Calyos NSG S0 2-Phase Cooling Solutions is Dead?

[LinusTech]

On 11/11/2023 at 6:55 AM, matt-fr said:

Linus talked about Calyos in this week's Wan Show.

If the embeded video doesn't start at the good moment, the timestamp is 2:41:04

 

 

 

@LinusTech You will find updates in this topic. Since the September update, posted above, we (the backers) don't have any news.

It still isn't a real refund, as stated in the September update. Backers who request a refund, will only get a refund if "their" physical copper unit (1200 USD) is sold.

 

Lol k

[RevGAM]

On 11/11/2023 at 9:55 AM, matt-fr said:

You will find updates in this topic. Since the September update, posted above, we (the backers) don't have any news.

It still isn't a real refund, as stated in the September update. Backers who request a refund, will only get a refund if "their" physical copper unit (1200 USD) is sold

Incorrect. 

On 9/19/2023 at 3:51 PM, tridy said:

the refund will be honoured regardless of your allocated unit being sold.

 

[matt-fr]

On 11/14/2023 at 2:42 PM, RevGAM said:

Incorrect. 

On 9/19/2023 at 9:51 PM, tridy said:

the refund will be honoured regardless of your allocated unit being sold.

Sorry for the late reply. Indeed I missed that part. But why talk about the whole "allocated unit stuff" if in the end they are going to honour every refund regardless of the allocated unit being sold or not ?

 

Anyways, it became more clear with the november update, that you will find under. Calyos won't spend a penny to refund Kickstarter backers. They will take money from people that want to purchase a limited Copper edition, and give that money to kickstarter backers that want a refund. It seems Calyos must just be really confident that the 500 copper editions will be sold out wathever happens.

 

 

 

November 2023 update:

Quote

Dear Backers,

I am excited to share that the time has now come for you to make a choice between purchasing the SG10 copper edition or opting to receive a refund. In order for you to make the best choice, Streacom have shared a document detailing the full SG10 product information. We will also share a link to the survey so that you can indicate your final choice!

SG10 Product information

Please follow the link below to a 20 pages PDF document that includes details about the specification, product renderings, assembly and the purchasing process for both backers and the general public. This is the same information that will be published on Streacom’s website in the very near future. Streacom will also publish a FAQ on their website too.
 
Here the link to the PDF: https://uploads-ssl.webflow.com/621d4065411a1a64851f5db1/6567594562243ff045a5f034_sg10-intro-231126.pdf

 

Exclusive Copper Edition

The SG10 that will be made available to the Kickstarter community is a limited-edition copper version as shown at Computex earlier this year. I should stress that only 500 of these will ever be made, all future SG10 cases produced will use the standard aluminium condenser, making the copper version highly exclusive. As communicated earlier, the cost of this limited-edition copper SG10 will be 1200EUR and the value of your original pledge (*) will be applied as a discount from this price in the form of a voucher that is redeemable when placing an order for it directly from Streacom.
(*) Kickstarter backer amount:
•    SUPER EARLY BIRD: 479 EUR
•    EARLY BIRD: 549 EUR
•    NEW BIRD & OTHERS: 579 EUR
•    For the backers that had a Kickstarter backing amount higher than 579 EUR please contact me directly
 
Refund

Our process for refunding backers who do not want the SG10 copper edition will be to make their allocated unit, and therefore voucher available for purchase. Members of the public who wish to purchase the product, must first purchase a ‘Kickstarter Pledge Voucher’ from Calyos as the proceeds from this will be used to refund backers. Full details are described in Streacom’s document. Calyos has also created a web shop from which the vouchers can be purchased, but for backers who wish to purchase a case, your voucher will be emailed to you directly, therefore backers will not need to interact with Calyos’ web shop. The refunds will be processed once SG10 units have begun shipping to customers in spring 2024. Do note that the refund will be a full refund including both the pledge and the shipping costs (this was a frequently asked question from the previous communication).

Survey for you to fill-in

Here the link to the survey to choose between the SG10 copper edition or a refund: *link edtited out*

It will take 2 minutes to fill in. You can fill either your backer ID or UID (both or only one). The survey will remain open for backers to respond with no immediate time restriction and only once you have completed the survey will your voucher be emailed or made available for purchase on the web shop. In a few weeks Calyos will begin to chase backers who have not responded and eventually there will come a point in time where we will assume anybody who has not responded wishes to receive a refund and the final ‘Kickstarter Pledge Vouchers’ will be sold.

Important notes for the ones selecting the voucher:
•    You will receive a voucher up to the value of your Kickstarter backer amount up to 579 EUR.
•    The voucher will allow you to place an order on the Streacom website and the discount will be applied.
•    The voucher is only valid for the limited-edition copper SG10 and must be redeemed within 2 months of issue.
•    The vouchers are not transferable and can only be used by the backer it is allocated to.
•    The voucher includes free shipping of the SG10 to you.

Next Steps

As a next step, Streacom will organize the official SG10 product launch through their website and continue with Calyos to prepare for the manufacturing of the units.

As usual, I will keep you informed on the progress through regular communication; and of course, do not hesitate to contact me directly by email if needed.

Kind Regards,
Antoine

 

[matt-fr]

December 2023 update:

 

Quote

Dear Backers,

Following the update from 2 weeks ago, here is an update to communicate the status and next steps. As you will see everything starts to fall in place and preparation of the SG10 launch is progressing well. Below you will find some new information including a clear timeline and next steps.

 

Web Shops & Manufacturing

In the last 2 weeks, colleagues from both Streacom and Calyos have finalized the details of the two web shops which will be used to sell the SG10 Copper Edition and the Kickstarter Pledge Vouchers (KPV). Below you can see a screenshot of the two sites. Lots of time has been spent to make sure that these sites are synchronized so that if someone purchase a voucher, it is delivered promptly and it is recognized on the Streacom web shop. For backers, your voucher will be valued at the amount you originally pledged (from 479 EUR to 579 EUR) plus the shipping will be free for all original backers. For the general public free shipping will not be included, hence if you are considering purchasing the case, we encourage you to ask for the voucher through the survey launched in the last communication so that you do receive free shipping.

 

                                         Streacom Web Shop for SG10

 

                     Calyos Web Shop for Kickstarter Pledge Vouchers

 

On the manufacturing side, Streacom has reviewed the processes with the different suppliers so that each part of the copper SG10 limited-edition is production ready. On this front, we are getting ready as well because Calyos will be assembling the LHP into the case at our factory in Belgium after it has been manufactured in China.

However, an important note is that Chinese New Year (CNY) is approaching in six weeks’ time. This means that some factories are only accepting new orders for after this time which is going to impact our manufacturing planning. More on this in the pre-order section below.

 

Launch Timing

By the 22nd of December, Streacom will release officially the SG10 product information to the general public and their press contacts so that the confidential information you received earlier in PDF format (pics below) is made public. This is an important step in order to raise awareness of the product before it becomes available. It is also important for press and media contacts to be fully up to speed on the design and timeline for manufacture. This will of course lead to future reviews by external parties (which is requested by many backers) and will be crucial for the success of the SG10. The Streacom website will contain information on the SG10 platform including both the aluminium and limited-edition copper version.

 

                              Streacom SG10 Product Information Pack

Together our intention is to go live accepting pre-orders from the 22nd January 2024. This will give additional time for backers to respond to the survey and allow Streacom to understand how the Chinese New Year will impact their manufacturing timeline. It is super important to both Calyos and Streacom to be transparent on the delivery timing given the history of this project. Also, we need to make sure that the vouchers we sell to the general public are in adequation with the feedback from the community to organize on one side the refunds; and on the other side the SG10 shipments.

 

Survey Update

The survey will be kept open for the time being, but I strongly encourage you to respond as soon as possible. Currently only 32% of Kickstarter Backers have responded, and we would like to drastically increase the number of responses before the go-live date for the pre-orders on the 22nd January. This is primarily so that we can align the number of Kickstarter Pledge Vouchers for sale to the number of Backers requesting refunds. I do appreciate that the decision as to how to respond may be a conflicting one for many backers due to the increased cost of the SG10 unit, so I understand that it is not a quick decision to make.

Here is again the link to the survey to choose between the SG10 copper edition or a refund: link removed

If you decided to request the voucher for the SG10 platform, here is a short summary of how this will work:

• The unique code will be delivered by email during the week starting January 15thso that you are in a position to place an order directly on the Streacom site on the 22nd. Please check your spam folder if you do not receive the email into your inbox.

• Only customers with a KPV will be able to place an order for the SG10 Copper Edition.

• As a Kickstarter Backer your code will also qualify you for free shipping.

• The unique code can only be used once.

• Please do not share the code.

I should also note that you will be required to enter two links to your preferred GPU choices during the purchase of the SG10 from Streacom, this is so that the correct mounting hardware can be provided to you. The image below highlights the steps in the purchasing process.

 

                                          Backer Purchase Process

 

 

Refunds

 

Our process for refunding backers who do not want the SG10 copper edition will be to make their allocated unit, and therefore voucher available for purchase. Members of the general public who wish to purchase the product, must first purchase a ‘Kickstarter Pledge Voucher’ from the Calyos web shop presented earlier. I should note that the value of the vouchers sold on the web shop will be for 479EUR only, but that does not affect your refund value if you pledged a larger amount originally. The refund will also include the shipping costs you paid, this was a common question sent to me over the past two weeks.

The proceeds from the sale of the Kickstarter pledge vouchers will be used to refund backers directly. The refunds will be processed once SG10 units have begun shipping to customers in the second quarter of 2024 (or earlier if possible).

 

 

Transparency

 

I also wanted to briefly mention a point about transparency. Since joining Calyos in 2020 it has been an important goal of mine to resolve this project in order to help Calyos move forward with its business objectives. An important part of every communication to the community has been how to be fully transparent, not only in light of the history behind the project, but also in order to share and show the challenges we have faced and are facing. This same belief resonates through my colleagues who are working to help deliver this internally and mutual feelings are felt by Streacom’s team. It is super important to Streacom that the community is recognised for being a part of this story, hence the inclusion of page four in the product documentation.

 

 

Next Steps

 

Hopefully you can see that the next steps are pretty clear. On your side, when you are ready please fill in the survey.

As usual, I will keep you informed on the progress through regular communication; and of course, do not hesitate to contact me directly by email if needed.

 

Kind Regards,

Antoine

 

[tridy]

Today I got the voucher email:
Another pre-order. Do I dare?

 

Quote

Subject: SG10 Kickstarter Pledge Voucher
From: Calyos - Info
Date: 19/01/2024
To: XXXXX

Hi XXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXX,

Thank you for responding to our SG10 survey. Your response has been successfully validated by our team.

We are glad to share two discount codes with you, one for the discount and one for free shipping.

Discount Voucher Code:
XXXXXXX-XXXXXXXX
 

Free Shipping Code:

XXXXXXX-XXXXXXXX
 

Streacom will be accepting pre-orders from the 22nd January and you will be able to complete your pre-order using this link: https://shop.streacom.com/products/sg10-ce. Streacom has asked that you prepare your GPU choices in advance as they will be requesting the Make and Model and a link to the product webpage when you place your order. The process is outlined in the image below.

 

Only customers with a KPV will be able to place an order for the SG10 Copper Edition. The unique codes are specific to you and can only be used once and we ask that you do not share the code. If you have any problems using the code please let us know.

 

Thank you for your patience and continued support.

Have a good weekend,

Ben

 

 

--
Calyos
Quatrième Rue, 20, Zoning De Jumet, Charleroi, 6040, Belgium
www.calyos-tm.com

 

[matt-fr]

It's good that you asked for the voucher; I asked for a refund.

We will be able to get a feedback from each side.

I got this email regarding the refund.

Quote

Hi,

I am pleased to inform you that we have received your survey response requesting a refund and your response has been successfully validated against our records by our team. When the time comes, we will be in touch to request additional information in order to process the refunds.

Thank you for your patience.

Take care,

 

 -

-
Calyos
Quatrième Rue, 20, Zoning De Jumet, Charleroi, 6040, Belgium
www.calyos-tm.com

 

[matt-fr]

Sorry for the double posting, but I guess this January update deserves a post.

 

Quote

Dear Backers,

Following the update from few weeks ago, here is a short message to update you about the SG10.

Firstly, I can confirm that discount vouchers have been sent to the first batch of backers who requested them. Secondly, a confirmation email has been sent out to backers that requested refunds too. I should note that we processed the first 200 responses last week, so if you responded more recently to the survey you will be part of the next batch. We intend to process the responses every two weeks, starting from last Monday (14th), therefore the next batch will be processed on week commencing 29th January. There were a couple of responses that could not be fully validated (matching three of: backer number, backer UID, number, email and name), my colleague Ben has been contacting these people directly to validate their response.

The website’s have now been launched, therefore backers who received their voucher via email can place their order and the general public can purchase Kickstarter Pledge Vouchers available from those who requested refunds.

• Streacom Product Page: https://shop.streacom.com/products/sg10-ce

• Calyos Kickstarter Pledge Voucher: https://sg10.calyos-tm.com/products/479-voucher

For the ones who have not yet filled-in the survey, it will be kept open for the time being, but I strongly encourage you to respond as soon as possible as in certain moment, we will need to close it. When the time comes to process the refunds, the backers who responded first to the survey will be refunded first. I have included the link to the survey for ease:

• Survey: link edited out

As usual, I will keep you informed on the progress through regular communications; and of course, do not hesitate to contact me directly by email if needed.

Kind Regards,

Antoine

 

 

 

 

As I can see, from the website selling the vouchers of people that requested a refund, at least 146 people requested a refund.

For your information, there are a total of 461 backers, and as said in the update above, Calyos only went through the first 200 responses.

[tridy]

It worked to pay by PayPal, so if it is not delivered within a month or so, or if it comes damaged, at least I would have a chance to open a dispute or whatever it is called.

 

It looks like they do the same bad VAT/IOSS workaround as eBay when VAT is refunded after the order is placed so that VAT would be paid later at Swedish (in my case) customs. This does not exactly work as they say, since the customs in Sweden will charge VAT based on the whole amount that already includes the original VAT (even though it was refunded). I wrote an email to the store and support asking for that but there is a high chance that they will screw this up anyways.

 

 

update on the VAT issue, got a reply from the support. It is going to be shipped from somewhere in Europe, so no more VAT issues:

 

Quote

You can ignore this message. We will ship the SG10 from a Europe country to Sweden.

Streacom - Tech Support Team

 

 

The final receipt

 

Quote

 

 

Edited January 26 by tridy
added info about VAT problem solved

[etonbears]

When I noticed the SG10 product was available, there were 151 vouchers available to people like me that were not part of the kickstarter. I bought one

 

So for me, the price was 1200euro plus 80euro shipping. When it arrives, as I am in the "Brexit" land of stupidity, I will probably have to pay 20% VAT and 5% duty on everything, some portion of which, I may get back from the refund of Belgian VAT.

 

At approximately 1500euro, this better be a damn good product!

 

Also, I'm glad they are refunding the original backers, even if inflation has eaten away at the value of the pledge. They are at least trying to the right thing ( or something close to it ).

 

Let's hope there are no more dramas in the next few months.

[tridy]

On 1/28/2024 at 12:03 AM, etonbears said:

When I noticed the SG10 product was available, there were 151 vouchers available to people like me that were not part of the kickstarter. I bought one

 

Now they have removed the counter of the available vouchers, which is weird, I think.

https://sg10.calyos-tm.com/products/479-voucher

 

 

 

A month has passed since I made the purchase and there is no news or updates from Streacom/Calyos.

 

 

[matt-fr]

23 hours ago, tridy said:

Now they have removed the counter of the available vouchers, which is weird, I think.

https://sg10.calyos-tm.com/products/479-voucher

You can still make "the cart" tell you how many are left.
Add items until it tells you "you can't add more".
There are 213 units left.

[tridy]

21 hours ago, matt-fr said:

There are 213 units left.

Nice trick with the cart!

 

So it went from 151 to 213, which means they have changed the available amount. As a result, it does not say anything about how many they have sold, even approximately.

[tridy]

So it has been more than 2 months without any updates.

 

Is there anyone who has got the case or the refund?

[matt-fr]

10 hours ago, tridy said:

Is there anyone who has got the case or the refund?

No news either. No refund.

On their website, where they sell the vouchers, there are 209 left.

[tridy]

I do not remember if this was in the description when I last looked at it but it says mid/end Q2 2024, which makes it like by the end of June 2024.

I will have to wait until then. At least PayPal's 180 days of buyer's protection covers that period.

[matt-fr]

April 2024 Update

Quote

Dear Backers,   Following the update from last quarter, this update is on the current status and planning. As you will see production of the SG10 is progressing well and we are also updating the GPU approach as suggested by the community. Below you will find some new information including a clear timeline and next steps.   Web Shops & Sales Status As a reminder, there are two separate web shops for the sale of the SG10 Copper Edition and its prerequisite Pledge Voucher (see screenshots below). Backers who chose to continue supporting the project should use the voucher they received on the Streacom webshop to access the ‘BUY’ button and once again at checkout to apply the discount (from 479EUR to 579EUR depending on your original pledge). The additional ‘Free Shipping’ voucher should also be used at checkout to receive the free shipping that is included for all backers.     Streacom Web Shop for SG10 & Calyos Web Shop for Kickstarter Pledge Vouchers For reference, here is the link to the Streacom webshop where your vouchers can be applied: https://shop.streacom.com/products/sg10-ce So far more than 70 backers have confirmed they will continue the journey and received their pledge voucher, however some have still not placed an order on the Streacom webshop. It is critical that these vouchers are redeemed soon along with the choice of GPU as this will impact what cards will be supported.   GPU Support & Free Cold Plate Upgrade Our initial list of compatible cards consisted of just six cards, chosen at the time of product development based on popularity (from sales figure data). Obviously, that has somewhat changed, but fortunately, they represented a good starting point for "comparable" board layouts, which allows our modular cooling solution to be adapted to the variations between cards.          Based on customer orders so far, we have already identified 12 popular card choices that appear to be suitable and we are currently working on validation. As we collect more customer requests and validate more cards, we will continue expanding on this list. Our goal is to cover the majority of popular cards and continue to add compatibility wherever possible.     With this in mind, Streacom has also decided to modify how they collect card choices on their website; previously, when placing an order, you would enter your first choice and then choose a backup option from the short list of compatible cards. As we aim to expand the list of compatible cards, knowing a customer's second card option will provide more valuable data on which cards we need to add. Another question that often comes up is compatibility with new cards, and whilst we can't guarantee next-generation GPUs can be supported until they have been released and we are able to test them, we are firmly committed to ongoing compatibility expansion. Whether it's a new generation of GPU, or you decide the card you chose wasn't the right one for you, every SG10 Copper Edition will include a free cold plate upgrade, valid for the first two years from delivery. This offer for the free cold plate upgrade only applies to the Copper Edition, as we appreciate the current choice of compatible cards is limited.   Manufacturing & Latest Planning On the manufacturing side, the different parts of the copper SG10 limited edition are in production right now. Below is a video of the condenser fins being produced, just to see some real moving images in a noisy manufacturing environment. https://youtube.com/shorts/YB_sz_f3GOU?feature=share   The majority of the parts are expected to be ready in the coming weeks in China. The Copper condenser is slightly later and is planned for mid-May. Assuming around 6 weeks transport, we can expect that the first SG10s will be assembled in Belgium around the end of June. We will keep you informed of the progress on that front as it is important to both Calyos and Streacom to be transparent on the delivery timing given the history of this project.   As you can appreciate, mass production is very different from prototyping and some issues only get identified on the first production run. This gets compounded by having multiple suppliers across our 2 independent supply chains as any single component delay will impact the entire schedule. We will keep you posted on the progress as updates become available.   Survey Update The survey remains open for the time being as some of the backers have still not responded to the survey. We strongly encourage these last people to respond as soon as possible. Here is the link to the survey to choose between the SG10 copper edition or a refund: Link edited out   If you decided to request the voucher for the SG10 platform, here is a short summary of how this will work: The unique code will be delivered by email during the week starting January 15th so that you are in a position to place an order directly on the Streacom site on the 22nd. Please check your spam folder if you do not receive the email into your inbox. Only customers with a KPV will be able to place an order for the SG10 Copper Edition. As a Kickstarter Backer you will receive a second code for free shipping. The unique codes can only be used once. Please do not share the codes.   Refunds As a reminder, our process for refunding backers who do not want the SG10 copper edition will be to make their allocated unit, and therefore voucher available for purchase. Members of the general public who wish to purchase the product, must first purchase a ‘Kickstarter Pledge Voucher’ from the Calyos web shop presented earlier. The proceeds from the sale of the Kickstarter pledge vouchers will be used to refund backers directly. The refunds will be processed once SG10 units have begun shipping to customers at the end of second quarter of 2024. We will keep you informed once we process the first refunds. We will be in touch with you at this time to confirm details of where to send the refund.   Next Steps Hopefully you can see that the project is moving step by step forward. As usual, I will keep you informed on the progress through regular communication; and of course, do not hesitate to contact me directly by email if needed.   Kind Regards, Antoine

 

You will find attached the video that is on Youtube (i added it to this message, to have a backup).

Spoiler

 

 

For the refunds, Calyos seems like they don't want to spend a penny out of their pocket.

I wonder what will happen if they don't sell enough vouchers to refund everyone.

[tridy]

It looks like Streacom is a part of this as well, which gives it a slightly bigger chance that this will work out.

 

If I do not have the case by mid-June, I will send them a notice that I do not want the case anymore but a refund, and file a dispute via PayPal.

My general feeling is that when a process like this is coming close to completion, there is more and more good news to share. In the case of Calyos-Streacom, it does not look like this.

 

The copper video is weird. I am not an expert on this type of machine, but having cardboard on the bottom probably shows the "test" or "temporary" state of the installation.

 

We should have had a video or a real running working example by now and I do not think we have seen one. Or have we?