Help from the community RTX 3080 Fraud

[Exidor]

3 minutes ago, IntMD said:

So, they cancelled all the BFG orders too, and are now just selling them normally but for a markup? Sure, thats not good.

Also under what section of British law is it legal to take somebody elses money under false pretenses use it for business gains. Not pay interest not deliver on the contract you signed and just give it back 3 moths later? Please point me to that that will make my next business plan so much simpler.

I will collect millions to buy up real estate state that I buy condos. But detached houses wait until they go up in value sell them and give people their money back......

I am pretty sure that would go under fraud. And the financial commission will be very interested.

 

But as I bought houses and promised apartments and now they are more expensive I can not simply buy them those apartments..... 

[Exidor]

26 minutes ago, -iSynthesis said:

German law makes it rather difficult to retract an already made purchase as a seller. Once you buy something a so-called "Kaufvertrag" is made, basically an agreement of purchase between the two sides. There are few reasons why one would be able to back out from that, most of those reasons are subject to the buyer, not the seller. 

I quote with own translation from the law §433 BGB:
(1) Through the agreement of purchase the seller is obligated to present the buyer with the object and ownership of said item. The seller is obligated to hand the item over without defects (physically or legally).

(2) The buyer is obligated to pay the agreed-upon price for the item as well as take the item from the seller.

 

A simple refund is NOT a substitute for handing over the item unless they have very good reasons not to do so (e.g. the item is not being produced anymore, etc.). You can agree to a refund, which might make more sense than a legal battle but that's about it.

 

Given all that I'm not a lawyer obviously so don't take this as legal advice^^

Referencing this.

The card they sold when they had stock at a higher margin while they had people who paid for the cards. The profits of that sale belongs to the person who bought it first......

Not the company that double sold it. The ownership transfer happens when the contract is signed the contract is signed as soon as the money transfer clears.

[IntMD]

Just now, Exidor said:

Also under what section of British law is it legal to take somebody elses money under false pretenses use it for business gains. Not pay interest not deliver on the contract you signed and just give it back 3 moths later? Please point me to that that will make my next business plan so much simpler.

I will collect millions to buy up real estate state that I buy condos. But detached houses wait until they go up in value sell them and give people their money back......

I am pretty sure that would go under fraud. And the financial commission will be very interested.

 

But as I bought houses and promised apartments and now they are more expensive I can not simply buy them those apartments..... 

That would depend entirely on the terms and conditions of the sale, in particular with regards to interest on any refund for not fulfilling a transaction. If it is under actual false pretenses, then, you will go to court. I really don't think any of this would actually have been under false pretenses though... but again... I DO understand why you are annoyed.

 

If you really want to read the Consumer Rights Act 2015 the link is below, but they appear to have been written from the same EU policy as the German one. It also partially references the Sales Of Goods Act 1979.

 

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/contents/enacted

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Exidor]

6 minutes ago, IntMD said:

That would depend entirely on the terms and conditions of the sale, in particular with regards to interest on any refund for not fulfilling a transaction. If it is under actual false pretenses, then, you will go to court. I really don't think any of this would actually have been under false pretenses though... but again... I DO understand why you are annoyed.

 

If you really want to read the Consumer Rights Act 2015 the link is below, but they appear to have been written from the same EU policy as the German one. It also partially references the Sales Of Goods Act 1979.

 

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/contents/enacted

 

 

 

 

 

 

If they are actively selling cards to other customers at a higher markup that demonstrates that they decided not to deliver rather than not being able to deliver.

 

Yes I am familiar with that law.

And I will reference that again transfer of ownership happens when the contract is signed.

That means they sold an item they technically did not even own.

 

 

And the burden of proof to disproof that would be on them.

 

 

 

Also you are completely missing the point of just taking somebody elses money and using it as you see fit.

I am very sure that all the above proves a motive and false pretenses.

[IntMD]

Just now, Exidor said:

If they are actively selling cards to other customers at a higher markup that demonstrates that they decided not to deliver rather than not being able to deliver.

 

Yes I am familiar with that law.

And I will reference that again transfer of ownership happens when the contract is signed.

That means they sold an item they technically did not even own.

Sure, by all means go for it, but I really do think you need to look through the terms and conditions of the actual sale (which would likely state, at least in many terms and conditions I've ever read) that it would be subject to refund if they were unable to fulfill the delivery in a reasonable timescale, or something to that effect. I think you would likely get scuppered by the product availability subject to fluctuations term that you used in that first post though in all honesty if that was part of the sale terms. Basically, the product is currently unavailable, so here is a refund (assuming they give you a refund at some point without having to get the CC company to do a chargeback). 

[Exidor]

3 minutes ago, IntMD said:

Sure, by all means go for it, but I really do think you need to look through the terms and conditions of the actual sale (which would likely state, at least in many terms and conditions I've ever read) that it would be subject to refund if they were unable to fulfill the delivery in a reasonable timescale, or something to that effect. I think you would likely get scuppered by the product availability subject to fluctuations term that you used in that first post though in all honesty if that was part of the sale terms. Basically, the product is currently unavailable, so here is a refund (assuming they give you a refund at some point without having to get the CC company to do a chargeback). 

Any contract that voids the law is void.

Does not really matter what they wrote in those terms and conditions.....

 

As long as they can not point me to an actual law that proves them right they can write what ever they want.

[Exidor]

5 minutes ago, IntMD said:

Sure, by all means go for it, but I really do think you need to look through the terms and conditions of the actual sale (which would likely state, at least in many terms and conditions I've ever read) that it would be subject to refund if they were unable to fulfill the delivery in a reasonable timescale, or something to that effect. I think you would likely get scuppered by the product availability subject to fluctuations term that you used in that first post though in all honesty if that was part of the sale terms. Basically, the product is currently unavailable, so here is a refund (assuming they give you a refund at some point without having to get the CC company to do a chargeback). 

 

Sure a refund at market value.

I buy a product to use it. So the refund must cover the product current market value. As I am buying it for its specifications. There is no law taht states I have to accept an arbitrary sum they made up. The market decides on the price.

Any court would state that they have to refund me in kind.

[LogicalDrm]

So... have they offered full refund or have you demanded full refund? What I understood from the German law snipped posted in this thread, them offering or you demanding it would allow breaking of the contract you now have. If you keep saying "I have not demanded refund", then I for one can't really take this as fraud or "bait-and-switch". Those two implicate that they either had no intention to  deliver the good, or are now unwilling to refund tackling on some smaller detail.

2 minutes ago, Exidor said:

If they are actively selling cards to other customers at a higher markup that demonstrates that they decided not to deliver rather than not being able to deliver.

You have proof on this? That they do actually sell and deliver to those who pay higher markup?

 

2 minutes ago, Exidor said:

Yes I am familiar with that law.

And I will reference that again transfer of ownership happens when the contract is signed.

That means they sold an item they technically did not even own.

I can't comment on that because its not how things work here. Ownership (on paper) and "right to control" are divided. I haven't really looked on how it works with consumer good, but with property the contract can make the clear separation of those two. With all the stuff of how to cancel and how that can happen automatically etc.

 

2 minutes ago, Exidor said:

And the burden of proof to disproof that would be on them.

So in German law system its "guilty until proven innocent"? Many other systems work opposite ways where you must prove wrongful action and until then its just accusations.

 

2 minutes ago, Exidor said:

Also you are completely missing the point of just taking somebody elses money and using it as you see fit.

I am very sure that all the above proves a motive and false pretenses.

No, it doesn't. You are claiming they are using your and others money for something which you have not detailed here. Thats just accusation at this point. From my perspective, you are just another angry customer who bought GPU, then store got hit by production difficulties on manufacturers side and now you are unable to see that.

 

The company has been up and running for over 20 years. If they would regularly use the market situation at their advantage, they would have been out of business years ago, probably during first mining crazyness. Also I don't see any 3080s listed in their site. So claims that they are selling these make no sense.

 

I would also recommend you take you tone down a notch. You seem to be bit hostile towards people who don't fall in line with your opinions.

[Biomecanoid]

28 minutes ago, Exidor said:

Also under what section of British law is it legal to take somebody elses money under false pretenses use it for business gains. Not pay interest not deliver on the contract you signed and just give it back 3 moths later? Please point me to that that will make my next business plan so much simpler.

I am sure the company has enough money and does not need to "steal" your 1000 euros. Plus how much is the interest in a savings account ? 0.5% ?  That would be like 5 euros lool

 

 

28 minutes ago, Exidor said:

I will collect millions to buy up real estate state that I buy condos. But detached houses wait until they go up in value sell them and give people their money back......

I am pretty sure that would go under fraud. And the financial commission will be very interested.

 

But as I bought houses and promised apartments and now they are more expensive I can not simply buy them those apartments..... 

Nice idea go do that and then a 1000 euros would not be a concern to you. It would like paper to start your fireplace in your mansion

[LogicalDrm]

1 minute ago, Exidor said:

 

Sure a refund at market value.

I buy a product to use it. So the refund must cover the product current market value. As I am buying it for its specifications. There is no law taht states I have to accept an arbitrary sum they made up. The market decides on the price.

Any court would state that they have to refund me in kind.

Could you provide link to laws stating that? Sounds pretty odd way to conduct consumer goods markets. That kind of thing would be different in property and business acquisitions where price is subject to change over time, and where contract validity periods can be much longer.

[IntMD]

3 minutes ago, Biomecanoid said:

I am sure the company has enough money and does not need to "steal" your 1000 euros. Plus how much is the interest in a savings account ? 0.5% ?  That would be like 5 euros lool

 

 

Nice idea go do that and then a 1000 euros would not be a concern to you. It would like paper to start your fireplace in your mansion

It wouldn't even be that much of a %age for a business deposit account. They likely would be getting basically nothing on deposit at current rates.

[Exidor]

2 minutes ago, LogicalDrm said:

So... have they offered full refund or have you demanded full refund? What I understood from the German law snipped posted in this thread, them offering or you demanding it would allow breaking of the contract you now have. If you keep saying "I have not demanded refund", then I for one can't really take this as fraud or "bait-and-switch". Those two implicate that they either had no intention to  deliver the good, or are now unwilling to refund tackling on some smaller detail.

You have proof on this? That they do actually sell and deliver to those who pay higher markup?

 

I can't comment on that because its not how things work here. Ownership (on paper) and "right to control" are divided. I haven't really looked on how it works with consumer good, but with property the contract can make the clear separation of those two. With all the stuff of how to cancel and how that can happen automatically etc.

 

So in German law system its "guilty until proven innocent"? Many other systems work opposite ways where you must prove wrongful action and until then its just accusations.

 

No, it doesn't. You are claiming they are using your and others money for something which you have not detailed here. Thats just accusation at this point. From my perspective, you are just another angry customer who bought GPU, then store got hit by production difficulties on manufacturers side and now you are unable to see that.

 

The company has been up and running for over 20 years. If they would regularly use the market situation at their advantage, they would have been out of business years ago, probably during first mining crazyness. Also I don't see any 3080s listed in their site. So claims that they are selling these make no sense.

 

I would also recommend you take you tone down a notch. You seem to be bit hostile towards people who don't fall in line with your opinions.

No they have not offered a refund.

They offer a replacement product. And keep saying all the products are out of stock when I point them to other 3080 that were listed on their website.

 

Yes that EVGA card was sold apparently but it was available a couple of hours ago.

They removed the category and probably moved to selling inventory as it comes in.

 

 

 

I appreciate your take on this but I do not agree with it.

[Exidor]

16 minutes ago, LogicalDrm said:

Could you provide link to laws stating that? Sounds pretty odd way to conduct consumer goods markets. That kind of thing would be different in property and business acquisitions where price is subject to change over time, and where contract validity periods can be much longer.

Laws state that something needs to function according to specifications.

 

 

So if I sell you a concrete block for very cheap.

Then fail to deliver.

Then offer you the money back months later. What damage has been done?

Was it just the value of the concrete block?

I still need that concrete block as a concrete block to finish construction.

 

How would a court go and determine the value of that concrete block?

Take your word for it or would it go out and collect competing offers?

 

 

 

 

Also as a side note for a private person loan the interest rate is in most countries at a minimum of 2%......

That scaled to several million is a lot of money.

[Exidor]

15 minutes ago, LogicalDrm said:

So... have they offered full refund or have you demanded full refund? What I understood from the German law snipped posted in this thread, them offering or you demanding it would allow breaking of the contract you now have. If you keep saying "I have not demanded refund", then I for one can't really take this as fraud or "bait-and-switch". Those two implicate that they either had no intention to  deliver the good, or are now unwilling to refund tackling on some smaller detail.

You have proof on this? That they do actually sell and deliver to those who pay higher markup?

 

I can't comment on that because its not how things work here. Ownership (on paper) and "right to control" are divided. I haven't really looked on how it works with consumer good, but with property the contract can make the clear separation of those two. With all the stuff of how to cancel and how that can happen automatically etc.

 

So in German law system its "guilty until proven innocent"? Many other systems work opposite ways where you must prove wrongful action and until then its just accusations.

 

No, it doesn't. You are claiming they are using your and others money for something which you have not detailed here. Thats just accusation at this point. From my perspective, you are just another angry customer who bought GPU, then store got hit by production difficulties on manufacturers side and now you are unable to see that.

 

The company has been up and running for over 20 years. If they would regularly use the market situation at their advantage, they would have been out of business years ago, probably during first mining crazyness. Also I don't see any 3080s listed in their site. So claims that they are selling these make no sense.

 

I would also recommend you take you tone down a notch. You seem to be bit hostile towards people who don't fall in line with your opinions.

Has nothing to do with guilt.

I bought an item I own that item.....

 

An identical item got sold. They refuse to deliver the item I bought.

I inquire where is the item I bought? How is the burden of proof not on them?

[LogicalDrm]

7 minutes ago, Exidor said:

Laws state that something needs to function according to specifications.

 

 

So if I sell you a concrete block for very cheap.

Then fail to deliver.

Then offer you the money back months later. What damage has been done?

Was it just the value of the concrete block?

 

How would a court go and determine the value of that concrete block?

Take your word for it or would it go out and collect competing offers?

 

 

 

 

Also as a side note for a private person loan the interest rate is in most countries at a minimum of 2%......

That scaled to several million is a lot of money.

You aren't providing answer...

 

Value of anything will depend on how and where you are using it, and do you intend to get profits for using it. If the delivery of something fails or is late and as result you end up losing something, that could be reason for paying more than actual price. But we are talking about consumer electronics which you (based on guess) are using for leisure and entertainment. I don't see you benefiting anymore by getting stuff now vs getting it 6 months from now. The performance of the GPU is still same, and usually price will drop during time. This kind of situation where it rises due limits of supply is rather rare in consumer goods overall. Unlike in property where it can go either way, so in business.

 

3 minutes ago, Exidor said:

Has nothing to do with guilt.

I bought an item I own that item.....

 

An identical item got sold. They refuse to deliver the item I bought.

I inquire where is the item I bought? How is the burden of proof not on them?

You are talking about taking them to court and saying that they are in defensive position from start. This is not how our court system works, I'm not familiar how it does in Germany. In here it would be treated as disagreement between two parties. One being company doesn't matter. You are claiming they are at fault. You must provide proof on how they are at fault in order to win. They can and must provide proof that your claims aren't valid. But if you can't provide anything to support your claim, I doubt it will even be accepted in courts.

 

Note: I only know how this works in Finland, and mainly from property perspective as thats what I have had to study.

[Biomecanoid]

15 minutes ago, Exidor said:

No they have not offered a refund.

 

You said you have means of taking your money back, do so

15 minutes ago, Exidor said:

They offer a replacement product. And keep saying all the products are out of stock when I point them to other 3080 that were listed on their website.

Products 1st go out of stock and then they are taken down from the site there is a delay sometimes a big delay. Stock on online stores is never realtime as it is updated automatically at certain intervals or worst manually.

 

 

15 minutes ago, Exidor said:

 

Yes that EVGA card was sold apparently but it was available a couple of hours ago.

They removed the category and probably moved to selling inventory as it comes in.

 

 

 

I appreciate your take on this but I do not agree with it.

Products may appear on stock online while in reality they are not. You are acting like its your 1st time ordering online.

 

Also is it widely known all over the world that your money tend to disappear around lawyers and doctors, if you want to do to court for nothing, it will only end with you being poorer 

[Exidor]

23 minutes ago, LogicalDrm said:

You aren't providing answer...

 

Value of anything will depend on how and where you are using it, and do you intend to get profits for using it. If the delivery of something fails or is late and as result you end up losing something, that could be reason for paying more than actual price. But we are talking about consumer electronics which you (based on guess) are using for leisure and entertainment. I don't see you benefiting anymore by getting stuff now vs getting it 6 months from now. The performance of the GPU is still same, and usually price will drop during time. This kind of situation where it rises due limits of supply is rather rare in consumer goods overall. Unlike in property where it can go either way, so in business.

 

You are talking about taking them to court and saying that they are in defensive position from start. This is not how our court system works, I'm not familiar how it does in Germany. In here it would be treated as disagreement between two parties. One being company doesn't matter. You are claiming they are at fault. You must provide proof on how they are at fault in order to win. They can and must provide proof that your claims aren't valid. But if you can't provide anything to support your claim, I doubt it will even be accepted in courts.

 

Note: I only know how this works in Finland, and mainly from property perspective as thats what I have had to study.

I have proof of ownership I have a paid invoice....

I want to know where that item is that I own. They have sold a comparable item and probably even identical items at a higher price and delivered while refuse to deliver to me.

Is that not proof. Let us start by them clearly stating where is the item I purchased if they are selling identical items at a higher price.

 

 

Now in reference to your first point.

I work in IT and it is a huge inconvenience to have an unfinished build and not being able to migrate to the new CPU.

Yes the GPU will not really improve the performance of the work I do but the new build will, completing that depends on the GPU.

As with a building or any item if I lack a component that hinders its functionality and have to pay for a replacement. Those are damages.

 

 

I also studied law and business.

So what you are saying we should encourage companies to speculate take a risk with other peoples money. Under false pretenses of a sales contract that they by selling at a higher markup and delivering and not delivering to people they sold to at a lower markup proof or at least point to not being interested in honoring.

So the consumers should just fund this speculation?

 

 

And yes the consumer law clearly states that I as the consumer have the right to get the item. Me and the seller can come to an agreement for a refund. But the seller first has to prove that he did all he could to procure that item. Then he can force me to take a refund in court. Until then it is my choice to take or not take the refund. Especially if I have to go through a credit card company and insurance.

They have to prove they can not deliver the item.

Taking a risky bet and speculating on market value of an item. Is the risk you take as a business. They can procure the items they are actively selling the items they just choose not to honor the contracts they already committed to.

 

 

 

They want to wait fine.

I will tie this unfinished computer to every service I provide to every hour I bill. And I will compare the productivity of my current CPU with the new CPU in that build I can not use.

[Biomecanoid]

24 minutes ago, Exidor said:

Laws state that something needs to function according to specifications.

 

 

So if I sell you a concrete block for very cheap.

Then fail to deliver.

Then offer you the money back months later. What damage has been done?

Was it just the value of the concrete block?

I still need that concrete block as a concrete block to finish construction.

 

How would a court go and determine the value of that concrete block?

Take your word for it or would it go out and collect competing offers?

 

Go to court - pay lawyers - lose time going to court - have to take time off work - achieve nothing - end owing money to lawyers - Sell pc and car to pay lawyers

 

24 minutes ago, Exidor said:

 

 

 

 

Also as a side note for a private person loan the interest rate is in most countries at a minimum of 2%......

That scaled to several million is a lot of money.

Its not a private loan and even if it was you think they owe you an extra 20 euros now ?, and will go to court for 20 euros ?

 

You are just trolling making a fuss online to put pressure on the online store to do what ever you want. It will not work.

[Exidor]

4 minutes ago, Biomecanoid said:

 

Go to court - pay lawyers - lose time going to court - have to take time off work - achieve nothing - end owing money to lawyers - Sell pc and car to pay lawyers

 

Its not a private loan and even if it was you think they owe you an extra 20 euros now ?, and will go to court for 20 euros ?

 

You are just trolling making a fuss online to put pressure on the online store to do what ever you want. It will not work.

Yes I do. And I stated that in the opening post of this thread.

And I will go to more media outlets to apply more pressure.

 

This is why the media is protected by law and has certain privileges they fulfill a function.

With social media like LTT they might lack a lot of the legal protection but they represent the community.

This post was not aimed at LTT but at the community. I think that it is important for the EU side of the community to be informed as this is a big player in the EU market.

I am voicing my opinion that this is fraud. And trying to argument it as best I can. And I am sure thousands are affected and chances are some of them are also part of this community.

Admittedly sometimes the argument gets heated. But that is my nature I am a relatively straight forward individual.

 

 

As for lawyers I already got one involved.

[Biomecanoid]

8 minutes ago, Exidor said:

I have proof of ownership I have a paid invoice....

I want to know where that item is that I own. They have sold a comparable item and probably even identical items at a higher price and refuse to deliver to me.

Is that not proof. Let us start by them clearly stating where is the item I purchased if they are selling identical items at a higher price.

 

 

Now in reference to your first point.

I work in IT and it is a huge inconvenience to have an unfinished build and not being able to migrate to the new CPU.

Yes the GPU will not really improve the performance of the work I do but the new build will that depends on the GPU.

As with a building or any item if I lack a component that hinders its functionality and have to pay for a replacement. Those are damages.

 

If you work in IT you should have known its not the right time to buy graphic cards, stock in non existent  You can check your emails, you can write your code, on monitor your stocks without a GPU.

 

Where is the damage that you can not play Cyberpunk in 4K ?

 

8 minutes ago, Exidor said:

 

 

I also studied law and business.

So what you are saying we should encourage companies to speculate take a risk with other peoples money. Under false pretenses of a sales contract that they by selling at a higher markup and delivering and not delivering to people they sold to at a lower markup proof or at least point to not being interested in honoring.

So the consumers should just fund this speculation?

"I also studied law and business."  that explains everything now.

 

8 minutes ago, Exidor said:

 

 

And yes the consumer law clearly states that I as the consumer have the right to get the item. Me and the seller can come to an agreement for a refund. But the seller first has to prove that he did all he could to procure that item. Then he can force me to take a refund in court. Until then it is my choice to take or not take the refund.

"Until then it is my choice to take or not take the refund" Just take the refund and that's all.

 

8 minutes ago, Exidor said:

 

Especially if I have to go through a credit card company and insurance.

You don't want to go thru all the procedure to take you money back ? Sounds lazy

8 minutes ago, Exidor said:

They have to prove they can not deliver the item.

Taking a risky bet and speculating on market value of an item. Is the risk you take as a business. They can procure the items they are actively selling the items they just choose not to honor the contracts they already committed to.

 

[Biomecanoid]

3 minutes ago, Exidor said:

Yes I do. And I stated that in the opening post of this thread.

And I will go to more media outlets to apply more pressure.

 

This is why the media is protected by law and has certain privileges they fulfill a function.

With social media like LTT they might lack a lot of the legal protection but they represent the community.

This post was not aimed at LTT but at the community. I think that it is important for the EU side of the community to be informed as this is a big player in the EU market.

I am voicing my opinion that this is fraud. And trying to argument it as best I can. And I am sure thousands are affected and chances are some of them are also part of this community.

Admittedly sometimes the argument gets heated. But that is my nature I am a relatively straight forward individual.

 

 

As for lawyers I already got one involved.

"As for lawyers I already got one involved."  Good but when all this end and lead nowhere, please do take the times to update the thread and not hide what really happened

[Exidor]

1 minute ago, Biomecanoid said:

 

If you work in IT you should have known its not the right time to buy graphic cards, stock in non existent  You can check your emails, you can write your code, on monitor your stocks without a GPU.

 

Where is the damage that you can not play Cyberpunk in 4K ?

 

"I also studied law and business."  that explains everything now.

 

"Until then it is my choice to take or not take the refund" Just take the refund and that's all.

 

You don't want to go thru all the procedure to take you money back ? Sounds lazy

 

As to reference to my education I also happen to have a Bachelor in IT.

 

Now if they are shipping other 3080 at a higher price then what does it have to do with the IT system they use?

This shows intent and business practices.

 

Also what does it have to do with Cyberpunk2077? 

[Exidor]

6 minutes ago, Biomecanoid said:

"As for lawyers I already got one involved."  Good but when all this end and lead nowhere, please do take the times to update the thread and not hide what really happened

So you can feel better about yourself?

I am sorry have I struck a nerve with you?

 

Is it all because of CyberPunk 2077 there there they promised to fix it this year. All will be good. Mama and daddy Corpo will make it all better soon they promised.

I am sure you have many other toys and games to choose from in the mean while......

[LogicalDrm]

14 minutes ago, Exidor said:

I have proof of ownership I have a paid invoice....

I want to know where that item is that I own. They have sold a comparable item and probably even identical items at a higher price and refuse to deliver to me.

Is that not proof. Let us start by them clearly stating where is the item I purchased if they are selling identical items at a higher price.

No. Do you have proof that they have actually sold AND delivered equal product to someone else? Thats the proof I'm talking about. Any order confirmation and receipt would be the contract you are acting about. But that would just make company liable to pay you the original price back. Any more would depend on whether this contract has details about time of delivery as set date. If they have even one word about time of delivery being estimate, they can easily use that as reasoning and then provide their evidence from importers about shortage and manufacturing issues.

 

14 minutes ago, Exidor said:

Now in reference to your first point.

I work in IT and it is a huge inconvenience to have an unfinished build and not being able to migrate to the new CPU.

Yes the GPU will not really improve the performance of the work I do but the new build will that depends on the GPU.

As with a building or any item if I lack a component that hinders its functionality and have to pay for a replacement. Those are damages.

So you did buy the card as representative of business and getting it on time would have had impact of you conducting your business? That does make difference since at that point getting stuff is tied to your own business ventures. Any laws and how things work there I cannot comment as those kinds of contracts are different and usually more strict in terms of delivery and such.

 

14 minutes ago, Exidor said:

I also studied law and business.

So what you are saying we should encourage companies to speculate take a risk with other peoples money. Under false pretenses of a sales contract that they by selling at a higher markup and delivering and not delivering to people they sold to at a lower markup proof or at least point to not being interested in honoring.

So the consumers should just fund this speculation?

Where in my posts you take that? You seem to have strong opinion, and now try to twist my words against me? Not cool, bro.

 

14 minutes ago, Exidor said:

And yes the consumer law clearly states that I as the consumer have the right to get the item. Me and the seller can come to an agreement for a refund. But the seller first has to prove that he did all he could to procure that item. Then he can force me to take a refund in court. Until then it is my choice to take or not take the refund. Especially if I have to go through a credit card company and insurance.

They have to prove they can not deliver the item.

Taking a risky bet and speculating on market value of an item. Is the risk you take as a business. They can procure the items they are actively selling the items they just choose not to honor the contracts they already committed to.

This is true. But the thing is that unless they have agreed on some certain date of delivery, they haven't broken any law or contract. Not in our law system at least (which I did just re-read to confirm). Our system of law doesn't know the case where customer would be too stubborn to not take their money out of failed transaction, but keep on demanding the product. Only thing I found was that if seller can provide evidence/reason for late delivery, the return period extends from 14-30 days to 12 months. So if you were here, 9 more months to wait.

 

 

14 minutes ago, Exidor said:

They want to wait fine.

I will tie this unfinished computer to every service I provide to every hour I bill. And I will compare the productivity of my current CPU with the new CPU in that build I can not use.

My personal opinion, take your money out and don't lose big on courts. I don't see this going your way, mainly because you have options and you aren't taking them.

[Biomecanoid]

7 minutes ago, Exidor said:

As to reference to my education I also happen to have a Bachelor in IT.

Then you should be updated on current event and know that everything is out of stock. I want a 3000series card myself but I wait for prices to go down and for stock to appear.

 

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Now if they are shipping other 3080 at a higher price then what does it have to do with the IT system they use?

This shows intent and business practices.

That shows that stock is low and demand is high. Availability and demand one of the 1st things you learn in business school I am sure

 

 

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Also what does it have to do with Cyberpunk2077? 

 

Chances are you just want to game badly. unless you do video editing, on 3D modelling.