Thoughts on Herman Miller?

[Shahrad]

Hello Hello!

 

I wanted to get a quick pulse check on how we feel about Herman Miller as a potential sponsor. Their CEO said some whacky stuff a while ago and got dragged for it on the internet, but as a brand, they have really nice quality products.

 

https://www.hermanmiller.com/

 

How do you guys feel about them?

 

Let me know!

[dizmo]

I imagine we're going to get tons of complaints here about how expensive their chairs are.

I like the brand, like the chairs. The CEO isn't the embodiment of the brand, but I get why in today's age you have to tread the way you do.

[ToboRobot]

CEO aside, good products from a long lasting brand.  No issue with working with them.  It's good to have high end options, other than "gaming chairs".  I think ergonomics and safe and healthy computer usage is a good topic to explore and educate.

CEO context: https://www.fastcompany.com/90916660/exclusive-millerknoll-ceo-andi-owen-talks-rto-and-what-she-learned-from-that-infamous-town-hall

 

 

[Brooksie359]

As a product Herman Miller is definitely top tier and I have multiple friends who own one some new some used. They all have only good things to say about the chairs so as a product Herman Miller is something I wouldn't be against being promoted. As for the CEO honestly I feel like alot of CEOs say alot of dumb stuff so I don't really care personally. Also to those who say Herman Miller is expensive I would say that they last a long time and keep their resell value alot better not to mention that preventing back problems by using a good chair is more than worth the money imo. 

[ImorallySourcedElectrons]

Good chairs, my only complaint is that they rarely consider folks who lack space when they design things, and transporting them up stairscases can be a bit of a hassle for some models.

 

One quality thing though, at a previous job we had some light coloured chairs of theirs in a meeting room that was in the sun all day, and they did noticeably yellow over time versus the ones that were in the other meeting rooms. But it was only noticeable when put next to chairs that weren't in that environment, otherwise you'd never be able to tell.

[cmndr]

I bought a used Herman Miller Aeron chair over 10 years ago. Since then I replaced $30ish worth of parts (foam arm rests, foam pad under my knees) with stuff off ebay. 
The chair still works. I can resell it for what I paid for it. 

Overpriced new but there's WAY dumber things to spend cash on than your spine. 

[Skiiwee29]

Like @cmndr I have a refurbished Aeron I have been using now for about 2 years with zero issues. Use to work from home 10-12hrs a day then would game another few hours after and never had any issues. Office Chairs > Gaming chairs 100000% of the time. As others alluded, just wish they had more friendly pricing as it would be out of reach even refurbished like mine at $750 for many, if not most, viewers that LTT targets its audience at. 

[Brooksie359]

1 hour ago, cmndr said:

I bought a used Herman Miller Aeron chair over 10 years ago. Since then I replaced $30ish worth of parts with stuff off ebay. 
The chair still works. I can resell it for what I paid for it. 

Overpriced new but there's WAY dumber things to spend cash on than your spine. 

Honestly it's surprising how well these chairs keep their value and not to mention that they tend to last alot better than some of the other office chairs I have had. Even if you buy new you can still sell the chair for a good percentage of what you bought it for if you keep it in good condition. That being said getting used chairs are a good option as well if you can't stomach the cost of a new one. 

[Needfuldoer]

They're not cheap, but their chairs are damned nice.

 

I got a screaming deal on an Aeron a few years ago; I swear I could live in that thing like the humans in Wall-E if it could go up and down stairs.

 

A good task chair is always better than any "gaming" chair or faux-leather chair from the office supply store.

[10leej]

7 hours ago, fella.hadid said:

Hello Hello!

 

I wanted to get a quick pulse check on how we feel about Herman Miller as a potential sponsor. Their CEO said some whacky stuff a while ago and got dragged for it on the internet, but as a brand, they have really nice quality products.

 

https://www.hermanmiller.com/

 

How do you guys feel about them?

 

Let me know!

I disagree about nice qualuty products, it's just really fancy EQ work and they steal GPL code and refuse to contribute or distribute their source code.

 

I should really look up the botique brands before I comment, I had harmon kardon stuck in my head.

[vetali]

I have a Logitech G Embody (now with an Atlas headrest). Bought it because a weekend gaming session absolutely destroyed my back the following day and ended up missing a few days at work due to it. Shipping was great with no issues and arrived on time. Comes fully assembled which is a huge + for me. Has held up to me putting on COVID pounds fine. Spent much less money at the chiropractor since getting it.

 

So I think the products are great. Have not had to file a warranty claim as the chair has had zero faults. I did notice the backlash on the CEO when it happened. Wasn't really surprised by the comments. I imagine their business has really struggled since the pandemic. Anything anti WFH seems to spread on social media like wildfire. HM would definitely qualify as anti WFH because their business depends on offices bulk buying their products. Her comments struck me as the typical trying to rally salespeople before a deadline, something that is very common in commission based sales roles.

 

Because you can get stupid good deals on second hand HM chairs, I looked around their site to see if they offered replacement parts or services. Just curious as to how anti right to repair they might be due to this. Their parts selection is very limited (and the link to their parts under service FAQ is broken, had to use the site map to find parts). Any other parts it says to contact an authorized dealer or retailer. Not great.

 

I'd like to see them secret shopped if they were to be a sponsor.

[cmndr]

18 hours ago, Skiiwee29 said:

Like @cmndr I have a refurbished Aeron I have been using now for about 2 years with zero issues. Use to work from home 10-12hrs a day then would game another few hours after and never had any issues. Office Chairs > Gaming chairs 100000% of the time. As others alluded, just wish they had more friendly pricing as it would be out of reach even refurbished like mine at $750 for many, if not most, viewers that LTT targets its audience at. 

I paid $300 back in 2013 before the COVID / WFH craze. 

If I'm being VERY critical, there's likely OTHER solid chairs out there today. I went with the Aeron because it's what I knew from work and it was "the best" in some sense (mostly by perception/reputation, not necessarily technical merits). I wouldn't be surprised if there's stuff with better design/engineering now. Potentially even by Herman Miller - if I recall correctly Luke got an HM Embody Chair and spent some time researching. I suspect that stuff won't have as good of a reputation irrespective of technical merits and benefits. 
 

17 hours ago, Brooksie359 said:

Honestly it's surprising how well these chairs keep their value and not to mention that they tend to last alot better than some of the other office chairs I have had. Even if you buy new you can still sell the chair for a good percentage of what you bought it for if you keep it in good condition. That being said getting used chairs are a good option as well if you can't stomach the cost of a new one. 

This is nitpicking, but if I had put the $300 in the S&P500 I'd have $900ish instead of something that just kept pace with inflation. 

There's definitely real value in underspending, tossing the funds in an investment grade asset and then watching it go to double in 10 years. Or in this case triple (an above average 10 year span). Either that or into SOMETHING that'll increase future earnings. $300 on an interview coach can turn into WAY more than that professionally. 

 

As a rule of thumb people SHOULD generally error on the side of underspending on things that aren't some mix of [long lived, revenue generating, used VERY frequently]

 

16 hours ago, 10leej said:

I should really look up the botique brands before I comment, I had harmon kardon stuck in my head.

They're arguably the biggest name in their industry.
If you've heard of "office cubicles" they were invented by Herman Miller. (Thanks, I hate it)
You've probably seen a Herman Miller Aeron chair in movies like... 100 times. I've worked at multiple Fortune 100 companies and there were definitely patches of "someone ordered 1000 of these and they're EVERYWHERE in this building"

 

[Brooksie359]

10 hours ago, cmndr said:

I paid $300 back in 2013 before the COVID / WFH craze. 

If I'm being VERY critical, there's likely OTHER solid chairs out there today. I went with the Aeron because it's what I knew from work and it was "the best" in some sense (mostly by perception/reputation, not necessarily technical merits). I wouldn't be surprised if there's stuff with better design/engineering now. Potentially even by Herman Miller - if I recall correctly Luke got an HM Embody Chair and spent some time researching. I suspect that stuff won't have as good of a reputation irrespective of technical merits and benefits. 
 

This is nitpicking, but if I had put the $300 in the S&P500 I'd have $900ish instead of something that just kept pace with inflation. 

There's definitely real value in underspending, tossing the funds in an investment grade asset and then watching it go to double in 10 years. Or in this case triple (an above average 10 year span). Either that or into SOMETHING that'll increase future earnings. $300 on an interview coach can turn into WAY more than that professionally. 

 

As a rule of thumb people SHOULD generally error on the side of underspending on things that aren't some mix of [long lived, revenue generating, used VERY frequently]

 

They're arguably the biggest name in their industry.
If you've heard of "office cubicles" they were invented by Herman Miller. (Thanks, I hate it)
You've probably seen a Herman Miller Aeron chair in movies like... 100 times. I've worked at multiple Fortune 100 companies and there were definitely patches of "someone ordered 1000 of these and they're EVERYWHERE in this building"

 

As someone who has tried alot of office chairs imo Herman Miller is one of the best. I couldn't really find any that were better but I am sure if you looked long enough you might but honestly most of those are going to be expensive as well. Also I never said that this should be treated as an investment to make money. My point is that when you spend money on a chair it's not like you can't get a big chunk of that money back if you need to so it's something to keep in mind. Also I would argue that having an ergonomic high quality chair is going to be worth far more than that 900 dollars you are talking about in terms of health benefits. There are places where spend less makes sense but not in areas where it concerns your health. 

[NinJake]

I picked up a refurbished Aeron chair years ago as I couldn't swallow the full cost of a new chair. It's been nothing short of wonderful to sit in and will never buy another "gaming" chair again. For context, I had purchased a Vertagear chair which was definitely cozy to sit in, started having troubles with the "reclining" function of it. (I would often bring the backrest wayyyy back to listen to music at times and eventually some thin aluminum tubing (for the frame of the chair) just ended up snapping.

 

To put it in context, I would assume I'm about average build and weigh less than 180 pounds, so it's not like my weight should have had anything to do with the chair catastrophically failing on me. I decided at that point to look into the Herman Miller hype and ultimately figured the Aeron chair was worth the investment.

 

I do wish the cost wasn't so steep, as I'd love to recommend the chair to many more people. If I recommend the chair as the price stands now, 95% of people laugh at the fact I'd recommend "a chair" that cost so much. Without going into the nitty gritty of things and how important posture is, most people can't justify spending so much money on "just a chair".

[Sir Beregond]

I much prefer Steelcase chairs at that price point, but Herman Miller are likewise good quality chairs that will last a couple decades unlike racer chairs, so in a sense, you get what you pay for. That said, I picked up a Steelcase Leap v2 refurbished a couple months back because even so its hard to pony up that much for "just a chair". But I will say its been worth every penny. My old Maxnomic chair can burn in hell, like zero contest in quality and comfort for me (milage will vary). For me, car bucket seats as a fad for "gaming chairs" should go away, and I'd like to just see lower cost chairs adopt better ergonomics.

[Erioch]

17 hours ago, cmndr said:

I paid $300 back in 2013 before the COVID / WFH craze. 

If I'm being VERY critical, there's likely OTHER solid chairs out there today. I went with the Aeron because it's what I knew from work and it was "the best" in some sense (mostly by perception/reputation, not necessarily technical merits). I wouldn't be surprised if there's stuff with better design/engineering now. Potentially even by Herman Miller - if I recall correctly Luke got an HM Embody Chair and spent some time researching. I suspect that stuff won't have as good of a reputation irrespective of technical merits and benefits. 
 

This is nitpicking, but if I had put the $300 in the S&P500 I'd have $900ish instead of something that just kept pace with inflation. 

There's definitely real value in underspending, tossing the funds in an investment grade asset and then watching it go to double in 10 years. Or in this case triple (an above average 10 year span). Either that or into SOMETHING that'll increase future earnings. $300 on an interview coach can turn into WAY more than that professionally. 

 

As a rule of thumb people SHOULD generally error on the side of underspending on things that aren't some mix of [long lived, revenue generating, used VERY frequently]

 

They're arguably the biggest name in their industry.
If you've heard of "office cubicles" they were invented by Herman Miller. (Thanks, I hate it)
You've probably seen a Herman Miller Aeron chair in movies like... 100 times. I've worked at multiple Fortune 100 companies and there were definitely patches of "someone ordered 1000 of these and they're EVERYWHERE in this building"

 

We have those in our office.  They are hella expensive, comfy AF and last forever.

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

I have one in the office and works wonders for my back and butt unlike my piece of shit DPS chair from Costco at home. 

[kirashi]

On 8/8/2023 at 10:24 AM, fella.hadid said:

Hello Hello!

 

I wanted to get a quick pulse check on how we feel about Herman Miller as a potential sponsor. Their CEO said some whacky stuff a while ago and got dragged for it on the internet, but as a brand, they have really nice quality products.

 

https://www.hermanmiller.com/

 

How do you guys feel about them?

Let me know!

CEO shenanigans aside, Herman Miller and Steelcase both make some of the most expensive but also comfortable, ergonomic, long-lasting all-day-use office chairs on the market, and I'm not just saying that - the company I work for has fleets of Mirra 2 chairs across multiple hot-desk offices.

 

I don't know how residential home-office users would be able to justify $1500 CAD on a single chair, but you can save around 30-50% off the new retail price if you can find a refurbished or second-hand Herman Miller in good condition. Overall, I would recommend compared to Staples chairs.

[Sir Beregond]

9 hours ago, kirashi said:

CEO shenanigans aside, Herman Miller and Steelcase both make some of the most expensive but also comfortable, ergonomic, long-lasting all-day-use office chairs on the market, and I'm not just saying that - the company I work for has fleets of Mirra 2 chairs across multiple hot-desk offices.

 

I don't know how residential home-office users would be able to justify $1500 CAD on a single chair, but you can save around 30-50% off the new retail price if you can find a refurbished or second-hand Herman Miller in good condition. Overall, I would recommend compared to Staples chairs.

Yeah there really is no comparison. I'm not a fan of the Mirra or Aeron personally, but I am definitely a Steelcase fanboy after sitting in my first Leap 13 years ago. Would love to try out a Gesture some day, but for now have a refurb Leap v2 at home. 

 

You definitely get what you pay for. Even the refurb came with a 12 year warranty.

[Jawa_Juice]

I absolutely love my Embody, and had a positive experience with their support when I encountered an issue placing my order. I will, however, echo what others have said about pricing. While they now have offerings under 4 figures, they're still firmly in the high-end/luxury category and out of reach for the average consumer (resale market aside). I can see them being a good fit with their recent focus on the gaming market, though some viewers might find the partnership slightly out of touch.

[chairitable]

Quote

Their CEO said some whacky stuff a while ago and got dragged for it on the internet

is it typical for these threads not to contextualize or frame these kinds of concerns? the CEO at the end of a staff video town hall, told people to focus on reaching their sales targets WRT getting their bonuses, instead of asking what would happen if they fell short. CNN article here . She later apologized (CNN follow-up article). I think it's very poorly worded/framed, if not outright dismissive of their employees' concerns, but they're trying to say focus on the process rather than the end result. There's also a 2021 NYT article about her having to grapple with politics in the office, but I'm not able to access it.

When I saw "whacky stuff" I thought it was gonna be like... truther-stuff or twitter rants about race/gender. But if it's just this speech, I don't see it as particularly problematic.


Disclaimer : I own a 2nd-hand Mirra 2 and it's an amazing chair. I'm reminded of how great it is every time I sit literally anywhere else. It does collect a lot of dust in the base though, because the seat is mesh. It's all pants/butt stuff LOL

[japerry]

HM is the gold standard when it comes to professional office furniture. And honestly, $1500 for a chair that lasts 10+ years is not crazy IMHO. My chair has outlasted TWO $1000+ mattresses and FOUR $2000+ laptops over the same period of time. For WFH, its essential to have correct ergonomics, and HM fits the bill perfectly.

 

Are they consumer cheap? No. But certainly sponsor worthy. They sell quality equipment and stand by what they sell. There is a reason why most tech companies have Mirra or Aeron chairs.

 

Not to say I'm necessarily a HM fanboy. Steelcase makes good chairs as well. I'm happy to see that LTT's do-not-sponsor list includes companies whose chairs are all show and no form.

[William M]

I own Herman miller chair. On the heavier side. Been use chair for about 4 or 5 years. Have not had issue. Also Herman Miller based right in area I live

[Djuntas]

I hate how impossible some brands are to try out. Fair enough I live in rural Denmark so fuck me in the ass raw - At least that's what brands tells you if you don't live in LA?

 

I would pay money to try a Aeron or other. Like straight up - If there was a store near me Id love to pay say 100 dollars to sit in some of the chairs.

[Lordmage]

for me it is an overpriced chair that i would never buy. not every one has that much just waiting to be spent.