BBC to set up team to debunk 'fake news' stories

[ivan134]

5 minutes ago, ace_cheaply said:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3214854/Pay-gap-Women-earn-men-till-40s-20-woman-paid-men-age-group-decade.html

 

 

You shouldn't be backing up any arguments with the UK equivalent of Fox News and Breitbart.

[ace_cheaply]

1 minute ago, ivan134 said:

I've already said before I don't give a shit about CNN. What about BreitBart?

You've already said before that Trump was a clown for berating CNN, when it was the reporter who was totally in the wrong.  Breitbart is biased as well, and I don't hold them as a gospel.  I don't trust any media outlet wholly.  But especially not CNN. 

[Memories4K]

1 minute ago, ivan134 said:

I've already said before I don't give a shit about CNN. What about BreitBart?

I'm biased when it comes to Breitbart, i've noticed they report on stories that other news outlets won't pick up because it doesn't fit with MSM's agenda and throughout this election cycle i've only gained more trust in Alt media (Not to say you should ever just take any organization's word, if you're only getting your news from one source then you're memeing yourself) but i do recognize Breitbart's past history and scandals with making shit up, so i think the criticism against Breitbart is totally fair.

[ivan134]

3 minutes ago, ace_cheaply said:

You've already said before that Trump was a clown for berating CNN, when it was the reporter who was totally in the wrong.  Breitbart is biased as well, and I don't hold them as a gospel.  I don't trust any media outlet wholly.  But especially not CNN. 

Ummm, he's a clown for specifically saying he won't take questions from CNN because they're fake news then turning around to take questions from the gold medalists of fake news. Is this really that hard to understand?

[stconquest]

There's no fixing "stupid".  Debunking actual fake news, as in completely made up stories, won't make that much of a difference when some people want to feel that something is true and do nothing to investigate a claim that suits their preferred emotional state.

[Memories4K]

4 minutes ago, ivan134 said:

You shouldn't be backing up any arguments with the UK equivalent of Fox News and Breitbart.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/earningsandworkinghours/bulletins/annualsurveyofhoursandearnings/2015provisionalresults

Source for you, not news organization

[ace_cheaply]

On 1/14/2017 at 0:37 PM, ivan134 said:

You shouldn't be backing up any arguments with the UK equivalent of Fox News and Breitbart.

This is called attacking the source rather than the evidence.  You can't simply claim it isn't true based on the source.   Is the argument sound? That's the only criteria that matters.   but here you go:

 

http://money.cnn.com/2016/04/12/pf/gender-pay-gap/

http://fortune.com/2016/04/12/women-are-out-earning-men/

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2015/aug/29/women-in-20s-earn-more-men-same-age-study-finds

http://www.forbes.com/forbes/welcome/?toURL=http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2014/02/24/childless-women-in-their-twenties-out-earn-men-so/&refURL=https://www.google.com/&referrer=https://www.google.com/

http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html

On 1/14/2017 at 0:39 PM, ivan134 said:

 turning around to take questions from the gold medalists of fake news.

Lol... He took no questions from CNN, so i don't know what you mean. 

[Memories4K]

2 minutes ago, stconquest said:

There's no fixing "stupid".  Debunking actual fake news, as in completely made up stories, won't make that much of a difference when some people want to feel that something is true and do nothing to investigate a claim that suits their emotional state.

People don't like to have their convictions challenged.

[stconquest]

1 minute ago, Memories4K said:

People don't like to have their convictions challenged.

You still have to suck it up and value the idea that the knowing truth is often more important than your feelings.

[Memories4K]

1 minute ago, stconquest said:

You still have to suck it up and value the idea that the knowing truth is often more important than your feelings.

^
100% agree

[Wolther]

12 minutes ago, Memories4K said:

It's a colloquial phrase, it's meaning is plainly "Do not do anything that would hurt yourself or confidence in yourself"

Yes, it's called negotiating a salary by marketing yourself based on your own value. The man could have more years in a company, better qualifications, be more prone to ask for raises (something we already know men do more of), live in a higher-cost area, there are extraneous variables you need to account for. There are many cases where women get paid the same, if not more, despite men providing a higher quality service, does that automatically mean men are objectively paid less for being men?

Right, there are very many variables that can be introduced when talking about anything that includes a group of people, never mind an entire sex. A lot of variables should become cancelled out when talking about vast populations, but not all do. To say an issue doesn't exist is not truthful. If you were to say it wasn't that big of an issue or the values are smaller to be of a mandatory concern then I'd agree with you. Equality is impossible to accomplish, both the mens and women's side.. and the "they" sex so it will always be an issue. 

[ivan134]

On 1/14/2017 at 0:39 PM, Memories4K said:

I'm biased when it comes to Breitbart, i've noticed they report on stories that other news outlets won't pick up because it doesn't fit with MSM's agenda and throughout this election cycle i've only gained more trust in Alt media (Not to say you should ever just take any organization's word, if you're only getting your news from one source then you're memeing yourself) but i do recognize Breitbart's past history and scandals with making shit up, so i think the criticism against Breitbart is totally fair.

Unfortunately, every news outlet has a bias. Al Jazeera American was the least biased for me, but they had to pack up due to not making enough money from low veiwership. Each outlet is going to carry stories that pushes their narrative. What differentiates them is making shit up. This is why I don't consider MSNBC as bad as Fox News or Breitbart. Unless I get slapped in the face again with evidence that they make shit up, I don't think they do. I don't watch them because they're not useful for keeping yourself completely informed about what's happening in the country (Al Jazeera did an amazing job with the investigative journalism on issues I didn't even know existed), but for the most part they don't make shit up. Fox News does on a daily basis, and Breitbart is even worse. These are just from the 1st page of googling Breitbart false stories.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/12/22/jewish_family_flees_county_following_fox_news_breitbart_stories.html

 

http://www.newser.com/story/236530/german-police-in-disbelief-over-false-breitbart-story.html

On 1/14/2017 at 0:41 PM, Memories4K said:

https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/earningsandworkinghours/bulletins/annualsurveyofhoursandearnings/2015provisionalresults

Source for you, not news organization

I don't need the source. I already know the gender pay gap is nonsense. I'm just saying if someone wants to back up their assertions, they need to choose their sources wisely.

[stconquest]

The debunking fake news industry will see huge growth in the next... four years. 

 

Trump is hard pressed to open his mouth for more than a minute without some lie, or falsehood, blasting out of it.

[ivan134]

3 minutes ago, stconquest said:

The debunking fake news industry will see huge growth in the next... four years. 

 

Trump is hard pressed to open his mouth for more than a minute without some lie, or falsehood, blasting out of it.

Seriously. The guy says he's not a politician, and he's right. He lies worse than politicians and lawyers. I didn't think that was possible.

[stconquest]

1 minute ago, ivan134 said:

Seriously. The guy says he's not a politician, and he's right. He lies worse than politicians and lawyers. I didn't think that was possible.

Even though I joke around, it is actually serious.  He might cause some major problems in the world.

[Memories4K]

1 minute ago, Wolther said:

Right, there are very many variables that can be introduced when talking about anything that includes a group of people, never mind an entire sex. A lot of variables should become cancelled out when talking about vast populations, but not all do. To say an issue doesn't exist is not truthful. If you were to say it wasn't that big of an issue or the values are smaller to be of a mandatory concern then I'd agree with you. Equality is impossible to accomplish, both the mens and women's side.. and the "they" sex so it will always be an issue. 

Well that's the thing.
I can absolutely tell you that many issues don't exist, for instance the Earth is not flat.
Flat-Earthers are arguing non-issues and spreading misinformation.
A lot is the same with the gender pay gap here in the U.S., it's an earnings gap it's not women being paid less than men because they are women.
We have several laws SPECIFICALLY dealing with equal pay here in the U.S.

Let me make it clear, i'm not at all against women being treated the same in our society, i understand things like sexism will never go away, i'm not saying "sexism is over" or "doesn't exist", i don't care about shit that isn't relevant to your work but this is false victimization.
If you were being paid less because of your gender, oh boy, all you'd have to do is go down to the BBB, prove it, and by god you could make a fortune off of suing your employers, that is how much protection there is towards business practices and standards.

The thing is the numbers brought up and perpetuated are misleading.
"Women make 77 cents per a man's dollar" Yeah, sure, if you don't account for different careers, age, qualifications, work hours, and aggregate the total number of money going towards all women in the U.S. and compare that to the total amount of money going to men in the U.S., then yes women look like they make less than men.

[ivan134]

3 minutes ago, stconquest said:

Even though I joke around, it is actually serious.  He might cause some major problems in the world.

Trust me, I know. I actually hopes he just focuses the next 4 years on building that wall and nothing else. It'll bankrupt us, but at least it won't start any unnecessary and dangerous international conflicts.

[stconquest]

1 minute ago, ivan134 said:

Trust me, I know. I actually hopes he just focuses the next 4 years on building that wall and nothing else. It'll bankrupt us, but at least it won't start any unnecessary and dangerous international conflicts.

They might do some major infrastructure work, enriching subsidized construction crews and causing major debt... but at least there will be something tangible at the end of it.

[ace_cheaply]

14 minutes ago, ivan134 said:

Trust me, I know. I actually hopes he just focuses the next 4 years on building that wall and nothing else. It'll bankrupt us, but at least it won't start any unnecessary and dangerous international conflicts.

I know, right? Could you imagine him telling such striking truths as "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor.  If you like your plan you can keep your plan. Premiums will be going down for middle class Americans."  Or " No religion condones the killing of innocents."  Or huge truthbombs like "My lawyers went through every single email. There was no classified information.  I handed over every single work related email."  Or what about having "the most transparent administration ever".   Man, if only Trump was that truthful. 

[stconquest]

3 minutes ago, ace_cheaply said:

I know, right? Could you imagine him telling such striking truths as "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor.  If you like your plan you can keep your plan. Premiums will be going down for middle class Americans."  Or " No religion condones the killing of innocents."  Or huge truthbombs like "My lawyers went through every single email. There was no classified information.  I handed over every single work related email."  Or what about having "the most transparent administration ever.   Man, if only he was that truthful. 

So wait, other people lie therefore Trump is honest.  Is that your message?  Seems legit.

[ace_cheaply]

3 minutes ago, stconquest said:

So wait, other people lie therefore Trump is honest.  Is that your message?  Seems legit.

Where did i say that?  

 

I quoted the wrong post, but I was responding to this:

22 minutes ago, ivan134 said:

Seriously. The guy says he's not a politician, and he's right. He lies worse than politicians and lawyers. I didn't think that was possible.

 

What lies did he tell that were worse than that?  Besides, I would say Trump is  more honest than any politician on the Left, and most on the Right. 

[Memories4K]

6 minutes ago, ace_cheaply said:

I know, right? Could you imagine him telling such striking truths as "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor.  If you like your plan you can keep your plan. Premiums will be going down for middle class Americans."  Or " No religion condones the killing of innocents."  Or huge truthbombs like "My lawyers went through every single email. There was no classified information.  I handed over every single work related email."  Or what about having "the most transparent administration ever".   Man, if only Trump was that truthful. 

Like i'm with you with the lie on Obamacare and Clinton's e-mails but...

"No religions condone killing" and "transparent administration" are more opinions based on personal perspective/values, not so much something the media "lied" about.

[stconquest]

45 minutes ago, ace_cheaply said:

I know, right? Could you imagine him telling such striking truths as "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor.  If you like your plan you can keep your plan. Premiums will be going down for middle class Americans."  Or " No religion condones the killing of innocents."  Or huge truthbombs like "My lawyers went through every single email. There was no classified information.  I handed over every single work related email."  Or what about having "the most transparent administration ever".   Man, if only Trump was that truthful. 

 

41 minutes ago, stconquest said:

So wait, other people lie therefore Trump is honest.  Is that your message?  Seems legit.

 

38 minutes ago, ace_cheaply said:

Where did i say that?  

 

I quoted the wrong post, but I was responding to this:

 

What lies did he tell that were worse than that?  Besides, I would say Trump is  more honest than any politician on the Left, and most on the Right. 

I was asking what message you are trying to convey.  What you are doing is deflecting.  It is like mentioning that Trump indicated a propensity to commit acts of sexual assault on women ("... I don't even wait") and his response is:  'Look at Bill Clinton's indiscretions, he is much worse.'

 

Ivan distinctly said he is worse than other politicians and lawyers so no matter how you paint it, all you are doing is indicating how bad Trump is;  unless you direct your argument to an end.

 

I don't think any US president, or president elect, has told so many outright lies in the public spectrum as Trump has done already.  He has not even started his term yet.

 

I would post sources, but I don't feel like posting 100+ sources.

[ace_cheaply]

1 minute ago, Memories4K said:

Like i'm with you with the lie on Obamacare and Clinton's e-mails but...

"No religions condone killing" and "transparent administration" are more opinions based on personal perspective/values, not so much something the media "lied" about.

Agree to disagree on the transparency.  But no religions condone killing?  Then what do these verses mean?  This isn't a personal opinion, these are literal verses. Seize them and slay them wherever ye find them is pretty damn conclusive. So is Strike off their heads and fingers. 

 

Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

 

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief or unrest] is worse than killing... but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun(the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

 

Quran (2:244) - "Then fight in the cause of Allah, and know that Allah Heareth and knoweth all things." 

 

Quran (3:56) - "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help."

 

Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority"

 

Quran (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward." 

 

Quran (4:76) - "Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah…"

 

Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."

 

Quran (4:104) - "And be not weak hearted in pursuit of the enemy; if you suffer pain, then surely they (too) suffer pain as you suffer pain..."

 

Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion is all for Allah" 

 

Quran (8:67) - "It is not for a Prophet that he should have prisoners of war until he had made a great slaughter in the land..."

 

Quran (8:65) - "O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight..."

 

There are plenty more.  There's also plenty of juicy stuff in the old testament as well. 

[AresKrieger]

2 hours ago, Wolther said:

Read this not gonna have a discussion about it here, but if you don't believe there is a pay gap then.. yeah 

It isn't real or rather it isn't more than 3-7 cents, which can be attibuted to women selecting jobs that have more benefits