Buisness/Home server network soloutions?

[TheNuzziNuzz]

My parents run a business that consists of 5 desktop machines that are all managed by a relatively old Dell Poweredge running Windows Small Business Server 2012. There Is a 2tb raid 1 shared as network storage where they store all the files. They work with a tech company that wants to charge them $1200 USD to "Untangle the machines from the server" and move there files to SharePoint. Which to me, seems like way to much. So as an alternative, I am thinking about getting two identical servers with 4+tb of raid, one at there home, and one at the business. And do the type of thing linus did a while back and have the home and server sync creating an offsite backup for both the home and the business. The business computers would store there files on the new NAS and the home computers would backup to the NAS. I feel this would be cheaper than going to SharePoint, and would allow them to work regardless of internet conditions. Plus they get an offsite backup both at there home and business. The idea is that it costs less the $150/mo for SharePoint, and find a way around the "Untangling Fee." I'm not experienced in real world business examples, but ive created NAS like soloutions at my house before. What could the "Untangling" fee actually be for, and is it something I could do myself? I imagine its just creating locla logins for each computer. Any suggestions about having two local NASs rather than just using SharePoint or some other External file sharing/backup system?

 

I hope I was clear in my writing above. How have you guys handled similar situations? Do you have an in home NAS?

[Lurick]

I have all my files backed up to a central NAS and then the important stuff backed up offsite using CrashPlan, allows me and the family to backup to a single point and I only need a single CrashPlan subscription.

[TheNuzziNuzz]

7 minutes ago, Lurick said:

I have all my files backed up to a central NAS and then the important stuff backed up offsite using CrashPlan, allows me and the family to backup to a single point and I only need a single CrashPlan subscription.

What is your central NAS soloution? Is it at the business or home?

[Lurick]

Just now, TheNuzziNuzz said:

What is your central NAS soloution? Is it at the business or home?

I use a QNAP TS-831-X with 8 WD Red 5TBs plus two M.2 SSDs for cache drive and a Dell R620 for Plex and Crashplan. I mounted the drives through the R620 since CrashPlan needs a non-ARM processor to run. It's at home for me but I backup my work stuff to it as well.

[TheNuzziNuzz]

Just now, Lurick said:

I use a QNAP TS-831-X with 8 WD Red 5TBs plus two M.2 SSDs for cache drive and a Dell R620 for Plex and Crashplan. I mounted the drives through the R620 since CrashPlan needs a non-ARM processor to run. It's at home for me but I backup my work stuff to it as well.

Can you access Crashplan files from anywhere or is it just backup/restore? How could the NAS be setup to achieve something like SharePoint?

[burnsmorgan14]

If it's literally a file server, maybe the old power edge will do fine. If you are running out of space, you can always upgrade the storage on that server. If you use something like Crashplan with it as well, it would save the need to spend loads of money on 2 new servers. 

[Lurick]

1 minute ago, TheNuzziNuzz said:

Can you access Crashplan files from anywhere or is it just backup/restore? How could the NAS be setup to achieve something like SharePoint?

You can access the CrashPlan files from anywhere but it's more for a backup/restore situation. The NAS can probably be setup like SharePoint. What aspects are you looking for the most from SharePoint?

[TheNuzziNuzz]

Just now, burnsmorgan14 said:

If it's literally a file server, maybe the old power edge will do fine. If you are running out of space, you can always upgrade the storage on that server. If you use something like Crashplan with it as well, it would save the need to spend loads of money on 2 new servers. 

The tech company who wants to "Untangle" the machines has told my parents the server is "On its last legs" claiming it took 4 hours to startup after an outage. How you think simply getting a boot SSD and new hard drives could improve this? From my experience the hardware is fine, its just sluggish software performance.

[manikyath]

as an employee of a consultancy company that works with MUCH higher budgets than you just mentioned, i see where said company is coming from, and what they missed.

 

what i'd recommend is if the network is getting rather questionable, replace it with small buisiness gear (something like linksys would do great).

and as for the server.. replacing the dell poweredge is gonna cost WAY more than $1200, with solutions like office 365 being VERY dependant on your uplink speed. i'd recommend a budget of $2-4000 for a new server you can expect to last, and for an off-site backup solution.. have you looked into freenas? they have firts party products ranging from small home solutions all the way up to multi-100TB storage servers.

[TheNuzziNuzz]

2 minutes ago, Lurick said:

You can access the CrashPlan files from anywhere but it's more for a backup/restore situation. The NAS can probably be setup like SharePoint. What aspects are you looking for the most from SharePoint?

The only reason they are thinking about moving to sharepoint is because the Tech Company they use is pushing them to do it. Now that you have suggested Crashplan to backup the existing server, I don't think there will be an issue as they will still be able to manager there files as they do now with network drives. As for what they do, simply editing office document/excel files on a server. Sharepoint would just be offsite, and less prone to data loss. If anything, it would probably impede there workflow.

[manikyath]

3 minutes ago, TheNuzziNuzz said:

The tech company who wants to "Untangle" the machines has told my parents the server is "On its last legs" claiming it took 4 hours to startup after an outage. How you think simply getting a boot SSD and new hard drives could improve this? From my experience the hardware is fine, its just sluggish software performance.

4 hours? they're exaggerating. i sense a certain amount of cowboy work here.

[burnsmorgan14]

Just now, TheNuzziNuzz said:

The tech company who wants to "Untangle" the machines has told my parents the server is "On its last legs" claiming it took 4 hours to startup after an outage. How you think simply getting a boot SSD and new hard drives could improve this? From my experience the hardware is fine, its just sluggish software performance.

Do you know the spec of the server? Maybe the tech company are just trying to get more money out of you? It would only be beneficial to put a boot SSD into the server if you are regularly going to be powering the server on and off, as this would only help the boot performance. The only logical answer that I can think of for a server to take 4 hours to boot up after an outage is that sudden power loss has corrupted system files and those have had to be repaired. To stop that from happening again, you could invest in a UPS that communicates with the server to shut it down when UPS power is low.

[Lurick]

Just now, TheNuzziNuzz said:

The only reason they are thinking about moving to sharepoint is because the Tech Company they use is pushing them to do it. Now that you have suggested Crashplan to backup the existing server, I don't think there will be an issue as they will still be able to manager there files as they do now with network drives. As for what they do, simply editing office document/excel files on a server. Sharepoint would just be offsite, and less prone to data loss. If anything, it would probably impede there workflow.

Ah, yah. If they just need a central point for file work then a NAS and offsite CrashPlan backup is much easier. Couple that with Rsync or similar to mirror the files between the home and business and you're good to go.

[TheNuzziNuzz]

20 minutes ago, burnsmorgan14 said:

Do you know the spec of the server? Maybe the tech company are just trying to get more money out of you? It would only be beneficial to put a boot SSD into the server if you are regularly going to be powering the server on and off, as this would only help the boot performance. The only logical answer that I can think of for a server to take 4 hours to boot up after an outage is that sudden power loss has corrupted system files and those have had to be repaired. To stop that from happening again, you could invest in a UPS that communicates with the server to shut it down when UPS power is low.

No I don't know the specs at the moment. As for the corrupt file system, how could that be repaired? Could I copy the important files to portable drives, wipe and reinstall, then copy the files back? What do you think they mean by "Untangle"?

[burnsmorgan14]

The corrupt system would have occurred when the system went down. This can be repaired through Windows installation media, which is what they would have done to bring the system back online. 

 

I would recommend backing up all data to removable media, formatting and reinstalling the operating system anyway.

 

With regards to "untangling" the server, they would have probably just backed up all data and reinstalled anyway, not too sure on what they meant because I don't know how "tangled" the server is. 

[Lurick]

3 minutes ago, TheNuzziNuzz said:

No I don't know the specs at the moment. As for the corrupt file system, how could that be repaired? Could I copy the important files to portable drives, wipe and reinstall, then copy the files back? What do you think they mean by "Untangle"?

"Untangle" = Separate you from your files and your money from your wallet, lol.

[burnsmorgan14]

From your original post, where you say that the computers are managed by the server, it sounds to me like the SBS is acting as a domain controller and the computers are all joined to the domain. If the company is small, you probably won't be benefiting from the domain environment. But be aware that if you are in a domained environment, you will need to be careful to see if you have any folder redirection policies for folders such as Desktop and Documents. 

[TheNuzziNuzz]

37 minutes ago, burnsmorgan14 said:

From your original post, where you say that the computers are managed by the server, it sounds to me like the SBS is acting as a domain controller and the computers are all joined to the domain. If the company is small, you probably won't be benefiting from the domain environment. But be aware that if you are in a domained environment, you will need to be careful to see if you have any folder redirection policies for folders such as Desktop and Documents. 

Yes, that is my understanding of what it is. I think by untagle they mean removing the machines from the domain so users would log in localy, which I think makes more sense for a small business as such with only 6 machines total. How do I disable SBS and setup local logins?

[burnsmorgan14]

4 minutes ago, TheNuzziNuzz said:

Yes, that is my understanding of what it is. I think by untagle they mean removing the machines from the domain so users would log in localy, which I think makes more sense for a small business as such with only 6 machines total. How do I disable SBS and setup local logins?

Windows 10:

 

Log into each computer as and Administrator, right click on Start menu and click on System.

If you've got the new creators update, you have to scroll down and click on System Info to get the old System page

Then click on Change Settings in the "Computer Name, domain and workgroup settings section"

Then select Change next to "To rename this computer or change its domain or workgroup, click change"

 

Then under "Member Of" change the box from Domain to Workgroup and just type WORKGROUP into the box. 

 

Click Ok on the boxes opened and restart the system

 

NOTE: You will need to know the local admin password for the computers

[burnsmorgan14]

It's the same process on Windows 8/8.1 and for 7 you need to click on start and then right click on Computer and then Properties and then you can pick up from step 3 above

[Lurick]

2 minutes ago, burnsmorgan14 said:

It's the same process on Windows 8/8.1 and for 7 you need to click on start and then right click on Computer and then Properties and then you can pick up from step 3 above

Another option is to use a program called ProfWiz.

It will take care of all the profile hooks in the background and migration for you  

[burnsmorgan14]

Just now, Lurick said:

Another option is to use a program called ProfWiz.

It will take care of all the profile hooks in the background and migration for you  

Not heard of that one before, thanks I will take a look into it!