Computer freezes randomly, only it doesnt actually freeze

[SumsarTheThird]

I've been having this issue with my computer lately. and i've looked around, tried to goole as best as i could. no luck.

So my pc has begun to freeze at completely random times. only, its not actually "frozen". I can navigate around windows, some things i can open, like task manager, some things i cant. like a browser or a game.

some days i dont see the issue, other days, i can get it time and time again, whenever i restart the system. yesterday started with two of theese "freezes" right after eachother, then nothing for 5-6 hours, only to get the freeze again at that point. there is no regularity in what i do when it happens, i can be afk, watch youtube, watch movies or playing a game.

Whenever i then go to reboot the pc, it closes everything down like its about to shut down, only it doesnt. neither reboot nor shutdown does anything.

Things i've tried since this issue started to appear (About 2 months ago):

- Re-installed nvidia driver with DDU. This was because i had this feeling its gpu related, as it seemed everything that is using the gpu for anything stopped working.
- Re-formatted all drives connected to the system and did a fresh windows install. in fact, i've done multiple fresh installs on different drives to check if it was a failing drive.
- Updated BIOS on mobo.
- inspected both GPU and mobo for signs of damage (im grasping for straws at this point)
- Tested ram with windows own tool - no errors.
- Ran a CPU stress test for between 10-12 hours. (i left home to do some stuff, when i got home. the error thats bothering me caused the stress test to "freeze".) i ran another stress test for 16 hours with no issues.

I dont know what else to try or look for. so if anybody could have an idea or actually knows what is going on, i would be grateful!

I tried to capture the issue in a video.https://youtu.be/Ocjr6Cbhh9g

System specs:

- MSI x470 Gaming pro
- AMD 2700x
- 16GB (2x8) 3200 MHz G.Skill Trident Z CL14
- GTX 1080TI
- Corsair RM850x

[boggy77]

might be ram instability. are you running them at 3200? 2000 series ryzen struggles with 3000+

[Radium_Angel]

9 minutes ago, SumsarTheThird said:

Tested ram with windows own tool - no errors.

That tool isn't very good. If you want to know your RAM is good for certain, use memtest

https://www.memtest86.com/

 

Also, if you are using XMP, turn it off and try to see how your system behaves

[SumsarTheThird]

4 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

That tool isn't very good. If you want to know your RAM is good for certain, use memtest

https://www.memtest86.com/

 

Also, if you are using XMP, turn it off and try to see how your system behaves

i do yes, but i have been doing that since i got the 2700x back when it launched.
I think the issue happened after i updated my bios and the ram ran at stock speeds as well. not totally sure on that one tho.

 

But lets say this is the issue, why would it suddently be an issue when it havent been before ?

[SumsarTheThird]

5 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

That tool isn't very good. If you want to know your RAM is good for certain, use memtest

https://www.memtest86.com/

 

Also, if you are using XMP, turn it off and try to see how your system behaves

Am i to run the memtest with 3200 first ? or drop it to stock speeds before testing ?

[Radium_Angel]

Just now, SumsarTheThird said:

Am i to run the memtest with 3200 first ? or drop it to stock speeds before testing ?

oh, drop it to stock speeds. I suspect your issue will go away from there. If it still persists after using stock speeds, test with memtest.

[SumsarTheThird]

6 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

oh, drop it to stock speeds. I suspect your issue will go away from there. If it still persists after using stock speeds, test with memtest.

since someone pointed out that 2000 series had issue with 3000+
Could i get away with setting it to 2933 mhz and "expext" the issue to be gone ? and if its not assume i need to test it with memtest ?
Also, is it suggested to use xmp to set the speeds ? or do it "manully" from presets ?
But else ill try what you said. thanks fo far!

[Radium_Angel]

5 minutes ago, SumsarTheThird said:

since someone pointed out that 2000 series had issue with 3000+
Could i get away with setting it to 2933 mhz and "expext" the issue to be gone ? and if its not assume i need to test it with memtest ?
Also, is it suggested to use xmp to set the speeds ? or do it "manully" from presets ?
But else ill try what you said. thanks fo far!

Turn off XMP entirely. Leave RAM at whatever speed the mobo sees it at.

Use your computer as normal, see how it behaves.

If it goes stupid again, try memtest.

[SumsarTheThird]

17 hours ago, Radium_Angel said:

Turn off XMP entirely. Leave RAM at whatever speed the mobo sees it at.

Use your computer as normal, see how it behaves.

If it goes stupid again, try memtest.

okay so it happened again while running at stock speeds.

so i ran the memtest you linked me, and it failed with 4 errors.

So i guess my issue is faulty ram, so ill be ordering some new ones later today.

Thanks a lot for the help man! i really really appreciate it!

 

[boggy77]

18 hours ago, SumsarTheThird said:

Could i get away with setting it to 2933 mhz and "expext" the issue to be gone ? and if its not assume i need to test it with memtest ?

i would try this as well

[SumsarTheThird]

On 10/26/2020 at 5:06 PM, Radium_Angel said:

Turn off XMP entirely. Leave RAM at whatever speed the mobo sees it at.

Use your computer as normal, see how it behaves.

If it goes stupid again, try memtest.

So the situation changed a little.

A friend that had 4 x 8 of the same memory as my, let me borrow two of his stick till my new ones arrive.

These are known good working ram.

 

nonetheless, i plug them into my system, leave xmp off.

low and behold. not even 5 mins after i booted the pc back up, the thing happened again.

another restart, and same again. not even 5 mins in, it locked up again.

i did another memtest with his ram in, and got no errors in 2 x 4 passes.

 

any other test i could do to tell what it could be ?

 

[Radium_Angel]

1 hour ago, SumsarTheThird said:

So the situation changed a little.

A friend that had 4 x 8 of the same memory as my, let me borrow two of his stick till my new ones arrive.

These are known good working ram.

 

nonetheless, i plug them into my system, leave xmp off.

low and behold. not even 5 mins after i booted the pc back up, the thing happened again.

another restart, and same again. not even 5 mins in, it locked up again.

i did another memtest with his ram in, and got no errors in 2 x 4 passes.

 

any other test i could do to tell what it could be ?

 

Sounds like a bad mobo.

[Radium_Angel]

1 hour ago, SumsarTheThird said:

any other test i could do to tell what it could be ?

Correction:

 

Have you tested your SSD/nVME/HDD with the manufacturer's diagnostic tools?

I assume you are leaving XMP and any OCing, off, correct?

[SumsarTheThird]

30 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

Correction:

 

Have you tested your SSD/nVME/HDD with the manufacturer's diagnostic tools?

I assume you are leaving XMP and any OCing, off, correct?

its bog standard right now. no oc on either cpu, ram or gpu.

No i havent tested all my ssds and nvme's. but i have tried to install windows on different drives to see if that was the issue.
additionally, the ssd my windows was originally on when i got this issue, isnt even in the system atm.
but i guess it wouldnt hurt to do it. ill give it a go now

[SumsarTheThird]

All of them pass without issue and are in "good health"

[Radium_Angel]

31 minutes ago, SumsarTheThird said:

All of them pass without issue and are in "good health"

Well....all that is left is a bad CPU or bad mobo.

And assuming you haven't OC'd the shit out of the CPU, CPUs are generally quite hard to kill, whereas mobos seem to fall over at the drop of a hat.

 

Others may chime in here with some other options, but I'm out of ideas other than bad mobo.

 

[SumsarTheThird]

3 minutes ago, Radium_Angel said:

Well....all that is left is a bad CPU or bad mobo.

And assuming you haven't OC'd the shit out of the CPU, CPUs are generally quite hard to kill, whereas mobos seem to fall over at the drop of a hat.

 

Others may chime in here with some other options, but I'm out of ideas other than bad mobo.

 

Alright. im grateful for your time man! really!

i was afraid it was either motherboard or cpu. i mean, i have been running the cpu with PBO enabled all the time.
So i wouldnt be able to rule out that it might have been damaged, as amd do warn users when enabling it.

 

so i guess im going on the market for something new. amd 5000 series isnt far away so i might just let the system suffer untill reviews are out, to see if its gonna be an intel or amd system this time around.

 

Once again, thanks a lot for your time!

[SumsarTheThird]

On 10/28/2020 at 12:13 AM, Radium_Angel said:

Well....all that is left is a bad CPU or bad mobo.

And assuming you haven't OC'd the shit out of the CPU, CPUs are generally quite hard to kill, whereas mobos seem to fall over at the drop of a hat.

 

Others may chime in here with some other options, but I'm out of ideas other than bad mobo.

 

 a little question that i hope could help locate the issue.
It seems that after it "freezes" some games have to get reinstalled or told where the gamefiles are.

also some programs have had to reinstall modules on startup, like msi dragon center.
Could this point to something ?

[homeap5]

Ok, so...

You can open Task Manager, but not some programs. And you tried installing Windows on different drive.

But that is not a good way to check if drive is a problem!

Some programs are drive-dependent, like Explorer for example, but not only. Basically all programs that have access to drives, must read basic informations about that drives first from system, and system trying to read drives then may freeze if ANY of your drives are faulty.

It's like keeping CD in CD-rom - after some time it stop spining and when you trying to open Explorer, you must wait until computer spin your cd again.

If drive is faulty and system loses its information somehow, some programs may freeze at this point.

 

If you want to proper check if you have drive problem - install Windows on any drive and work on your computer for some time with all other drives disconnected.

 

[Radium_Angel]

On 10/27/2020 at 6:39 PM, SumsarTheThird said:

All of them pass without issue and are in "good health"

What tools did you use to test your drives with? Your last post indicates corruption, typically in storage drives

[SumsarTheThird]

On 10/30/2020 at 8:30 PM, Radium_Angel said:

What tools did you use to test your drives with? Your last post indicates corruption, typically in storage drives

Manufacturers own tests. But I've had windows installed on 3 nvme drives and 2 ssds. From different manufacturers. Still get this. 

 

[SumsarTheThird]

On 10/30/2020 at 5:50 PM, homeap5 said:

Ok, so...

You can open Task Manager, but not some programs. And you tried installing Windows on different drive.

But that is not a good way to check if drive is a problem!

Some programs are drive-dependent, like Explorer for example, but not only. Basically all programs that have access to drives, must read basic informations about that drives first from system, and system trying to read drives then may freeze if ANY of your drives are faulty.

It's like keeping CD in CD-rom - after some time it stop spining and when you trying to open Explorer, you must wait until computer spin your cd again.

If drive is faulty and system loses its information somehow, some programs may freeze at this point.

 

If you want to proper check if you have drive problem - install Windows on any drive and work on your computer for some time with all other drives disconnected.

 

I'll try to install windows on a drive I bought 2 weeks ago. And leave all other out of the system. 

I'll update soon

[SumsarTheThird]

On 10/30/2020 at 5:50 PM, homeap5 said:

Ok, so...

You can open Task Manager, but not some programs. And you tried installing Windows on different drive.

But that is not a good way to check if drive is a problem!

Some programs are drive-dependent, like Explorer for example, but not only. Basically all programs that have access to drives, must read basic informations about that drives first from system, and system trying to read drives then may freeze if ANY of your drives are faulty.

It's like keeping CD in CD-rom - after some time it stop spining and when you trying to open Explorer, you must wait until computer spin your cd again.

If drive is faulty and system loses its information somehow, some programs may freeze at this point.

 

If you want to proper check if you have drive problem - install Windows on any drive and work on your computer for some time with all other drives disconnected.

 

okay so i tried this on all my nvme's, one at a time.
nothing changed.