What is better: i5 8600k or i7 8700(non-k) for 1440p gaming?

[Verrm]

Hi guys!

I'm thinking about those two processors and I'm not sure what is better for gaming? I'm thinking 1440p 144hz with 1080Ti. Please help!

Which one is better - overclocked i5 8600k to 4.8-4.9Ghz or i7 8700 (obviously) at stock?

By better I mean performance+future proofing. Let's assume that i7 8700 would run at full turbo speeds (no thermal bottlenecks).

I don't want to bring price argument to the table - this will change soon and is a tough discussion with different prices in different countries and non-Z mobos coming soon.

 

Let me know what you think! 

[Moress]

8600k

[Projex]

I5 100%

[Morgan MLGman]

I'd choose an i7-8700 and run it at its max turbo speed. @Princess Cadence

[Damascus]

Get an asus board with MCE and the 8700 will run at 4.6ghz, thus kicking the i5 out the door in performance

[xg32]

8700, save on heatsink, ram, psu, motherboard, i have my 8600k running at 1.45v just to justify my buyer's remorse.

[Verrm]

4 minutes ago, Damascus said:

Get an asus board with MCE and the 8700 will run at 4.6ghz, thus kicking the i5 out the door in performance

Good point, didn't remember about MCE even though it made quite a noise in benchmarking early on with Coffee Lake.

[xg32]

Just now, Verrm said:

Good point, didn't remember about MCE even though it made quite a noise in benchmarking early on with Coffee Lake.

you could also turn the blk to 102 and make it 4.7 i think. I really think the 8700 was a mistake (good for us), 4.6 boost compared to 4.0 on the i5 8400.

[Verrm]

3 minutes ago, xg32 said:

you could also turn the blk to 102 and make it 4.7 i think. I really think the 8700 was a mistake (good for us), 4.6 boost compared to 4.0 on the i5 8400.

Really that is what it really makes a good question that I ask here I think. One thing though - do you need a special z370 to up blk to 102?

[xg32]

8 minutes ago, Verrm said:

Really that is what it really makes a good question that I ask here I think. One thing though - do you need a special z370 to up blk to 102?

you should be able to increase the blk on almost every board, the cheapest board ur looking for with MCE is asus prime-A, I personally haven't use that board but it never came up when i was looking at the LLC problems when buying my motherboards.

 

this is from a reddit post on blk overclocking on non-k coffee lake cpus 

 

"The best you can get out of it is 102.5 MHz"

[Nicnac]

wow 50-50 rn lol

[xg32]

forgot to add, if ryzen 2 which comes out in february*, even sniffs 4.5ghz with 6c/12t the 8600k will be in the garbage can. (i got mine on sale so max loss is about  200usd, still)

[Princess Luna]

47 minutes ago, Morgan MLGman said:

I'd choose an i7-8700 and run it at its max turbo speed. @Princess Cadence

The i7 8700 is so good that I managed to sell my current system for a profit and instead of going back to the i7 8700k this time I have ordered the locked i7 8700 out of blind faith for it

 

And to save 100 bucks

[Verrm]

3 minutes ago, Princess Cadence said:

The i7 8700 is so good that I managed to sell my current system for a profit and instead of going back to the i7 8700k this time I have ordered the locked i7 8700 out of blind faith for it

 

And to save 100 bucks

Do you think you'll be able to run with MCE on at 4.3GHz or at 4.6GHz on all cores?

[Princess Luna]

33 minutes ago, Verrm said:

Do you think you'll be able to run with MCE on at 4.3GHz or at 4.6GHz on all cores?

Even if you don't there is no difference, you're playing at 1440p right? at this resolution the i7 8700 or i7 8700k Stock actually even outperforms the i7 8700k at 5ghz:

 

already set the time for you, watch the benchmarks and hear the commentaries, we're heading an era where overclocking is not as important as it used to be, because now we have full 6 cores to play with and games A LOT more optimized for multi-threading.

 

The gold about getting the locked i7 8700 is that now you can cheap up on motherboard as VRMs and what not won't matter, you also can cheap up on cooling as the Cooler Master 212X is quiet and sufficient for it... no need to delid it and lose your warranty to achieve 5ghz... I mean over all it is a much better deal, same performance for less hassle and less costing.

[Verrm]

8 minutes ago, Princess Cadence said:

Even if you don't there is no difference, you're playing at 1440p right? at this resolution the i7 8700 or i7 8700k Stock actually even outperforms the i7 8700k at 5ghz:

 

already set the time for you, watch the benchmarks and hear the commentaries, we're heading an era where overclocking is not as important as it used to be, because now we have full 6 cores to play with and games A LOT more optimized for multi-threading.

 

The gold about getting the locked i7 8700 is that now you can cheap up on motherboard as VRMs and what not won't matter, you also can cheap up on cooling as the Cooler Master 212X is quiet and sufficient for it... no need to delid it and lose your warranty to achieve 5ghz... I mean over all it is a much better deal, same performance for less hassle and less costing.

Whew, very interesting. I think I might just go with 8700 and get a cheaper board and cooling. It does make sense: should be more future-proof with 12 cores and the performance at 1440p might not matter at this performance level as it seems in video that it is mostly gpu-bottlenecked situation. Evident seeing ryzen performing so well in comparison. Thanks man, very eye-opening! I now see why you sold your 8700k, what a waste of money it is!

[Princess Luna]

Just now, Verrm said:

!

Oh thank you so much for the kind words ^^ I'm a girl by the way haha but still appreciate it as not many do so.

 

I have been defending along side @Morgan MLGman that the locked i7 offers more value since the i5 6600k vs i7 6700 days, this is back then as games finally started fully utilizing at least all 4 cores having just 4c/4t would result in 100% usages and no room for system resources and side stuff...

 

The main issue with it is the very low minimums, this is the most important thing in gaming way more important than average because those micro-freezes, the stuttering that really breaks immersion in the game is caused when these minimums are too low, your eye and brain captures the sudden decrease in frames even if it stays above 60 should it go like 144 all the way down to 60 all of sudden.

 

Since the i7 6700 had hyper-threading it did alleviated it and gave more breathing room so its minimums were much superior even if averages were the same.

 

Now people back then concerned on overclocking as a future proofing method like before didn't count with one simple thing, Intel raising the core count, it's obvious, there is simply no denying more cores when they are the best cores available will be better.

 

The i7 7700 vs i7 7700k they are quite equal, at stock it is identical, overclocked well you have a couple extra frames... but now both are barely on pair with the i5 8400 entry level to mid end... it is pathetic, thinking in a future more powerful GTX 2080 Ti if your i7 7700 is at 4gh or 5gh there will be bottlenecks all around just the same you'll be in need for an upgrade just the same... so much for futuring proofing on a platform.

 

Therefore instead of spending heavy money on a Asus Maximus and get the overclockable i7 the actual better proofing yourself is getting the h110 and an i7 7700 you spend less you make reselling it easier because you also can ask less for it and you get a free path to beyond... and mind you had more powerful system than one with the overclocked i5.

 

Having all that in mind I think that the i5 8600k is in a difficult selling position, it is enough for todays high end GPUs like the 1080 Ti since even the cheaper i5 8400 equals an i7 7700k so it is plenty... but the GTX 2080 Ti will already have 6cores mainstream for both Intel and AMD they will optimize it so the i7 8700k with Hyper-Threading and high frequency can show how much faster it is to an i5 8400...

 

If you want to think of tomorrows graphics card you will need Hyper Threading and every thing again, the i5 8600k makes no sense it is realistically speaking the same as an i5 8400 for so much more expensive and just around you have the the i7 8700 fastest CPU in the world sitting? I say it is a no brainer.

Cheers!

 

 

[xg32]

if you do end up getting the 8700, MCE will bump the voltage up to 1.35v automatically, i think the worst 8700k will be 4.7 on 1.3v, since you'll be using a cheaper cooler, there's a considerable difference between 1.3 and 1.35 in temps.

 

Personally, I still think the 8700k is a viable option, but man that last 400mhz is expensive lol. (next build for me is probably august, things will change by then)

[Verrm]

43 minutes ago, Princess Cadence said:

!

 

 

Sorry heh, somehow didn't expect a girl here, but I think you're already kinda used to it (sad but true)  My wife is not so interested in this stuff, she turns on her "half-listening" face when I start talking about this  

 

Either way you made a very fair point that while 8700 should be able to leverage most of the 2080Ti performance, the 8600k might be lacking in cores.

 

I think this is an issue with us enthusiasts thinking that overclocking/higher clocks = fun & performance. Tinkering is deep in us and when you got locked CPU you sometimes feel like the fun is somewhere else. Also we grew thinking that higher clocks = higher performance. Especially 4.3Ghz vs possibly 5.0GHz, as in this situation. While it is mostly truth in this case it's about cores. And intel through last years taught us that we always get the same cores and there is no reason to consider them.

 

I think I personally will wait until Feb/March and hopefully there will be B-series and H-series motherboards available. Unless by then AMD will blow Intel away with new Ryzens. Curious times we live in

[Princess Luna]

2 minutes ago, Verrm said:

H-series

h310 + i7 8700 certainly will be a killer deal, 2666mhz for memory frequency shouldn't be bad at all.

 

Ryzen+ might keep competition spiced up, whatever way you decide to go it will certain give you good performance, a shame not being able to wait all the way to August~September for the 10nm 8c/16t i7 9700k now that processor is going to swipe the floor even with current i9's ^^

 

I wish you good luck with the build planning and all, cheers!

[Verrm]

2 minutes ago, Princess Cadence said:

h310 + i7 8700 certainly will be a killer deal, 2666mhz for memory frequency shouldn't be bad at all.

 

Ryzen+ might keep competition spiced up, whatever way you decide to go it will certain give you good performance, a shame not being able to wait all the way to August~September for the 10nm 8c/16t i7 9700k now that processor is going to swipe the floor even with current i9's ^^

 

I wish you good luck with the build planning and all, cheers!

To be honest I'm not that certain about this 10nm cpus. I heard that currently their 10nm performs worse then their 14nm ffn++. So I think that their first 10nm cpu lineup will be performing better purely because they will have more cores, lower power draw, and less heat generated. I suspect we'll have to wait till 10nm+ for a nice bump in performance. 10nm will bring major difference mainly to laptop market. The i7-9500U might be a game-changer, finally making the U cpus capable ones for gaming. Small ultrabooks with i7-9500U, very efficient in office tasks, once hooked up to docking station with GPU via thunderbolt will turn into gaming beasts. They even might hold the Vega iGPUs for some on-the-go playing. My dream  

[xg32]

1 hour ago, Verrm said:

To be honest I'm not that certain about this 10nm cpus. I heard that currently their 10nm performs worse then their 14nm ffn++. So I think that their first 10nm cpu lineup will be performing better purely because they will have more cores, lower power draw, and less heat generated. I suspect we'll have to wait till 10nm+ for a nice bump in performance. 10nm will bring major difference mainly to laptop market. The i7-9500U might be a game-changer, finally making the U cpus capable ones for gaming. Small ultrabooks with i7-9500U, very efficient in office tasks, once hooked up to docking station with GPU via thunderbolt will turn into gaming beasts. They even might hold the Vega iGPUs for some on-the-go playing. My dream  

i always skip the node changes. Might be different this time though with monitors, cpus, video cards coming out all at once, im ready to throw out the z370+8600k next year if the refreshes are all good, but looking at the zen 1 max clocks+skylake x+coffee lake temps doesn't exactly instill confidence. It's also clear that coffee lake+skylake x was rushed due to pressure from ryzen, and the 10xx gpus are getting old.

[Verrm]

Oh man I see the fight is pretty rough in the poll  It looks like it might be a general problem in understanding which cpu is better for us.

[simonh2159]

On 09/12/2017 at 7:30 PM, Princess Cadence said:

Oh thank you so much for the kind words ^^ I'm a girl by the way haha but still appreciate it as not many do so.

 

I have been defending along side @Morgan MLGman that the locked i7 offers more value since the i5 6600k vs i7 6700 days, this is back then as games finally started fully utilizing at least all 4 cores having just 4c/4t would result in 100% usages and no room for system resources and side stuff...

 

The main issue with it is the very low minimums, this is the most important thing in gaming way more important than average because those micro-freezes, the stuttering that really breaks immersion in the game is caused when these minimums are too low, your eye and brain captures the sudden decrease in frames even if it stays above 60 should it go like 144 all the way down to 60 all of sudden.

 

Since the i7 6700 had hyper-threading it did alleviated it and gave more breathing room so its minimums were much superior even if averages were the same.

 

Now people back then concerned on overclocking as a future proofing method like before didn't count with one simple thing, Intel raising the core count, it's obvious, there is simply no denying more cores when they are the best cores available will be better.

 

The i7 7700 vs i7 7700k they are quite equal, at stock it is identical, overclocked well you have a couple extra frames... but now both are barely on pair with the i5 8400 entry level to mid end... it is pathetic, thinking in a future more powerful GTX 2080 Ti if your i7 7700 is at 4gh or 5gh there will be bottlenecks all around just the same you'll be in need for an upgrade just the same... so much for futuring proofing on a platform.

 

Therefore instead of spending heavy money on a Asus Maximus and get the overclockable i7 the actual better proofing yourself is getting the h110 and an i7 7700 you spend less you make reselling it easier because you also can ask less for it and you get a free path to beyond... and mind you had more powerful system than one with the overclocked i5.

 

Having all that in mind I think that the i5 8600k is in a difficult selling position, it is enough for todays high end GPUs like the 1080 Ti since even the cheaper i5 8400 equals an i7 7700k so it is plenty... but the GTX 2080 Ti will already have 6cores mainstream for both Intel and AMD they will optimize it so the i7 8700k with Hyper-Threading and high frequency can show how much faster it is to an i5 8400...

 

If you want to think of tomorrows graphics card you will need Hyper Threading and every thing again, the i5 8600k makes no sense it is realistically speaking the same as an i5 8400 for so much more expensive and just around you have the the i7 8700 fastest CPU in the world sitting? I say it is a no brainer.

Cheers!

 

 

Hi, very interesting reading your experiences . I have 8600k it’s good cpu but falters a bit when multitasking , but only a bit , 8700 I agree if I’d thought of that I may very well gone with it . Maybe still might . One thing I’ve noticed with coffee lake is heat output has increased on z370 vrms and on the cpu ! Airflow and case choice plus cooling choice is critical with a coffee lake build , not always nessary to go for water cooled but of cause it does make sense.having said that I’m on air and got very acceptable temps with a Noctua n12 ah , it’s a horizontal design really menu for small case form factor builds , but having two horizontal fans air is pushed out over memory and board vrms which helps cool cpu and all surrounding components. Only downside is if covers memory slots so have to choose memory modules carefully! But most are ok . I need a newer gpu as I have an r9 280 !! But it seems to handle most games ok for me at 1080 . Planning getting a 1080 in the near future or the 2080 . But I need also a new monitor. So will have to save up a bit I think !!!! 

[simonh2159]

Motherboard Msi Sli plus  8600k