Linux over windows 11?

[thehardwarehacker]

Late morning yall. I've been checking out the content that's been coming out around windows 11, and I'll admit I'm not impressed. I'm to the point even on windows 10 that I'm willing to suffer just switching to Linux instead of going to 11. I'm curious how many others are of the same mindset. 

[Zando_]

Windows 10 will be supported till my hardware (which won't run 11 unless I get an add-in TPM or MS removes the bullshit requirement for it) is too slow to be useful, so it's not a big worry. 11 looks to have a more consistent UI and AFAIK it runs all the same software as 10 so I don't see any issues there. Linux has been far more limiting in my experience than any version of Windows I've used. It's better for like, browsers than oldish-to-ancient (pre Catalina) macOS though. 

[Helpful Tech Witch]

Just keep using 10? Its supported for 5 more years.
Id like toy remind you that wine is stillmnot great, even after 20 years, gaming is going to be a pain.

 

 

Honestly, I couldn't give a shit. I'll use it, as Android support is cool, but everything else is bassically the same, but I like the new UI. (After I move the taskbar and start menu)

[Helpful Tech Witch]

1 minute ago, Zando Bob said:

Windows 10 will be supported till my hardware (which won't run 11 unless I get an add-in TPM or MS removes the bullshit requirement for it) is too slow to be useful, so it's not a big worry. 11 looks to have a more consistent UI and AFAIK it runs all the same software as 10 so I don't see any issues there. Linux has been far more limiting in my experience than any version of Windows I've used. It's better for like, browsers than oldish-to-ancient (pre Catalina) macOS though. 

Actually tpm isnt the only issue for you, your 6th gen CPU is 2 gens too old for support.

[Sauron]

Aside from the slightly odd requirements I don't see why one would be ok with using 10 and not 11... though if you're willing and able to use Linux then by all means, do it.

[Zando_]

6 minutes ago, HelpfulTechWizard said:

Id like toy remind you that wine is stillmnot great, even after 20 years, gaming is going to be a pain.

Even if it was great, it still messes with files/memory so a lot of anti-cheats will flag it and ban you. And since most game publishers do not support Linux, they have no reason to un-ban you (this has happened to people on some EA Battlefield titles IIRC). The issue with Linux is the same as ever: large companies don't support it consumer-side (a lot of enterprise stuff runs on various flavors of linux/unix AFAIK), so the userbase is tiny. Because the userbase is tiny, it's not worth it for large companies to support it. 

4 minutes ago, HelpfulTechWizard said:

Actually tpm isnt the only issue for you, your 6th gen CPU is 2 gens too old for support.

Nah. I haven't seen anything making these CPUs actually incompatible, I believe the reason MS lists 8th gen onwards is that those are the chips with built in TPM. There are add-in TPM modules that - to my knowledge - let older platforms work fine. Otherwise there'd be no point to them as again, everything newer has TPM built in to the CPU itself. PTT on Intel and fTPM on AMD. 

 

[Helpful Tech Witch]

Just now, Zando Bob said:

Nah. I haven't seen anything making these CPUs actually incompatible, I believe the reason MS lists 8th gen onwards is that those are the chips with built in TPM. There are add-in TPM modules that - to my knowledge - let older platform work fine. Otherwise there'd be no point to them as again, everything newer has TPM built in to the CPU itself. PTT on Intel and fTPM on AMD. 

My 7400 has ptt, no other tpm.
Ms moved CPUs to a hard floor, meaning you have to have those, they used to be a soft floor (suggested). They are thinking of adding r1000 and 7th gen

2 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

Even if it was great, it still messes with files/memory so a lot of anti-cheats will flag it and ban you. And since most game publishers do not support Linux, they have no reason to un-ban you (this has happened to people on some EA Battlefield titles IIRC). The issue with Linux is the same as ever: large companies don't support it consumer-side (a lot of enterprise stuff runs on various flavors of linux/unix AFAIK), so the userbase is tiny. Because the userbase is tiny, it's not worth it for large companies to support it. 

It being great would insinuate that that wouldn't happen......

[8tg]

Why do you see it as necessary to always use only the newest and most up to date things even if it’s not anything great?

I still use Windows 7 fairly often because it works, there’s nothing wrong with it.

Youre not required to use windows 11, stick with 10 or whatever.

[RONOTHAN##]

For me, I'm with you in thinking that Windows 11 has some deal breakers for me (the inability to use a local account on Home edition, odd UI, etc.) that I won't be switching to it until Windows 10 is no longer supported. However, I wouldn't try switching to Linux just yet, since Windows 10 will still get you by with nearly everything you need to do. Windows 10 will be supported until sometime around 2025, so continue using it until then and see if they fix some of the major issues there are with enthusiasts. If by say 2023-2024, that's when I'd seriously consider switching to Linux if you still can't stand it and all your software can be run in Linux/in a Windows VM. I'd also only really consider switching if you were considering switching already. This is a good final push, but don't make it the first push to switch. 

[Zando_]

7 minutes ago, HelpfulTechWizard said:

My 7400 has ptt, no other tpm.
Ms moved CPUs to a hard floor, meaning you have to have those, they used to be a soft floor (suggested). They are thinking of adding r1000 and 7th gen

Ahhh, hadn't seen that. 

8 minutes ago, HelpfulTechWizard said:

It being great would insinuate that that wouldn't happen......

Fair, I thought you meant from a technical standpoint. A lot of Linux is technically very solid, but usability wise it sucks because there's little support for mainstream stuff so you're stuck with often jank alternatives. 

[RONOTHAN##]

4 minutes ago, 8tg said:

I still use Windows 7 fairly often because it works, there’s nothing wrong with it.

Are you using it on the internet? It's no longer getting security updates, so it's a liability to everything else on the network. I get the point you're trying to make, but using software without security updates is an unnecessary risk.

[Helpful Tech Witch]

12 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

you're stuck with often jank alternatives

Cough p7zip cough

[8tg]

16 minutes ago, RONOTHAN## said:

Are you using it on the internet? It's no longer getting security updates, so it's a liability to everything else on the network. I get the point you're trying to make, but using software without security updates is an unnecessary risk.

nah mate it’s been out of support for years and this is the first time I’m hearing about it????

Yeah I use it on the internet with no antivirus, no windows defender or antimalware, no firewalls enabled either.

And I do this because I’m not stupid and know how to use the internet and not get butt blasted by viruses.

”oh well you wouldn’t even know if something installed itself in the background, you can get viruses just by seeing advertisements”

that’s not how that works, that’s how some idiot on Reddit presumes this works as they shill for windows 10

 

windows security updates have accomplished just about as much as simply telling people to stop clicking on the “free Minecraft download!!” banner ads on Facebook, they’re gonna do it anyway 

 

[RONOTHAN##]

3 minutes ago, 8tg said:

Yeah I use it on the internet with no antivirus, no windows defender or antimalware, no firewalls enabled either.

And I do this because I’m not stupid and know how to use the internet and not get butt blasted by viruses.

That's kinda like saying "I don't drive with a seat belt because I'm a good driver and not gonna get in an accident." Yeah it helps, but it doesn't do anything if a drunk driver (a compromised usually trusted website) decides to T-bone you. I think you're genuinely underestimating what hackers can do. Yeah security updates aren't perfect, but they're far better than nothing. 

10 minutes ago, 8tg said:

windows security updates have accomplished just about as much as simply telling people to stop clicking on the “free Minecraft download!!” banner ads on Facebook, they’re gonna do it anyway 

Running without security updates is like leaving your car in a parking lot unlocked with the windows rolled down and a "steal me" sign on the windshield. Yeah, if someone really wanted to steal it they're gonna do it anyway, but hackers like car thieves always go for the easiest targets. It puts everything else on your network at risk if you do get unlucky with a compromised website and it just isn't worth the risk.

[Giganthrax]

So far, I haven't seen enough reason to upgrade from Win10, as 10 does everything I want it to. I would also never swtich to Linux on my main machine because I like to play games. 

 

However, if 11 gets some great functionality that Win10 can't have, I will definitely switch. 

[JCBiggs]

i dont have a windows machine other than the  1 i use for work.  when software gets to the point it is OS independent, ill be using all linux. 

[thehardwarehacker]

2 hours ago, RONOTHAN## said:

For me, I'm with you in thinking that Windows 11 has some deal breakers for me (the inability to use a local account on Home edition, odd UI, etc.) that I won't be switching to it until Windows 10 is no longer supported. However, I wouldn't try switching to Linux just yet, since Windows 10 will still get you by with nearly everything you need to do. Windows 10 will be supported until sometime around 2025, so continue using it until then and see if they fix some of the major issues there are with enthusiasts. If by say 2023-2024, that's when I'd seriously consider switching to Linux if you still can't stand it and all your software can be run in Linux/in a Windows VM. I'd also only really consider switching if you were considering switching already. This is a good final push, but don't make it the first push to switch. 

im in that final bit, ive been considering switching to linux for a while anyways. and most of the stuff im doing i dont think i need windows for. plus, im sort of bored with windows as an OS, and im getting an itch to learn something new.

[Alexeygridnev1993]

2 hours ago, thehardwarehacker said:

im in that final bit, ive been considering switching to linux for a while anyways. and most of the stuff im doing i dont think i need windows for. plus, im sort of bored with windows as an OS, and im getting an itch to learn something new.

No one genuinely likes Windows, but everyone needs Windows to be able to run software they need. Office 365 will never be ported to Linux, as well as Adobe Creative Cloud. There are, of course, substitutes on Linux, but the compatibility will never be 100%. And that's a sad reality of it.

 

I've been using Linux for over decade and I absolutely love it, but I am already used to looking for alternatives and workarounds, which you may find annoying.

 

My suggestion would be to give Linux a try but to move your Windows installation to a VM or to dual-boot (with Internet unplugged while using Windows 10 after EOL), so that you can run Windows programs and games if needed.

[maplepants]

I use my gaming PC in basically the same way I treat my game consoles and I would like the operating system to be just as hands off. When I actually sit down at a computer to do work or development or something, it's never running Windows.

 

As soon as W11 supports new titles better than W10, then there'd have to be something pretty major to keep me from upgrading. 

[MartinTheActor]

My advice would be to pick up a cheap HDD or SSD, and install a Linux distro on that. Try running Linux for a few days or weeks and see how it goes. I stated it in another thread that I found it almost impossible to transition to Linux from Windows because invariably there was some widget or app I needed to use that there wasn't a supported equivalent on Linux.

So, throwing an extra bootable drive into your rig (or a bootable SD/USB) and testing Linux for a while would give you your answer on if it's worth it. 

As others have said though, Win 10 is still supported for another five years at least, and if Win 11 is a failure, then support might get extended for W10 as happened for Win7.

[Dutch_Master]

To anyone considering switching to Linux, as a long term Linux user (<2005), I have the following advise:

 

Keep your expectations realistic. Linux ain't Win-OS so don't expect it to be "just like a free Windows". It isn't. Linux has a different design philosophy at its base so it works differently to what you've been conditioned accustomed to. Expect a learning curve. Depending on your circumstances, it might be steep, or it may not be. Linux is all about choice. Including the choice not to use it. Try that from stuff you bought from Bill Gates and Steve Jobs

[10leej]

The gaming has gotten better and honestly I don't even have wine istalled these days and just use proton. One thing you'll want to know about Linux is that things don't always come setup out of the box.

So it's worthwhile to learn where to find documentation.

[thehardwarehacker]

Wow, I've been so busy I've forgotten about this thread. Interesting opiias always. At this point I'm planning on getting a 1TB ssd, and stick POP_os on it. I'm only going in with the loose plan of 'have fun with it, see what works, and what wont'. 

[YoungBlade]

Apart from gaming, I honestly prefer Linux over Windows since Windows 10. I switched my laptop over to Ubuntu 20.04 earlier this year because I just hate having to spend so much time uninstalling random crap that Microsoft puts back into the OS after updates. I remove Cortana, Edge, Maps, etc because I don't want them, and yet, after an update, there they are again. Or, they've added new nonsense, like that "News and Interests" thing. That doesn't happen on Linux. When I remove a piece of software, it stays removed. And general updates don't mess with the way I've configured my desktop.

 

The crown jewel of Microsoft's recent stupidity came with an update in May that has broken the search function completely on my desktop. I can't use search in Windows Explorer nor the Start Menu unless I go into a new user account that I created after that update. I just haven't found the time to migrate all of my documents over, but frankly, I shouldn't have to.

 

I want a computer that I can set up and then use, not one that I have to constantly be tinkering with to get it to do what I want. Which is, ironically, why I didn't switch to Linux back in the day. Windows XP through 8.1 just worked, and Linux required regular tinkering because updates could mess things up. Now, I haven't had an update break a piece of functionality on Linux since 2014, while Windows 10 updates regularly leave me searching online to fix something or to undo something I don't like.

[TheProf]

I dual boot with Windows 10 and Fedora 34 but I only use Windows for gaming because it is still better on Windows. However, aside from gaming, I think Linux is a solid choice. I think the harder part is choosing a distro that suits you.