Fiio E10 vs Audioengine D1 vs ?

[ProfoundDisputes]

Ok, first system specs:

Current Rig:

Intel Xeon E3-1230V3 3.3GHZ

ARCTIC Freezer 7 Pro Rev. 2, CPU Cooler

Rosewill Blackbone Black Steel / Plastic ATX Mid Tower Computer Case

ASUS Z87-A LGA 1150 Intel Z87 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard

EVGA 660ti 3GB superclocked edition

CORSAIR CXM series CX750M 750W SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Modular

G.SKILL Sniper Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 2133

Cooler Master CM Storm Spawn Red Wired USB Optical Gaming 

Microsoft SIDEWINDER X4 Keyboard

Storage:

Seagate Barracuda ST1000DM003 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache

OCZ Vertex 450 128GB Solid State Drive

Seagate FreeAgent GoFlex Desk 1.5TB USB 2.0 
WD Elements SE 1TB USB 3.0 portable hard
 

Audio:
Sound Blaster Z Sound Card

Beyerdynamic DT-990-Pro-250 Professional
Audio-Technica ATH-M50S Professional Studio Monitor Headphones

Logitech X-540 5.1 Surround Sound Speaker System

 

Monitors:

Hanns-G HL272HPB Black 27" 2ms HDMI Widescreen LED 

HANNspree By Hanns-G HF225DPB Black 21.5" Full HD 
[Perfect Pixel] New YAMAKASI DS270 IPS SE AH-IPS Low-Reflection 27" (soon to arrive)
 

I have been doing a lot of research lately on a DAC solution, I can't really decide on anything, its an endless circle of research; so I need a push.
I decided on trying a DAC solution after Teksyndicate's video (you know which one). I thought I was content with my Sound Blaster Z and dt-990s, until I started messing around with ASIO drivers (ASIO4ALL V2 better than official). The bass response was dramatically improved I loved the punchy bass, it really shakes the speakers; that's when I think I understood what people mean by bass doesn't sound as good. So maybe a DAC would open all new worlds in other areas, I thought. Also ASIO drivers are great but I can't have MusicBee running ASIO drivers unless I want to constantly be switching back in forth to allow my sound card to be used by all of windows. Its really annoying and I just want everything to be the same quality and work.

Well I can't seem to figure what will be worth it. The only DAC/AMP that I can find decent reviews on is Fiio E10 and the AudioEngine D1, for my price range. I am not sure what sound advantages AudioEngine D1 has to justify 90$ more. I have heard that Fiio E10 would be plenty sufficient. Do they have different sounds like one better than the other for certain music? ASIO drives sound a little on the bright side with some music, I like a warmer sound however.
I also have set EQ settings on the sound card drivers. I really don't like music without my EQ settings with emphasis on bass and balancing out the high pitches. I currently have its at:
 

31kHz @ +6db
62KHz @ +7db
125KHz @ +11db
250KHz @ +9db
500KHz @ +8db
1000KHz @ +6db
2000KHz @ +3db
4000KHz @ +4db

8000KHz @ +7db
16000KHz @ +5db
Level @ +4db

 

TL:DR ---> Fiio E10 Vs AudioEngine D1? AudioEngine D1 worth extra $$$? Better DAC/AMP alternatives for around 150$ max?

[asickduckie]

I have been doing a lot of research lately on a DAC solution, I can't really decide on anything, its an endless circle of research; so I need a push.

I decided on trying a DAC solution after Teksyndicate's video (you know which one). I thought I was content with my Sound Blaster Z and dt-990s, until I started messing around with ASIO drivers (ASIO4ALL V2 better than official). The bass response was dramatically improved I loved the punchy bass, it really shakes the speakers; that's when I think I understood what people mean by bass doesn't sound as good. So maybe a DAC would open all new worlds in other areas, I thought. Also ASIO drivers are great but I can't have MusicBee running ASIO drivers unless I want to constantly be switching back in forth to allow my sound card to be used by all of windows. Its really annoying and I just want everything to be the same quality and work.

Well I can't seem to figure what will be worth it. The only DAC/AMP that I can find decent reviews on is Fiio E10 and the AudioEngine D1, for my price range. I am not sure what sound advantages AudioEngine D1 has to justify 90$ more. I have heard that Fiio E10 would be plenty sufficient. Do they have different sounds like one better than the other for certain music? ASIO drives sound a little on the bright side with some music, I like a warmer sound however.

I also have set EQ settings on the sound card drivers. I really don't like music without my EQ settings with emphasis on bass and balancing out the high pitches. I currently have its at:

 

 

31kHz @ +6db

62KHz @ +7db

125KHz @ +11db

250KHz @ +9db

500KHz @ +8db

1000KHz @ +6db

2000KHz @ +3db

4000KHz @ +4db

8000KHz @ +7db

16000KHz @ +5db

Level @ +4db

 

TL:DR ---> Fiio E10 Vs AudioEngine D1? AudioEngine D1 worth extra $$$? Better DAC/AMP alternatives for around 150$ max?

Fioos are generally cheap crap (not bad for the price, but not good amps).. At a low price like that, I would get the topping tp30 or a cheap behringer instead.

[ProfoundDisputes]

Fioos are generally cheap crap (not bad for the price, but not good amps).. At a low price like that, I would get the topping tp30 or a cheap behringer instead.

I really was avoiding the Fiio brand myself because I got the impression that its just a popular cheap brand. I just kept seeing reviews and forums that referenced it so I started leaning towards it. I only knew about Audioengine by mkbhd's video. I'll be checking out your suggestions. Thank You.

[helping]

Fioos are generally cheap crap (not bad for the price, but not good amps).. At a low price like that, I would get the topping tp30 or a cheap behringer instead.

So.. you're putting down Fiio for Behringer? 

 

I really was avoiding the Fiio brand myself because I got the impression that its just a popular cheap brand. I just kept seeing reviews and forums that referenced it so I started leaning towards it. I only knew about Audioengine by mkbhd's video. I'll be checking out your suggestions. Thank You.

 

perhaps this might help you decide

 

http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2012/01/fiio-e10-dac.html

[asickduckie]

So.. you're putting down Fiio for Behringer? 

Behringer dacs and amps look like pooh, but they're fantastic for the money (29$)

 

 

I really was avoiding the Fiio brand myself because I got the impression that its just a popular cheap brand. I just kept seeing reviews and forums that referenced it so I started leaning towards it. I only knew about Audioengine by mkbhd's video. I'll be checking out your suggestions. Thank You.

Otherwise I can probably recommend the schiit modi, which should be a great dac considering schiit is a fantastic brand. It also looks quite nice unlike the behringers.

[ProfoundDisputes]

 

perhaps this might help you decide

 

http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2012/01/fiio-e10-dac.html

Yes I read that article to the best of my ability about 3 hours ago haha I am not sure if it convinced me. What about the AudioEngine D1 or other alternatives? I am kinda looking to make sure I haven't missed some great alternative within my price range.

[ShearMe]

The Audioengine D1's amp wont drive headphones as well as the FiiO E10. The D1 is a DAC meant to work alongside audioengine's other components, and the headphone port is a convenient monitor, but not really meant to be used solely for headphones.

 

We recommend the E10 so much because it is the cheapest thing out there which doesn't suck. You can buy slightly better performing stuff, but you likely wont hear any improvement. You can buy stuff with better build quality, but the E10 is durable enough for normal use to not warrant such an expenditure.

 

Fioos are generally cheap crap (not bad for the price, but not good amps).. At a low price like that, I would get the topping tp30 or a cheap behringer instead.

 

So.. you're putting down Fiio for Behringer? 

 

Or fucking Topping???? I mean, if someone's got bookshelf speakers as well I'm sure they're a nice all-in-one solution, but they're speaker amps first and foremost.

 

Behringer dacs and amps look like pooh, but they're fantastic for the money (29$)

 

 

Otherwise I can probably recommend the schiit modi, which should be a great dac considering schiit is a fantastic brand. It also looks quite nice unlike the behringers.

 

Funny, because "fantastic for the money" is exactly why FiiO is such a popular brand, and exactly why we don't recommend Schiit around here.  :rolleyes:

[ProfoundDisputes]

Behringer dacs and amps look like pooh, but they're fantastic for the money (29$)

 

 

Otherwise I can probably recommend the schiit modi, which should be a great dac considering schiit is a fantastic brand. It also looks quite nice unlike the behringers.

I looked at the schiit modi but I was pretty sure that it's only a DAC without an amp. I have 250ohm 990's I was worried about driving them.

Plus it only has RCA plugs as far as I can tell, I would prefer to not have to add splitters and other adapters.

[ShearMe]

I looked at the schiit modi but I was pretty sure that it's only a DAC without an amp. I have 250ohm 990's I was worried about driving them.

Plus it only has RCA plugs as far as I can tell, I would prefer to not have to add splitters and other adapters.

 

Affirmative - the Modi is just a DAC.

[asickduckie]

I looked at the schiit modi but I was pretty sure that it's only a DAC without an amp. I have 250ohm 990's I was worried about driving them.

Plus it only has RCA plugs as far as I can tell, I would prefer to not have to add splitters and other adapters.

oops.. definitely not recommended for 250ohm headphones. You would have to get both he modi and the magni in that case, so you would be better off buying another brand.

[helping]

we don't recommend Schiit around here.  :rolleyes:

oh the puns that this name causes by accident in so many cases

[ProfoundDisputes]

The Audioengine D1's amp wont drive headphones as well as the FiiO E10. The D1 is a DAC meant to work alongside audioengine's other components, and the headphone port is a convenient monitor, but not really meant to be used solely for headphones.

 

We recommend the E10 so much because it is the cheapest thing out there which doesn't suck. You can buy slightly better performing stuff, but you likely wont hear any improvement. You can buy stuff with better build quality, but the E10 is durable enough for normal use to not warrant such an expenditure.

 

 

 

Or fucking Topping???? I mean, if someone's got bookshelf speakers as well I'm sure they're a nice all-in-one solution, but they're speaker amps first and foremost.

 

 

Funny, because "fantastic for the money" is exactly why FiiO is such a popular brand, and exactly why we don't recommend Schiit around here.  :rolleyes:

Ya I have seen multiple forums and such with people asking about price rang alternative for Fiio E10 and they were all like 'no'. 

The guy did mention "topping tp30", with some research they appear have received good reception.  Any thoughts?

[ProfoundDisputes]

oops skipped over your "fucking topping" quote. I guess that explains that haha

[ProfoundDisputes]

The Audioengine D1's amp wont drive headphones as well as the FiiO E10. The D1 is a DAC meant to work alongside audioengine's other components, and the headphone port is a convenient monitor, but not really meant to be used solely for headphones.

 

We recommend the E10 so much because it is the cheapest thing out there which doesn't suck. You can buy slightly better performing stuff, but you likely wont hear any improvement. You can buy stuff with better build quality, but the E10 is durable enough for normal use to not warrant such an expenditure.

 

 

 

Or fucking Topping???? I mean, if someone's got bookshelf speakers as well I'm sure they're a nice all-in-one solution, but they're speaker amps first and foremost.

 

 

Funny, because "fantastic for the money" is exactly why FiiO is such a popular brand, and exactly why we don't recommend Schiit around here.  :rolleyes:

"You can buy slightly better performing stuff, but you likely wont hear any improvement."

What do you mean by "better performing", I want to know what I will be paying for if I go beyond Fiio E10. What other options are there? I often figure out other options other than mainstream stuff in other electronics so I want to make sure I am being thorough. I might be satisfied with Fiio E10 but perhaps I will be missing out on something even better due to the chanting of well know stuff.

[helping]

 

"You can buy slightly better performing stuff, but you likely wont hear any improvement."

What do you mean by "better performing", I want to know what I will be paying for if I go beyond Fiio E10. What other options are there? I often figure out other options other than mainstream stuff in other electronics so I want to make sure I am being thorough. I might be satisfied with Fiio E10 but perhaps I will be missing out on something even better due to the chanting of well know stuff.

 

Beyond the e10 I wouldn't say there is that much more captivating on the market. The next step up would be an o2

GOOD LORD WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THIS FORUM TODAY aeirhjaedhaehfBUGS

[mr moose]

"You can buy slightly better performing stuff, but you likely wont hear any improvement."

What do you mean by "better performing", I want to know what I will be paying for if I go beyond Fiio E10. What other options are there? I often figure out other options other than mainstream stuff in other electronics so I want to make sure I am being thorough. I might be satisfied with Fiio E10 but perhaps I will be missing out on something even better due to the chanting of well know stuff.

 

If you want to hear the difference between an e10 and "anything better" you will need to spend some pretty peso's ($350+) for decent headphones, otherwise it will be a stretch. 

[mr moose]

  

Beyond the e10 I wouldn't say there is that much more captivating on the market. The next step up would be an o2

GOOD LORD WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THIS FORUM TODAY aeirhjaedhaehfBUGS

delete your cookies, there was a bug and it apparently effected those.

[ShearMe]

"You can buy slightly better performing stuff, but you likely wont hear any improvement."

What do you mean by "better performing", I want to know what I will be paying for if I go beyond Fiio E10. What other options are there? I often figure out other options other than mainstream stuff in other electronics so I want to make sure I am being thorough. I might be satisfied with Fiio E10 but perhaps I will be missing out on something even better due to the chanting of well know stuff.

 

I mean it wont be better performing anywhere in your budget.

 

The O2 amp is probably the best amp you can get, and it should be in your budget, but it's just an amp and the form factor isn't very convenient for desktop use. I really wish there were more good options for cheap desktop DACs/amps, but that's just the way the cookie crumbles. 

[t0wer]

as far as the beyer's are concerned

you are using 250ohm headphones.(1/8 of 250 is around 31ohm)

the z is at 22ohm output impedance

 

you shouldn't notice any difference with a different dac/amp(assuming they are operating correctly)

 

 

the m50's are another story

but if they are secondary to the beyers, I probably wouldn't bother upgrading.

[EmoRarity]

oh the puns that this name causes by accident in so many cases

Its funny because the way the name sounds is directly correlated to the quality of their products.

And duck dude that tends to talk out of his Schiithole. 

http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2012/01/fiio-e10-dac.html

[ProfoundDisputes]

If you want to hear the difference between an e10 and "anything better" you will need to spend some pretty peso's ($350+) for decent headphones, otherwise it will be a stretch.

So you think that the dt990pros and the m50s are not decent headphones? I think your insinuating that to hear more in higher quality dacs you would need very high end headphones, which makes sense.

Just in case though the m50s and the dt990s are "decent" headphones if not better than decent.

[ProfoundDisputes]

Its funny because the way the name sounds is directly correlated to the quality of their products.

And duck dude that tends to talk out of his Schiithole. 

http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2012/01/fiio-e10-dac.html

I never understood why people must try to burn somebody via insults in order to prove a point. I do not approve of people that insult people simply because they have a difference of opinion. You may think (along with others) that schiit is a bad brand but its no reason to insult the person suggesting it. If you want to convince somebody of something damaging/insulting their character is not the way to do it. You will only put them in a blindly defensive position.

[ProfoundDisputes]

as far as the beyer's are concerned

you are using 250ohm headphones.(1/8 of 250 is around 31ohm)

the z is at 22ohm output impedance

 

you shouldn't notice any difference with a different dac/amp(assuming they are operating correctly)

 

 

the m50's are another story

but if they are secondary to the beyers, I probably wouldn't bother upgrading.

So your tell me that the only thing that determines sound quality is output impedance? I find that hard to believe.

Also its still worth it to me since the difference between ASIO drivers and the standard drivers is very noticeable. Like I stated above I can't have asio driver selected as a output in musicbee(or any other program) if I want to hear sound for chrome, mpc, windows notifications and etc..

[EmoRarity]

I never understood why people must try to burn somebody via insults in order to prove a point. I do not approve of people that insult people simply because they have a difference of opinion. You may think (along with others) that schiit is a bad brand but its no reason to insult the person suggesting it. If you want to convince somebody of something damaging/insulting their character is not the way to do it. You will only put them in a blindly defensive position.

And I...will do as I please. 

[mr moose]

So you think that the dt990pros and the m50s are not decent headphones? I think your insinuating that to hear more in higher quality dacs you would need very high end headphones, which makes sense.

Just in case though the m50s and the dt990s are "decent" headphones if not better than decent.

 

No, they are decent, just not good enough to hear the noise floor of the amp, If you had the K102 you probably hear the difference between the e10 and o2 but not m50s, I can't speak for the dt990 pros.

 

So your tell me that the only thing that determines sound quality is output impedance? I find that hard to believe.

Also its still worth it to me since the difference between ASIO drivers and the standard drivers is very noticeable. Like I stated above I can't have asio driver selected as a output in musicbee(or any other program) if I want to hear sound for chrome, mpc, windows notifications and etc..

 

He's not saying it's the only thing, but that it is the major thing, becasue that effects frequency response which is otherwise flat across nearly every amp/sound card.  Until you start spending major cash on amps and headphones (i say around $300+ ) then there are few options for good sound and 99% of the time the only difference in SQ between those options comes down to impedance.