Low image quality on newer GPUs

[vanished]

ok, this is the best I can get, maybe it's not portray the whole condition but here you go, 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6ZB1ApVOSRfSVQzWHFLM0RLRGc/view?usp=sharing

 

please do watched at fullscreen 

what on earth did you encode that with?  VLC cannot play it (wow, never thought I'd utter those words...)

[silverhawk]

I forgot, it's between NV12 or RTV1, I used MSI afterburner...

try using Klite codec pack perhaps?

[xAcid9]

ok, this is the best I can get, maybe it's not portray the whole condition but here you go, 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6ZB1ApVOSRfSVQzWHFLM0RLRGc/view?usp=sharing

 

please do watched at fullscreen 

Oh, i've seen that before.

 

what on earth did you encode that with?  VLC cannot play it (wow, never thought I'd utter those words...)

Ahah! MPC-BE FTW! =x

[silverhawk]

you do?, in your experience what is it or what has causing it?

[serstoney]

Can you play game with this issue?

[silverhawk]

yes but it was in degrading image quality.. the most noticeable is on the aliasing and texture shimmering, for aliasing it looks some geometry that have a white line over its edge show jagginess

[serstoney]

I have too but its very disgusting so i dont want to play game with this issue.

[ManniMarc31]

Same problem as you guys. I changed my hardware as well as testing my old pc on an other monitor to see if it could be a hardware virus or whatever.. Do you think buying an ups could change something if this is really an electricity problem? I really dont know what it could be if not.. got it on my old pc which was fine with the same games, laptop etc.. in YT videos as well only on my phone videos seem to be normal so the electricity theory is the only thing i can imagine at this point.

[Demiqas]

Haha wow all of a sudden my image quality degraded again. Now LOD bias even through nvidia inspector doesn't work at all, all shadows in all games shimmer 3x as much and 8x MSAA/SSAA + DSR makes my games look what 2xmsaa would typically look like.

 

now the process seems to be complete, new games officially look worse than atari games

 

it was NEVER this horrendous on my amd cards. Nvidia, never again for me.

[212th]

Do you guys think devs will eliminate this issue for new games in 2016? (by using some tweaks, drivers)

 

P.S. I only play GTA:Online on PC ( i7-3770, GTX 560, Asus P8Z77-V LX, 12GB 1333mHz RAM, 256GB Crucial MX100, 1TB Seagate HDD, Windows 10/8.1 )

I started to notice graphics degradation after I changed my old mobo and Phenom 955 to the new one.

I don't have pop-ins (the game is on SSD), but I do have shimmering, very low draw distance (notorious bubble), lighting sometimes shimmers as if it's turned off and on.

Characters look mostly fine, except their hair and accessories are full of shimmering.

[serstoney]

Do you guys think devs will eliminate this issue for new games in 2016? (by using some tweaks, drivers)

 

P.S. I only play GTA:Online on PC ( i7-3770, GTX 560, Asus P8Z77-V LX, 12GB 1333mHz RAM, 256GB Crucial MX100, 1TB Seagate HDD, Windows 10/8.1 )

I started to notice graphics degradation after I changed my old mobo and Phenom 955 to the new one.

I don't have pop-ins (the game is on SSD), but I do have shimmering, very low draw distance (notorious bubble), lighting sometimes shimmers as if it's turned off and on.

Characters look mostly fine, except their hair and accessories are full of shimmering

 

 

I think so many of them dont know the issue. 

[iPugx]

yes but it was in degrading image quality.. the most noticeable is on the aliasing and texture shimmering, for aliasing it looks some geometry that have a white line over its edge show jagginess

 

You pretty much described the problem im having to the tee. 

[MageTank]

Haha wow all of a sudden my image quality degraded again. Now LOD bias even through nvidia inspector doesn't work at all, all shadows in all games shimmer 3x as much and 8x MSAA/SSAA + DSR makes my games look what 2xmsaa would typically look like.

 

now the process seems to be complete, new games officially look worse than atari games

 

it was NEVER this horrendous on my amd cards. Nvidia, never again for me.

I am going to need to see this to believe it. I have been running this test for you for quite a while now, and my experience has not degraded since day one. After seeing the anomalies you pointed out, i have not noticed anything different across the generational spectrum of cards i have.

 

I have sufficiently proven time and time again in this thread that the original problem you talked about, was not Nvidia exclusive. If you read the LOD bias information you gave me, you would have seen that it was not Nvidia's choice to do away with the LOD bias option, but instead, a result of DirectX. AMD removed theirs at the same time too. Yet you still blame Nvidia, even though plenty of people with AMD cards have chimed in with the same claims you are making.

 

This thread has gotten nowhere. No information has come from it, and no resolution. Only you placing false blame on Nvidia while ignoring that the "problem" is vendor and platform agnostic. I believe it's time for this thread to be closed, or cleaned up so new information can be presented without having to read through pages of nonsense.

[daraga123]

MageTank man,the problem is real.I'm not blaming nvidia or amd but i we still need help.I have the same thing like Demiqas except i dont have it on windows texts.Everything started when i changed card from gtx 650 to r9 280.I have this on all games.Shimmering textures,long loading texture times (pop ins) and jagged edges even if i turn the aliasing on max.

[tsrbino]

Of course this is not Nvidia-specific. I feel like every time demiqas tries to blame them he ignores the info other people with the problem have provided. As far as I'm concerned, blaming NVidia will only sidetrack us and take away our legitimacy in the eyes of others who might somehow be able to help. 

 

Anyway, considering everything I've read and experienced for almost a year now I'm beginning to think this may be some kind of hardware rootkit. Mage Tank, what do you know about this subject? When I try to investigate on the web I mostly get results that go no further than trying to sell me anti rootkit software. Can a hardware rootkit embed itself in periphery devices such as keyboards, mouses, monitors, televisions, game controllers, etc.?  If so, that would explain why this problem has stayed with me when I built completely new rigs but used the same peripheries.

 

It doesn't seem that things such as keyboards, game controllers, and mice could have the information storage capabilities required to harbor a hardware rootkit.  On the other hand, monitors and televisions most definitely have information storage capabilities.

 

By the way, I confirmed last night that the only television in my house that my pc has never come into contact with is displaying the same visual anomalies (aliasing, temporal aliasing, line flashing) while displaying television programs, specifically South Park.

[LokiFire]

This is all hearsay and people who are clueless about image quality and anomalies that are quite normal in certain game engines and nothing more.

[MageTank]

MageTank man,the problem is real.I'm not blaming nvidia or amd but i we still need help.I have the same thing like Demiqas except i dont have it on windows texts.Everything started when i changed card from gtx 650 to r9 280.I have this on all games.Shimmering textures,long loading texture times (pop ins) and jagged edges even if i turn the aliasing on max.

I've seen the problem. I am not discounting the fact that something is going on. What annoys me is that certain people are focusing entirely on Nvidia, which is diluting this thread's legitimacy and hurting our chances at finding real answers. If this thread was titled "Warning: All GPU's at risk for performance degradation/anomalies" it would have gotten the attention of not just Nvidia users and anti-Nvidia fans, but legitimate people that own cards from every vendor. They would be here clarifying whether or not they have noticed these anomalies, which would further aid in our search for answers.

 

 

Of course this is not Nvidia-specific. I feel like every time demiqas tries to blame them he ignores the info other people with the problem have provided. As far as I'm concerned, blaming NVidia will only sidetrack us and take away our legitimacy in the eyes of others who might somehow be able to help. 

 

Anyway, considering everything I've read and experienced for almost a year now I'm beginning to think this may be some kind of hardware rootkit. Mage Tank, what do you know about this subject? When I try to investigate on the web I mostly get results that go no further than trying to sell me anti rootkit software. Can a hardware rootkit embed itself in periphery devices such as keyboards, mouses, monitors, televisions, game controllers, etc.?  If so, that would explain why this problem has stayed with me when I built completely new rigs but used the same peripheries.

 

It doesn't seem that things such as keyboards, game controllers, and mice could have the information storage capabilities required to harbor a hardware rootkit.  On the other hand, monitors and televisions most definitely have information storage capabilities.

 

By the way, I confirmed last night that the only television in my house that my pc has never come into contact with is displaying the same visual anomalies (aliasing, temporal aliasing, line flashing) while displaying television programs, specifically South Park.

There was a post in the news section of this forum, involving the NSA having spy software on a bios level, and it stores information in devices plugged into the motherboard. While such a rootkit may be possible, i highly doubt it is responsible for these anomalies. I have been testing for over 2 weeks now (I have 4 systems in my home currently, with CPU's ranging from an Intel Q9300, a Phenom II 720 Black Edition, FX 8320, and my current Pentium G4400, each running different GPU's, ranging from a Radeon 2400 Pro, all the way up to a GTX 770. I even have a 9800GT and 560 Ti in the mix, so that is G92, Fermi, and Kepler that i am testing with. I have a brother with a GTX 750 Ti and a brother with a GTX 970, both of whom are also helping out. We all see the anomalies posted before, in the Heaven benchmark. We have determined that it is a normal phenomenon. However, we were unable to reproduce the anomalies in Metal Gear Solid: Phantom Pain. I have tried different resolutions, levels of AA, nothing was able to cause the problem in that video. I have to assume something else outside of the game is causing that problem.

 

My other theory is a dumb one, but one that should be investigated nonetheless since we happen to be 100% at a standstill in this thread, and that is signal interference. The jumping picture quality on your TV can be explained by signal interference or impedance at the cable or splitter level. Perhaps call a cable technician to come out and replace your cables and splitters and check the signals to ensure they are within proper operating ranges. How that is impacting your PC is beyond me though, but hey, we have to start somewhere. 

 

When it comes to getting to the bottom of this graphic anomaly problem, we have to start introducing controls. As much as it would suck, we need people to get together, and agree upon cheap hardware and software configurations that we can all use and test to see if it is 100% reproducible across all machines. We need to factor in all variables, even if they are absurd, such as ISP's, geographical locations, power consumption at the wall, etc. We need to compare this data among the group, and see how it fares out. That is the only scientific way to get a definitive answer regarding this problem. Sadly, such a reality will be next to impossible to orchestrate given the chaotic nature of this (and that Nvidia forum) thread. 

[ManniMarc31]

I've seen the problem. I am not discounting the fact that something is going on. What annoys me is that certain people are focusing entirely on Nvidia, which is diluting this thread's legitimacy and hurting our chances at finding real answers. If this thread was titled "Warning: All GPU's at risk for performance degradation/anomalies" it would have gotten the attention of not just Nvidia users and anti-Nvidia fans, but legitimate people that own cards from every vendor. They would be here clarifying whether or not they have noticed these anomalies, which would further aid in our search for answers.

 

 

There was a post in the news section of this forum, involving the NSA having spy software on a bios level, and it stores information in devices plugged into the motherboard. While such a rootkit may be possible, i highly doubt it is responsible for these anomalies. I have been testing for over 2 weeks now (I have 4 systems in my home currently, with CPU's ranging from an Intel Q9300, a Phenom II 720 Black Edition, FX 8320, and my current Pentium G4400, each running different GPU's, ranging from a Radeon 2400 Pro, all the way up to a GTX 770. I even have a 9800GT and 560 Ti in the mix, so that is G92, Fermi, and Kepler that i am testing with. I have a brother with a GTX 750 Ti and a brother with a GTX 970, both of whom are also helping out. We all see the anomalies posted before, in the Heaven benchmark. We have determined that it is a normal phenomenon. However, we were unable to reproduce the anomalies in Metal Gear Solid: Phantom Pain. I have tried different resolutions, levels of AA, nothing was able to cause the problem in that video. I have to assume something else outside of the game is causing that problem.

 

My other theory is a dumb one, but one that should be investigated nonetheless since we happen to be 100% at a standstill in this thread, and that is signal interference. The jumping picture quality on your TV can be explained by signal interference or impedance at the cable or splitter level. Perhaps call a cable technician to come out and replace your cables and splitters and check the signals to ensure they are within proper operating ranges. How that is impacting your PC is beyond me though, but hey, we have to start somewhere. 

 

When it comes to getting to the bottom of this graphic anomaly problem, we have to start introducing controls. As much as it would suck, we need people to get together, and agree upon cheap hardware and software configurations that we can all use and test to see if it is 100% reproducible across all machines. We need to factor in all variables, even if they are absurd, such as ISP's, geographical locations, power consumption at the wall, etc. We need to compare this data among the group, and see how it fares out. That is the only scientific way to get a definitive answer regarding this problem. Sadly, such a reality will be next to impossible to orchestrate given the chaotic nature of this (and that Nvidia forum) thread. 

 

As i said i tested my old pc which i didnt touch for a year and he has the same problem as my new one. It has to be a problem with the signal interference or impedance at the cable or splitter level as you said. I recognized that there are very little hdr changes all the time which would explain why the flickering is mostly on transparent objects where light is breaking through. It would also explain the fact that it was there from one day to the other without changing anything. It started withougt changing any hardware, after that i began to change gpu, ram etc cause i never expected that it could be a general problem in my house, but now after testing my old pc which ran fine and seeing it on my new laptop makes that clear for me. But i think we maybe got 2 different problems here because i never got a bluescreen with my new gpu i "only" got shimmering and flickering lines on transparent objects and edges which happened from one day on the other a half year ago.

My english isnt the best i guess but i hope i could make my point clear^^ have a nice day

[MageTank]

As i said i tested my old pc which i didnt touch for a year and he has the same problem as my new one. It has to be a problem with the signal interference or impedance at the cable or splitter level as you said. I recognized that there are very little hdr changes all the time which would explain why the flickering is mostly on transparent objects where light is breaking through. It would also explain the fact that it was there from one day to the other without changing anything. It started withougt changing any hardware, after that i began to change gpu, ram etc cause i never expected that it could be a general problem in my house, but now after testing my old pc which ran fine and seeing it on my new laptop makes that clear for me. But i think we maybe got 2 different problems here because i never got a bluescreen with my new gpu i "only" got shimmering and flickering lines on transparent objects and edges which happened from one day on the other a half year ago.

My english isnt the best i guess but i hope i could make my point clear^^ have a nice day

Your English is better than most American's i talk to on a daily basis, do not be worried about that. I have never noticed a bluescreen on any of my test setup's either. There has to be something causing this degradation, which is why i suggested introducing some controls. Have the people with this problem switch to an OS we all have and can test with, have them run hardware configurations that we can all test with (Maybe a cheap $50 CPU and $40 motherboard to isolate platform and CPU as the cause) and test to see if each and every person suffers the same problem. We will never come up with a definitive answer with all of these variables. It is just not going to happen.

[Denisix]

read what is resampling is it can????

[MarkFMB]

I've seen the problem. I am not discounting the fact that something is going on. What annoys me is that certain people are focusing entirely on Nvidia, which is diluting this thread's legitimacy and hurting our chances at finding real answers. If this thread was titled "Warning: All GPU's at risk for performance degradation/anomalies" it would have gotten the attention of not just Nvidia users and anti-Nvidia fans, but legitimate people that own cards from every vendor. They would be here clarifying whether or not they have noticed these anomalies, which would further aid in our search for answers.

A lot of people have asked for a thread rename man, us wanting to get to a solution or at the very least to a cause are in the vast majority in this thread. We could open another different thread if this misconception about this thread being about slandering Nvidia goes on.

You mentioned The Phantom Pain and not being able to reproduce the animalies. So compared to the video i posted none of the animalies there were present on your systems? I also tried almost every thinkable setting through Nvidia Control Panel, Nvidia Inspector and SweetFx and that was the avarage result (with some variables) on any setting tested. If you can't reproduce it with any setting as well, then at least it's pretty clear it's something external to the software engine causing these issues.

I'd wish i had the money right now to buy 2-3 cheap systems and try them in another house with my peripherals, in this house while sharing only the power, in another house with some hardware components of my 2 "infected pcs", to like isolate at least where to look for a cause. But after buying my actual pc and all the xmas present rush i'm nearly broke on cash for some time at least... Hopefully someone else is comfortable enough to try such testing... i'll save up meanwhile.

[MageTank]

A lot of people have asked for a thread rename man, us wanting to get to a solution or at the very least to a cause are in the vast majority in this thread. We could open another different thread if this misconception about this thread being about slandering Nvidia goes on.

You mentioned The Phantom Pain and not being able to reproduce the animalies. So compared to the video i posted none of the animalies there were present on your systems? I also tried almost every thinkable setting through Nvidia Control Panel, Nvidia Inspector and SweetFx and that was the avarage result (with some variables) on any setting tested. If you can't reproduce it with any setting as well, then at least it's pretty clear it's something external to the software engine causing these issues.

I'd wish i had the money right now to buy 2-3 cheap systems and try them in another house with my peripherals, in this house while sharing only the power, in another house with some hardware components of my 2 "infected pcs", to like isolate at least where to look for a cause. But after buying my actual pc and all the xmas present rush i'm nearly broke on cash for some time at least... Hopefully someone else is comfortable enough to try such testing... i'll save up meanwhile.

I saw no such anomalies in my run of Phantom Pain. It is my little brothers game, so i only played it at the beginning (the hospital scene) as i had no intention of trying to beat it or anything, but graphically speaking, it looked fine. I did have problems trying to run it with my ATI 2400 Pro, but my newer AMD laptop ran it fine too without any problems. I am running the game off a steam directory on an external SSD (I don't have time to transfer these large games to each and every PC, as my older machines use low capacity IDE drives) but the source from the games, all come from the same external drive. It also helps isolate any issues involving me using different storage configurations. The drive is a 250gb Samsung 850 Evo in a cheap $10 Rosewill external 2.5 enclosure. 

 

I can have my little brother play the game longer, and have him specifically look for any anomalies if that will help. 

[Demiqas]

Sorry for the nvidia blaming, I'll change the title

 

I have something really interesting to share though. I tried playing several quite old games both on my newer computer with the 750 ti and a very old laptop with an nvidia 7000m on it, using driver 179.48. Here's the funny thing: I ran all the games with 0x anti aliasing, so naturally there were a lot of jaggies. But there was no temporal aliasing at all, while there was a lot of it on my 750 ti. You know those weird white lines running through almost all objects when you move? Completely absent on the 7000m, which made the game look a LOT better even though I was running them with 0x anti aliasing on a small resolution. There was only natural aliasing, the type that would easily go away with some high multisampling or a bit of supersampling.

 

So why does this card not having any temporal aliasing at all?

[Denisix]

Resampling

(also called oversampling) – change volume of image data while changing its pixel dimensions or resolution. While reducing the number of pixels (downsampling) the picture loses some information. While increasing the number of pixels or increase the resolution (resampling) and add new pixels image. Note otoh that resampling can result in poorer quality image. For example, when resampling the image to a larger size in pixels reduces detail and sharpness.

[NvidiaGPU]

Do you guys experience this in GTA 5?   Watch in 1080p.