Windows Doesn’t Suck! Microsoft Just Wants You To Think So…

[Thadir]

So there alternative to Chocolatey, witch is scoop. There both fine there a lot of hacks these days now that windows has a decent terminal and that powershell is slowly also in the opensource space. 2 bad my bigest gripe with powershell is still there think it will be always there the lack of zsh like history behavior.

[DarkSwordsman]

Re: "Full Blown Linux"

WSL and WSL2 are not "Full Blown Linux". They are far from it in fact. At the very least, WSL 2 does not ship with a system-daemon. A lot of programs do run on WSL, but the majority of the ones that you'd probably use don't, or at least don't run properly. And for example, in order to use docker in linux... you need to install docker for Windows.

It's nothing more than a modified Linux kernel (I think?) running alongside/integrated with Windows. And the best part of all of this? WSL 2 uses a VM... which was exactly not the original plan or goal with WSL 2.

I am glad they added support for GPU pass through at some point, but really WSL is no good for anything beyond Node web development or some PyTorch apps (though I still had other issues with PyTorch even after they setup GPU pass through). But even then, tools like Cypress that require a browser window don't work properly. It needs to send a desktop preview through a display directory thing and it's just not intuitive.

Basic rule of thumb: If the Linux thing you're doing has a Windows alternative, you're better off doing it through Windows or dual booting Linux.

[SkyStreaker]

18 hours ago, ToboRobot said:

Windows 2000 Pro.

I'll do you one better: https://softfamous.com/microsoft-windows-2000-unofficial-sp5/ install that together with Blackwingcat's kernel extensions and you have yourself a still solid, if not rockstable, OS.

 

@Avocado DiaboliWindows Search does indeed suck, try VoidTools' it's nifty program called "Everything". Far more powerful.

[Avocado Diaboli]

20 hours ago, Radium_Angel said:

UltraSearch says Hello.

4 hours ago, SkyStreaker said:

@Avocado DiaboliWindows Search does indeed suck, try VoidTools' it's nifty program called "Everything". Far more powerful.

I find it amusing how in a thread about Windows built-in functions, people feel compelled to advise for 3rd party tools, completely missing the point of my comment and assuming that my comment was in any way an indication that I was unaware of these tools. The built-in Windows search is perfectly adequate and more powerful than anything you've recommended, if properly configured. But you'd know that had you bothered to learn something instead of regurgitating a common misconception.

[Radium_Angel]

1 hour ago, Avocado Diaboli said:

But you'd know that

The funny thing is, out of the box Windows Search is terrible. It does require tweaking, but Everything and UltraSearch work right out of the box and are superior if you wish not to fiddle with WS, as you are busy fiddling with all the other crap that Windows 10/11 requires in order to get something useful out of it. Unless of course you are happy with Win10/11 as it is, in which case carry on!

[finest feck fips]

As someone who uses most of these applications on his daily driver for work, there are a lot of problems with many of these utilities:

• PowerToys is quite buggy and slow
  • Run has enough lag that it's little better than the Start Menu
  • FancyZones seems related to an issue with the window manager where normal window dragging lags so much the system is unusable until DWM.exe is killed, requiring periodic restarts of that process or logging out and logging back in
  • Global microphone mute sometimes doesn't work right, making it untrustworthy for work contexts
• Windows Subsystem for Linux is riddled with bugs
  • accessing Windows files from the Linux guests is atrociously slow
  • no way to pass hardware to the Linux guests
  • resize/drag glitches, multimonitor issues, and random crashes with GUI apps via WSLg
  • wsl --terminate and wsl --shutdown are not always safe to run (can result in filesystem corruption on the guests)
  • weird filename/case sensitivity incompatibilities with git checkouts depending on whether they were originally made on the Linux side or the Windows side
  • huge memory leak that brings the whole system to a grinding halt when many Docker containers are running on a Linux guest
  • Docker Desktop's default behavior breaks Docker on some distros
  • the version of systemd used for systemd-enabled systems and WSLg is kinda broken (this is actually a systemd bug, not really Windows' fault)
• Windows Terminal is pretty good but
  • decent performance requires GPU acceleration
  • there are issues with accessing a single WSL instance from both privileged and unprivileged contexts at the same time
  • Quake Mode is subpar— you can't even control the size of the dropdown window... you're better off using a third-party hack like the Windows Terminal Quake app
• Windows' SSH implementation is hugely deficient in ways that are undocumented except as GitHub issues
  • ssh-agent behavior is super weird and requires admin privileges to set up, not clear if it's even possible to have multiple agents
  • sharing an SSH agent with WSL guests is a huge pain in the ass and may require configuration of complicated third-party apps
  • multiplexing (Control Master) is completely unsupported, just missing
  • remote forwarding to Unix sockets doesn't work right
  • the version that ships with Windows doesn't support modern encryption on the client, so you need to install a separate copy of Microsoft's port to use, e.g., OpenSSH's native 2FA-enabled keytypes
  • configuring authorized_keys and other things for SSHD has to be done twice for admin accounts, various other quirks
• Winget and Chocolatey aren't real package managers and have various deficiencies
  • both are just installer-wranglers
  • no granular packaging
  • little packaging of development libraries
  • both require administrator privileges way too much
  • neither can really ensure that installations are non-interactive
  • upgrades and uninstallations don't work reliably, can leave dangling loose ends like normal Windows uninstallers (because all they do is invoke the normal uninstallers)
• PowerShell is basically unusable as a login shell
  • compared to bash, zsh, or fish, it is unbelievably slow— especially if you try to grow a reasonably comfortable or efficient-to-use config
  • oh-my-posh is anemic compared to a real shell framework; it's just a prompt and it's slow as hell since it's implemented in PowerShell. just use Starship instead!
  • PowerShell profile configuration is quite brittle as well as overcomplicated
    • background tasks and settings that work fine in interactive shells can completely b0rk your profile for non-interactive use
    • way too many places for profiles to be configured for a given user (like a dozen or more)
    • fucking Documents folder used for config files (???)
  • no fscking job control (WTF?)

Having them around is better than nothing, but they definitely still suck. A Linux or Unix noob probably won't notice the differences, but longtime Linux workstation users and sysadmins are likely to stumble over a ton of missing features.

 

As for what was the last good version of Windows: there's never been one, from the ones you used to launch from MS-DOS all the way to Windows 11. They all suck.

[Avocado Diaboli]

4 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

The funny thing is, out of the box Windows Search is terrible. It does require tweaking, but Everything and UltraSearch work right out of the box and are superior if you wish not to fiddle with WS, as you are busy fiddling with all the other crap that Windows 10/11 requires in order to get something useful out of it. Unless of course you are happy with Win10/11 as it is, in which case carry on!

Configuring Windows search can literally be done in seconds. I showed you how to do it. Downloading and installing any of your proposed solutions arguably requires more "tweaking", given that you first have to download and install them. Again, my point isn't that either of those two are bad solutions if you want a search function, I use Everything from time to time myself. My point is that Linus' insistence on complaining about Windows search is silly given his willingness to improve the user experience of Windows with this video but blatantly ignoring this easy fix.

[YannisAstucesPC]

On 1/21/2023 at 7:51 PM, Delano.888 said:

Can someone tell me which event I need to find in task scheduler to get an alert when a disk is failing? (like at 3:00 in the video)?

I would also love to know how to configure the task to get this popup !

[m4ha7m4]

Great video however after watching, replaying, scrolling back and forth a few times trying to implement a few tips my brain was overwhelmed and I gave up.

 

The information provided would be much easier to digest and implement in written form (as already noted by some here).  Of course as a YouTube channel it makes no business sense for LTT to post a written article that would drive away traffic from the video.

 

Could LTT post a cleaned up transcript (blog-post style) at a later date once the video is generating less revenue?  I'd love to come back and push some of these features on my family's PCs.

 

Thanks!

 

[powertoys]

I have not watched the video yet, but judging by some of the responses in this thread, I think you guys have not mentioned this key piece of information: from Windows 10 onwards, the group policy editor (gpedit.msc) is NOT available on Home editions. Only on Pro / Enterprise.

[Ultraforce]

7 hours ago, finest feck fips said:

• Winget and Chocolatey aren't real package managers and have various deficiencies
  • both are just installer-wranglers
  • no granular packaging
  • little packaging of development libraries
  • both require administrator privileges way too much
  • neither can really ensure that installations are non-interactive

Having them around is better than nothing, but they definitely still suck. A Linux or Unix noob probably won't notice the differences, but longtime Linux workstation users and sysadmins are likely to stumble over a ton of missing features.

 

As for what was the last good version of Windows: there's never been one, from the ones you used to launch from MS-DOS all the way to Windows 11. They all suck.

For this one isn't some of the issues just with how Windows deals with programs where a lot of software needs admin privileges? I know as a new linux user while it's a bad habit and behaviour I tend to do sudo install rather then just install for basically everything.

[Spindel]

14 hours ago, finest feck fips said:

• Windows Terminal is pretty good but
  • decent performance requires GPU acceleration

WTF?

[evanfisha]

On 1/21/2023 at 1:31 PM, zambaito said:

I did this and it worked

 

Win + R, followed by Gpedit.msc

 

Windows Search is just that terrible.

Win + R "gpedit.msc" just gives me errors. What disk should I run the commands on? Mine was C:\WINDOWS\System32

[powertoys]

3 hours ago, evanfisha said:

Win + R "gpedit.msc" just gives me errors. What disk should I run the commands on? Mine was C:\WINDOWS\System32

 

If it gives you an error then you are on Windows Home, not Pro. From Windows 10 onwards, gpedit is restricted to Pro (and above) editions.

[Mad Bull]

Hey guys, Just wondering does anybody know what his windows theme is? Love the black and orange along with the start menu too which looks so much better than stock.

[SteveMagruder]

2 hours ago, powertoys said:

If it gives you an error then you are on Windows Home, not Pro. From Windows 10 onwards, gpedit is restricted to Pro (and above) editions.

I have gpedit installed and running just fine on my Windows 10 Home and Windows 11 Home systems - the earlier shown commands should install it in an account with admin rights and the command window is run as administrator.

 

22 hours ago, finest feck fips said:

PowerToys is quite buggy and slow

Some things to note. PowerToys is still versioned at 0.x - so any issues can and should be reported. Its developers are quite responsive. Also, practically any part of PT you're not using can be turned off. For me, PT has become solid enough for me for several uses. FancyZones seemed too janky for a while, but at this point, it's pretty solid (not saying it's perfect, however).

 

On 1/22/2023 at 8:29 AM, SkyStreaker said:

Windows Search does indeed suck, try VoidTools' it's nifty program called "Everything". Far more powerful.

For straight-up file search, Everything is, well, everything.

[Continuum]

The winget example to install Chrome intrigues me: since Chrome is not available on the MS Store unlike Firefox, does winget install it using Google's own installer? In that case, will it be updated using Google's updater instead of Microsoft channels?

 

This video is quite timely for me since I daily drive Linux and I just bought a cheap HP laptop yesterday for on-site usage. I'm a heavy user of virtual desktops, but I never could figure out how to get that going on Windows, no UI hints or anything. Never tried looking for it, but neither have I ever stumbled upon any reference to the feature in Settings. I'll be digging into it more, and review the video again.

[ExperiencersInternational]

On 1/21/2023 at 6:31 PM, zambaito said:

I did this and it worked

 

Win + R, followed by Gpedit.msc

 

Windows Search is just that terrible.

Tried that and didn't work either

 

[YellowJersey]

Or I could just run Linux

Though, I will be checking out some these "tech tips" for my windows partition. I'm always paranoid about malware on windows.

[Spindel]

I just tried ”Run” on my work issued computer. 
 

And it’s a joke, slow as hell and even doing simple calculations (that I do all the time with Spotlight) have a ridicolous delay. 
 

To bad I’m mostly back at the Office nowadays and get less time using my Mac for work. 

[Radium_Angel]

17 hours ago, YellowJersey said:

Or I could just run Linux

Though, I will be checking out some these "tech tips" for my windows partition. I'm always paranoid about malware on windows.

Use Shutup10 and Spybot AntiBeacon....it helps tone down the crap built-in to windows

[yahoo_1999]

On 1/23/2023 at 9:15 PM, Continuum said:

The winget example to install Chrome intrigues me: since Chrome is not available on the MS Store unlike Firefox, does winget install it using Google's own installer? In that case, will it be updated using Google's updater instead of Microsoft channels?

Oh yeah, winget isn't just cli for Microsoft Store. Community repo packages use different means of installation (exe, msi) that are being downloaded, validated and executed automatically. In my experience in some cases that means you need to click through the installer yourself (but I may be missing some kind of start option here). Still, for me, it's much faster and more convenient than finding and downloading installer myself (it is technically safer too, considering that hackers are promoting trojaned software with Google ads, and it's surprisingly easy to download the wrong thing by mistake. Even for more technical users).

 

In case of Chrome, winget is using standalone enterprise MSI installer:

[...]
Installers:
- Architecture: x64
  Scope: user
  InstallerUrl: https://dl.google.com/dl/chrome/install/googlechromestandaloneenterprise64.msi
  InstallerSha256: E7A686E01FF6C12C7564361FCE86FD6BEE5C7C67DB4C19977F2CCC1543B4AFC4
  ProductCode: '{1D1D1768-10D8-3DFF-9AD9-1E26B6323A29}'
- Architecture: x64
  Scope: machine
  InstallerUrl: https://dl.google.com/dl/chrome/install/googlechromestandaloneenterprise64.msi
  InstallerSha256: E7A686E01FF6C12C7564361FCE86FD6BEE5C7C67DB4C19977F2CCC1543B4AFC4
  ProductCode: '{1D1D1768-10D8-3DFF-9AD9-1E26B6323A29}'
- Architecture: x86
  Scope: user
  InstallerUrl: https://dl.google.com/dl/chrome/install/googlechromestandaloneenterprise.msi
  InstallerSha256: DD843BF90E34BBF915EDAF797002F05AD73D9E89FD0BD8CB0E6026A2EDB016FB
  ProductCode: '{75A85918-18DD-3BBC-9B5C-0D4E2D2E5A01}'
- Architecture: x86
  Scope: machine
  InstallerUrl: https://dl.google.com/dl/chrome/install/googlechromestandaloneenterprise.msi
  InstallerSha256: DD843BF90E34BBF915EDAF797002F05AD73D9E89FD0BD8CB0E6026A2EDB016FB
  ProductCode: '{75A85918-18DD-3BBC-9B5C-0D4E2D2E5A01}'
  [...]

 

Winget has multiple versions available that you can install (and update to) but I assume that this kind of chrome install still uses it's built in auto updater and it would update on process restart as usual.

[wseaton]

 

On 1/23/2023 at 4:54 AM, Spindel said:

WTF?

 

My thoughts on this entire thread. I don't think anybody here is capable of using group policy to set up some enterprise printers, and the power shell comments are hysterical. 

 

RDS farms I've set up are significantly less buggy than their Linux counterparts and much more responsive, SSH be damned. 

 

Windows Core is now becoming the standard for most Enterprise setups, even in the cloud. So sick of having to type Get-Mailbox with hosted Exchange, but it gets it done.

 

Nobody cares about operating systems, at least if you're an adult. Professionals don't run Linux. They run apps, and the platform to get their job done.

 

 

 

 

[GeorgeMKane]

Windows 10 doesn't suck, but Windows 11 has so far. The only reason to use Windows 11 is if you're upgrading to the newest hardware, because apparently in some cases (like with the 13th gen intel cpu's) performance is actually reduced on 10... which is BIZARRE. lol 

[Continuum]

2 hours ago, yahoo_1999 said:

In case of Chrome, winget is using standalone enterprise MSI installer:

How interesting. Did it install Google Updater alongside Chrome?