Expats? US citizen considering moving to Canada

[raidbossreid]

Hello Community,

 

I’m a 32 year old male born and raised in the US. My wife and I are considering moving abroad and are highly considering Canada due to proximity to all of our family. I’m posting here because I know LTT has a big community in North America and wondering if there are any American expats that can share their stories. 

[RevTadd]

I'm an American expat abroad (almost the same age, though not in Canada). Ultimately going abroad is a very personal decision that needs to reflect your own particular circumstances and preferences, but below are few thoughts from my own experience for your consideration or rejection.

 

Visa - getting a visa will be the key consideration. If you happen to work for a large professional services / tech company / similar company (e.g. KPMG, Accenture, Microsoft, Morgan Stanley), getting a work visa as part of an internal transfer can be almost trivial (and was my experience). If you don't work for an international company then getting a temporary work visa (especially one with a pathway to permanent residency) can be exceptionally challenging and will depend on a lot on your own circumstances, where you're wanting to go, and whether you have any particular set of skills for which you can secure a visa with or otherwise get an overseas employer to sponsor you for.

 

Location - Again, your own preferences for location should be the deciding factor, but I would generally recommend going to a larger, more metropolitan city (that has a decent amount of international and / or domestic migration). In Canada, I think this would mean Toronto or Vancouver. The reason being from my perspective is with going to city like Calgary or Montreal, most of the people you meet will have been born in that city, went to school / uni in that city, and worked in that city and its just a bit challenging making new connections when everyone you meet already has large existing 20+ year friendship groups.

 

Healthcare - I think its well understood globally the state of American healthcare, but you'll want to do your research on healthcare before moving over, as other countries universal healthcare programs don't always extend to non-permanent residents. For example, in the country I'm in now, I don't (yet) qualify for the government healthcare program and have to get special expatriate health insurance instead, which annoyingly enough is about 1.5x as expensive as the health insurance I had in the US. My circumstance is a bit atypical though and I knew it was going to be the case (and I can't really begrudge the government for not placing a political imperative on reducing health insurance premiums for a population of relative well off foreigners who can't vote). If you have special healthcare requirements, or expect to have healthcare needs in the future, just be sure to do some research ahead of time.

 

Lifestyle - One thing to note is in terms of your lifestyle, moving abroad won't necessarily mean much of a change, unless you actively choose to to make it so. That is, its very easy to settle into the same sort of work / life patterns even if moving to a very different city or country and you may find your day to day life is largely the same, with only a few differences at the margin. If you're not looking for a significant lifestyle change, then it may not be something to worry about, but if you are, then just keep in mind you need to change your lifestyle / habits, your location won't necessarily do it for you.

[Lomac]

Are any of your parents Canadian, by chance? That would be by far the most ideal solution if you plan in moving to Canada. Otherwise you're most likely looking at getting work visas and becoming a PR for a minimum of three years.

 

https://www.justlanded.com/english/Canada/Canada-Guide/Visas-Permits/Permanent-Residency

 

Just keep in mind that shit is expensive up here.

[ToboRobot]

Lots of Canadians move to the USA for better opportunities, I am curious why you think Canada is better?

[Tan3l6]

I'd migrate to New Zealand if possible, but most likely it's not possible...

[IPD]

In-depth research on any country you move to--should be committed to before considering a long-term residency change.  What you get from the MSM in your own country is often fairly off the mark as far as a boots-on-the-ground experience of living somewhere else.  The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.  My personal experience from living with and interacting with other nationalities from time to time--is that the foreign sentiments about the USA are often just as skewed and misinformed.  That's because those foreigners are sourcing their info from their own MSM, and from movies/TV from the USA.  They would be in for quite a shock if they were to interact with your average person from say, Iowa.

 

Another example is how I've told foreign coworkers that the sub-sandwich seems to be a fairly American invention and phenomenon.  And the response I always get is "oh, you mean like Sub-Way?"  And I have to explain that Sub-Way is mid-bottom-tier for subs in the USA, and even still has far better selection there than overseas.  So the impression foreigners have over this culinary variety is already fairly off the mark.

 

I'm trying to avoid bringing up politics here--but that is another area that you should make yourself absolutely certain of being ok with.  In the past 12 months alone, I've seen some things in Canada that would give me extreme pause about considering the course of action you are contemplating.  And that's all I'm going to say on it.

[raidbossreid]

Quote

On 9/22/2022 at 8:29 AM, ToboRobot said:

Lots of Canadians move to the USA for better opportunities, I am curious why you think Canada is better?

 

Canada is often listed as one of the top 10-15 countries in the world to live in.  With so much family in the US, I'd like to stay in this hemisphere if possibly.  Not to get too political but guns, reproductive rights, more guns, overwhelming mindset of "My interests are number one vs the good of the group", religious indoctrination being enforced from the very top of our government, etc.

 

Just wanted some experiences of other expats.

[IPD]

5 minutes ago, raidbossreid said:

Canada is often listed as one of the top 10-15 countries in the world to live in.  With so much family in the US, I'd like to stay in this hemisphere if possibly.  Not to get too political but guns, reproductive rights, more guns, overwhelming mindset of "My interests are number one vs the good of the group", religious indoctrination being enforced from the very top of our government, etc.

 

Just wanted some experiences of other expats.

Please understand that your experience of living in the USA will vary WILDLY depending on where you reside.  Many areas are close to a living hell--fomented by decades of bad policy and leadership--and will deflect criticism by trying to portray the rest of the USA as problematic.

 

Then there are areas where nobody really GAF about what you do.  Everyone knows everyone.  Everyone is pretty much friends with everyone.  And you don't really worry about crime because of the general mindset of the populace that resides there.

 

I'm not going to cite examples of either--because I'm not going to wade into it politically.  Just know that there are areas where the cacaphony is attenuated by the pragmatism of people going about their lives in the best way they can.  And as a general rule, the more dense a population center becomes--the worse it will potentially get.

 

I've lived in both types of areas.

[ToboRobot]

1 hour ago, raidbossreid said:

Canada is often listed as one of the top 10-15 countries in the world to live in.  With so much family in the US, I'd like to stay in this hemisphere if possibly.  Not to get too political but guns, reproductive rights, more guns, overwhelming mindset of "My interests are number one vs the good of the group", religious indoctrination being enforced from the very top of our government, etc.

 

Just wanted some experiences of other expats.

Canada is also facing some serious issues with housing prices, soaring food costs, high debt, healthcare.  Immigration isn't quick, easy or cheap for most people if you do it legally.

We have guns including criminals that get them from the USA, we still have limits on reproductive rights, legal guns too, Canadians are polite but if you think humans everywhere are self interested, and our government is heavy on religion, we have a public and a catholic school system most places and both are funded by government.

Those lists of best countries to live in are pretty bogus in my opinion, and not really representative of real life.  It's some influencer types idea of the best places to live for a while before they pack up for the next hot new city that pays them.  If living and working in Toronto or Vancouver is something you think you can do, you need to earn a very high income or have considerable wealth.  Most big cities in Canada aren't really affordable for average people anymore.

[Yoinkerman]

You can't really just move to Canada unless you're some kind of needed professional 

[AudiTTFan]

On 9/23/2022 at 3:19 PM, ToboRobot said:

Canada is also facing some serious issues with housing prices, soaring food costs, high debt, healthcare.  Immigration isn't quick, easy or cheap for most people if you do it legally.

We have guns including criminals that get them from the USA, we still have limits on reproductive rights, legal guns too, Canadians are polite but if you think humans everywhere are self interested, and our government is heavy on religion, we have a public and a catholic school system most places and both are funded by government.

Those lists of best countries to live in are pretty bogus in my opinion, and not really representative of real life.  It's some influencer types idea of the best places to live for a while before they pack up for the next hot new city that pays them.  If living and working in Toronto or Vancouver is something you think you can do, you need to earn a very high income or have considerable wealth.  Most big cities in Canada aren't really affordable for average people anymore.

Some of them like Winnipeg are quite a lot cheaper, but that's largely because our downtown is the kind of place where you'd find a 2002 Oldsmobile abandoned at every corner with used needles on the floor

[ToboRobot]

10 minutes ago, AudiTTFan said:

Some of them like Winnipeg are quite a lot cheaper, but that's largely because our downtown is the kind of place where you'd find a 2002 Oldsmobile abandoned at every corner with used needles on the floor

Yes, but as you mentioned, Winnipeg is a dumpster fire.  Edmonton is a better option IMO, but it's heavy industry/oil. 

No one wants to move to Winnipeg. LOL

[AudiTTFan]

43 minutes ago, ToboRobot said:

Yes, but as you mentioned, Winnipeg is a dumpster fire.  Edmonton is a better option IMO, but it's heavy industry/oil. 

No one wants to move to Winnipeg. LOL

There's a damn good reason why I usually avoid parts of town where every bus stop is sheltered. Almost every bus shelter here has a group of homeless people sharing a bong in it lmfao

[wasab]

On 9/23/2022 at 4:19 PM, ToboRobot said:

If living and working in Toronto or Vancouver is something you think you can do, you need to earn a very high income or have considerable wealth.  Most big cities in Canada aren't really affordable for average people anymore.

If Americans can survive in cities like New York or San Francisco Bay, pretty sure they can survive in Toronto or any other city on Earth for that matter. 

 

The thing about Canada is that it is cold... 

[IPD]

[ToboRobot]

5 hours ago, wasab said:

If Americans can survive in cities like New York or San Francisco Bay, pretty sure they can survive in Toronto or any other city on Earth for that matter. 

 

The thing about Canada is that it is cold... 

Compare salaries in NYC to Toronto.

[wasab]

2 hours ago, ToboRobot said:

Compare salaries in NYC to Toronto.

I cant find any data on the internet, those that are up to date and valid anyways. 

https://livingcost.org/cost/new-york/toronto

 

In any case, to maintain the same standard of living, your salalries will need to be 55.8%  higher if you are to move from Toronto to NYC or conversly, you can take a 38.58% salalry cut and still maintain the same living statndard if you are to move from NYC to Toronto. 

 

San Frasnicso Bay area is on the extreme end of affordability. I wont dig into it. Its income does not keep up with the living cost one bit unless you are working in the big techs like everyone else there.