raise the goal post to a hight unreachable, or is this a discussion?

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

And how do you expect me to offer the type of evidence you request? I no longer own that GPU. I wasn't comparing the two cards for you, but for me to see which to keep. It is you that is not looking at this correctly, or in a fair manner. I have been as accommodating as one could be expected with any information I have to share. So are you trying to raise the goal post to a hight unreachable, or is this a discussion?

 

I've even went so easy as to ask "Is anyone else having the same symptoms as you?" Yet even that, you cannot find. That's why I suggested it being user error. 

[App4that]

I've even went so easy as to ask "Is anyone else having the same symptoms as you?" Yet even that, you cannot find. That's why I suggested it being user error.

Look over my post history, I didn't know I had the issue until I compared the two cards that closely. Try this, to judge any change in micro shuttering I would stand in the middle of Sanctuary and throw the mouse around, basically run around like a fool LOL. With the 390 I got micro shuttering, but not with the 290. That should be easily reproduced. As for the FPS I gave the exact clock settings I used, and can offer my exact game settings at any time.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

Look over my post history, I didn't know I had the issue until I compared the two cards that closely. Try this, to judge any change in micro shuttering I would stand in the middle of Sanctuary and throw the mouse around, basically run around like a fool LOL. With the 390 I got micro shuttering, but not with the 290. That should be easily reproduced. As for the FPS I gave the exact clock settings I used, and can offer my exact game settings at any time.

And did anyone else have the same symptoms as you?

[App4that]

And did anyone else have the same symptoms as you?

I am honestly trying to figure out what you mean by that. I'm providing the means to test for the issue and can give detailed instructions to anyone that asks. Are you under the assumption I have a team of gamers under my supervision running Vaporx 290s and Nitro 390s? There are multiple people with crossfire issues on the first page of this subsection of the forum and can't get anyone to listen to me about the crossfire issues ether. So I hope you can forgive me for not having (much) faith anything would change if there were other people as vocal as myself with the same findings.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

I am honestly trying to figure out what you mean by that. I'm providing the means to test for the issue and can give detailed instructions to anyone that asks. Are you under the assumption I have a team of gamers under my supervision running Vaporx 290s and Nitro 390s? There are multiple people with crossfire issues on the first page of this subsection of the forum and can't get anyone to listen to me about the crossfire issues ether. So I hope you can forgive me for not having (much) faith anything would change if there were other people as vocal as myself with the same findings.

Nah, we'll stop here. This is probably as far as we'll get.

[App4that]

Nah, we'll stop here. This is probably as far as we'll get.

Good plan.

[afyeung]

 

 

 

We obviously took this post way too far and the OP has already chosen the 390. I'm sure he'll be more than satisfied with the 390. Yes, the 390 series isn't magically better than the 290 series, the modded BIOS doesn't change performance too much(improvements include better tessellation performance ex. tressfx or hairworks, and lower idle power usage). But to suggest the 390 series has more issues than the 290 series is absolutely ridiculous, really. If you're comparing your own experiences then that's fine. The microstuttering you're talking about is a defect if it's even real(you have yet to provide proof @App4that). And there's tons of proof to support that the 390 provides a wonderful experience. I won't link you the whole internet unfortunately and plus I'm on like 5 kb/s internet. Digital foundries(on YouTube) compares game play from the 390(x) and other cards. If you look at the frametimes graphs the 390(x) is doing just fine. Digital foundries actually is very particular about this data and they are very satisfied with the 390(x). Actually all the reviewers out there who have reviewed the 390(x) have really enjoyed the card. Really, go on google and search up all the reviews. They all say the 390(x) provides an improved, or similar, experience as the 290(x). I would record my own gameplay and we could compare frametimes and fps, but it's pointless to record data countless of people already have. I'm sure you don't have bad intentions, but the 390(x) is really just a tuned 290(x) and doesn't have any of the issues you mentioned, all the reviewers have contradicted you. Merry Christmas and happy gaming. Btw, crossfire is a discussion for another day lol. 

[afyeung]

Crashes and FPS loss, also stability in game. It's in his overclocking tutorial.

I know he said that in his oc'ing tutorial. But he didn't specifically say it was a driver issue with AMD. I actually run with Riva Tuner all the time in my games. The only issue I have is the OSD shows up in Powerpoint so I have to close it lol

[App4that]

We obviously took this post way too far and the OP has already chosen the 390. I'm sure he'll be more than satisfied with the 390. Yes, the 390 series isn't magically better than the 290 series, the modded BIOS doesn't change performance too much(improvements include better tessellation performance ex. tressfx or hairworks, and lower idle power usage). But to suggest the 390 series has more issues than the 290 series is absolutely ridiculous, really. If you're comparing your own experiences then that's fine. The microstuttering you're talking about is a defect if it's even real(you have yet to provide proof @App4that). And there's tons of proof to support that the 390 provides a wonderful experience. I won't link you the whole internet unfortunately and plus I'm on like 5 kb/s internet. Digital foundries(on YouTube) compares game play from the 390(x) and other cards. If you look at the frametimes graphs the 390(x) is doing just fine. Digital foundries actually is very particular about this data and they are very satisfied with the 390(x). Actually all the reviewers out there who have reviewed the 390(x) have really enjoyed the card. Really, go on google and search up all the reviews. They all say the 390(x) provides an improved, or similar, experience as the 290(x). I would record my own gameplay and we could compare frametimes and fps, but it's pointless to record data countless of people already have. I'm sure you don't have bad intentions, but the 390(x) is really just a tuned 290(x) and doesn't have any of the issues you mentioned, all the reviewers have contradicted you. Merry Christmas and happy gaming. Btw, crossfire is a discussion for another day lol.

I take responsibility for not humaning well, I've never said the 390 is a bad GPU. I've said it looks like it came from a Dollar store, because it does if you compare it to the flagship 290 models. Even Digital Foundry who I follow concentrate on fps over everything else. And I have REPEATEDLY said how to reproduce my findings. Anyone that wants to replicate my test just has to play Fallout 4 in 1440 at Ultra settings and spin the camera while in Sanctuary. The micro stuttering happens when you change the field of view quickly. So In front of the players house from before the war makes for a good control.

OH! SHIT! Merry Christmas! Hope everyone is enjoying their holiday

[afyeung]

AMD peasant issues :lol:  Also pops up when you're on the edge of stability on a overclock. Stock speeds I never had an issue. I push my memory pretty hard which is probably the culprit.

AMD peasant? lol. Honestly, reading a lot of these posts sounds like you're just bad with computers, no offense <-that's mean and not really evidence based. sorry dude. And if you really hate AMD, seriously go and get a 980 which is easy to do if you had a 390 and a 290. Maybe you will have less issues and can game more easily. No point in wasting time trouble shooting when you could be making bank or gaming like a 1 percenter. But it's really not fair to also claim that the 390(x) or AMD sucks in general while a lot of us AMD users are having a great time. I have some issues with AMD, but it really hasn't affected my gaming experience and usually my gaming experience is stellar so I like the company. The 390(x) is considered a mid-high end card so it should perform that way. 

[App4that]

AMD peasant? lol. Honestly, reading a lot of these posts sounds like you're just bad with computers, no offense <-that's mean and not really evidence based. sorry dude. And if you really hate AMD, seriously go and get a 980 which is easy to do if you had a 390 and a 290. Maybe you will have less issues and can game more easily. No point in wasting time trouble shooting when you could be making bank or gaming like a 1 percenter. But it's really not fair to also claim that the 390(x) or AMD sucks in general while a lot of us AMD users are having a great time. I have some issues with AMD, but it really hasn't affected my gaming experience and usually my gaming experience is stellar so I like the company. The 390(x) is considered a mid-high end card so it should perform that way.

It was a joke. Go back and read it again.

[afyeung]

 

Maybe the nitro 390 looks like it came from the dollar store. But that's just one of the models lol. No denying the vapor and lightning 290x's were just beautiful. I'll get to play Fallout 4 after vacation. It wasn't even playable for me before because of the stuttering during the drops from 60-40 lol. 

[afyeung]

It was a joke. Go back and read it again.

Yep. I get it. Lots of unread posts   But still. If you don't want to stick with AMD, there's always Nvidia so you can enjoy JC3, which they probably haven't fixed on AMD yet. 

[App4that]

Yep. I get it. Lots of unread posts But still. If you don't want to stick with AMD, there's always Nvidia so you can enjoy JC3, which they probably haven't fixed on AMD yet.

When did I ever say I didn't want to stick with AND? I love my Vapor, like really love it. IF I was forced to buy a card today because I didn't have the Vapor I'd be tempted to go with Nvidia ONLY because most of the games I play are Gameworks games. My decision would have nothing to do with hardware.

I'm Not A Fan! I don't care about the name on the box, I just want to play my games and not be hassled by the man.

[afyeung]

When did I ever say I didn't want to stick with AND? I love my Vapor, like really love it. IF I was forced to buy a card today because I didn't have the Vapor I'd be tempted to go with Nvidia ONLY because most of the games I play are Gameworks games. My decision would have nothing to do with hardware.

I'm Not A Fan! I don't care about the name on the box, I just want to play my games and not be hassled by the man.

Yeah. Totally agree. Some gameworks features are implemented really well like in Witcher 3. Others, not so much... 

[Nena Trinity]

I vote for any 390 unless you use Linux.

MSI & Sapphire both have good 390s get the cheapest or coolest?