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How hot is too hot?

Oliver davies
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Hey, I'm using a cooler master hyper 212x to cool a xeon x5650. under full synthetic load I hit max temps of about 95*C after about half an hour. should i upgrade my cooler. and if I should what too. (budget is about less than £40)

Many thanks!image.png.28c3b32419b00b0166529aa7a85712da.png

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Take the cooler off and check your previous thermal paste application. Does it cover most of the IHS?

CPU: i7-2600K 4751MHz 1.44V (software) --> 1.47V at the back of the socket Motherboard: Asrock Z77 Extreme4 (BCLK: 103.3MHz) CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 RAM: Adata XPG 2x8GB DDR3 (XMP: 2133MHz 10-11-11-30 CR2, custom: 2203MHz 10-11-10-26 CR1 tRFC:230 tREFI:14000) GPU: Asus GTX 1070 Dual (Super Jetstream vbios, +70(2025-2088MHz)/+400(8.8Gbps)) SSD: Samsung 840 Pro 256GB (main boot drive), Transcend SSD370 128GB PSU: Seasonic X-660 80+ Gold Case: Antec P110 Silent, 5 intakes 1 exhaust Monitor: AOC G2460PF 1080p 144Hz (150Hz max w/ DP, 121Hz max w/ HDMI) TN panel Keyboard: Logitech G610 Orion (Cherry MX Blue) with SteelSeries Apex M260 keycaps Mouse: BenQ Zowie FK1

 

Model: HP Omen 17 17-an110ca CPU: i7-8750H (0.125V core & cache, 50mV SA undervolt) GPU: GTX 1060 6GB Mobile (+80/+450, 1650MHz~1750MHz 0.78V~0.85V) RAM: 8+8GB DDR4-2400 18-17-17-39 2T Storage: 1TB HP EX920 PCIe x4 M.2 SSD + 1TB Seagate 7200RPM 2.5" HDD (ST1000LM049-2GH172), 128GB Toshiba PCIe x2 M.2 SSD (KBG30ZMV128G) gone cooking externally Monitor: 1080p 126Hz IPS G-sync

 

Desktop benching:

Cinebench R15 Single thread:168 Multi-thread: 833 

SuperPi (v1.5 from Techpowerup, PI value output) 16K: 0.100s 1M: 8.255s 32M: 7m 45.93s

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1 minute ago, Jurrunio said:

Take the cooler off and check your previous thermal paste application. Does it cover most of the IHS?

yeah it does last time I reapplied. I know the interface is good but I need to know if the temps are too high.

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Well, anything above 80 isn't going to be good for that cpu. Maybe a artic freezer 33 esports one will help you out?

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1 minute ago, LukeSavenije said:

Well, anything above 80 isn't going to be good for that cpu. Maybe a artic freezer 33 esports one will help you out?

seems to be a good idea ill have proper look at reviews

 

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Just now, Oliver davies said:

seems to be a good idea ill have proper look at reviews

 

Well, there is a model of it that can keep treadripper cool, so yeah...

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Just now, LukeSavenije said:

Well, there is a model of it that can keep treadripper cool, so yeah...

They have large IHS's tho and large die areas so that may help. does anyone know if you can delid x58 chips?

 

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I tend to say that 75 is the max I'd be happy with for sustained long term use. Although that's a bit conservative. On all my folding rigs I set the max temp to 73 and I'm happy. Then again, I have good coolers for all of them so they can pretty much run full out and never reach that. 

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1 minute ago, corrado33 said:

I tend to say that 75 is the max I'd be happy with for sustained long term use. Although that's a bit conservative. On all my folding rigs I set the max temp to 73 and I'm happy. Then again, I have good coolers for all of them so they can pretty much run full out and never reach that. 

Oh ok ill see if i can drop some of the overclock in that case

 

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44 minutes ago, Oliver davies said:

yeah it does last time I reapplied. I know the interface is good but I need to know if the temps are too high.

they are high, but it could be just not enough mounting pressure. I got 75C on the NH-D15 on my 2600k at stock at the first time, but 60C the second time when I literally torqued it down.

CPU: i7-2600K 4751MHz 1.44V (software) --> 1.47V at the back of the socket Motherboard: Asrock Z77 Extreme4 (BCLK: 103.3MHz) CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 RAM: Adata XPG 2x8GB DDR3 (XMP: 2133MHz 10-11-11-30 CR2, custom: 2203MHz 10-11-10-26 CR1 tRFC:230 tREFI:14000) GPU: Asus GTX 1070 Dual (Super Jetstream vbios, +70(2025-2088MHz)/+400(8.8Gbps)) SSD: Samsung 840 Pro 256GB (main boot drive), Transcend SSD370 128GB PSU: Seasonic X-660 80+ Gold Case: Antec P110 Silent, 5 intakes 1 exhaust Monitor: AOC G2460PF 1080p 144Hz (150Hz max w/ DP, 121Hz max w/ HDMI) TN panel Keyboard: Logitech G610 Orion (Cherry MX Blue) with SteelSeries Apex M260 keycaps Mouse: BenQ Zowie FK1

 

Model: HP Omen 17 17-an110ca CPU: i7-8750H (0.125V core & cache, 50mV SA undervolt) GPU: GTX 1060 6GB Mobile (+80/+450, 1650MHz~1750MHz 0.78V~0.85V) RAM: 8+8GB DDR4-2400 18-17-17-39 2T Storage: 1TB HP EX920 PCIe x4 M.2 SSD + 1TB Seagate 7200RPM 2.5" HDD (ST1000LM049-2GH172), 128GB Toshiba PCIe x2 M.2 SSD (KBG30ZMV128G) gone cooking externally Monitor: 1080p 126Hz IPS G-sync

 

Desktop benching:

Cinebench R15 Single thread:168 Multi-thread: 833 

SuperPi (v1.5 from Techpowerup, PI value output) 16K: 0.100s 1M: 8.255s 32M: 7m 45.93s

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You can delid X58 chips just as you can any other Intel CPU (mostly), it will yeild great results and may even result in not needing to upgrade your cooler.

i7-7700k | GTX 1080 Ti | 32GB 3100MHz | Prime Z270-AR

 

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17 minutes ago, qqqqqq said:

You can delid X58 chips just as you can any other Intel CPU (mostly), it will yeild great results and may even result in not needing to upgrade your cooler.

Delidding a soldered CPU like this isn't that great of an idea, though. 

 

18 hours ago, Oliver davies said:

Hey, I'm using a cooler master hyper 212x to cool a xeon x5650. under full synthetic load I hit max temps of about 95*C after about half an hour. should i upgrade my cooler. and if I should what too. (budget is about less than £40)

Many thanks!

So is this at stock settings or overclocked? For stock this is very high to a degree where I also suspect poor contact. You did peel off the plastic protector film on the cooler, right? :P 

PC Specs - AMD Ryzen 5 5600X MSI B550M Mortar 16GB Crucial Ballistix DDR4-3600 @ CL15 - RX5700XT 660p 1TBGB & 256GB 600p Fractal Define Mini C CM V550 - Pop!_OS 20.04

 

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19 hours ago, LukeSavenije said:

Well, anything above 80 isn't going to be good for that cpu. Maybe a artic freezer 33 esports one will help you out?

Where do you get 80 from?  How much not good is going to happen?

 

This is synthetic load tho, he needs to check real gaming temps.

Emma : i9 9900K 5.1Ghz - Gigabyte AORUS 1080Ti - Gigabyte AORUS Z370 Gaming 5 - G. Skill Ripjaws V 32GB 3200Mhz - 750 EVO 512GB + 2x 860 EVO 1TB (RAID 0) - EVGA SuperNova 650 P2 - Thermaltake Water 3.0 Ultimate 360mm - Fractal Design Define R6 - AOC AGON 35" 3440x1440 100Hz - Mackie CR5BT - Corsair Virtuoso SE - Logitech G910, G502 - Cooler Master Universal Graphics Card Holder

 

Plex : Ryzen 5 1600 - Gigabyte B450M-DS3H - G. Skill Ripjaws V 16GB 2400Mhz - MSI 1050Ti 4GB - 840 EVO 256GB + Toshiba P300 3TB - TP-Link AC1900 PCIe Wifi - Cooler Master MasterWatt Lite 500 - Antec Nine Hundred - Samsung 27" + Dell 24" 

 

Raven:  Intel i3 10100F - ASRock H410M-HDV - G. Skill Ripjaws V 16GB 2666Mhz - MSI 1050Ti 4GB - Inland 256GB SSD + Toshiba 2TB HDD - TP-Link AC600 USB Wifi - Gigabyte GP-P450B PSU -  Cooler Master MasterBox Q300L -  Spectre 24" 

 

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- 2021 Volvo S60 Recharge T8 Polestar Engineered - 415hp/495tq 2.0L 4cyl. turbocharged, supercharged and electrified.

Lenovo 720S Touch 15.6" - i7 7700HQ, 16GB RAM, 512GB NVMe SSD, 1050Ti, 4K touchscreen

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4 minutes ago, jstudrawa said:

Where do you get 80 from?  How much not good is going to happen?

 

This is synthetic load tho, he needs to check real gaming temps.

Well, it's a general rule I use. Temps around 90 are too hot imo because on the long term it can be damaging for thd cpu. That's why my general rule is <80

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8 minutes ago, LukeSavenije said:

Well, it's a general rule I use. Temps around 90 are too hot imo because on the long term it can be damaging for thd cpu. That's why my general rule is <80

I get what you mean, I was curious where the 80c was coming from.  If it's a scientific CPU damaging temp or just your guideline.  Now you're saying 90c is damaging. :)

 

I'll do some checking as well, I am unsure about that since the CPU has a throttling feature that should kick in before damage, which is 100c or is it 105c?

 

Emma : i9 9900K 5.1Ghz - Gigabyte AORUS 1080Ti - Gigabyte AORUS Z370 Gaming 5 - G. Skill Ripjaws V 32GB 3200Mhz - 750 EVO 512GB + 2x 860 EVO 1TB (RAID 0) - EVGA SuperNova 650 P2 - Thermaltake Water 3.0 Ultimate 360mm - Fractal Design Define R6 - AOC AGON 35" 3440x1440 100Hz - Mackie CR5BT - Corsair Virtuoso SE - Logitech G910, G502 - Cooler Master Universal Graphics Card Holder

 

Plex : Ryzen 5 1600 - Gigabyte B450M-DS3H - G. Skill Ripjaws V 16GB 2400Mhz - MSI 1050Ti 4GB - 840 EVO 256GB + Toshiba P300 3TB - TP-Link AC1900 PCIe Wifi - Cooler Master MasterWatt Lite 500 - Antec Nine Hundred - Samsung 27" + Dell 24" 

 

Raven:  Intel i3 10100F - ASRock H410M-HDV - G. Skill Ripjaws V 16GB 2666Mhz - MSI 1050Ti 4GB - Inland 256GB SSD + Toshiba 2TB HDD - TP-Link AC600 USB Wifi - Gigabyte GP-P450B PSU -  Cooler Master MasterBox Q300L -  Spectre 24" 

 

Other Tech:

- Ubiquiti Amplifi HD mesh wifi

- 2021 Volvo S60 Recharge T8 Polestar Engineered - 415hp/495tq 2.0L 4cyl. turbocharged, supercharged and electrified.

Lenovo 720S Touch 15.6" - i7 7700HQ, 16GB RAM, 512GB NVMe SSD, 1050Ti, 4K touchscreen

MSI GF62 - i7 7700HQ, 16GB 2400 MHz RAM, 256GB NVMe SSD + 1TB 7200rpm HDD, 1050Ti

 

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4 minutes ago, jstudrawa said:

I get what you mean, I was curious where the 80c was coming from.  If it's a scientific CPU damaging temp or just your guideline.  Now you're saying 90c is damaging. :)

 

I'll do some checking as well, I am unsure about that since the CPU has a throttling feature that should kick in before damage, which is 100c or is it 105c?

 

It's 105 on the core and 73 on the dye if I remeber right. But that's a limit, not a recommended situation. It's kinda my guidelines, it's not a scientific theoratical guideline, just mine

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Heat will put wear and tear on the part regardless of how hot the part is. I've heard this thrown around in electrical engineering circles but the rule of thumb is every 10C hotter reduces the expected life of the component by half. The problem is that there's no real way to determine life expectancy. You can infer it's supposed to last at least as long as the warranty period with the stock cooler, but there are 10 year old processors that have been in regular use. There is a "too hot" temperature though, as semiconductors will exhibit thermal runaway once beyond that point.

 

For the purposes of this topic though, you can say a CPU is definitively too hot when:

  • Typically if the core temperature exceeds the specified maximum Tjunction. Unfortunately for this processor, Intel only lists a Tcase temperature of 81.3C. Tcase is always lower than Tjunction, and the only thing I could find that suggests how the two are related is at https://malwaretips.com/threads/intel-cpu-temperatures.66242/ (they say maximum Tjunction is about 5C higher than maximum Tcase)
  • The CPU cannot maintain base clocks during a nominal workload. If the CPU is not turbo-boosting but maintaining base clocks, then it's technically fine. It's when it drops below base clocks that's a problem, because now it's thermal throttling.
Edited by M.Yurizaki
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6 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

Heat will put wear and tear on the part regardless of how hot the part is. I've heard this thrown around in electrical engineering circles but the rule of thumb is every 10C hotter reduces the expected life of the component by half. The problem is that there's no real way to determine life expectancy. You can infer it's supposed to last at least as long as the warranty period with the stock cooler, but there are 10 year old processors that have been in regular use. There is a "too hot" temperature though, as semiconductors will exhibit thermal runaway once beyond that point.

 

For the purposes of this topic though, you can say a CPU is definitively too hot when:

  • Typically if the core temperature exceeds the specified maximum Tjunction. Unfortunately for this processor, Intel only lists a Tcase temperature of 81.3C. Tcase is always lower than Tjunction, and the only thing I could find that suggests how the two are related is at https://malwaretips.com/threads/intel-cpu-temperatures.66242/ (they say maximum Tjunction is about 5C higher than maximum Tcase)
  • The CPU cannot maintain base clocks during a nominal workload. If the CPU is not turbo-boosting but maintaining base clocks, then it's technically fine. It's when it drops below base clocks that's a problem, because now it's thermal throttling.

well. I wasn't that far off with 80 then... Are you a cooling nerd?

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2 hours ago, NelizMastr said:

Delidding a soldered CPU like this isn't that great of an idea, though. 

 

So is this at stock settings or overclocked? For stock this is very high to a degree where I also suspect poor contact. You did peel off the plastic protector film on the cooler, right? :P 

overclocked to 4.5Ghz and i cant drop it because windows gets fucked when i do (something to do with base clock issues i thing)

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30 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

Heat will put wear and tear on the part regardless of how hot the part is. I've heard this thrown around in electrical engineering circles but the rule of thumb is every 10C hotter reduces the expected life of the component by half. The problem is that there's no real way to determine life expectancy. You can infer it's supposed to last at least as long as the warranty period with the stock cooler, but there are 10 year old processors that have been in regular use. There is a "too hot" temperature though, as semiconductors will exhibit thermal runaway once beyond that point.

 

For the purposes of this topic though, you can say a CPU is definitively too hot when:

  • Typically if the core temperature exceeds the specified maximum Tjunction. Unfortunately for this processor, Intel only lists a Tcase temperature of 81.3C. Tcase is always lower than Tjunction, and the only thing I could find that suggests how the two are related is at https://malwaretips.com/threads/intel-cpu-temperatures.66242/ (they say maximum Tjunction is about 5C higher than maximum Tcase)
  • The CPU cannot maintain base clocks during a nominal workload. If the CPU is not turbo-boosting but maintaining base clocks, then it's technically fine. It's when it drops below base clocks that's a problem, because now it's thermal throttling.

thanks and as it doesnt thermal throttle  so ill asumme for only short periods of time when it peaks its ok.

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2 hours ago, qqqqqq said:

You can delid X58 chips just as you can any other Intel CPU (mostly), it will yeild great results and may even result in not needing to upgrade your cooler.

looks like ill consider that.. its only a cheap chip

 

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58 minutes ago, LukeSavenije said:

well. I wasn't that far off with 80 then... Are you a cooling nerd?

Per what I read from this thread, the CPU controls its thermals well, by throttling.  So 100c+ is damage, not 80c.

Emma : i9 9900K 5.1Ghz - Gigabyte AORUS 1080Ti - Gigabyte AORUS Z370 Gaming 5 - G. Skill Ripjaws V 32GB 3200Mhz - 750 EVO 512GB + 2x 860 EVO 1TB (RAID 0) - EVGA SuperNova 650 P2 - Thermaltake Water 3.0 Ultimate 360mm - Fractal Design Define R6 - AOC AGON 35" 3440x1440 100Hz - Mackie CR5BT - Corsair Virtuoso SE - Logitech G910, G502 - Cooler Master Universal Graphics Card Holder

 

Plex : Ryzen 5 1600 - Gigabyte B450M-DS3H - G. Skill Ripjaws V 16GB 2400Mhz - MSI 1050Ti 4GB - 840 EVO 256GB + Toshiba P300 3TB - TP-Link AC1900 PCIe Wifi - Cooler Master MasterWatt Lite 500 - Antec Nine Hundred - Samsung 27" + Dell 24" 

 

Raven:  Intel i3 10100F - ASRock H410M-HDV - G. Skill Ripjaws V 16GB 2666Mhz - MSI 1050Ti 4GB - Inland 256GB SSD + Toshiba 2TB HDD - TP-Link AC600 USB Wifi - Gigabyte GP-P450B PSU -  Cooler Master MasterBox Q300L -  Spectre 24" 

 

Other Tech:

- Ubiquiti Amplifi HD mesh wifi

- 2021 Volvo S60 Recharge T8 Polestar Engineered - 415hp/495tq 2.0L 4cyl. turbocharged, supercharged and electrified.

Lenovo 720S Touch 15.6" - i7 7700HQ, 16GB RAM, 512GB NVMe SSD, 1050Ti, 4K touchscreen

MSI GF62 - i7 7700HQ, 16GB 2400 MHz RAM, 256GB NVMe SSD + 1TB 7200rpm HDD, 1050Ti

 

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Just now, jstudrawa said:

Per what I read from this thread, the CPU controls its thermals well, by throttling.  So 100c+ is damage, not 80c.

yep. that's why 80 is my max. I don't say 80 is bad. I say everything above it is bad (not talking about a degree or two)

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Just now, LukeSavenije said:

yep. that's why 80 is my max. I don't say 80 is bad. I say everything above it is bad (not talking about a degree or two)

What I'm getting at is being careful stating opinions as fact... 80c and 90c do necessarily adversely damage a CPU under a stress test or gaming.  it is well within their normal operating limits.

Emma : i9 9900K 5.1Ghz - Gigabyte AORUS 1080Ti - Gigabyte AORUS Z370 Gaming 5 - G. Skill Ripjaws V 32GB 3200Mhz - 750 EVO 512GB + 2x 860 EVO 1TB (RAID 0) - EVGA SuperNova 650 P2 - Thermaltake Water 3.0 Ultimate 360mm - Fractal Design Define R6 - AOC AGON 35" 3440x1440 100Hz - Mackie CR5BT - Corsair Virtuoso SE - Logitech G910, G502 - Cooler Master Universal Graphics Card Holder

 

Plex : Ryzen 5 1600 - Gigabyte B450M-DS3H - G. Skill Ripjaws V 16GB 2400Mhz - MSI 1050Ti 4GB - 840 EVO 256GB + Toshiba P300 3TB - TP-Link AC1900 PCIe Wifi - Cooler Master MasterWatt Lite 500 - Antec Nine Hundred - Samsung 27" + Dell 24" 

 

Raven:  Intel i3 10100F - ASRock H410M-HDV - G. Skill Ripjaws V 16GB 2666Mhz - MSI 1050Ti 4GB - Inland 256GB SSD + Toshiba 2TB HDD - TP-Link AC600 USB Wifi - Gigabyte GP-P450B PSU -  Cooler Master MasterBox Q300L -  Spectre 24" 

 

Other Tech:

- Ubiquiti Amplifi HD mesh wifi

- 2021 Volvo S60 Recharge T8 Polestar Engineered - 415hp/495tq 2.0L 4cyl. turbocharged, supercharged and electrified.

Lenovo 720S Touch 15.6" - i7 7700HQ, 16GB RAM, 512GB NVMe SSD, 1050Ti, 4K touchscreen

MSI GF62 - i7 7700HQ, 16GB 2400 MHz RAM, 256GB NVMe SSD + 1TB 7200rpm HDD, 1050Ti

 

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