Do certain LTT forum situations merit payment? Are any members / moderators paid?

[An0maly_76]

Wasn't really sure where to put this, but is payment expected in certain situations in the forums? In what I thought was a general conversation I hoped to learn something from, this was the other person's last reply (name blocked out)

 

 

Not trying to stir up drama, was just curious if there was something I wasn't aware of.

Edited April 15, 2022 by An0maly_76
Revised

[DigitalGoat]

Just now, An0maly_76 said:

Wasn't really sure where to put this, but is payment expected in certain situations in the forums? In what I thought was a general conversation I hoped to learn something from, this was the other person's last reply (name blocked out)

 

 

Not trying to stir up drama, was just curious if there was something I wasn't aware of.

I think the person was saying that since his time to sort an issue was being volunteered maybe the poster could take the time to give as much info as possible so as to not waste his time.

[da na]

I assume they pay the moderators and admins/staff but definitely no members. 

[whispous]

no

[An0maly_76]

4 minutes ago, DigitalGoat said:

I think the person was saying that since his time to sort an issue was being volunteered maybe the poster could take the time to give as much info as possible so as to not waste his time.

Thing is, I was just about to do exactly that when this response came. I was just wondering. I show a lot of signs of autism spectrum disorder (to be diagnosed soon), and I have a really hard time picking up on certain things. Seemed a bit rude otherwise. I don't get paid for my time here, either, but I don't come at people like that. I rarely get an attitude with people unless they get one with me.

Edited April 15, 2022 by An0maly_76
Revised

[RockSolid1106]

4 minutes ago, Mel0nMan said:

I assume they pay the moderators and admins/staff

Remember reading a post on here, and it said no one on this forum is paid for their work. The only one that does as I remember was Jake since he was the one working on the servers or something for the forum, can't remember exactly, but I'm sure no one on the forum gets paid.

Edited April 15, 2022 by RockSolid1106

[GuiltySpark_]

In this field dealing with new people, they'll have a complex problem but present it with little to no information that could be useful. If someone is a little impatient, which lets be honest if you spend a lot of time here and on the discord server helping others, it happens, you might make a joke about not being paid for this. 

 

In short no, no one is actually expecting money helping answer tech questions on a free public forum. 

[lewdicrous]

7 minutes ago, Mel0nMan said:

I assume they pay the moderators and admins/staff but definitely no members. 

Moderators are 100% voluntary (they don't get paid for their time)

Not sure about admins, but I think it's the same as moderators.

 

11 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

is payment expected in certain situations in the forums?

That response was a "help us help you" sort of think; helping members in the forum isn't a job, it's all voluntary, so be respectful with people's time and provide all the necessary info for them to help you out.

Having to wait for piecemeal info turns this voluntary act into a chore, which no one wants.

[An0maly_76]

3 minutes ago, lewdicrous said:

Moderators are 100% voluntary (they don't get paid for their time)

Not sure about admins, but I think it's the same as moderators.

 

That response was a "help us help you" sort of think; helping members in the forum isn't a job, it's all voluntary, so be respectful with people's time and provide all the necessary info for them to help you out.

Having to wait for piecemeal info turns this voluntary act into a chore, which no one wants.

I would agree, except for the "thanks bye" part. Comes off as more of a "f*ck off, I don't want to be bothered with you" to me. It's not just what you say, it's how you say it.

Edited April 15, 2022 by An0maly_76

[BondiBlue]

4 minutes ago, Mel0nMan said:

I assume they pay the moderators

Being a moderator is a voluntary position, so there's no pay associated with it. 

[lewdicrous]

6 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

I would agree, except for the "thanks bye" part. Comes off as more of a "f*ck off, I don't want to be bothered with you" to me.

I wouldn't read that far into it.

 

General rule: do not assume intent where there is none.

[An0maly_76]

1 minute ago, lewdicrous said:

I wouldn't read that far into it.

I'm just saying that if everyone on this forum were that snippy, nothing would be getting solved.

[Somerandomtechyboi]

Ive mostly seen mods and prob even admis being voluntary on other forums and tbh i basically never wondered if they get paid or not just because most of the time theyre voluntary and dont get paid

 

Ive been to 4 forums so far which is tomshardware, bleepingcomputer, warp9, and ltt forum and everyone seems to be voluntary

[lewdicrous]

Just now, An0maly_76 said:

I'm just saying that if everyone on this forum were that snippy, nothing would be getting solved.

Just going by what was posted on this thread (what's written in the quote below), the "thanks, bye" was the person signing off of the discussion.

19 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

this was the other person's last reply

Again, I wouldn't read that far into it.

 

Was this conversation privately held? I can't seem to find it.

[An0maly_76]

20 minutes ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

Ive mostly seen mods and prob even admis being voluntary on other forums and tbh i basically never wondered if they get paid or not just because most of the time theyre voluntary and dont get paid

 

Ive been to 4 forums so far which is tomshardware, bleepingcomputer, warp9, and ltt forum and everyone seems to be voluntary

*shrugs* Just kinda sounded like if they weren't getting paid for it, they didn't want to be bothered with it. Granted, the original convo wandered a bit, but still...

 

  

11 minutes ago, lewdicrous said:

Was this conversation privately held? I can't seem to find it.

Yeah, PM convo, that's why I was wondering if there was something I wasn't aware of. It came off like there was some kind of expectation, is all. If I don't have time to continue the conversation, I just say we'll pick it up another time or something. Seems like rudeness has become so commonplace now that people think it's normal, because the way it was said was rather rude.

Edited April 15, 2022 by An0maly_76
Revised

[Needfuldoer]

To me that reads like someone getting frustrated because the OP isn't giving them the information they need to actually solve the problem no matter how they ask, but pestering them for a solution anyway.

 

Of course there's no way to know for certain without reading the entire conversation. (That looks like the last in a series of PMs to me...)

[Blue4130]

8 minutes ago, Needfuldoer said:

To me that reads like someone getting frustrated because the OP isn't giving them the information they need to actually solve the problem no matter how they ask, but pestering them for a solution anyway.

 

Of course there's no way to know for certain without reading the entire conversation. (That looks like the last in a series of PMs to me...)

This is exactly it. I have run across this many times on this forum. Someone PM's me, asks a thousand wandering questions that I have either already answered, or they are asking irrelevant questions that have nothing to do with the main topic or they withhold information. I attribute it to age generally. It seems that there are MANY high school aged people on here. Instead of a 5 second google search for some very easy to find information, they treat this place as their personal PC crystal ball, open 24/7 and expect a reply instantly.

[Kilrah]

->Moved to Off Topic

 

1 hour ago, An0maly_76 said:

I would agree, except for the "thanks bye" part. Comes off as more of a "f*ck off, I don't want to be bothered with you" to me. It's not just what you say, it's how you say it.

It does sound like it, but we don't have the rest of the conversation and there may have been a good reason for it.

 

1 hour ago, An0maly_76 said:

Yeah, PM convo

Again we don't have the conversation to know who came first, but if the person asking the question was the one starting the convo asking for help and didn't provide the required information that will also feel rude to the recipient.

Unlike when it's on the open forums when you're asked something through PM it can feel like you're obligated to reply, it's essentially some random guy coming to you in the street and asking you to spend [amount of time] explaining something to them with no way out, which can already feel rude and annoying. If on top of that the requester didn't give the proper information and the exchange feels like it's not going to be a 5 minute reply but you'll have to spend half an hour or more and multiple message exchanges to extract the information to even be able to begin, patience can wear thin quick.

Also depending on the person doing such kind of support can be their job, and visiting the forum is something they do precisely not to see the same thing again. A reply like that hints at "I'm already doing this all day but at least I'm paid for it". 

 

The "polite" thing to do is to either tell the requester to post in the forum where anyone else and not just you can answer, say "sorry, I don't do private support", "I don't have time" or such, but it takes some kind of self-confidence to do so that not everyone has, the answer you got was probably from someone who doesn't and was feeling cornered.

 

It's a 2-way thing. If you felt that reply as rude it's likely the other felt the interaction as rude too. The best is to learn from it.

[Origami Cactus]

44 minutes ago, Kilrah said:

Unlike when it's on the open forums when you're asked something through PM it can feel like you're obligated to reply, it's essentially some random guy coming to you in the street and asking you to spend [amount of time] explaining something to them with no way out, which can already feel rude and annoying. If on top of that the requester didn't give the proper information and the exchange feels like it's not going to be a 5 minute reply but you'll have to spend half an hour or more and multiple message exchanges to extract the information to even be able to begin, patience can wear thin quick.

 

The "polite" thing to do is to either tell the requester to post in the forum where anyone else and not just you can answer, say "sorry, I don't do private support", "I don't have time" or such, but it takes some kind of self-confidence to do so that not everyone has, the answer you got was probably from someone who doesn't and was feeling cornered.

 

It's a 2-way thing. If you felt that reply as rude it's likely the other felt the interaction as rude too. The best is to learn from it.

[Skiiwee29]

We are 100% volunteers. Zero payment for our services as moderators. We are no different than you guys being tech enthusiasts beyond a green badge. We actually dislike when we have to moderate as we just want people to engage in friendly thoughtful conversations around technology and help one another, not tear each other down just because someone may not know the right answer. I'm guilty just as much as the next of being wrong from time to time, thus why I stuck the " just because I'm a moderator doesn't mean I'm always right and to please fact check me" in my signature. 

[An0maly_76]

2 hours ago, Blue4130 said:

I attribute it to age generally. It seems that there are MANY high school aged people on here. Instead of a 5 second google search for some very easy to find information, they treat this place as their personal PC crystal ball, open 24/7 and expect a reply instantly.

I would like to point a couple things out here...

 

First, I likely have autism (my testing report is scheduled for review next week, but it's a formality as I have shown dozens of signs all my life). The defining characteristic of autism is that it is a neuro-developmental disorder. This means certain parts of the brain that control certain behaviors, etc., stop developing at various ages. Hence, someone chronologically 35, in some ways might be 4, in other ways might be 9, and in still other ways might be 12.

 

Those of us with these issues cannot help it. We usually don't even realize it, and there is literally nothing that can be done about it. So while your statement might be true in some cases, and I'm not going to make a federal case of it in this instance, you really ought to consider that as a possible factor. Many people who have autism don't even know it themselves, they just think they are quirky, etc. Unfortunately, many neurotypical folks don't understand neurodivergence and don't want to, preferring to treat us as the problem, even to the point of ableism. Isolation is enough of a problem without that stigma, and in addition, autism gets worse for some as they age.

 

Secondly, Google can be very evasive in certain situations if you don't know the magic words -- and some people are trying to find out about something they don't even know the correct terminology for. So why is it such a problem for them to come to a tech-oriented site to try to find out what they're having difficulty with elsewhere?

 

Thirdly, why hang around a tech-oriented website if someone asking tech-related questions is such a problem? Sorta defeats the purpose of it being a tech website, and sounds more like a "go away, I gave at the office" attitude. No one's forcing anyone to be here, last I checked. I certainly am free to log off whenever I feel like it. I'm also pretty sure there's nothing in the terms and conditions that state "you must be this old to use this website". So lighten up, or take a break if it stresses you out that much. That's like someone going to a dance club and getting annoyed because they're playing music.

 

Seriously, I get that when you're good at what you love to do, it does have its moments when you wish you were someone else. I had lots of those moments when I drove semis over-the-road. But I didn't resent or berate people who wanted to learn from me.

 

As to my original question, I think it's been answered satisfactorily, and the person whom I had this convo with has apparently realized they might have come off as rude and reached out.

Edited April 15, 2022 by An0maly_76
Revised

[Moonzy]

10 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

Secondly, why hang around a tech-oriented website if someone asking tech-related questions is such a problem?

this

1 hour ago, Kilrah said:

when you're asked something through PM it can feel like you're obligated to reply

plus i dont really like it when i get pinged to answer in a thread at times, for the same reason (though im guilty of pinging people at times)

 

why? because i might not feel like answering at that particular moment

[Kilrah]

19 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

So why is it such a problem for them to come to a tech-oriented site to try to find out what they're having difficulty with elsewhere?

 

Thirdly, why hang around a tech-oriented website if someone asking tech-related questions is such a problem?

It's not. If unfriendly responses happen on the public forum then moderation will step in precisely for that reason, report such posts if you come across some. But PMs are a completely different affair, on the public forum anyone can choose whether to step in or not so if they do they should be wanting to help and friendly but if it's in PM the person didn't choose to receive a PM requesting help, they're just put in the situation, and as mentioned they may be feeling forced to answer and exacerbated by that.

 

32 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

First, I likely have autism (my testing report is scheduled for review next week, but it's a formality as I have shown dozens of signs all my life).

Since you understand that it will likely be useful to you to know that a good proportion of "tech nerds" is somewhere on the spectrum as well. So especially on a tech-oriented site, the people who are likely to have your answers may have some form of social anxiety as well, which can lead to the "not appreciating being forced to reply" situation mentioned above.

Forum/chat is a means of communication that is well suited to introvert/socially anxious people precisely because they are never forced to interact, if they do so it's if they want, when they want so obviously you'll find quite a few of these on a tech forum. 

 

So be aware that while you might have difficulty with some things the person on the other end may have some too, and as proper "forum etiquette" avoid sending help requests to specific people either via PM or by tagging them unless there's a specific reason or you have already built a "relationship" with them where you know it's OK. Like IRL really, although a bit more difficult online due to text conversation being less complete but the principle is the same, IRL you'll have people you can't have anything but strictly professional/topical discussions with, some you know you can reach out to for more, and friends you're gonna be joking with and maybe throw each other harsh piques because you know the other will take it funny and you'll both laugh at it... 

[An0maly_76]

As it happens, the person (yes this was a PM) has reached out... They had somewhere to be, but may have chosen their words poorly. I try not to be as pushy as some people, but I have a lot of difficulty recognizing certain social cues, though I certainly do get the gist of "Hey I've got somewhere to be". It just wasn't worded that way, unfortunately.