Windows 10 will not be pre-installed on new PCs at launch. Now says there will be--

[jos]

 

Update:   Microsoft now claims that there will be PCs on sale in stores with Windows 10 pre-installed for the operating system's official launch date on July 29. Previously, the company had indicated that would not be the case.

 

 

Source: http://www.windowscentral.com/july-29-will-see-some-pcs-sale-windows-10-pre-installed-after-all

Thanks @Kherm

 

Microsoft is weeks away from debuting its Windows 10 operating system, but don't expect to see it pre-installed on new PCs at launch.

 

Instead, Microsoft will offer customers who buy a new PC starting on July 29 the opportunity to upgrade to Windows 10 Home or Pro at retail stores. If you want a new PC and Windows 10 on launch day, expect to spend a little bit of extra time at your retailer for the entire process.

 

Best Buy, Bic Camera, Croma, Currys/PC World, Elkjop, Jarrir, Incredible Connection, Media Markt, Staples, Wal-Mart, Yamada, Yodobashi and other retailers will offer new PC buyers data migration services and upgrade support, said Yusuf Mehdi, vice president of Windows and Device Marketing, in a blog post.

 

The problem is that Microsoft is still working on finalizing the operating system ahead of the launch. This means that Windows 10 hasn't been sent to device manufacturers to test with their own drivers, despite rumors that a "release to manufacturing" build would be ready last week.

 

"You will see computers running with Windows 10 installed very soon after the 29th and then in the fall a whole new class of machines for the holidays," Mehdi explained in an interview with Bloomberg.

 

 

It is good to get fully finished product at launch.. It is a necessity for marketting ...

 

Source: http://www.in.techradar.com/news/software/operating-systems/Windows-10-will-not-be-pre-installed-on-new-PCs-at-launch/articleshow/48061116.cms

 

It feel like windows 10 free to insiders all over again.. Even the marketting head dont have any clue..

[ltguy]

It other news, Microsoft flounders to release a finished product after firing their QA department and looks pretty darn foolish in the process. Shocking.

[Kherm]

Sorry, that's incorrect

 

http://www.windowscentral.com/july-29-will-see-some-pcs-sale-windows-10-pre-installed-after-all

 

 

It other news, Microsoft flounders to release a finished product after firing their QA department and looks pretty darn foolish in the process. Shocking.

Nice try, but nope. 

[GoodBytes]

Basically. Windows 10 ready PC will have Windows 10.

Currently sold computers in stores that have Windows 8 won't have time on July 29th, to be sent back to teh manufacture to be upgraded to Windows 10. Probably an upgrade disk will be sent to retail stores to include, or something, while stores have some time to return part of their stocks to manufacture for upgrade. By 1-2 weeks, all should be Windows 10 out of the box, would be my guess.

 

This is nothing really new. Upgrade disks from CP to Vista, Vista to 7, and 7 to 8 where always used, and added in boxes of PCs.

[Master Disaster]

Basically. Windows 10 ready PC will have Windows 10.

Currently sold computers in stores that have Windows 8 won't have time on July 29th, to be sent back to teh manufacture to be upgraded to Windows 10. Probably an upgrade disk will be sent to retail stores to include, or something, while stores have some time to return part of their stocks to manufacture for upgrade. By 1-2 weeks, all should be Windows 10 out of the box, would be my guess.

 

This is nothing really new. Upgrade disks from CP to Vista, Vista to 7, and 7 to 8 where always used, and added in boxes of PCs.

Does raise an interesting question though.

Why are MS skipping RTM entirely for Windows 10? That screams to me as lack of confidence in the quality of the final product when combined with the fact they're delaying the mainstream release of 10 until the Insiders have finished QAing it.

All seems a tad odd to me, they've finalised a release date but now they're saying they're not actually releasing it on that day after all (to the large majority of users at least).

[AlexGoesHigh]

Does raise an interesting question though.

Why are MS skipping RTM entirely for Windows 10? That screams to me as lack of confidence in the quality of the final product when combined with the fact they're delaying the mainstream release of 10 until the Insiders have finished QAing it.

All seems a tad odd to me, they've finalised a release date but now they're saying they're not actually releasing it on that day after all (to the large majority of users at least).

do you even know what RTM means? It means release to manufacture, aka a production ready build of windows, RTM is not a release day, that's GA (general availability) which is the 29th, leaks indicate they should hit RTM tomorrow, that gives OEM's 14 days to test and upgrade current inventory to windows 10, really short period of time but not impossible

[Misanthrope]

It other news, Microsoft flounders to release a finished product after firing their QA department and looks pretty darn foolish in the process. Shocking.

Well remember that YOU are now the QA department since you will be doing more testing with the official release because they're giving you a "free" upgrade, so that by the xmas season they have figured out major issues and PC retailers have a more stable version

[Master Disaster]

do you even know what RTM means? It means release to manufacture, aka a production ready build of windows, RTM is not a release day, that's GA (general availability) which is the 29th, leaks indicate they should hit RTM tomorrow, that gives OEM's 14 days to test and upgrade current inventory to windows 10, really short period of time but not impossible

It means the build they send out to OEMs exactly for the reason of preinstalling onto systems for release day. Seeing as MS are not shipping laptops with 10 on release day combined with the fact release day is 2 weeks away and RTM still isn't available its pretty obvious they've decided to drop to standard RTM model.

Windows Vista, 7 & 8 all had RTM builds leaked onto the internet over a month before release date.

[Techhog]

Does raise an interesting question though.

Why are MS skipping RTM entirely for Windows 10? That screams to me as lack of confidence in the quality of the final product when combined with the fact they're delaying the mainstream release of 10 until the Insiders have finished QAing it.

All seems a tad odd to me, they've finalised a release date but now they're saying they're not actually releasing it on that day after all (to the large majority of users at least).

I'm speechless... How can you possibly have such terrible reading comprehension!?

 

OP is wrong, new PCs will have Windows 10 unless they had 7 or 8.1 installed when retailers received them. 

[jos]

I'm speechless... How can you possibly have such terrible reading comprehension!?

 

OP is wrong, new PCs will have Windows 10 unless they had 7 or 8.1 installed when retailers received them. Only in those cases will there be upgrades in store. RTM released a few weeks ago.

That was not my words but of VP of marketting of windows

[Master Disaster]

I'm speechless... How can you possibly have such terrible reading comprehension!?

OP is wrong, new PCs will have Windows 10 unless they had 7 or 8.1 installed when retailers received them.

I'm sorry but what? I based that on the info posted in the OP and it clearly says they won't he selling 10 on systems on release day, instead customers can have their systems upgraded to 10 if they choose to.

My reading is fine, I am wondering if yours is?

[Techhog]

That was not my words but of VP of marketting of windows

Second reply

[AlexGoesHigh]

It means the build they send out to OEMs exactly for the reason of preinstalling onto systems for release day. Seeing as MS are not shipping laptops with 10 on release day combined with the fact release day is 2 weeks away and RTM still isn't available its pretty obvious they've decided to drop to standard RTM model.

Windows Vista, 7 & 8 all had RTM builds leaked onto the internet over a month before release date.

another MS PR emailed some outlets saying that they will in fact be devices on sale in the 29th from some OEM's http://www.neowin.net/news/you-will-be-able-to-buy-a-windows-10-pc-on-july-29

[Ex14]

microsoft communication at its finest they still ahvent gotten their shit together..

[GoodBytes]

Does raise an interesting question though.

Why are MS skipping RTM entirely for Windows 10? That screams to me as lack of confidence in the quality of the final product when combined with the fact they're delaying the mainstream release of 10 until the Insiders have finished QAing it.

All seems a tad odd to me, they've finalised a release date but now they're saying they're not actually releasing it on that day after all (to the large majority of users at least).

They are not. As we speak, Microsoft is working with manufactures (actually been done a while back) with release candidates of the RTM release.

Depending if it needs more fixing, they could release RTM tonight or towards the end of the month, giving only a few days or a week for fast manufacturing upgrade disks to send to store, while stores have more time to ship back old stick to be upgraded to Windows 10.

 

While it looks and sounds last minute. The problem with software development, is you can always do more, fix more, add more. You have to draw the line at some point. And that is always the tricky part, especially, as a developer, you know a lot more bugs and issues. You might know bugs which you think are important to solve, but less than 0.5% of the users will encounter it.

[GoodBytes]

Well remember that YOU are now the QA department since you will be doing more testing with the official release because they're giving you a "free" upgrade, so that by the xmas season they have figured out major issues and PC retailers have a more stable version

 

Actually no. Microsoft developer fired (everyone is on contract, there is no job switching, employees, and most of them did, reapply for new position in the company) the Software Developers in Test.

Those are not QA. Their role is to build programs to test code. Now that responsibility is by the developer itself, which makes more sense as they typed their own code, so they can test their stuff far faster. The idea of this move is to make Microsoft deliver faster products and new version of software, and implement more time consuming features into a product.

[Misanthrope]

Actually no. Microsoft developer fired (everyone is on contract, there is no job switching, employees, and most of them did, reapply for new position in the company) the Software Developers in Test.

Those are not QA. Their role is to build programs to test code. Now that responsibility is by the developer itself, which makes more sense as they typed their own code, so they can test their stuff far faster. The idea of this move is to make Microsoft deliver faster products and new version of software, and implement more time consuming features into a product.

 

That technicality amounts to the same thing: Not testers but the product is not as thoroughly tested. 

[RH00D]

That technicality amounts to the same thing: Not testers but the product is not as thoroughly tested. 

 

Actually, Windows 10 is the most thoroughly tested version of Windows of all time. Please see the diagram below,

 

And this screenshot was from the early days of Windows 10 Technical Preview.

 

Also Windows 10 still has plenty of internal QA as seen in the diagram below... Note that the Insider ring now has ~5 million testers, this diagram is old.

 

 

Not only that but the Insider Preview will continue on an ongoing basis. No other release of Windows has had millions of people testing it on a daily basis even after release. Not to mention Microsoft firing a couple hundred QA testers is OK when they have literally millions of Insiders doing QA in exchange for a free beta OS. They still do also have internal QA as depicted in the diagram above.

[linuxfan66]

as long as it works at launch everyone will be happy...

[handymanshandle]

I still don't really care too much about Windows 10. Basically it's Windows 7 but with Windows 8.1 elements frankly I think I prefer 8.1.

[sgloux3470]

I still don't really care too much about Windows 10. Basically it's Windows 7 but with Windows 8.1 elements frankly I think I prefer 8.1.

 

I am still baffled by all the diehard windows 7 boys hyped for windows 10.

 

Windows 8 has always been a straight upgrade from 7, windows 10 is basically just 8.2.  Yet everyone is perpetuating the whole "durrhurr every second release of Windows sucks" meme.  

[handymanshandle]

I am still baffled by all the diehard windows 7 boys hyped for windows 10.

 

Windows 8 has always been a straight upgrade from 7, windows 10 is basically just 8.2.  Yet everyone is perpetuating the whole "durrhurr every second release of Windows sucks" meme.  

 

I think if Microsoft had intended 10 to be essentially 8.2. MS would have kept intact more things from 8.1 or at least have them as an option (the charms bar is gone and the start menu even full screen is still more or less poorly done.

To me (at least since I've last used the Tech Preview (Build 10074) seems more like something for the 7 diehards. 

Though I guess Microsoft diehards could discredit me since I'm not one to fancy Windows in the first place, I just end up dealing with it because it just so happens to be about the money rather than the actual platform itself.

Even though developers could just as easily make some good money off Linux (as a desktop/laptop OS). I guess there's other factors as to why Linux is left in the dust. It just sucks that basically if you want any good software (Games, Photo Editors (Photoshop), Video Editors (Premier Pro), Video Effects (After Effects), etc.) you have to go with Windows or OS X...

However OS X is only technically available for Apple manufactured hardware (I mean not illegal but if Apple ever decided that they want to sue those with Hackintoshes, they could.).

 

[GoodBytes]

The real problem is that during Windows 8 development and release, if you look at chart, it is pretty much indicating that the only thing that sales were tablet. Microsoft being annoyed being late at every party gave carte blanch to Steve Sinofsky, who was pretty much Steve Job's of Microsoft. He had a vision, and it came full in. That is why they removed user feedback from the development of the OS. Windows 8 aim was to make a productivity tablet OS. But still usable with mouse and keyboard, for the productivity

Sadly, by the time Windows 8 was released, laptop sales started increase, and some movement happened. Little, but it happen, and people didn't ditch their desktop to tablet which is what Microsoft expected. Sinofsky left the company.

Now Windows 8 was, in my opinion, usable, and fine with keyboard and mouse. You could make the Start Screen practical, by doing things like pinning all your games and not just Steam, to have direct access to them, make and name groups, pin folders, and locate everything in a way that you put the most used stuff at the bottom left corner, and least used top right corner of the screen. However, I think the biggest problem, is a mix that people saw too different and didn't give a chance, mix with lack of any tutorials on how to do things, mix with a awful first startup layout.

It didn't help that the Metro/ModernUI application, probably due to their limitation of the framework, were bare bone basic, making users see no value in them, and provided no interest for developers.

Windows 10 brings things to reality, and the universal app (or simply called Windows Apps, as opposed to Windows Desktop Apps), show more of their power, by being more complete. They are smarter, makes developers interested in it, because the OS has nice example. Sure the mail and calendar apps doesn't make you breakfast in the morning, but they are far better than before, and enough to show. "Look you can make real things with it... check out what else it can do", making the developers interested in digging and seeing the full power of it. And ideally, hopefully for Microsoft, have developers actually make apps for it, which means that Windows 10 Mobile will have apps. Having at least the core apps for most people, that would solve a HUGE problem in Windows Phone world, and I think sales will pick up. If you have checked out a Windows Phone 8.1 latest update before, you can see that it is actually pretty good. Has everything I could quickly think about... beside apps. The missing features I am sure aren't critical for most, and that can be fixed. Especially if Microsoft finds a way to be like Apple for the updates, were you have the latest Windows 10 Mobile release update without waiting for your carrier approval like it is on Android.

The model that Microsoft have been taking in regard of the silly "good, bad, good, bad" cycle, is really:

Innovates -> Polish -> Innovate -> Polish...

People don't like change, but want change, which results in the good -> bad -> good... cycle they talk about, even though it doesn't really work, and they skip version of Windows, and Microsoft didn't start since day 1 to do this model. It was more sporatic, and really started with Vista, as by then all companies were in sync in their 6 year upgrade cycles, allowing Microsoft to take chances and not affect businesses.

Windows 10 seems that they will change that. They have shown that they do A/B testing with features with testers, and now getting direct feedback, will polish things as they innovate... or at least that is the idea.

Windows 10 list of features is actually not huge. Windows 8 was longer, which most people ignored. But many of the new features of Windows 10 are pretty big projects. They are things one would expect to only have 1 or 2 of them per release, now we have all of them.

Personally, I can't wait for 10.1, which should polish things further at the user experience level, and bring more features (probably smaller in development scale, but more of them).

[RH00D]

I still don't really care too much about Windows 10. Basically it's Windows 7 but with Windows 8.1 elements frankly I think I prefer 8.1.

 

There's a lot more to it than that...

 

• Overhauled Start menu
• The Action Center/notification center
• Cortana (If you are concerned about privacy, there are lots of options for enabling/disabling things Cortana can/cannot do, what she does and doesn't have access to, etc.)
• Continuum (Modifies the UI for tablet or desktop usage depending on device type and input method being used.)
• UI for switching tasks (Alt-Tab) is significantly improved
• Aero Snap functionality hugely improved
• New Microsoft Edge browser
• Universal Apps (This is more relevant if you have multiple Windows-based devices, including PC, Phone, Xbox, HoloLens, etc.)
• Windows Hello (Automatically login/lock PC by face detection, requires special webcam hardware.)
• DirectX12
• Multiple virtual desktops
• All stock apps are completely overhauled (Store, Photos, Weather, News, Groove Music, Movies & TV, Settings, Mail & Calendar, Calculator, Alarm & Clock, and many more)
• Xbox app, will bring a bunch of Xbox platform features to Windows 10 including bringing some Xbox games to Windows 10 and allowing cross-platform play, etc. Xbox app can also act as a Game DVR/take screenshots. It will also allow the Xbox One-to-PC game streaming. They are also reportedly working on PC-to-Xbox One streaming. The Xbox games on Windows 10 confirmed so far are Fable Legends, Gears of War: Ultimate Edition, Gigantic, and Killer Instinct. Doom (2016 release) is also coming to Xbox One and Windows 10. Also, all the Xbox 360 games that will be playable via backwards compatibility can also be stream to Windows 10 PCs
• File Explorer is improved as well with new functionality
• Login screen UI is updated
• Plenty of UI refinements all over the place, everything looks a lot nicer and more pleasing now
• Phone Companion app that works not only with Windows phones but also iPhones and Android phones
• Command Prompt has been improved after all these years as well with a more scale-able GUI and new features like being able to paste using Ctrl+V, among other things (These improvements also apply to PowerShell): http://arstechnica.c...e-21st-century/
• Windows Update in Windows 10 supports peer-to-peer downloading on the same local network. So if you have 2 or more PCs then 1 PC downloads the Windows updates from the internet, then all other PC download the updates from the first PC so it will be faster for the other PCs and save on your internet bandwidth cap if you have one.
• Better high-resolution screen support. Windows 10 supports up to 8K displays and will have better UI scaling overall.

I don't get this comparison of Windows 10 to Windows 7 just because of the Start menu. And that list above doesn't even include everything.

[dalekphalm]

There's a lot more to it than that...

 

• Overhauled Start menu
• The Action Center/notification center
• Cortana (If you are concerned about privacy, there are lots of options for enabling/disabling things Cortana can/cannot do, what she does and doesn't have access to, etc.)
• Continuum (Modifies the UI for tablet or desktop usage depending on device type and input method being used.)
• UI for switching tasks (Alt-Tab) is significantly improved
• Aero Snap functionality hugely improved
• New Microsoft Edge browser
• Universal Apps (This is more relevant if you have multiple Windows-based devices, including PC, Phone, Xbox, HoloLens, etc.)
• Windows Hello (Automatically login/lock PC by face detection, requires special webcam hardware.)
• DirectX12
• Multiple virtual desktops
• All stock apps are completely overhauled (Store, Photos, Weather, News, Groove Music, Movies & TV, Settings, Mail & Calendar, Calculator, Alarm & Clock, and many more)
• Xbox app, will bring a bunch of Xbox platform features to Windows 10 including bringing some Xbox games to Windows 10 and allowing cross-platform play, etc. Xbox app can also act as a Game DVR/take screenshots. It will also allow the Xbox One-to-PC game streaming. They are also reportedly working on PC-to-Xbox One streaming. The Xbox games on Windows 10 confirmed so far are Fable Legends, Gears of War: Ultimate Edition, Gigantic, and Killer Instinct. Doom (2016 release) is also coming to Xbox One and Windows 10. Also, all the Xbox 360 games that will be playable via backwards compatibility can also be stream to Windows 10 PCs
• File Explorer is improved as well with new functionality
• Login screen UI is updated
• Plenty of UI refinements all over the place, everything looks a lot nicer and more pleasing now
• Phone Companion app that works not only with Windows phones but also iPhones and Android phones
• Command Prompt has been improved after all these years as well with a more scale-able GUI and new features like being able to paste using Ctrl+V, among other things (These improvements also apply to PowerShell): http://arstechnica.c...e-21st-century/
• Windows Update in Windows 10 supports peer-to-peer downloading on the same local network. So if you have 2 or more PCs then 1 PC downloads the Windows updates from the internet, then all other PC download the updates from the first PC so it will be faster for the other PCs and save on your internet bandwidth cap if you have one.
• Better high-resolution screen support. Windows 10 supports up to 8K displays and will have better UI scaling overall.

I don't get this comparison of Windows 10 to Windows 7 just because of the Start menu. And that list above doesn't even include everything.

Frankly, people look at the start menu, and think "Derp, it's just Windows 7 again!".

 

Hardly anyone around here seems to look at the backend improvements.

 

I'll just say this: File Transfer in Windows 8/8.1 was worth upgrading from Windows 7 alone, and Windows 10 improves it even further.