Windows 8.1 (Blue): new features!

[arkon]

They should call that boot to Chaos :lol:  really who wants to see that on boot up? I'd prefer a boot with listing of what is going on like Linux/Unix then I log in and I get a command prompt or small search app where I type what I want and it brings that up, not a list of every app on my system as who will want to use the calculator on boot up :huh:

 

It doesn't boot to this. This is the all apps (programs) screen.

[carolkarine]

Do you still have to ALT F4 to close programs?

you never did. to close livetiles you would switch out of them (I use alt-tab, but going back to the desktop works) and then you open the sidebar of them on the lefthand side by running your mouse along the edge. right click on any you wish to close and select close.

 

but alt f4 is so much faster.

[IdeaStormer]

It doesn't boot to this. This is the all apps (programs) screen.

 

Rats, misread that :mellow:

[KaareKanin]

So... What? People actually like window 8? :-s

[gliszt]

So... What? People actually like window 8? :-s

I love Windows 8. And here am I, hoping not too many backwards changes in 8.1 but expecting many improvements :)

[arkon]

So... What? People actually like window 8? :-s

 

Yes, I like Windows 8. I honestly think most people who hate on it have never actually given it a proper try (taking the time to play around with it and find where everything is). They remind me of the narrow minded people who cry out every time Facebook has a design update or something.

[ThreePinkApples]

I understand the need for the Start button to be there on default, but I really hope I can remove it, too me it only takes up unnecessary space on the superbar

 

It is nice to have to option to boot to the desktop. More options is better, (almost) always. Someone will always want it. 

 

They should do a better separation between Modern UI and Desktop

 

If I click to open a picture, song, video or any other file in desktop file explorer, it really really should not open the file in it's Modern UI viewer.
So, you open file through desktop file explorer, open in desktop viewing program. (As default)

 

 

All other improvements I have seen for 8.1 looks really good (and necessary)

I love 8, and will love 8.1

[Nexus]

That start button better bring up the start menu.

I understand that they want to push the new shiny metro interface but its not suitable for people like me who use windows everyday for work. I have far too many programs open and i rely on the start menu to navigate to them. The start screen in windows 8 was a nightmare for me.

I know people say that you can just type what you are looking for and it will search for it but i have all my programs pinned to the start menu and instinctively know where to click.

[GoodBytes]

The desktop background part is really awesome.

 

What will the start button do?? Is it like Windows 7 or is it just the button to the start screen that has been made visible? If the latter, I don't really mind it. I think it's fine to have it there easy to access.

 

This will come to RT as well, right?

The Start Button will open the Start Screen. That's is all. It was removed during the beta version of Windows, because the common complaint was that if you had a metro app on the left side of the screen, and the rest was the desktop, it would be difficult and strange to click on the Start Button, as clicking where you normally clicks, there is nothing beside the metro app. Also, if you set the large part of the screen to a metro app, and the rest the desktop:

You had no task bar, so no Start Button, and you were stuck there. You had to hit the Start button on your keyboard.

 

The Start Button made 0 sense, and was removed and replaced with the hot corner. Microsoft was beating that no one would notice and people would instinctively click there.

 

 

Do some of you guys mind explaining about that a bit more? I'm intrigued, as 99% of what I've heard before this thread was people raging about no start button.

 

More importantly, are they going to make the search global again? Splitting it up made no sense to me.

Global Search is a go! (based on leaks). My guess is that Microsoft removed it initially, because they thaught they could not actively provide instant search experience when mixing Settings, Files, Apps, and modern UI apps together. And how would the results for metro app be represented? Now, we don't know how it will work. Will only search Apps, Settings and Files and not Modern UI apps, or Microsoft found a new way to do this?

 

Of course, it's alpha, so like in anything in alpha stages, things changes big time until beta and final release...

 

So... What? People actually like window 8? :-s

Windows 8 has a steep learning curve. People that go in with an open mind, and ready to learn something new, end up loving Windows 8.

Those that don't, hate Windows 8.

 

It's a bit like Windows 7. The only reason why Windows 7 was popular, is because XP didn't work properly or didn't took advantage of any of the capabilities of a modern system.. as it's a 2001 OS, based on 1999 OS (Windows 2000), which was based all the way back to 1993.

 

But Windows 7 new Task Bar was hatted like Windows 8 right now. People said it was identical to MacOS (obviously it was completely false). This forced people to use it, especially that you didnt' have a task bar replacement available, as it's a pain in the neck to program, and now people love it. Hence the term: People want change... but people hate, even despise, change.

[arkon]

The Start Button will open the Start Screen. That's is all. It was removed during the beta version of Windows, because the common complaint was that if you had a metro app on the left side of the screen, and the rest was the desktop, it would be difficult and strange to click on the Start Button, as clicking where you normally clicks, there is nothing beside the metro app. Also, if you set the large part of the screen to a metro app, and the rest the desktop:

 

You had no task bar, so no Start Button, and you were stuck there. You had to hit the Start button on your keyboard.

 

The Start Button made 0 sense, and was removed and replaced with the hot corner. Microsoft was beating that no one would notice and people would instinctively click there.

 

I thought it still showed up when you hovered on the bottom left, like the current one? (Except it was the old one with the charms, of course.)

 

Don't quite remember. It's been a long time since I've used the Dev Preview.

[Owen]

My computer boots into desktop now...I didn't even think I changed anything.

[GoodBytes]

If I click to open a picture, song, video or any other file in desktop file explorer, it really really should not open the file in it's Modern UI viewer.

So, you open file through desktop file explorer, open in desktop viewing program. (As default)

The reason why Microsoft did what they did, is because there isn't a file/folder explorer Modern UI version. So they had to use the desktop.

I don't think this will change in 8.1 thought, because such change is more of a new Windows version kinda a change (i.e: Windows 9).

 

But what is recommended is to open Default Programs panel, and click on Set your default program, and click on the program you want to open files, like Windows Media Player, and click on Set this program as default button.

 

That start button better bring up the start menu.

I understand that they want to push the new shiny metro interface but its not suitable for people like me who use windows everyday for work. I have far too many programs open and i rely on the start menu to navigate to them. The start screen in windows 8 was a nightmare for me.

I know people say that you can just type what you are looking for and it will search for it but i have all my programs pinned to the start menu and instinctively know where to click.

It won't. Start Screen. It's perfectly suitable for people who use Windows everyday. You just need to know how to use it.

I suggest you read: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2011/10/11/reflecting-on-your-comments-on-the-start-screen.aspx

Following the article guideline, you can end up with what I have. You arrange the layout so that you have the most use items at the bottom left corner of the screen, and the least used on the far right top of the screen. For mostly used programs, you pin them on the task bar.

[GoodBytes]

I thought it still showed up when you hovered on the bottom left, like the current one? (Except it was the old one with the charms, of course.)

 

Don't quite remember. It's been a long time since I've used the Dev Preview.

Yes, but it was not visible. So, you think that it simply didn't exists. Why would is be a hot corner at times and a button at others?

[Nexus]

The reason why Microsoft did what they did, is because there isn't a file/folder explorer Modern UI version. So they had to use the desktop.

I don't think this will change in 8.1 thought, because such change is more of a new Windows version kinda a change (i.e: Windows 9).

 

But what is recommended is to open Default Programs panel, and click on Set your default program, and click on the program you want to open files, like Windows Media Player, and click on Set this program as default button.

 

It won't. Start Screen. It's perfectly suitable for people who use Windows everyday. You just need to know how to use it.

I suggest you read: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2011/10/11/reflecting-on-your-comments-on-the-start-screen.aspx

Following the article guideline, you can end up with what I have. You arrange the layout so that you have the most use items at the bottom left corner of the screen, and the least used on the far right top of the screen. For mostly used programs, you pin them on the task bar.

Ok for a start using the new interface for programs is terrible. It means i have to move the mouse a much farther distance meaning it is far less efficient.

Secondly pinning programs to the start menu may be good for some but personnally i dont like it. Its untidy and when you have program 1 open program 2 closed and program 3 open you end up with random icons between open programs. I dislike this, its the reason i have everything pinned to the start menu in the first place.

Its fair enough that some people like the new method but Microsoft should allow people to use both ways. Its not as though it would have been a lot of work seeing as how the early dev edition could have the start menu reactivated.

[911^NEmeSis]

Yay windows with a startbar again. Sick! Something windows was all about.

[arkon]

The reason why Microsoft did what they did, is because there isn't a file/folder explorer Modern UI version. So they had to use the desktop.

I don't think this will change in 8.1 thought, because such change is more of a new Windows version kinda a change (i.e: Windows 9).

 

 

There's a File Manager app in the leaked builds (part of SkyDrive), but I don't know if they'll ship 8.1 with it or not.

 

Ok for a start using the new interface for programs is terrible. It means i have to move the mouse a much farther distance meaning it is far less efficient.

Secondly pinning programs to the start menu may be good for some but personnally i dont like it. Its untidy and when you have program 1 open program 2 closed and program 3 open you end up with random icons between open programs. I dislike this, its the reason i have everything pinned to the start menu in the first place.

Its fair enough that some people like the new method but Microsoft should allow people to use both ways. Its not as though it would have been a lot of work seeing as how the early dev edition could have the start menu reactivated.

 

Further != less efficient. If the target is large enough, it's actually perfectly efficient. You can pin apps to your start screen in 8.1 and set them to be smaller tiles, so that might be better for you.

[Nexus]

There's a File Manager app in the leaked builds (part of SkyDrive), but I don't know if they'll ship 8.1 with it or not.

 

 

Further != less efficient. If the target is large enough, it's actually perfectly efficient. You can pin apps to your start screen in 8.1 and set them to be smaller tiles, so that might be better for you.

With windows 7 once i click the start button i just have to move the cursor in an upwards motion and click when i reach the program i want. With windows 8 i have to move in multiple directions to reach the same thing. Making the tiles smaller doesn't really help imo as the problem isn't their size its their location.

Im not saying that i dislike metro in anyway way tho. After using a touchscreen laptop for a few hours i can see the appeal but i just feel for a desktop machine when doing serious work its not good enough.

[Esivo]

Changes sound cool. I'm gonna upgrade to Win8 from Win7 soon to try them out.

[mrthuvi]

But Windows 7 new Task Bar was hatted like Windows 8 right now. People said it was identical to MacOS (obviously it was completely false). This forced people to use it, especially that you didnt' have a task bar replacement available, as it's a pain in the neck to program, and now people love it. Hence the term: People want change... but people hate, even despise, change.

Yes, i hate changes. That's just not how i roll. I'm used to windows with taskbar and shit and has been for the last 10 years. The problem is that you can create a taskbar for windows 7 easily with no 3rd party program. But in windows 8 i hit a brick. No startmenu, stupid search, no aero. I just can't stand it. Hey, seriously,  it's cool to have new features, but how hard is it to give us the option to bring back old ones?

 

[ThreePinkApples]

The reason why Microsoft did what they did, is because there isn't a file/folder explorer Modern UI version. So they had to use the desktop.

I don't think this will change in 8.1 thought, because such change is more of a new Windows version kinda a change (i.e: Windows 9).

 

But what is recommended is to open Default Programs panel, and click on Set your default program, and click on the program you want to open files, like Windows Media Player, and click on Set this program as default button.

 

Yes yes, I understand this. But it looks like we will see a Moder UI file explorer in 8.1 so from 8.1 it should be like I described

 

And yes I know how to change it, have done it everytime I have installed Windows 8 on my computer(s). For me it is easy, just takes time, but for someone not good with PC this is could be a really anoying thing for them and it does not make sense to have it like it is now (when/if a Modern UI file explorer comes (which it really really should, sad that it wasn't in Windows 8))

[arkon]

Hey, seriously,  it's cool to have new features, but how hard is it to give us the option to bring back old ones?

 

That option would be to use Windows 7.

 

With windows 7 once i click the start button i just have to move the cursor in an upwards motion and click when i reach the program i want. With windows 8 i have to move in multiple directions to reach the same thing. Making the tiles smaller doesn't really help imo as the problem isn't their size its their location.

 

I mean you can lay them more app shortcuts out on the left side of the screen or something and it'd be practically the same as an old start menu?

[GoodBytes]

Further != less efficient. If the target is large enough, it's actually perfectly efficient. You can pin apps to your start screen in 8.1 and set them to be smaller tiles, so that might be better for you.

Exactly!

 

With windows 7 once i click the start button i just have to move the cursor in an upwards motion and click when i reach the program i want. With windows 8 i have to move in multiple directions to reach the same thing. Making the tiles smaller doesn't really help imo as the problem isn't their size its their location.

Im not saying that i dislike metro in anyway way tho. After using a touchscreen laptop for a few hours i can see the appeal but i just feel for a desktop machine when doing serious work its not good enough.

On the Start Menu, you can't pin folders. You have to live with the predefine folders there.  Also, as the article pointed out, you have little room for Apps on the Start Menu, so you need to do an extra click for All Programs, and then you need to search through a long list of folders, where the structure varies between each programs, and you are submerged with useless crap like: Readme, Visit our web site, Visit our blog, Visit our Forum, Visit our About page, etc.. and Uninstall items, etc. It's a mess. Here all this is eliminated, and quick and easy to access. And let's not talk about using a touchpad with the Start Menu with a high screen resolution on a small screen size. Good luck! Touchpad, even on Mac, are great to navigate large distances, but when you want precision, it's a serious pain. The solution is simple, use the pointing sticks thing that old and business class laptop have. They give you better precision on when you need do so small travels, but large ones... oh boy. So no. Not a real solution. The GUI needs to be updated, and Windows 8 does just that.

 

Yes, i hate changes. That's just not how i roll. I'm used to windows with taskbar and shit and has been for the last 10 years. The problem is that you can create a taskbar for windows 7 easily with no 3rd party program. But in windows 8 i hit a brick. No startmenu, stupid search, no aero. I just can't stand it. Hey, seriously,  it's cool to have new features, but how hard is it to give us the option to bring back old ones?

You have a desktop, taskbar, and "shit" in Windows 8. By task bar, I think you mean toolbar on the task bar? You can create that on Windows 8. The Taskbar in Win8 is identical to Win7. Start Menu is inferior.

search is using the same engine, Aero used to be there, but people complained non stop on how it didn't fit with the Metro look that Microsoft wanted to provide, and hence why Microsoft pulled Aero out with this look, which was much preferred by people. Bringing the old ones means that the time and energy spent on the new one, is wasted. Also, you create an non-uniform experience. It means that each OEM will customize Windows their own way, and it makes a mess of things when you try to help someone. You think they'll know what is a Start Menu or Start Screen? No, because they have what comes with the system. Most, don't navigate through options in Windows. I won't be surprise if Microsoft has number that indicate that the majority of people don't even change the wallpaper of the desktop. And yes, it was a problem in XP, with the old classic Start Menu.

 

If you don't like it, well, see it as the down side of new features. For me, I find it exiting to learn something new, to discover thing by myself, to experience new things, which only once I am comfortable, I judge.  Well, I guess it's an attitude and personality difference.

[Ultimate_PIMP]

It's good to finely see people who don't want the start button. Its just close minded people that don't want to learn anything new raging. I think windows 8 is way sexier than 7.

[mrthuvi]

On the Start Menu, you can't pin folders. You have to live with the predefine folders there. Also, as the article pointed out, you have little room for Apps on the Start Menu, so you need to do an extra click for All Programs, and then you need to search through a long list of folders, where the structure varies between each programs, and you are submerged with useless crap like:

Like this ?: I have a 1600x900 monitor and i can pin 20 programs or folders in there. 1080p can pin even more.

search is using the same engine

Please, they are not the same, they are separated by Apps, settings and Files. Unified search in windows 7 is better. I can type [star button]/cmd/enter and boom, cmd is brought up. [star button]/user account/enter ;user account is brought up. Tell me how you navigate in windows 8 search again?

Aero used to be there, but people complained non stop on how it didn't fit with the Metro look that Microsoft wanted to provide, and hence why Microsoft pulled Aero out with this look, which was much preferred by people. Bringing the old ones means that the time and energy spent on the new one, is wasted. Also, you create an non-uniform experience.

Actually it takes more time to remove aero completely than to disable aero by default.

Also, you create an non-uniform experience.

Windows 8 is a freaking non-uniform experience. Why? File Explorer is in windows mode, not Modern UI. It would be faster to list the things that exist in modern ui than to list the things still in windows mode.

[arkon]

Like this ?: I have a 1600x900 monitor and i can pin 20 programs or folders in there. 1080p can pin even more.

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Please, they are not the same, they are separated by Apps, settings and Files. Unified search in windows 7 is better. I can type [star button]/cmd/enter and boom, cmd is brought up. [star button]/user account/enter -> user account is brought up. Tell me how you navigate in windows 8 search again?

Actually it takes more time to remove aero completely than to disable aero by default.

Windows 8 is a freaking non-uniform experience. Why? File Explorer is in windows mode, not Modern UI. It would be faster to list the things that exist in modern ui than to list the things still in windows mode.

 

You can pin folders to the Start screen, actually. And a 1080p would show more than 20 programs and folders, so...

(Also I think he meant in the All Programs pane.)

 

And Windows 8.1 is bringing back unified search.

And yes, it takes time to remove Aero/rework DWM, but it's much lighter on performance, so that's sort of nice.

And File Explorer is being integrated into the SkyDrive app.

 

Boom, all of your arguments are toast.