10900k vs 11900k

[thepoorgamer]

If the rumors about a $100 price bump and lackluster gains over last gen, do you think the 10900k will be better than the 11900k? I think a interesting dynamic where the 10900k might be worth the same or even more (because it has 2 more cores) then the 11900k. 10th to11th gen looks to be like  6 to 7th gen. If 12th gen isn't amazing, Intel's desktop division might be in SERIOUS trouble.  If intel can gain gaming performance leadership on 11th gen, they might have a shot at holding AMD back until the 12th gen launch. What do you think about 11th gen and Intel as a whole?

[Downkey]

5 minutes ago, thepoorgamer said:

If the rumors about a $100 price bump and lackluster gains over last gen, do you think the 10900k will be better than the 11900k? I think a interesting dynamic where the 10900k might be worth the same or even more (because it has 2 more cores) then the 11900k. 10th to11th gen looks to be like  6 to 7th gen. If 12th gen isn't amazing, Intel's desktop division might be in SERIOUS trouble.  If intel can gain gaming performance leadership on 11th gen, they might have a shot at holding AMD back until the 12th gen launch. What do you think about 11th gen and Intel as a whole?

the anandtech review says that the 11700k is worse than the 10700k lmao. The pattern will prob repeat with the 11900, although i could be wrong. There are also alot of factors that havent been accounted for yet

[Fasauceome]

I'm just waiting for more comprehensive reviews. Also newer, more stable BIOS versions for better performance data.

[King of Memes]

i think it will be worse. Increasing the price and lowering the core count isnt gonna be good. Any one who does someone that uses more than 8 damn cores is not gonna be happy. They'd better just go with AMD. And even for gamers, over $500 is expensive for an 8 core 16 thread cpu. Intel is not gonna kill AMD with their new cpus. And on the 11900k, it wont be worth it for a lot of ppl. 

[curiousmind34]

9 minutes ago, thepoorgamer said:

If the rumors about a $100 price bump and lackluster gains over last gen, do you think the 10900k will be better than the 11900k? I think a interesting dynamic where the 10900k might be worth the same or even more (because it has 2 more cores) then the 11900k. 10th to11th gen looks to be like  6 to 7th gen. If 12th gen isn't amazing, Intel's desktop division might be in SERIOUS trouble.  If intel can gain gaming performance leadership on 11th gen, they might have a shot at holding AMD back until the 12th gen launch. What do you think about 11th gen and Intel as a whole?

Intel took away their one advantage with 10th gen, more cores at a cheaper price. the i5 10400f was cheaper than a 3600, and an i7 10700 was cheaper than a 3700x and 5800x. They are taking away the one small advantage they had. 

[Sauron]

The answer is that nobody cares because AMD has better offerings regardless.

[Mister Woof]

Anandtech isn't the most reliable source IMO. So I'm still taking their early 11700k review with a large grain of salt.

 

They are among the reviewers who got skewed results in their Ryzen 5000 series by testing 10th gen on 2933mhz ram and Ryzen on 3200mhz.

 

I understand that 2933 is the spec for Intel and 3200 is the spec for Ryzen 5000, but typically only OEM users are going to be pairing their latest and greatest i7s and i9s with such slow RAM (and they won't really care about the differences between a 10900k and a Ryzen 5800x at 1080p). Meanwhile, enthusiasts are pairing their systems with 3200mhz+.

In almost every review I've seen that DOES use the same RAM speed for both platforms (TPU, GN, HUB, Jarrod's Tech, etc), 10900k and 5800x/5900x/5950x gaming results at 1080p and even 720p are mostly within 1% of each other, minus a few outliers on both sides. Some outlets even come out with the 10900k on top. The point is, they're so close in gaming when tested fairly, any wins or losses to me count as a draw.

 

So with that said, I agree with @curiousmind34regarding the step back to 8 cores. While in a practical sense the number of cores may not matter vs absolute performance, there's another psychological component that is less tangible where more cores just feels better as the consumer.

I went with the 10900K. $400 for 10 cores vs $600 for the 11th gen 8, and $450 for Ryzen 5800x.

 

I might be wrong, I also got a Z590 so I could switch later and get the full benefits, including the upgraded DMI over Z490.

[Jurrunio]

If you're looking for multicore.performance 11th gen will definitely be a downgrade. Otherwise it should still be competitive against its predecessor. It doesnt compete with Zen 3 though, which is faster but plagued by awful availability.

[jones177]

I look at it as "is it an upgrade" and the answer is not for me.

 

Right now I am using a i7 8086k(2018), i9 9900k(2019) and a i9 10900k(2020). Going by frames in games neither i9s are an upgrade to the 6 core. Going by my hardware not getting in the way of my enjoyment playing, the i9 10900k wins.

 

With the tests I have done I know an 8 core would be fine so I am getting a R7 5800X with my tax return since I already have an i9 10900k.   

[Mister Woof]

28 minutes ago, jones177 said:

I look at it as "is it an upgrade" and the answer is not for me.

 

Right now I am using a i7 8086k(2018), i9 9900k(2019) and a i9 10900k(2020). Going by frames in games neither i9s are an upgrade to the 6 core. Going by my hardware not getting in the way of my enjoyment playing, the i9 10900k wins.

 

With the tests I have done I know an 8 core would be fine so I am getting a R7 5800X with my tax return since I already have an i9 10900k.   

What do you mean by the hardware not getting in the way, exactly?

[jones177]

3 minutes ago, Mister Woof said:

What do you mean by the hardware not getting in the way, exactly?

The i9 10900k is incredibly smooth running games.

All my games now have migrated from the 6 core i7 and it is not about frames. It is just a better experience. The same happened when I went from a i7 6700k to a i7 8700k. Again not big frame rate jump but the 6 core was smooth and the 4 core was not.

 

I think it is the 4 types of boost it has that make the difference. Especially thermal velocity boost since all my games run the CPU below 70c with my 360mm AIO.

Also the only games that do better with all core overclocks(5 and 5.1ghz) are the ones that don't use the "preferred" cores to deliver frames to the GPU. These are usually AMD titles.  This makes the only worth while all core overclocks for games 5.2 or 5.3ghz and the one you use has more to do with thermals than it does with stability.

 

 

[Mister Woof]

20 minutes ago, jones177 said:

The i9 10900k is incredibly smooth running games.

All my games now have migrated from the 6 core i7 and it is not about frames. It is just a better experience. The same happened when I went from a i7 6700k to a i7 8700k. Again not big frame rate jump but the 6 core was smooth and the 4 core was not.

 

I think it is the 4 types of boost it has that make the difference. Especially thermal velocity boost since all my games run the CPU below 70c with my 360mm AIO.

Also the only games that do better with all core overclocks(5 and 5.1ghz) are the ones that don't use the "preferred" cores to deliver frames to the GPU. These are usually AMD titles.  This makes the only worth while all core overclocks for games 5.2 or 5.3ghz and the one you use has more to do with thermals than it does with stability.

 

 

Thanks for the feedback. Jumping to a 10900KF/4000mhz RAM soon myself from my 5ghz 8700k/3200mhz RAM.

[Ennogs]

I just hope supply is not an issue leading to people buying them to resell on ebay. 

[thepoorgamer]

13 minutes ago, Ennogs said:

I just hope supply is not an issue leading to people buying them to resell on ebay. 

If they are worse then 10th gen that won't be a problem.

[Ennogs]

I heard a rumour Intel have told sellers they can take pre-orders for the i9-11900 on the 16th of March. Does anybody know if this is true? 

[jones177]

1 minute ago, Mister Woof said:

Thanks for the feedback. Jumping to a 10900KF/4000mhz RAM soon myself from my 5ghz 8700k/3200mhz RAM.

To me you will be entering a world of strange and It will be nice to have more brains on figuring this CPU out.

The main Youtubers I watch dismissed it in their reviews and then they all used one to get a better score with the 3090 in Port Royal. 

They all tested it with the Intel limits in place so I had no problem beating all their CPU benches by a good margin even thought I am not overclocking.  

 

I have only tested at 5.3ghz with the Intel extreme tuning utility but I did not crash on any bench and did not throttle on Cinebench R20 with 0 avx offset. I did throttle on TimeSpy but the temp was only 93c max so I know I can get it down with a manual overclock. The only reason I have not done the overclock is that I am getting the frames I need now.

That will change when I get a 30 series card and can do 4k 120hz on my TVs.

 

So have fun with the i9 10900kf. I think it will like your 3080. 

[Mister Woof]

10 minutes ago, jones177 said:

To me you will be entering a world of strange and It will be nice to have more brains on figuring this CPU out.

The main Youtubers I watch dismissed it in their reviews and then they all used one to get a better score with the 3090 in Port Royal. 

They all tested it with the Intel limits in place so I had no problem beating all their CPU benches by a good margin even thought I am not overclocking.  

 

I have only tested at 5.3ghz with the Intel extreme tuning utility but I did not crash on any bench and did not throttle on Cinebench R20 with 0 avx offset. I did throttle on TimeSpy but the temp was only 93c max so I know I can get it down with a manual overclock. The only reason I have not done the overclock is that I am getting the frames I need now.

That will change when I get a 30 series card and can do 4k 120hz on my TVs.

 

So have fun with the i9 10900kf. I think it will like your 3080. 

I see a lot of reviewers running these CPUs at 2933 memory and then claim Ryzen 5000 is better at gaming (when they tested the Ryzen on 3200 because that's "spec") - meanwhile in reviews that use the same RAM speeds, performance is about on par with Ryzen at stock, and overclocks help Intel while they are a detriment to Ryzen.

 

This test here is with one of the biggest examples of real-world single-threaded performance as it pertains to gaming, and when paired with very fast memory, and a high OC, the 10900k will still beat a stock 5800x.

 

Now I don't expect to be able to get 5.3ghz AND 4700mhz memory with great timings and I'd agree on average your typical 10900k user at Intel spec w/2933 memory will be outperformed by Ryzen. But it is nice to see someone not automatically dismiss Intel because Ryzen is bandwagon right now and use just as many tricks (FLCK 2000mhz chasers, lookin at you) to see how they compete in gaming head to head full bore.

 

 

I think years and years of people saying memory speed on Intel systems don't matter has just made everyone believe this to be true even in very CPU limited scenarios (like MMOs), when in fact, it's a big help.

 

Nobody here (well not me anyway) is saying Intel is just better - obviously it's worse at other tasks outside of gaming and secondary costs (cooler, mobo, etc) can be higher....but they're still very viable in gaming when applied appropriately. 

 

It most definitely is NOT bulldozer, as much as people want to call these chips FX-9590s.

[jones177]

1 minute ago, Mister Woof said:

I see a lot of reviewers running these CPUs at 2933 memory and then claim Ryzen 5000 is better at gaming (when they tested the Ryzen on 3200) - meanwhile in reviews that use the same RAM speeds, performance is about on par with Ryzen at stock, and overclocks help Intel while they are a detriment to Ryzen.

 

This test here is with one of the biggest examples of real-world single-threaded performance as it pertains to gaming, and when paired with very fast memory, and a high OC, the 10900k dominates.

 

Now I don't expect to be able to get 5.3ghz AND 4700mhz memory with great timings and I'd agree on average your typical 10900k user at Intel spec w/2933 memory will be outperformed by Ryzen. But it is nice to see someone not automatically dismiss Intel because Ryzen is bandwagon right now and use just as many tricks (FLCK 2000mhz chasers, lookin at you) to see how they compete in gaming head to head full bore.

 

I like the WoW comparisons. 

 

I did buy a R7 5800X today with a ASUS ROG X570 Crosshair VIII Hero ATX Motherboard and a Pci gen 4 SSD.  It will be replacing the i7 8086k as a gaming computer and the i7 will replace an i7 6700k rig my son uses as a work at home computer.

 

It is going to be fun testing the i9 10900k against 5800X especial in single thread games.

My really fun tests are a lot like that WoW battle since that is where the frames can drop to the point of getting stutter.   

 

[Mister Woof]

8 minutes ago, jones177 said:

I like the WoW comparisons. 

 

I did buy a R7 5800X today with a ASUS ROG X570 Crosshair VIII Hero ATX Motherboard and a Pci gen 4 SSD.  It will be replacing the i7 8086k as a gaming computer and the i7 will replace an i7 6700k rig my son uses as a work at home computer.

 

It is going to be fun testing the i9 10900k against 5800X especial in single thread games.

My really fun tests are a lot like that WoW battle since that is where the frames can drop to the point of getting stutter.   

 

I think they're both great options but a lot of folks tend to get really caught up in teams.

 

MMOs are great tests of CPU - I was on my 1600 in FF14 and my Vega 64 was sitting at around 45%, CPU was as always only maxed out on a few cores but idle otherwise, still struggling to hold 35-40fps.

Meanwhile my 8700k breezes through the same place in the city at a cool 75+.

[jones177]

Just now, Mister Woof said:

I think they're both great options but a lot of folks tend to get really caught up in teams.

I used AMD from 2000 to 2008 and after that it was all Intel. So Intel fanboy. Now I will run both until there is a clear winner so I may end up being an AMD fanboy again.

All I know it is going to be fun.