Looking for a beginner/entry-level camera for landscapes/cityscapes and low-light/night photography

[wantfastcars]

I also posted this on r/AskPhotography, but I figured I'd ask here too.

 

I recently got a new phone that, among the other features that made me want it, came with a pretty neat camera setup. The features of the camera helped me realize that doing more than basic pictures is actually pretty easy (I know, doing really good stuff will take a lot of time and practice), but I find that it leaves a bit to be desired when shooting at night (even when editing RAWs - though I also need a lot more practice with that), and I could do with a longer lens. Also, while it does have multiple lenses and pretty nice zoom, the aperture is fixed for each lens. It's a Sony Xperia 1 III, since I just noticed I hadn't mentioned that.

 

When I was younger my parents had a Canon EOS Rebel of some variety (I want to say a 70D?) that gave pretty good results for taking pictures of nature and birds. I also have a Panasonic point-and-shoot that's pretty okay but loses a lot of flexibility when you take it out of the "Auto" mode, it's old enough that to my eye my smartphone camera matches it in everything except optical zoom. I now live in Japan and I like to travel and take pictures of the landscapes and cities, and also buildings (in particular, temples, shrines, and castles), and sometimes close-ups of assorted stationary objects. I'm also interested in being able to take night photos of cities (so like, dark with bright points of light from things like neon signs or lanterns) and sunsets and such. I very rarely take pictures of people, and I have very little interest in video functionality.

 

I'd like to spend under ~$1000 USD since I'm not planning on doing anything crazy, I just want something that'll do well in low-light situations and will have a decent variety of extra lenses and accessories should I want something in the future. Mirrorless seems to be the way to go for what I want, but it also seems like the options are a bit more limited within my budget range.

 

The three main options I'm considering right now:

Used Nikon D3500 w/ 2 lens kit - ~$550 - the lowest general quality/performance, but seems like an overall very good deal

Used Fujifilm X-T2 w/ used 18-55mm lens - ~800-$900 - good price/performance balance, but only has one lens

New Fujifilm X-S10 w/ 2 lens kit - ~$1300 - a bit over-budget but has a LOT of nice-to-haves like IBIS, Bluetooth, and a built-in flash. Also it's new so fewer risks

 

Thanks for any advice you can offer!

[jec6613]

3 hours ago, wantfastcars said:

Used Nikon D3500 w/ 2 lens kit - ~$550 - the lowest general quality/performance, but seems like an overall very good deal

Used Fujifilm X-T2 w/ used 18-55mm lens - ~800-$900 - good price/performance balance, but only has one lens

New Fujifilm X-S10 w/ 2 lens kit - ~$1300 - a bit over-budget but has a LOT of nice-to-haves like IBIS, Bluetooth, and a built-in flash. Also it's new so fewer risks

All of these will take functionally identical photos.  The D3500 will have the advantage in technical image quality (better kit optics and sensor, but both by a functionally imperceptible amount), the Fujis are mirrorless so have a number of quality of life improvements, and both Fujis higher end cameras to start with (the equivalent Nikon cameras are the Z50 and D7500) so are going to have more features.

 

Straight up, if you're looking to just learn and have some fun, get the D3500, and spend the extra $500 you just saved by getting a cheap body, on a couple of fast aperture lenses (the Nikon 35 f/1.8G DX comes to mind), which are going to drastically change your night shooting ability more than any other factor.  The lenses are going to matter much more than the body, and Nikon's accessory ecosystem is unparalleled, going back to 1959 for used gear - for $200 during the height of COVID I picked up about 3-4 lenses that are older than I am just to mess around with and had a blast with it, something that you can't really do with the more modern mounts.

[YellowJersey]

I'd honestly go with the X-S10. It's a solid camera and you wouldn't have any need to upgrade for a while. The X-T2 is also good, but a bit long in the tooth.

 I'd stay away from DSLRs like the D3500 simply because SLRs are being phased out in favour of mirrorless, so you're going to end up with a dead system. Going mirrorless like Fuji means you have future support with new bodies and lenses. You can learn just fine on a mirrorless, perhaps even better than on a DSLR since it's built for live-view so you can see in real-time what different settings do to your image before you even take it.

 

[wantfastcars]

3 hours ago, jec6613 said:

All of these will take functionally identical photos.  The D3500 will have the advantage in technical image quality (better kit optics and sensor, but both by a functionally imperceptible amount), the Fujis are mirrorless so have a number of quality of life improvements, and both Fujis higher end cameras to start with (the equivalent Nikon cameras are the Z50 and D7500) so are going to have more features.

 

Straight up, if you're looking to just learn and have some fun, get the D3500, and spend the extra $500 you just saved by getting a cheap body, on a couple of fast aperture lenses (the Nikon 35 f/1.8G DX comes to mind), which are going to drastically change your night shooting ability more than any other factor.  The lenses are going to matter much more than the body, and Nikon's accessory ecosystem is unparalleled, going back to 1959 for used gear - for $200 during the height of COVID I picked up about 3-4 lenses that are older than I am just to mess around with and had a blast with it, something that you can't really do with the more modern mounts.

Yeah, the QoL stuff is the big thing I'm thinking about with the Mirrorless Fujis, as well as the idea that while I am learning now, I don't want to get something cheap and end up having to pay more to get something better later. The main reason I initially considered the DSLR was because my parents had one when I was younger and using it was... comfortable, for lack of a better term? It just felt good to use and still gave good results. 

 

2 hours ago, YellowJersey said:

I'd honestly go with the X-S10. It's a solid camera and you wouldn't have any need to upgrade for a while. The X-T2 is also good, but a bit long in the tooth.

 I'd stay away from DSLRs like the D3500 simply because SLRs are being phased out in favour of mirrorless, so you're going to end up with a dead system. Going mirrorless like Fuji means you have future support with new bodies and lenses. You can learn just fine on a mirrorless, perhaps even better than on a DSLR since it's built for live-view so you can see in real-time what different settings do to your image before you even take it.

These are a couple of the big reasons I'm leaning towards the X-S10. The whole "won't need to upgrade" thing is big for me.

 

Thanks to both of you for your input!

[Imbadatnames]

XT30 with lens is around 800 might get a BF deal on it too 

[GDRRiley]

I'd go ether Fuji or look at a used/ refurbished EOS RP if your focus is photos.
the X-s10, X-T3, X-T4, X-T30/ X-T30mk2 and a few others share the sames sensor, so their photos look the same but they've got different features like sensor stabilization, capture speed, different grips

[D13H4RD]

The most important thing is the glass.

 

If you go with the X-S10, factor in potentially purchasing one of the Fuji f/2 primes like the 23mm f/2 or 35mm f/2. The high ISO performance on the X-Trans4 sensors are very good for an APS-C format sensor, but having a fast prime will help with that significantly.

[Imbadatnames]

5 hours ago, D13H4RD said:

The most important thing is the glass.

 

If you go with the X-S10, factor in potentially purchasing one of the Fuji f/2 primes like the 23mm f/2 or 35mm f/2. The high ISO performance on the X-Trans4 sensors are very good for an APS-C format sensor, but having a fast prime will help with that significantly.

I can vouch for the 35mm. Tres bien. You could probably get away with the 15-45 kit lens though to start. 

[wantfastcars]

Thanks for the input everybody, I ended up going with the X-S10 with the 15-45 and 50-230 kit lenses, since a local shop price-matched and would deliver it to my home for free. I think I'm going to be quite happy with that to start, and I'll definitely look into other lenses in the future.

 

I have one other question - any recommendations for batteries? I imagine I'm going to want at least one extra, but the only options I'm seeing are either really cheap and have a lot of reported issues (short useful life, expansion, etc) or are the expensive first-party ones. Other folks have recommended getting like, one extra first-party battery and 2-3 extra third-parties to use as needed. On the one hand, that seems like overkill, but on the other, the off-brand batteries are SO cheap.

[Imbadatnames]

6 hours ago, wantfastcars said:

Thanks for the input everybody, I ended up going with the X-S10 with the 15-45 and 50-230 kit lenses, since a local shop price-matched and would deliver it to my home for free. I think I'm going to be quite happy with that to start, and I'll definitely look into other lenses in the future.

 

I have one other question - any recommendations for batteries? I imagine I'm going to want at least one extra, but the only options I'm seeing are either really cheap and have a lot of reported issues (short useful life, expansion, etc) or are the expensive first-party ones. Other folks have recommended getting like, one extra first-party battery and 2-3 extra third-parties to use as needed. On the one hand, that seems like overkill, but on the other, the off-brand batteries are SO cheap.

With Fuji you’ll need to buy a charger for extra batteries because the one they include you just plug in the camera to charge. 
 

maybe a 128GB-256GB UHS SD card if you’re planning on doing lots of video and burst shooting. 

[YellowJersey]

16 hours ago, wantfastcars said:

Thanks for the input everybody, I ended up going with the X-S10 with the 15-45 and 50-230 kit lenses, since a local shop price-matched and would deliver it to my home for free. I think I'm going to be quite happy with that to start, and I'll definitely look into other lenses in the future.

 

I have one other question - any recommendations for batteries? I imagine I'm going to want at least one extra, but the only options I'm seeing are either really cheap and have a lot of reported issues (short useful life, expansion, etc) or are the expensive first-party ones. Other folks have recommended getting like, one extra first-party battery and 2-3 extra third-parties to use as needed. On the one hand, that seems like overkill, but on the other, the off-brand batteries are SO cheap.

I have a Sony mirrorless and I have two batteries plus a USB battery bank. Make sure you have two fully charged batteries before you go out and then top up via USB. I've considered getting a third party USB charger so I don't have to charge through the camera while on the go.

[wantfastcars]

I have a pretty beefy external battery pack that I use mostly for my phone, so I'll be keeping that with me. I did notice a lot of the third-party battery options on amazon include a charger (some with two slots, even!). I was more worried about quality of third-party batteries than being able to charge them on-the-go.

 

Once I get it in-hand I'll see how many pictures will go on my 64gb card and maybe buy another one or a 128 if I think it'll be necessary.

 

Thanks!

[Radium_Angel]

On 11/26/2021 at 12:12 AM, YellowJersey said:

simply because SLRs are being phased out in favour of mirrorless

You got a citation for this?

On 11/25/2021 at 7:45 PM, wantfastcars said:

Nikon

You have glass options dating back to 1959 if you wanna go manual focus.

Fujifilm might (and I stress *might*) make a better camera but lens options won't be as prevalent, something to consider as it's the glass that makes or breaks the image, less so the body (and of course the skill of the user)

[YellowJersey]

11 hours ago, Radium_Angel said:

You got a citation for this?

https://petapixel.com/2021/03/31/canon-appears-to-be-rapidly-discontinuing-its-dslr-lenses/

 

https://digital-photography-school.com/nikon-dropping-1-3rd-of-its-dslr-lineup-in-move-to-mirrorless/

 

 Writing's on the wall. And that was only 2 minutes on google.

[Radium_Angel]

4 hours ago, YellowJersey said:

https://petapixel.com/2021/03/31/canon-appears-to-be-rapidly-discontinuing-its-dslr-lenses/

 

https://digital-photography-school.com/nikon-dropping-1-3rd-of-its-dslr-lineup-in-move-to-mirrorless/

 

 Writing's on the wall. And that was only 2 minutes on google.

Canon is dropping some EF lens production, and Nikon is ditching their entry-level dSLRS according to both articles, hardly the death-knell for the dSLR line.

[YellowJersey]

19 hours ago, Radium_Angel said:

Canon is dropping some EF lens production, and Nikon is ditching their entry-level dSLRS according to both articles, hardly the death-knell for the dSLR line.

DSLRs aren't dead yet. However, that's the direction we're heading. Having switched systems before, I know what a colossal pain in the ass it is. So I think it makes sense for people looking to get into a system to go with one whose future support is more certain, rather than getting into DSLRs and then having to switch later on due to a lack of support, repair, and upgrade options.

[GDRRiley]

On 11/27/2021 at 9:23 PM, wantfastcars said:

I have one other question - any recommendations for batteries? I imagine I'm going to want at least one extra, but the only options I'm seeing are either really cheap and have a lot of reported issues (short useful life, expansion, etc) or are the expensive first-party ones. Other folks have recommended getting like, one extra first-party battery and 2-3 extra third-parties to use as needed. On the one hand, that seems like overkill, but on the other, the off-brand batteries are SO cheap.

go with first party fuji batteries, no one seem to be able to make a good clone. haven't had enough time with pro master units to recommend them

 

[Imbadatnames]

On 11/30/2021 at 4:40 PM, Radium_Angel said:

You got a citation for this?

You have glass options dating back to 1959 if you wanna go manual focus.

Fujifilm might (and I stress *might*) make a better camera but lens options won't be as prevalent, something to consider as it's the glass that makes or breaks the image, less so the body (and of course the skill of the user)

Fuji have opened X mount to 3rd party now the lens options are getting a lot better 

[uncreativespace]

My info's a little dated as the last Fuji mirrorlesses I owned were the X100 and X100S but generally in the sub-$1000 space the lenses for their mount cost more than the competitors. They were usually a fair amount noisier in low light at higher ISO's than my T3i and 7D but much more fun to shoot with (especially as the newer Fuji's improved write buffer performance for RAW files).

 

If you're still learning or just doing it for fun I'd definitely go with a entry level or used DSLR as you can always sell it later. The D3500 (or any equivalent T series) with a 50mm that has decent glass is much more forgiving and cheaper. If it's your second camera, or budget for lenses isn't a huge concern, the X-T2 would be a decent buy.