Need help deciding between Canon 1DX III and Canon R5

[CommanderAlex]

Hey guys, 

 

So, 2 weeks ago, I got a Canon R5 from Amazon with the control ring adaptor to mount my EF glass to the RF mount.

 

I'm really invested in EF glass; 

• EF 70-200mm f/2.8L III
• EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II
• EF 16-35mm f/2.8L III
• EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L II

I just had gotten my "holy trinity" set back in July and have been using them with Canon's DSLRs (5DSr, 6DII, and 7DII). I only do this as a hobby/enthusiast so price is a concern to an extent. I've been trying out the R5 now and the eye-detect is amazing...to an extent. You have to select which subject to detect from and going back and forth with this menu system drives me nuts. Currently just using SD cards as I don't have any CFexpress cards to try out with the R5. 

 

The one problem I'm having is whether or not to keep the R5. The issues that I face with the camera is it burns through fully charged LP-E6NH batteries quickly, tried using power saving mode, and just the overall front heavy lens due to using DSLR glass. The 1DX III is currently on sale on Canon's website refurbished for $4,500 and I'm considering returning the R5 and selling my DSLR bodies to help purchase CFexpress cards and have this as my main camera body. RF class is nice...only if you can cough up the money for each f/2.8L equivalent lens. I really hate Canon's choice of using an external zoom on their 70-200mm unlike Sony and Canon's DSLR glass where they were all internal zoom (pretty subjective, but if other manufacturers can reduce weight lower than Canon, why did Canon not do the same?). 

 

TL DR: Should I return the R5 and control ring and go with the 1DX III, while also selling my other DSLR bodies?

 

Thanks!

[Radium_Angel]

Professional photographer here, take that FWIW:

 

Canon either already has, or is very soon to, kill off the SLR in favour of mirrorless bodies.

I don't care one way or the other, the single most important part of a camera is the user.

 

Bodies don't matter, glass does. If the R5 drives you nuts, you'll be less inclined to use it. But if the SLRs are dying off, then you might be able to grab a good deal on one, and by the time it really matters, you'll have long used up the 1Dx iii, and hopefully Canon will have improved their mirrorless line in the meantime.

 

 

[porina]

56 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

TL DR: Should I return the R5 and control ring and go with the 1DX III, while also selling my other DSLR bodies?

What is your goal with the upgrade? Or is it upgrading because it is there? It can be easy to dump a lot of cash for small incremental changes. 

 

I have zero experience with the new mirrorless range but if you can't find a way to make it work for you, it isn't for you.

[CommanderAlex]

58 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

Professional photographer here, take that FWIW:

 

Canon either already has, or is very soon to, kill off the SLR in favour of mirrorless bodies.

I don't care one way or the other, the single most important part of a camera is the user.

 

Bodies don't matter, glass does. If the R5 drives you nuts, you'll be less inclined to use it. But if the SLRs are dying off, then you might be able to grab a good deal on one, and by the time it really matters, you'll have long used up the 1Dx iii, and hopefully Canon will have improved their mirrorless line in the meantime.

 

 

Yes that's correct, Canon has already announced that the 1DX III is Canon's last flagship DSLR, so any more DSLRs coming from them (if any tbh and none has been leaked) would target the midrange/low end-I'd think like Rebel lineup or 6D lineup. 

 

Hence having good glass like I already have for my DSLRs. For the R5, I aimed it to kill off my 5DSr for it's burst rate and high MP, which helps cropping in. The touchscreen, tilt screen, and autofocus is just as fast as an DSLR imo. 500,000 shutter actuations, if it matters, for both the 1DXIII and R5, will surpass me from upgrading for a very long time before having to buy a new body. The R6II seems to have improved mainly video recording limitations due to overheating, which the R5 also suffers from most likely due to firmware locks so it doesn't cannibalize Canon's video cameras. Supposedly, there is already a rumor for the R5 mark II coming sometime in Q1 of 2023. Do you think I'm just being paranoid using the adaptor to adapt EF lenses to mirrorless? The battery situation is kind of taken care of as I have 3 other LP-E6NH batteries. On the first full charge, the battery dropped to 1 bar after 133 shutter actuations on the R5. While using the R5, the tracking is really cool for autofocus sake, but isn't it best used with AI servo than one shot? 

 

Trust me, I thought about switching to Sony's FF lineup, but their ergonomics and handling is way too small for my hands. At least with Canon's, they still feel like a DSLR in my hand, just without the mirror box. 

 

53 minutes ago, porina said:

What is your goal with the upgrade? Or is it upgrading because it is there? It can be easy to dump a lot of cash for small incremental changes. 

 

I have zero experience with the new mirrorless range but if you can't find a way to make it work for you, it isn't for you.

Slightly biased towards upgrading because it is there. I mainly shoot aviation, wildlife, and some family gatherings. Video capabilities I don't care because I'm a stills guy and hardly ever shoot video. If I do, I'll use my S22 Ultra just because it's there when I need it. 

[Radium_Angel]

11 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

Sony's FF lineup

Is an ergonomic disaster. I tried a co-worker's Sony and give it back after 5 minutes. While it might be technologically superior to my Nikon D3x, I fought with the controls the entire time. 

As I tell new folk all the time, the best camera is the one you use and feels right in your hands. If you have to fight with it (or constantly have to worry about battery life, or fiddling with lens adapters) it's not for you.

 

But cameras, like guns, is a highly subjective choice, and I can't answer for you which is best to go to. I've tried mirrorless and am not impressed, but I am not their target audience (I work in a studio) YMMV.

[porina]

42 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

Slightly biased towards upgrading because it is there. I mainly shoot aviation, wildlife, and some family gatherings. Video capabilities I don't care because I'm a stills guy and hardly ever shoot video. If I do, I'll use my S22 Ultra just because it's there when I need it. 

I still wonder if not upgrading at all is worth considering. Just use what you have. 

 

We have some overlap, as I tended to focus on wildlife when I was active. Right now my preferred combo remains 7D2 and 100-400 mk1, although I do wish for "better" AF whatever that means in reality. Depending on exactly how you approach it, I found the above was my weight limit and 1D series bodies were ruled out while I could still afford them. Likewise I got a 120-300/2.8 but hardly used it for wildlife due to weight, but it did well in astrophotography.

[CommanderAlex]

1 hour ago, Radium_Angel said:

Is an ergonomic disaster. I tried a co-worker's Sony and give it back after 5 minutes. While it might be technologically superior to my Nikon D3x, I fought with the controls the entire time. 

As I tell new folk all the time, the best camera is the one you use and feels right in your hands. If you have to fight with it (or constantly have to worry about battery life, or fiddling with lens adapters) it's not for you.

 

But cameras, like guns, is a highly subjective choice, and I can't answer for you which is best to go to. I've tried mirrorless and am not impressed, but I am not their target audience (I work in a studio) YMMV.

The one thing I don't understand on Sony's cameras is the addition of the exposure compensation dial on top of the body. Like, why couldn't they just have made this a tiny button and the use of exposure simulation on the rear LCD or EVF already shows what your getting. Am I missing something? 

 

For the longest time, when selecting autofocus points, I never realized you can use the quick control dial and the main dial to move the autofocus point/cluster (depending on which AF mode you're using) to most the point left/right or up/down respectively. This made changing my AF points take a long time, possibly missing shots. 

So, would you just say that if the R5 is not for me, to just stick with DSLRs, maybe even the one's I already own instead? 

 

1 hour ago, porina said:

I still wonder if not upgrading at all is worth considering. Just use what you have. 

 

We have some overlap, as I tended to focus on wildlife when I was active. Right now my preferred combo remains 7D2 and 100-400 mk1, although I do wish for "better" AF whatever that means in reality. Depending on exactly how you approach it, I found the above was my weight limit and 1D series bodies were ruled out while I could still afford them. Likewise I got a 120-300/2.8 but hardly used it for wildlife due to weight, but it did well in astrophotography.

That was something I was considering when purchasing the R5 if I should just use what I have, learn more using it to get more familiar with the camera's and what they are able to achieve. I was considering maybe just purchasing a 1DXII instead as they seem to be pretty cheap compared to the 1DXIII and sell the DSLRs I have (7DII, 5DSr, 6DII) and not bother with mirrorless-for the time being. One thing I love about the 1DX bodies is the built-in vertical grip that they come with, which I already have with all of my DSLRs. The R5 vertical grip is pretty costly so I'd forgo even purchasing and get used to holding the camera body normally (hand above etc). 

[Radium_Angel]

38 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

maybe even the one's I already own instead? 

Well lemme spin this about:

 

What does your current body NOT do, that the Mark III WILL do?

In other wirds, what reasons do you have for upgrading, or is it simply "I've got the money and the itch"?

[CommanderAlex]

1 hour ago, Radium_Angel said:

Well lemme spin this about:

 

What does your current body NOT do, that the Mark III WILL do?

In other words, what reasons do you have for upgrading, or is it simply "I've got the money and the itch"?

One thing I would say is that using multiple bodies is something that I'd look into reducing; like a jack-of-all trades thing where one body can do it all. 6D2/5DSr has low burst so then I'd have to use the 7D2, which is a crop sensor to get 10FPS. 16FPS with the OVF and 20FPS in live-view is nearly just as good as the R5, besides the higher MP count (12FPS mech, 20FPS electronic). 

 

Otherwise, the latter is true and the reason why I got the R5. 

[Radium_Angel]

2 hours ago, CommanderAlex said:

where one body can do it all.

Then you need to use Nikon 

<---- (Nikon wh*re, and proud of it)

2 hours ago, CommanderAlex said:

Otherwise, the latter is true and the reason why I got the R5. 

Totally fair. 

[CommanderAlex]

1 hour ago, Radium_Angel said:

Then you need to use Nikon 

<---- (Nikon wh*re, and proud of it)

Lmao, actually I know someone that used Nikon as a professional photographer. They sent a lens and body in for cleaning for Nikon and when they got it back, there were scratches over the body and the front element had a scratch too. They immediately contact Nikon back and basically told them they are SOL. They pushed them to get it repaired at their expense and didn't want to help him. He sold his Nikon gear and switched to Sony (to whom now says to go Sony FF mirrorless and where I am stuck now). 

 

1 hour ago, Radium_Angel said:

Totally fair. 

That would be the reason for going with the R5 that I got. 

[Radium_Angel]

5 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

Lmao, actually I know someone that used Nikon as a professional photographer. They sent a lens and body in for cleaning for Nikon and when they got it back, there were scratches over the body and the front element had a scratch too. They immediately contact Nikon back and basically told them they are SOL. They pushed them to get it repaired at their expense and didn't want to help him. He sold his Nikon gear and switched to Sony (to whom now says to go Sony FF mirrorless and where I am stuck now). 

This is not an isolated incident sad to say. One of the most famous war photographers was a Nikon rep until Nikon went all arrogant and he switched to Canon.

I've used Canon bodies before, I find the Nikon Way(tm) works better for me, but I"m not wedded to them. I've used Pentax, Yashica, Canon, Olympus and Mamiya before, I just find Nikons better suited.

[CommanderAlex]

2 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

This is not an isolated incident sad to say. One of the most famous war photographers was a Nikon rep until Nikon went all arrogant and he switched to Canon.

I've used Canon bodies before, I find the Nikon Way(tm) works better for me, but I"m not wedded to them. I've used Pentax, Yashica, Canon, Olympus and Mamiya before, I just find Nikons better suited.

Wow, that's sad to hear that these are not uncommon to hear about. That's really interesting to see that war photographer switch from Nikon to Canon when relations hit the bed. 

 

I've growned to use my mom's Canon Rebel SL1 with the kit lens and that god-awful 70-300mm that always comes with it. We used it a lot back in those days and then stopped using it for a long time. It wasn't until last year I started to learn more about it and got into photography. Hence, why I've stuck with Canon. 

[Radium_Angel]

6 hours ago, CommanderAlex said:

Hence, why I've stuck with Canon.

I hear you. While I can't post it here, one of my best images was taken with an ancient 10D that had been converted to IR.

I too have thought about upgrading to the D4 or D5, lord knows the prices are great right about now, but I can't justify it.

[CommanderAlex]

4 hours ago, Radium_Angel said:

I hear you. While I can't post it here, one of my best images was taken with an ancient 10D that had been converted to IR.

I too have thought about upgrading to the D4 or D5, lord knows the prices are great right about now, but I can't justify it.

So, that leads me back to the 1DXIII and R5, what do you think?

[Radium_Angel]

2 hours ago, CommanderAlex said:

So, that leads me back to the 1DXIII and R5, what do you think?

I don't like mirrorless cameras. I've tried several, I don't care for them. Traditional dSLR all the way for me

[CommanderAlex]

On 12/1/2022 at 10:02 AM, Radium_Angel said:

I don't like mirrorless cameras. I've tried several, I don't care for them. Traditional dSLR all the way for me

So, I've decided to return the R5, forget about the 1DXIII, but went for a used like new 1DXII. Pretty comparable specs anyway. Thanks for your help!

[Radium_Angel]

3 hours ago, CommanderAlex said:

So, I've decided to return the R5, forget about the 1DXIII, but went for a used like new 1DXII. Pretty comparable specs anyway. Thanks for your help!

You are most welcome. Because of this thread, I went looking at D4s and D5 Nikons....so tempting, heck a low shutter count (like under 10k) D4s can be had for ~1k$...that's cheap

[CommanderAlex]

2 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

You are most welcome. Because of this thread, I went looking at D4s and D5 Nikons....so tempting, heck a low shutter count (like under 10k) D4s can be had for ~1k$...that's cheap

Haha, I started something for you now to finish!! The 1DXII I ordered has a shutter count below 5k. Includes nearly everything except a neck strap. I could order one on eBay to go with it and deciding on that. 

[Radium_Angel]

4 hours ago, CommanderAlex said:

Haha, I started something for you now to finish!!

I would totally, if I could justify it. Ever since covid changed everything, and I shut down my studio, I've done less and less photography, sticking almost exclusively with action figures, and the D3x is plain overkill for that. On another forum I did a number of tests going all the way back to the Nikon D1x, and for web posts on a forum, even that was perfectly fine (helps to control lighting), so while the concept is alluring, it'll have to stay in the realm of theoretical right now.

[CommanderAlex]

3 hours ago, Radium_Angel said:

I would totally, if I could justify it. Ever since covid changed everything, and I shut down my studio, I've done less and less photography, sticking almost exclusively with action figures, and the D3x is plain overkill for that. On another forum I did a number of tests going all the way back to the Nikon D1x, and for web posts on a forum, even that was perfectly fine (helps to control lighting), so while the concept is alluring, it'll have to stay in the realm of theoretical right now.

That sucks man. Combine that with compression due to file formats, it'll hardly be noticeable on the Internet for megapixel counts. 

[Radium_Angel]

1 hour ago, CommanderAlex said:

That sucks man. Combine that with compression due to file formats, it'll hardly be noticeable on the Internet for megapixel counts. 

If you are inclined, you can check out some of the comparisons in this thread

https://www.tfw2005.com/boards/threads/lets-see-some-cool-toys-non-transformers-2021-edition-rules-in-1st-post.1206148/page-82#post-19721052

(I"m "Another Stray Toaster" there) and you'll see how little MP matters for web work

[sub68]

I know this is old I am super sorry, but I would get the 1dx mk3, the AF in the 1dx series is stupid good. The mk3 in live view basically has a r3 eye track and full mirrorless AF functionalty.

I have shot with the R6 and love the grip, didnt shoot enough to see battery life, I would get the adapter if going mirrorless. 

I love the canon mirrorless as the egronomics are like DSLR's.  

When I was using the 1dxmk2 the owner was using a z6 or some kind of nikion mirrorless, but the nikion mirrorless is not good the camera basically dictates when you shoot. Canon didnt have that I think (shot some astro but dont remember minor things). Panasonic isnt fun as it also dectates to shoot (bassicaly in manuel you have to put shutter speed in a bracket that the camera puts for you) and is a absaloute pain to focus as it only does auto on some lenses.

I do find 20mp to be enough for some cropping and I feel like its the goldylocks of MP. 

[CommanderAlex]

1 hour ago, sub68 said:

I know this is old I am super sorry, but I would get the 1dx mk3, the AF in the 1dx series is stupid good. The mk3 in live view basically has a r3 eye track and full mirrorless AF functionalty.

I have shot with the R6 and love the grip, didnt shoot enough to see battery life, I would get the adapter if going mirrorless. 

I love the canon mirrorless as the egronomics are like DSLR's.  

When I was using the 1dxmk2 the owner was using a z6 or some kind of nikion mirrorless, but the nikion mirrorless is not good the camera basically dictates when you shoot. Canon didnt have that I think (shot some astro but dont remember minor things). Panasonic isnt fun as it also dectates to shoot (bassicaly in manuel you have to put shutter speed in a bracket that the camera puts for you) and is a absaloute pain to focus as it only does auto on some lenses.

I do find 20mp to be enough for some cropping and I feel like its the goldylocks of MP. 

Lol it's been so long, I thought you created a thread sub. I had the R5 a couple weeks with the control ring adaptor to adapt my EF glass to Canon RF and it was ok, only issue I had at the time was IS was enabled every time in live view and in EVF. This will of course use more power from the battery and drain faster. Plus the R5 chewed thru LP-E6NH batteries, which is the latest in terms of high capacity mAH and felt that buying all these batteries wasn't that worth it for me. I thought about the R6 at the time and thinking about getting that, the battery grip, which is expensive, and more batteries I felt it was more economical to get a used 1DXII. @Radium_Angelhelped me a lot in making the decision over the 1DXIII which they are both pretty similar. The AF on the 1DXII is superb and can't wait to use it at airshows and wildlife...once I get a teleconverter (thinking of the 1.4X III as they don't have that big of an impact on IQ compared to previous teleconverter versions, besides losing a stop of light which I'm comfortable with as the 1DXII can achieve center AF at f/8 depending on lighting). I have big hands so the 1DX series fits really well and the reason I shoot with vertical grips (as well as having two batteries instead of one) on my other camera bodies.

 

Nikon mirrorless has had some issues with their AF system where it doesn't want to lock on to subjects well from what I remember. Their mirrorless bodies look really nice like a hybrid of DSLR and Canon mirrorless with the main top dial, but that involves switching ecosystems and I'm not ready for that and my gear works really well that I don't feel the need to upgrade just yet. 

 

Side note: I dreamt where they combined a newer AF sensor in a DSLR akin to Live View (mirrorless cameras even) thru an OVF so that face tracking is possible on DSLR instead of in Live View. 

[sub68]

17 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

I thought you created a thread sub.

I dont as I dont want dumps of notifications.

19 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

This will of course use more power from the battery and drain faster

Mirrorless just sucks battery in general.

20 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

I felt it was more economical to get a used 1DXII. @Radium_Angelhelped me a lot in making the decision over the 1DXIII which they are both pretty similar. The

I see, I do want a mk3 due to live view having eye track and I do remember the mk3 has a touchscreen. But the mk2 is a absolute unit and a good camera have fun with that workhorse. 

(No wonder why when I did that event you commented.)

27 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

Canon mirrorless with the main top dial

Huh?

29 minutes ago, CommanderAlex said:

dreamt where they combined a newer AF sensor in a DSLR akin to Live View (mirrorless cameras even) thru an OVF so that face tracking is possible on DSLR instead of in Live View. 

Hmm I do remember a opposite were sony had a live view that the mirror was still down and used the DSLR af.