Lenovo found to include unremovable software which spies on users (a clean install of Windows doesn't fix it - BIOS level)

[deviant88]

Best combo a Lenovo laptop with Windows 10 you might aswell write all your personal details of your life and data on paper and throw copies on the street. 

[Swndlr]

Good reason to not buy PC laptops

[alicskysareblue]

Good reason to not buy PC laptops

not everyone buys them for gaming and not everyone has a choice

[mr moose]

 there is no way to hold them accountable. They are the only ones who has access to the evidence that they are innocent/guilty.

 

A court order making them hand over the necessary tools/keys to access all information being sent back should be enough.

[LAwLz]

A court order making them hand over the necessary tools/keys to access all information being sent back should be enough.

A court can't order that because it would break the fifth amendment.

[Godlygamer23]

Time to flash a modded BIOS perhaps if possible?

[mr moose]

A court can't order that because it would break the fifth amendment.

 

A jury can overrule the 5th amendment and I believe it only applies to capital or otherwise infamous crimes not to corporations.

 

EDIT: otherwise whenever a court orders the handover of files or emails from MS or another ISP they could simply plead the 5th. Which to my knowledge they haven't.

[LAwLz]

A jury can overrule the 5th amendment and I believe it only applies to capital or otherwise infamous crimes not to corporations.

 

EDIT: otherwise whenever a court orders the handover of files or emails from MS or another ISP they could simply plead the 5th. Which to my knowledge they haven't.

Isn't the point of amendments that they can't be overruled? It has happened a few times that people have been forced to hand over encryption keys, but it has also happened that the court has agreed that people are not required to hand over encryption keys since it would break the fifth amendment. Wikipedia has some examples of both things happening.

 

When it comes to MS and ISPs it's different, because handing over emails in those cases would not be self incriminating. It would incriminate the users of those services. The fifth amendment only protects you from incriminating yourself (the right to remain silent).

[mr moose]

Isn't the point of amendments that they can't be overruled? It has happened a few times that people have been forced to hand over encryption keys, but it has also happened that the court has agreed that people are not required to hand over encryption keys since it would break the fifth amendment. Wikipedia has some examples of both things happening.

 

When it comes to MS and ISPs it's different, because handing over emails in those cases would not be self incriminating. It would incriminate the users of those services. The fifth amendment only protects you from incriminating yourself (the right to remain silent).

 

In cases of individuals it might be upheld, however the amendment clearly states that a jury can force it. 

 

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/fifth_amendment

 

unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury

 

 

Also a corporation is not an individual but is an entity and the case is not capital but between either government and Corporation or consumer and corporation and thus the matter is consider a civil matter. 

 

 

Edit:  Also I found this,  Corporations and organizations cannot plead the 5th:

 

The privilege against self-incrimination is a personal one and cannot be utilized by or on behalf of any organization, such as a corporation. Thus, a corporation cannot object on self-incrimination grounds to a subpoena of its records and books or to the compelled testimony of those corporate agents who have been given personal immunity from criminal prosecution. 175 Neither may a corporate official with custody of corporate documents which incriminate him personally resist their compelled production on the assertion of his personal privilege.

 

http://constitution.findlaw.com/amendment5/annotation07.html#sthash.Ck5bk7xm.dpuf

[Django]

A court can't order that because it would break the fifth amendment.

Lenovo is a multinational Company, i.e. worldwide.

[AlwaysFSX]

Lenovo is a multinational Company, i.e. worldwide.

Doesn't matter, if they're tried in a US court they abide by US laws.

[Django]

The US is not the only country to have courts

Or maybe I should say "why do they have to be tried in the US?"

[Tomsen]

Lenovoes US channel can be under court in US, but the rest wont.

[Enferk]

I'm glad that i haven't bought anything from lenovo. They don't deserve my money! 

[Mew]

Can we just do away with these manufactuers that largely sell junk and hope that people buy their products because only their flagship products are any good? I'm sick and done with using crummy keyboards, trackpads, bloatware, and poor battery life. Microsoft, just please make your own ultrabooks that can compete with Apple's offerings.