Intel price drop due to Ryzen?

[James360]

Will there be a significant price drop on Intel's side due to Amd Ryzen? Also would it be a good idea to pre-order or would it be less expensive after march 2nd?  

[TomR]

2 minutes ago, James360 said:

Will there be a significant price drop on Intel's side due to Amd Ryzen? 

None of us know, only speculation.

[Shiv78]

As of now, no.

I'd expect a drop on the 6900K to maybe $600-700 but not much else, as the rest of the Ryzen7 CPUs are similarly priced to Intel.

[TomR]

As far as speculation goes..

 

Will there be a price drop? Probably.

Will it be significant? Probably not.

[vanished]

I think they'll have to if they want to sell any more CPUs.  At least on the high end (6800k and above).

[Shiv78]

Actually, Intel could just drop the 7700K by like $30-50 and then drop X299 at a lower price, with the 7900K (or equivalent) at around $500 to compete with the 1800X

[Qwweb]

Supply and demand, if the overall demand for Intel CPUs and products does not drop, the price will not drop whatsoever.

[atavax]

I think Intel will primarily rely on brand loyalty. They might do a small price drop, and i think rumor is they'll release a new I5 with hyper threading that also has a slightly higher clock speed. I would expect Intel's main response to be their from their next line.

[VagabondWraith]

6950X - $350

6900K - $250

7700K - $129

 

They could severely undercut AMD and make Ryzen irrelevant.  

[rjfaber91]

I think that Intel's reputation is still strong enough to allow the Kaby Lake mainstream-series CPUs to retain their price or only be reduced slightly, but I would suspect a significant lowering on enthusiast-series CPUs, yes. Especially the 6800K seems ridiculously overpriced right now, compared to its new AMD equivalents.

[vanished]

36 minutes ago, VagabondWraith said:

6950X - $350

6900K - $250

7700K - $129

 

They could severely undercut AMD and make Ryzen irrelevant.  

Those prices would certainly kill the buzz around RyZen but I doubt Intel has been overpricing their stuff badly enough that they can actually afford to drop them this much.  I suspect those chips will never sell for any less than twice what you listed here.

[VagabondWraith]

2 minutes ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

Those prices would certainly kill the buzz around RyZen but I doubt Intel has been overpricing their stuff badly enough that they can actually afford to drop them this much.  I suspect those chips will never sell for any less than twice what you listed here.

I forgot the /s at the end.

[vanished]

1 minute ago, VagabondWraith said:

I forgot the /s at the end.

Well, to be fair though, we don't know how much of Intel's price is actual cost, how much is R&D recovery and how much is pure profit.  They could conceivably give up as much (or as little) of their profit slice as they want, but how much they choose to and how much that amounts to remains to be seen.  I'm sure they'd be willing to make less on each chip if it meant the difference between remaining relevant and not selling any, but I think they won't give up too much profit no matter what, and again, how much profit they even have to play with is unknown (to me at least).

[Dash Lambda]

1 hour ago, Shiv78 said:

As of now, no.

I'd expect a drop on the 6900K to maybe $600-700 but not much else, as the rest of the Ryzen7 CPUs are similarly priced to Intel.

How does that work?

Intel has one current-generation 8-core, and so far we only know details for 3 Ryzen CPUs, all of which are 8-cores that are supposed to compete with the Intel part, the cheapest of which costs less than Intel's flagship consumer part. How exactly is AMD supposed to price the rest of their lineup similarly to Intel?

[atavax]

They're even capable of selling at a loss if they want to completely dick over AMD. The thing is the desktop market is shrinking and they need legit competition to not be a monopoly.  I imagine they won't fight AMD too hard on desktop CPUs. I also imagine Ryzen is going to grow the market more than its going to steal Intel customers. I mean, sure a lot of people will switch to AMD. But most people that have bought a good Intel CPU since Sandy Bridge have no need to buy a CPU. So its not like, oh no, sales are bad because of Ryzen. Its like, oh no, sales are bad because we are failing to innovate and our latest generation was garbage. I bet Kaby lake's sales will be very poor, but the next 2 Intel generations afterwards will be much higher because of AMD.

[Siman]

22 hours ago, atavax said:

They're even capable of selling at a loss if they want to completely dick over AMD. The thing is the desktop market is shrinking and they need legit competition to not be a monopoly.  I imagine they won't fight AMD too hard on desktop CPUs. I also imagine Ryzen is going to grow the market more than its going to steal Intel customers. I mean, sure a lot of people will switch to AMD. But most people that have bought a good Intel CPU since Sandy Bridge have no need to buy a CPU. So its not like, oh no, sales are bad because of Ryzen. Its like, oh no, sales are bad because we are failing to innovate and our latest generation was garbage. I bet Kaby lake's sales will be very poor, but the next 2 Intel generations afterwards will be much higher because of AMD.

Right now not really coffee lake is having problems and their next gen 10nm process is botched. From the rumor mill they are also having internal problems. AMD's ryzen wafer yields are supposedly ridiculous. The die is also 10% smaller than Intel's CPUs. That is why AMD can sell these at their current prices... Anyway intel really cant sell at a loss right now, they are cornered and hard at that. Expect a price drop to barely profitable margins.

[atavax]

3 hours ago, Siman said:

Right now not really coffee lake is having problems and their next gen 10nm process is botched. From the rumor mill they are also having internal problems. AMD's ryzen wafer yields are supposedly ridiculous. The die is also 10% smaller than Intel's CPUs. That is why AMD can sell these at their current prices... Anyway intel really cant sell at a loss right now, they are cornered and hard at that. Expect a price drop to barely profitable margins.

 

Even with no technical improvements Intel still appears to be king of single threaded performance and i imagine we'll see i5's with hyperthreading as the standard next gen, to compete with AMD.

[MidnightBanshi]

Kaby Lake has already dropped price by $10 on Amazon.  Not much, but hey.........it's a start.

[Siman]

3 hours ago, atavax said:

 

Even with no technical improvements Intel still appears to be king of single threaded performance and i imagine we'll see i5's with hyperthreading as the standard next gen, to compete with AMD.

till ryzen releases... Also Coffee is already tapped out, its a process improvement over kaby so dont expect much. The high end is supposed to have 6 cores though. That is still a farcry from AMD's 8 core Ryzen 7. Intel's coffee i7s will be a max of 6 threads...

[atavax]

8 hours ago, Siman said:

till ryzen releases... Also Coffee is already tapped out, its a process improvement over kaby so dont expect much. The high end is supposed to have 6 cores though. That is still a farcry from AMD's 8 core Ryzen 7. Intel's coffee i7s will be a max of 6 threads...

I haven't seen a single leaked benchmark that indicates Ryzen's single threaded IPC is anything but lower than Kaby Lake's. And people are overclocking Kaby Lake to 5Ghz on consumer cooling. They got Ryzen to 5.1 on Liquid Nitrogren. Somehow i don't think the benefits of liquid nitrogren cooling is only 0.1ghz.  And don't mix up cores and threads please. I want AMD to do well and I am very tempted to get a Ryzen CPU, but it is not an obvious choice like you are making it out to be.

[Qwweb]

3 hours ago, atavax said:

And people are overclocking Kaby Lake to 5Ghz on consumer cooling. They got Ryzen to 5.1 on Liquid Nitrogren. Somehow i don't think the benefits of liquid nitrogren cooling is only 0.1ghz.  

The OC on Ryzen is certainly not impressive, and may/should be taken into account when buying for gaming where clock speed matters. Seeing that Kabylake was succesfully OCed to 7.838GHz on Liquid Nitrogen (a +3183MHz OC) vs the 5.1GHz on Nitro (a 1000 MHz OC) that Ryzen achieved, the OC potential is not comparable whatsoever.

3 hours ago, atavax said:

And don't mix up cores and threads please. I want AMD to do well and I am very tempted to get a Ryzen CPU, but it is not an obvious choice like you are making it out to be.

The R7 is a hyperthreaded CPU.

There are indeed quite a few drawbacks to Ryzen due to fewer PCIe lanes (same amount as Kabylake i7s at 24 lanes between CPU and motherboard) than the x99 CPUs and lack of quad channel memory.

[atavax]

2 minutes ago, Qwweb said:

The OC on Ryzen is certainly not impressive, and may/should be taken into account when buying for gaming where clock speed matters. Seeing that Kabylake was succesfully OCed to 7.838GHz on Liquid Nitrogen (a +3183MHz OC) vs the 5.1GHz on Nitro (a 1000 MHz OC) that Ryzen achieved, the OC potential is not comparable whatsoever.

The R7 is a hyperthreaded CPU.

There are indeed quite a few drawbacks to Ryzen due to fewer PCIe lanes (same amount as Kabylake i7s at 24 lanes between CPU and motherboard) than the x99 CPUs and lack of quad channel memory.

For most applications outside of gaming, i agree that it looks like Ryzen will be very compelling. But i think most consumers looking at enthusiast level hardware are primarily doing so for gaming.

[Qwweb]

2 minutes ago, atavax said:

For most applications outside of gaming, i agree that it looks like Ryzen will be very compelling.

I think it will be more popular outside of gaming (unless streaming), but I believe that Ryzen will not be popular as a workstation due to the lack of quad channel memory and PCIe lanes (will not be able to support Nvidia's new NVLink with both cards in x16 slots). The emphasis on GPU acceleration and computation in professional workloads will likely spell the downfall of Ryzen in the professional workstation market due to the lack of extra PCIe lanes.

 

One of the reasons why AMD can keep the cost lower than Intel's competitors is due to a smaller die size, by about a 10% decrease in size. But as stated above, this has drawbacks that limit the CPU in terms of extra features such as DDR-RAM channels and PCIe lanes which are more popular in the prosumer and professional markets.

 

But none of this means that Ryzen R7 is bad, it just means that it was created for a specific market which we will see expand as more mainstream consumer oriented chips such as the R5 come out (sometime this summer).

[atavax]

yeah, the dual channel lanes and limited PCIe lanes are two things that are turning me off of Ryzen. Even if it doesn't matter much now, i could have this CPU for 8+ years. Who knows, maybe we'll see the next E series from Intel have much more compelling prices because of Ryzen. Or maybe AMD will answer the criticisms we'll see a higher end chipset for Ryzen come out. For now I think my plan is to get an AIO cooler, overclock my 2600k, and wait.

[Simon771]

Ideal would be if Intel lowered prices, and then Ryzen drop prices even lower to still compete, and then Intel does the same and so on ...

You are looking at around 10% price decrease from Intel side.

And after some time Ryzen prices will go down for about same percentage.