Squadron 42 and Star Citizen

[Steve N. Mavronis]

I understand that Squadron 42 takes place in the Star Citizen universe but will be separate games. The first being single player and the later being multiplayer.

 

But when they both come out which is the best to buy first? Would you just want to complete the single player campaign before interacting with others in multiplayer? The problem is I'm reading Squadron 42 will end up being in 3 parts with expansion stories released later.

 

I like the concept of both but just wish they would have kept them integrated as elements of the same game. However, I'm looking forward to both anyway, especially Star Citizen which reminds of what the old EA game Earth and Beyond could have been if they would have kept developing it. I've never played the Star Citizen author's previous works Wing Commander nor Freespace.

[Napper198]

4 minutes ago, Steve N. Mavronis said:

I understand that Squadron 42 takes place in the Star Citizen universe but will be separate games. The first being single player and the later being multiplayer.

 

But when they both come out which is the best to buy first? Would you just want to complete the single player campaign before interacting with others in multiplayer? The problem is I'm reading Squadron 42 will end up being in 3 parts with expansion stories released later.

 

I like the concept of both but just wish they would have kept them integrated as elements of the same game. But I'm looking forward to both anyway, especially Star Citizen which reminds of what the old EA game Earth and Beyond could have been if they would have kept developing it. I've never played the Star Citizen author's previous works Wing Commander nor Freespace.

Squadron 42 will take place before Star Citizen and there will not be much of an influence between the two games except some badges and maybe a title to wear in SC however may encounter a spoiler or two in SC because of things being destroyed or not. I'm sure CIG will do their best to avoid that in the first place and/or make it as unobtrusive as possible but if you're going with SC first there's also the chat so other people can ruin it.

 

What you should buy is up to you. Do you want community driven multiplayer or story based singleplayer?

+ there should be an add-on for 15$ to get both games, but I only see the combo package right now.

[Wauthar]

From what I've heard about it through the 10 for the Chairman and the various Q&A's, you will start as a civilian in the Star Citizen universe. With Squadron 42, you get listed into the UEE Navy and do missions etc.

The SQ42 campaign will be in parts and will ultimately lead you to gain Citizenship at the end of it. The period between the episodes will serve as 'leave' or time off. Citizens will have some benefits over Civilians, but the details of that escape me for now.

 

The campaign is optional but, as of a month of two ago, came with any ship package you bought in the pledge store. Now you can buy either of them, or as a bundle at a slightly discounted price.

 

It's all upto you, honestly, of what you want to do. There will be some tie-ins with SQ42 and the persistent universe, that's for sure

[Corwin111]

15 hours ago, Wauthar said:

Citizens will have some benefits over Civilians, but the details of that escape me for now.

 

Sounds like they took this, pretty much word for word, from Robert Heinlein't classic novel Starship Troopers (we don't talk about the dreadful movie).

 

If they keep the concept itself intact, and not only the verbeage -  the idea in the book was basically that society is divided into two classes - Citizens and Civilians. Both classes are afforded the same legal rights and are equal before the law. The only difference is that Civilians do not have the right to vote and run for office, while Citizens do.

 

Everyone in the society is born a Civilian, the title is not hereditary or purchasable. The only way to become a Citizen is to "Prove that you are capable of taking personal responsibility for the good of society". It is not really clear what that means, exactly and how it would work in a normal society. 

 

The society in the book had a clear way of becoming a citizen. It was a society, waging a centuries long war with no end in sight. So military service guaranteed you Citizenship at the end of your first tour. But it was hinted in the book that Citizenship was also attainable through other means of distinguished public service. They may swing it the same way in SC, as that society will also be at a constant state of war with the Vanduul. We'll see.

 

The concept has received some pretty heavy criticism, being called unfair and "fascist", over the years, for potentially withholding basic human rights and making them contingent  on arbitrary and ill-defined conditions. And probably unworkable outside the context of an overarching, virtually unending state of war, as in the book. I personally am not sure if I disagree with that assessment. But it is certainly an interesting concept and a very good plot device. I hope they adopt it shamelessly and that the Heinlein estate doesn't take issue with its use.

[Steve N. Mavronis]

It's an interesting concept but in the end it's just a sci-fi plot device that works for our purposes.

[Geekavenger]

4 hours ago, Corwin111 said:

Sounds like they took this, pretty much word for word, from Robert Heinlein't classic novel Starship Troopers (we don't talk about the dreadful movie).

The movie is fantastic if you look at it as a satire of Heinlein and his jingoistic military fetishism.  It is just not true to tone or details of the book, which was good for different reasons.  The sequels to the movie (which are genuinely dreadful) took all the flash and spectacle of the first movie with none of the deadpan satire of the military "utopia" from the first movie, so avoid those.

 

Back on topic though, it sounds like the first episode of SQ42 is going to be available long before the PU is in any state worth exploring, so if you really are going to forgo getting the joint package I say get SQ42.  Though personally I would argue if you are buying in now, before the product is actually out, just buy in for what is there today (baby PU, AC, Social Module and the Hanger) If that is not what you want to play then wait until actual release and make your decision then.  I have been loving what is there today and think it is well worth the full price of a joint package but that is just my opinion.

[Corwin111]

21 minutes ago, Geekavenger said:

The movie is fantastic if you look at it as a satire of Heinlein and his jingoistic military fetishism.  It is just not true to tone or details of the book, which was good for different reasons.  The sequels to the movie (which are genuinely dreadful) took all the flash and spectacle of the first movie with none of the deadpan satire of the military "utopia" from the first movie.

 

 

Apologies for going grossly off-topic here but my main problem with the movie is not that it is satire, but that it satirizes a straw-man. The entire point of the story flies right above Verhoven's head. The political system, depicted in the book is not the focus. And neither is the basic run-of-the-mill war story of camaraderie in the face of adversity BS that the plot revolves around. 

 

In the end it all comes down to asking the question - is neglecting or even suspending rights and liberties necessary when the very survival of the entire group/nation/species is at stake at the hands of an implacable enemy? And the answer is not a definite "yes", but an ambiguous "maybe". And the conclusion is simply - "Whether or not it is necessary, we humans would probably do it anyway. As we have in the past, against much lesser enemies."

 

I would still love to see a Starship Troopers movie done faithfully. The ideas in it may not appeal to everyone, but they sure will spark some interesting discussions. 

[Geekavenger]

1 minute ago, Corwin111 said:

Apologies for going grossly off-topic here but my main problem with the movie is not that it is satire, but that it satirizes a straw-man. The entire point of the story flies right above Verhoven's head. The political system, depicted in the book is not the focus. And neither is the basic run-of-the-mill war story of camaraderie in the face of adversity bullshit that the plot revolves around. 

 

In the end it all comes down to asking the question - is neglecting or even suspending rights and liberties necessary when the survival of the entire group/nation/species is at stake. And the answer is not a definite "yes", but an ambiguous "maybe". And the conclusion is simply - "Whether or not it is necessary, we humans would probably do it anyway."

 

I would still love to see a Starship Troopers movie done faithfully. The ideas in it may not appeal to everyone, but they sure will spark some interesting discussions. 

In short I don't disagree with anything you said, and I wish this wasn't so off topic so we could continue the discussion.  And I would also love a faithful and/or darker movie.

[Steve N. Mavronis]

So what happens if I buy the combo package now and later the finished game(s) come out? Do I get both games somehow or is it just upgraded accordingly online with no additional cost?

[Napper198]

4 minutes ago, Steve N. Mavronis said:

So what happens if I buy the combo package now and later the finished game(s) come out? Do I get both games somehow or is it just upgraded accordingly online with no additional cost?

You basically pre-order both games to get them when they're ready. As an added bonus you get alpha access (and later on beta access) to see and test for yourself how development goes now.

 

We do not now yet about the later 2 expansions of SQ42. There was a rumor that they'll be sold separately (unclear whether as add-on or as separate games), but since they changed the pricing I have not heard anything about it.

[Wauthar]

3 hours ago, Geekavenger said:

In short I don't disagree with anything you said, and I wish this wasn't so off topic so we could continue the discussion.  And I would also love a faithful and/or darker movie.

For all off-topicness we have our Discord server

 

Back on topic, when buying one of the combo packages, you get the full experience: SQ42 (episode 1) when it comes out and Star Citizen (PU). PLUS it also comes with the aforementioned alpha and beta access. 

[Steve N. Mavronis]

On 4/19/2016 at 4:20 PM, Wauthar said:

Back on topic, when buying one of the combo packages, you get the full experience: SQ42 (episode 1) when it comes out and Star Citizen (PU). PLUS it also comes with the aforementioned alpha and beta access. 

Cool well now I have to decide between the 2 combo packages!

1. Perhaps you're looking for something that offers carrying capacity but has combat capabilities too? The Aurora Marque comes with a pair of Behring-quality lasers and a high quality gun cooler system.
2. Inspired by Consolidated Outland CEO Silas Koerner’s cutting edge vision, the Mustang Alpha is a sleek, stylish spacecraft that uses ultralight alloys to push power ratios to the limits, albeit sometimes unsafely. And now, with the optional Cargo Carrier, you can have the Alpha’s advantages without sacrificing carrying capacity.

So if I went for the Mustang Alpha which is a fighter (SQ42) there's an optional cargo carrier for it? How would that aspect compare to the Aurora MR?

 

 

 

[Napper198]

9 hours ago, Steve N. Mavronis said:

Cool well now I have to decide between the 2 combo packages!

1. Perhaps you're looking for something that offers carrying capacity but has combat capabilities too? The Aurora Marque comes with a pair of Behring-quality lasers and a high quality gun cooler system.
2. Inspired by Consolidated Outland CEO Silas Koerner’s cutting edge vision, the Mustang Alpha is a sleek, stylish spacecraft that uses ultralight alloys to push power ratios to the limits, albeit sometimes unsafely. And now, with the optional Cargo Carrier, you can have the Alpha’s advantages without sacrificing carrying capacity.

So if I went for the Mustang Alpha which is a fighter (SQ42) there's an optional cargo carrier for it? How would that aspect compare to the Aurora MR?

 

As always it depends on your desired profession in the PU. Both feature the same cargo capacity but the Aurora can be upgraded to almost twice the size and has an open hardpoint for some missiles. The Mustang has better maneuvering, is faster, has its guns mounted on a turret (so they will follow your mouse) and has open hardpoints for 2 additional weapons (which can not be fitted to follow your mouse). Plus the Mustang is about 5000 UEC more worth. So the Mustang is more of a closed system for combat and the Aurora is more open and upgradable for all kinds of mercantile.

 

Edit: Do you know that there's a free flight going on, so you can test the game in it's current stage until Monday without purchase?

The best way to get a feeling for the two ships is to fly them. The LN and The Delta are not these specific models but they are close enough to their smaller brothers.

 

Maybe these will help you:

 

 

[Steve N. Mavronis]

5 hours ago, Napper198 said:

As always it depends on your desired profession in the PU. Both feature the same cargo capacity but the Aurora can be upgraded to almost twice the size and has an open hardpoint for some missiles. The Mustang has better maneuvering, is faster, has its guns mounted on a turret (so they will follow your mouse) and has open hardpoints for 2 additional weapons (which can not be fitted to follow your mouse). Plus the Mustang is about 5000 UEC more worth. So the Mustang is more of a closed system for combat and the Aurora is more open and upgradable for all kinds of mercantile.

 

Edit: Do you know that there's a free flight going on, so you can test the game in it's current stage until Monday without purchase?

The best way to get a feeling for the two ships is to fly them. The LN and The Delta are not these specific models but they are close enough to their smaller brothers.

Thanks I didn't know about the free flight time period. Too bad there isn't a slightly more expensive combo to purchaser both ships + both games.

 

No biggie but I really wish they would have kept the 2 games as one where you can play as a civilian in MMO mode but also join SQ42 in-game on the side (like serving in part time military reserves) for single player mode to hone your flight and combat skills and earn citizenship along the way,   

[rentaspoon]

@Corwin111 yep its an easter egg or a nod to a classic depending on how you look at it

[Geekavenger]

16 hours ago, Steve N. Mavronis said:

So if I went for the Mustang Alpha which is a fighter (SQ42) there's an optional cargo carrier for it? How would that aspect compare to the Aurora MR?

So someone else can feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but in SQ42 you will be part of the UEE Navy and therefore flying one of their ships not your own.  I think the pledge ships are only for the PU.  I could be way wrong though.  It would just seem weird to be part of an elite wing of fighters headed by an aurora.

 

Not that the Aurora can't be bad ass in the right hands, but it just doesn't seem like the UEE's style.

[Steve N. Mavronis]

43 minutes ago, Geekavenger said:

So someone else can feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but in SQ42 you will be part of the UEE Navy and therefore flying one of their ships not your own.  I think the pledge ships are only for the PU.  I could be way wrong though.  It would just seem weird to be part of an elite wing of fighters headed by an aurora. Not that the Aurora can't be bad ass in the right hands, but it just doesn't seem like the UEE's style.

That would make sense. I just want to get started in the right way. Any clue when the commercial release date will be? I'd hate to buy into this and have it be delayed or not out for another year while experimenting with test versions for $45 or $60 as a combo.

[Corwin111]

30 minutes ago, Steve N. Mavronis said:

That would make sense. I just want to get started in the right way. Any clue when the commercial release date will be? I'd hate to buy into this and have it be delayed or not out for another year while experimenting with test versions for $45 or $60 as a combo.

The official word so far for SQ42 is "Q4 2016" as far as I remember. But it has to be mentioned that, while CIG are good at many things, keeping schedules is not one of them.  

[Napper198]

@Geekavenger @Steve N. Mavronis Yes, the ship you buy now will only be available in SC. Having a Idris in SQ42 would be a bit unfair wouldn't it

 

You can also buy an additional ship as an add-on to your pledge but at that point I'd advise you to just upgrade to an Avenger Titan which is the overall better ship.

 

As for release date, there is nothing confirmed yet but based on what we know SQ42 is practically finished and only needs some bug fixing and maybe an asset or two.

Star Citizen will take a little longer because they still need to implement a lot of tech and assets so it doesn't end up like ED. Rumors are end of 2017.

[Steve N. Mavronis]

So I guess SQ42 is the first one to actually be able to play for real. If SC is still another year away I may just buy that separately and not bother with the combo savings I dunno.