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"The Fastest Gaming CPU in the World"

Intel got out ahead of AMD’s newest Ryzen CPU launch with the Core i9-12900KS – Was it enough to take the fight out of AMD’s 3D V-Cache Ryzen 7 5800X3D, or is it still the world’s fastest gaming CPU?
 

 

 

Anthony @ LINUS MEDIA GROUP             

I'm a handsome man with a charming personality. - Gabe Newell

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There seems to be a slight disconnect between the script and the statistics.  A 2% increase in performance wouldn't usually be described as "dominating". 

 

As in the voice-over saying the i7 dominates the 5800X3D in productivity while the graphs show a 2% performance difference.

 

 

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Would like to see overclocking testing on these.

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I'd like to get my hands on one, but there isn't any overclocking support on it. I'd rather get a 5800x and call it a day.

GAMING RIG:

CPU: Ryzen 5 5600x (Lazy OC - Not fine tuned. PBO Tuning)

MOBO: ASUS TUF Gaming X570 PLUS (Wi-Fi)

RAM: 32GB G.Skill Ripjaws @ 3600MHz

GPU: Zotac RTX 2080 Super (Mild OC - Still Testing)

STORAGE: 500GB Crucial MX500 M.2 (Boot Drive) / 500GB Crucial SATA / 1 HDD

CASE: Dimas Tech EasyBench V3.0

 

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Alot of it depends on how the system is setup and the actual bench ran as was pointed out in the vid.
I have to assume for this testing each setup was ran at "Stock" whether it can be OC'ed or not with all other things like RAM speeds/timings also at stock values to represent a typical setup.

As for tweaks, that's mainly a gaming thing and I can promise you some good 3D tweaking can make a difference but to be fair that works both ways with both brands, question here would be to what extent these tweaks would have, again based on the actual bench ran and the GPU ran with it.

Even though it may seem the Intel chip is slightly better from this testing it's not enough to make this a thing that's "Written In stone" if you will because of all the possible variables in play here.

For the $$ Ryzen is still the better buy from what I'm seeing and what you do save can be put towards a better/higher GPU model or maybe more/faster RAM for example, making it a better overall value for the same money spent based on one's actual budget for such a build.

That's how I see it.
 

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11 minutes ago, Beerzerker said:

Alot of it depends on how the system is setup and the actual bench ran as was pointed out in the vid.
I have to assume for this testing each setup was ran at "Stock" whether it can be OC'ed or not with all other things like RAM speeds/timings also at stock values to represent a typical setup.

As for tweaks, that's mainly a gaming thing and I can promise you some good 3D tweaking can make a difference but to be fair that works both ways with both brands, question here would be to what extent these tweaks would have, again based on the actual bench ran and the GPU ran with it.

Even though it may seem the Intel chip is slightly better from this testing it's not enough to make this a thing that's "Written In stone" if you will because of all the possible variables in play here.

For the $$ Ryzen is still the better buy from what I'm seeing and what you do save can be put towards a better/higher GPU model or maybe more/faster RAM for example, making it a better overall value for the same money spent based on one's actual budget for such a build.

That's how I see it.
 

12700f for 315$ still looks unbeatable. Its pretty much identical to 12700K in games running stock.

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This looks like a good upgrade for me. I went with a R5 3600 because i had some renovations going on at that time, but now this is within my budget. Too bad that i am propably going to need a new PSU also. 450W paired with a GTX1070, 32GB of RAM and 2 SSD´s might be hard on the limit here i think. Just hope that the MSI Tomahawk B450 will get a BIOS for this.

 

@Beerzerker I am constantly in a CPU limit with my games, it really just depends on what you are playing.

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1 hour ago, pApA^LeGBa said:

Just hope that the MSI Tomahawk B450 will get a BIOS for this.

They will, there's an official release schedule for april-may.

1 hour ago, pApA^LeGBa said:

I am constantly in a CPU limit with my games, it really just depends on what you are playing.

Same here, even 1% improvement makes a difference for Arma 3/Squad and similar (and 5-10% is a complete game-changer)

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I wanna see them race the 5800X3D against an EPYC 72F3.

I don’t suppose LMG has one just laying around? :p

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Straight cache, homie.

 

Definitely buying this

Leonidas

Specs: Ryzen 7 3700x | AMD 6800 XT Midnight Black | MSI B550 Gaming Plus | Corsair Dominator CL16 3200 MHz  4x8 32GB | be quiet! Silent Base 802

Monitors: Acer Nitro XV272U 1440p 170Hz IPS / Acer KG240 1080p 144Hz TN | SSDs: Samsung 970 Evo Plus 1TB / WD SN550 1TB  / Samsung 860 Evo 500GB

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9 minutes ago, GreatnessRD said:

Straight cache, homie.

 

Definitely buying this

Shit was so cache. 

Your "PC master race" thing is cringe. 

 

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1 hour ago, Dogzilla07 said:

139706706_gnCPUTDP.thumb.jpg.a1c5c15068017f63029553285ae70132.jpg

Yeah, LTT's 12900K and 12900KS are clearly thermal throttling with the NH-D15S when running Prime95, thus reducing their total power draw. The fact that both have the same power draw in LTT's power consumption slide is evidence that they are thermally constrained - the 12900KS should pull more (both GN and HUB have shown that it pulls about 10-20% more power than the 12900K), but LTT reached an equilibrium point for the NH-D15S. That cooler just can't remove more than ~240W worth of heat. When you look at the temperature graph, it shows the two bouncing off the 100C mark.

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Another one to cross-refence between the GamersNexus Cinebench/Blender 5min pic top, and this HardwareUnboxed gaming picture below

525025994_HWUBgamingtdp.thumb.jpg.5ac2c0bc5a5054af4be28cd01b669952.jpg

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5 hours ago, Jeppes said:

12700f for 315$ still looks unbeatable. Its pretty much identical to 12700K in games running stock.

12700f respects tau, 12700k doesnt, so the K stays turboed, so I cant imagine them being identical in games that are frequency dependent. It will not hold the turbo longer then 28 seconds, and will then drop down frequency, 12700k just holds turbo untill it runs out of cooling capacity 

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10 minutes ago, starsmine said:

12700f respects tau, 12700k doesnt, so the K stays turboed, so I cant imagine them being identical in games that are frequency dependent. It will not hold the turbo longer then 28 seconds, and will then drop down frequency, 12700k just holds turbo untill it runs out of cooling capacity 

Not how it works and you can remove power limits with 12700f too.

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26 minutes ago, Jeppes said:

Not how it works and you can remove power limits with 12700f too.

its literally how it works for 12th gen chips. K chips dont just mean unlocked OC this go round, it means tau = infinite.
12700 tau is 28 seconds. as in, it only can hold pl2 for 28 seconds before dropping down to pl1. 
12700k, has no tau time, and pl2 = pl1.

Only on some motherboards, that are out of spec btw so its not really stock, are you able to say to the mobo to ignore tau (similar to multi core enhancement from previous gens)
To say 12700 can come close to matching the 12700k, when its usually running 25% slower is just going to lead people astray.  Especially when you  specified "running stock."

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2 minutes ago, starsmine said:

its literally how it works for 12th gen chips. K chips dont just mean unlocked OC this go round, it means tau = infinite.
12700 tau is 28 seconds. as in, it only can hold pl2 for 28 seconds before dropping down to pl1. 
12700k, has no tau time, and pl2 = pl1.

Only on some motherboards, that are out of spec btw and not stock, are you able to say to the mobo to ignore tau (similar to multi core enhancement from previous gens)
To say 12700 can come close to matching the 12700k, when its usually running 25% slower is just going to lead people astray.  Especially when you  specified "running stock."

Why comment without finding out first? And why on earth would cripple the 12700F by not unlocking power limits and not using a good b660-board? To show clueless people with too much money that they should spend on more expensive parts?

kuva.png.9e993baa23282109a0c54ac70faa4096.png

https://www.techspot.com/review/2391-intel-core-i7-12700/

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1 hour ago, YoungBlade said:

but LTT reached an equilibrium point for the NH-D15S. That cooler just can't remove more than ~240W worth of heat. When you look at the temperature graph, it shows the two bouncing off the 100C mark.

Yeah, I agree, It's possible to extract a couple of watts by using Fractal Torrent, and it will be possible to extract an additional few extra watts with 2x next-gen LCP (Liquid Crystal Polymer) 140mm round-frame fans from Noctua/Phanteks coming late this year/early next. But it's gonna be pennies on the dollar.

 

And additionally I doubt it, but it might possible to at least run 12900KS stock with both from above + the next gen 7(or 8)x6mm heatpipe NH-D16, or a 6x8mm heatpipe Thermalright or Phanteks equivalent, But at that point we'll already be on 13900K and AM5 monsters, and those will probably chug even more power 😅

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14 minutes ago, Jeppes said:

Why comment without finding out first? And why on earth would cripple the 12700F by not unlocking power limits and not using a good b660-board? To show clueless people with too much money that they should spend on more expensive parts?

kuva.png.9e993baa23282109a0c54ac70faa4096.png

https://www.techspot.com/review/2391-intel-core-i7-12700/

the 65W bar is the only one of the 12700F bars running the chip at spec, or "running stock." as you said. 

If you are going to compare a chip out of spec, not running stock, then you had best compare it to running the 12700KF running OC, not running stock.
It is wrong and misleading to compare an out of spec 12700F, and say, "see it almost matches an in spec 12700KF." 


You are not crippling the 12700F running it in spec any more then you cripple the 12700KF by not overclocking it. 

Yes the 12700F, when not "running stock" is a good value part. 

For most current AM4 owners, the 12700F not a good value part however. 
Going from a 2600X to a 5800x3D is far bigger bang for the buck then completely swapping platform, and that's who most of the buyers for the 5800x3D really are since buying the am4 platform today is a bad deal when in 5 months AM5 drops with zen 4 with far better value for a whole new set up. 

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So you used 3200MHz ram and left the 12900K at stock speeds. Utterly useless review.

 

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52 minutes ago, starsmine said:

the 65W bar is the only one of the 12700F bars running the chip at spec, or "running stock." as you said. 

If you are going to compare a chip out of spec, not running stock, then you had best compare it to running the 12700KF running OC, not running stock.
It is wrong and misleading to compare an out of spec 12700F, and say, "see it almost matches an in spec 12700KF." 


You are not crippling the 12700F running it in spec any more then you cripple the 12700KF by not overclocking it. 

Yes the 12700F, when not "running stock" is a good value part. 
 

And getting a cooler and an oc-board for K-model is 120-150$ extra. So value goes bad again.

 

And read up on how the turbo works as it really does not work like you think in games. It wont be stuck to 65W:s like on that review. Im done educating for the night but there are articles from Gamers Nexus and most likely videos from LTT.

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The benchmark I really want to see is "gaming while doing another thing".  I realise standardising "another thing" is hard, but I'm regularly streaming video (watching or hosting), playing a game, idling some chrome tabs, and running gentle server loads.  The 'just playing a game" benchmark is becoming a somewhat synthetic use case.

Main rig: 5900X, ROG Strix X570-F Gaming, 2x 32Gb KSM32ED8/32ME @3600MHz, gtx 1080, 4x 7TB MTFDDAK7T6TDS, 2TB 660p, 3.2TB IOscale,  2x 4TB Samsung 850, 1TB Samsung 860, 2TB MX500

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2 hours ago, starsmine said:

the 65W bar is the only one of the 12700F bars running the chip at spec, or "running stock." as you said. 

If you are going to compare a chip out of spec, not running stock, then you had best compare it to running the 12700KF running OC, not running stock.
It is wrong and misleading to compare an out of spec 12700F, and say, "see it almost matches an in spec 12700KF." 


You are not crippling the 12700F running it in spec any more then you cripple the 12700KF by not overclocking it. 

Yes the 12700F, when not "running stock" is a good value part.

The Intel spec is a loose one. As long as the 12700F doesn't exceed the clock multiplier table values, and doesn't fall below the base clock, it is technically within spec, even if Tau is ignored. The reason GN refers to Tau adherence as "official guidance" is that it is not "out of spec" to ignore it.

 

Plenty of boards run without Tau at all. Do you think Intel would just allow that for all these years if it was out of spec behavior?

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25 minutes ago, offweek said:

The benchmark I really want to see is "gaming while doing another thing".  I realise standardising "another thing" is hard, but I'm regularly streaming video (watching or hosting), playing a game, idling some chrome tabs, and running gentle server loads.  The 'just playing a game" benchmark is becoming a somewhat synthetic use case.

This has been tried to death, and you just can't get consistent, repeatable data. Without that, the test is pointless.

 

Also, I typically just play a game. I occasionally stream, but most of my gaming is single player games played with nothing else open.

 

So why is my real world use case synthetic and yours isn't?

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