Modular Graphics Cards

[Damascus]

1 minute ago, tom_w141 said:

-snip-

Thanks for filling me in on the shady history there, pretty informative.  And yeah, I wasn't sure if the 1080 ti was a bad choice of examples as it could be used as a "hey, they can sell a titan for half price" kind of thing.  

 

3 minutes ago, tom_w141 said:

Sucker Punch 2: Launching a new Titan Xp 3 months after that at the price you paid for your Titan XP which at the time was advertised as the pinnacle of the pascal architecture but turned out to be a lie and it was held back the whole time so they could release the real Titan Xp a year on.

 

Totally agree thats shady AF and pretty scummy on Nvidias side

[Zando_]

30 minutes ago, tom_w141 said:

People just go "Right i need a gpu and i've got $150, which nvidia gpu can I get for that? Ah the 1050Ti ok i'll take that one"

No comment.

[App4that]

1 minute ago, H0R53 said:

We're getting off point now.

Modularity comes from wanting a specific thing when it doesn't readily exist - say I buy a modular GPU with 2GB of GDDR5 and a 1000mhz core for $100. Expensive for the performance, but I can readily keep upgrading the memory and the core until it's phased out by the company, like my motherboard. I had an i5 3330. Didn't have the performance I wanted. So I saved and got a Xeon E3 1240. I had 6GB of RAM. Needed more. Saved and got 8GB.

You're missing the fact that would add to the size of the card itself. It would also add to the cost. 

[BloodyWaters]

Geez this exploded. My answer:

 

GPU manufacturers don't care about their customers and only care about money. 

[H0R53]

Just now, Damascus said:

Thanks for filling me in on the shady history there, pretty informative.  And yeah, I wasn't sure if the 1080 ti was a bad choice of examples as it could be used as a "hey, they can sell a titan for half price" kind of thing.  

 

Totally agree thats shady AF and pretty scummy on Nvidias side

Their pricing is stupid.

 

Just now, BloodyWaters said:

Geez this exploded. My answer:

 

GPU manufacturers don't care about their customers and only care about money. 

Their pricing is stupid. This is why I buy old shit like the GTX 580 - 1050ti performance for $70 less.

[manikyath]

Just now, H0R53 said:

2GB of GDDR5 and a 1000mhz core for $100

the base plate of this stuff wouldnt even be avaliable for $100..

 

look... my issue here is simple: every time i encounter you it's you once again making some ridiculous claims with a mountain of problems that you fail to acknowledge, and with the job you have in the past claimed to do, you should REALLY know exist in the first place. i'm not saying you're somehow mentally incapable, but you start to more and more sound like the electrician who today claimed that if the 8 wires connect trough between sockets, that cable is now magically capable of passing full gigabit speeds reliably.

[tom_w141]

1 minute ago, Damascus said:

Thanks for filling me in on the shady history there, pretty informative.  And yeah, I wasn't sure if the 1080 ti was a bad choice of examples as it could be used as a "hey, they can sell a titan for half price" kind of thing.  

 

Totally agree thats shady AF and pretty scummy on Nvidias side

But back to my original point. People really need to realise how serious the problem is or could be. If AMD has a better card at the same price but you don't but it anyway then that is 1 less sale that AMD has toward the next years GPU R&D. If this continues then the gap widens and widens until Nvidia has a monopoly as strong as Intel used to have.

 

Whats wrong with this? Well those huge gains you see for example from the 980Ti to the 1080Ti will stop. Why innovate when you no longer have to? Innovation costs money and a business will avoid cost if possible. If this monopoly happens you'll start seeing 5-10% gains per generation instead of the huge gains you see now. This is because Nvidia won't have anyone to beat and for us the consumer that is BAD. Remember Intel used to develop on a tick tock cycle until they no longer needed to? Well i'd bet my last penny that Intel's tick tock development cycle will return shortly  

 

Oh and I also expect Intel to be improving the awful thermal situation between their die and IHS very shortly also  Now that AMD is selling quality soldered chips as standard on processors that can seriously compete again...

[Zando_]

6 minutes ago, BloodyWaters said:

Geez this exploded. My answer:

 

GPU manufacturers don't care about their customers and only care about money. 

Not that simple. If they only care about money, they'll care about their customers. If they didn't care about their customers, they wouldn't have any money to care about in the first place. What's the reason so many people recommend EVGA*? Great customer service and a high quality product. To make money, you have to care about your customers. 

 

 

*First example that popped into my head. 

[manikyath]

Just now, Zando Bob said:

EVGA*? Great customer service and a high quality product.

in the USA, in europe they're not better than the rest of them. get a retailer with decent in-house policies if you wanna be covered

[Zando_]

1 minute ago, tom_w141 said:

But back to my original point. People really need to realise how serious the problem is or could be. If AMD has a better card at the same price but you don't but it anyway then that is 1 less sale that AMD has toward the next years GPU R&D. If this continues then the gap widens and widens until Nvidia has a monopoly as strong as Intel used to have.

 

Whats wrong with this? Well those huge gains you see for example from the 980Ti to the 1080Ti will stop. Why innovate when you no longer have to? Innovation costs money and a business will avoid cost if possible. If this monopoly happens you'll start seeing 5-10% gains per generation instead of the huge gains you see now. This is because Nvidia won't have anyone to beat and for us the consumer that is BAD. Remember Intel used to develop on a tick tock cycle until they no longer needed to? Well i'd bet my last penny that Intel's tick tock development cycle will return shortly  

 

Oh and I also expect Intel to be improving the awful thermal situation between their die and IHS very shortly also  Now that AMD is selling quality soldered chips as standard on processors that can seriously compete again...

^^^^ Good point. Any healthy economy will have good competition. That's why communist countries* generally suck. There isn't any competition, as everything is run by the government. No competition = no innovation = no growth = 

 

 

*Like, does North Korea innovate in anything interesting but nukes?

[H0R53]

3 minutes ago, manikyath said:

the base plate of this stuff wouldnt even be avaliable for $100..

 

look... my issue here is simple: every time i encounter you it's you once again making some ridiculous claims with a mountain of problems that you fail to acknowledge, and with the job you have in the past claimed to do, you should REALLY know exist in the first place. i'm not saying you're somehow mentally incapable, but you start to more and more sound like the electrician who today claimed that if the 8 wires connect trough between sockets, that cable is now magically capable of passing full gigabit speeds reliably.

I have Aspergers and often get distracted with other shit, I have GMail and like 8 other tabs open as well as music, youtube and Need for Speed, plus I just poured some frosted cheerios, and now this thread blew up.

 

My point is, yes, there are problems, but years ago they said it'd be impossible to pass 5GHz. Look at the 7700k. There are limitations but if something develops enough it can be possible.

 

My GTX 650 was about to be picked up by the trash men when I dug it out and tried to fix it for the last time. And now it works.

 

Persevere and the impossible gets that much closer.

 

I am extremely bad at logical thought like math. Magic makes more sense to me than clockworks do. Bad example.

 

But seriously, people need to give modularity a chance. It doesn't take off because people scrap their ideas too early, like I threw my 650 out too early and was almost too late. I have tons of ideas I hold onto just because it may be possible. For example my Precision build. Yeah it looks like shit now but give it time and it'll flesh itself out. That thing sat in a corner for months and I was even considering throwing it out because it took up too much space. Now it's in an mATX sized case and it's an E-ATX board!

[Damascus]

5 minutes ago, tom_w141 said:

But back to my original point. People really need to realise how serious the problem is or could be. If AMD has a better card at the same price but you don't but it anyway then that is 1 less sale that AMD has toward the next years GPU R&D. If this continues then the gap widens and widens until Nvidia has a monopoly as strong as Intel used to have.

 

Yeah, I've been waiting for Vega with baited breath.  If AMD can manage to beat the fps/dollar value of a 1070/1080 I will gladly buy one - its the partially same reason I'm strongly considering an R7 platform change

[tom_w141]

3 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

^^^^ Good point. Any healthy economy will have good competition. That's why communist countries* generally suck. There isn't any competition, as everything is run by the government. No competition = no innovation = no growth = 

 

 

*Like, does North Korea innovate in anything interesting but nukes?

They even do that badly. More chance of them nuking themselves than anyone else.

[manikyath]

1 minute ago, H0R53 said:

I have Aspergers and often get distracted with other shit,

join the club

[Damascus]

1 minute ago, H0R53 said:

My point is, yes, there are problems, but years ago they said it'd be impossible to pass 5GHz. Look at the 7700k. There are limitations but if something develops enough it can be possible.

 

Hasn't the 83XX series been hitting 5Ghz for years?

[Damascus]

yup.  Wow, 2011 was hopeful

 

"Speed. It's of paramount importance in evaluating any computer system, and the engine that gives your PC its get up and go is its CPU. The folks at AMD wanted to show off just how awesome (and fast) their new Bulldozer-based FX chips can be, and set a Guinness World Record for the "Highest Frequency of a Computer Processor" while they were at it. To get the record, a team of "elite overclocking specialists" cranked up the juice on an 8-core desktop CPU until hitting a speed of 8.429GHz -- handily surpassing the previous mark of 8.308GHz. So, AMD's got the fastest silicon in the west and it's chipping away at Intel's processor predominance. What say you, Chipzilla?"

 

https://www.engadget.com/2011/09/13/amd-gets-guiness-world-record-for-fastest-cpu-with-overclocked-o/

[H0R53]

1 minute ago, manikyath said:

join the club

I'd rather not.

1 minute ago, Damascus said:

Hasn't the 83XX series been hitting 5Ghz for years?

The AMD chips? Yeah, but I think it was a derivitive of Moore's law that said computer speeds can never pass 5ghz.

[tom_w141]

Just now, Damascus said:

Yeah, I've been waiting for Vega with baited breath.  If AMD can manage to beat the fps/dollar value of a 1070/1080 I will gladly buy one - its the partially same reason I'm strongly considering an R7 platform change

I hope vega is good too, not because I want to change my 1070 but just to keep nvidia on their toes

 

R7 platform is great and highly under rated imo. On the whole i see improvements with my 1700 over my 6700k especially in the smoothness, 1% and 0.1% frames and when streaming my 6700k used to drop frames like crazy whereas this 1700  is a beast. I couldn't recommend my cpu enough. I'm really happy AMD are back in the game and I hope they continue the forward momentum with Zen 2 and beyond. Competition is good for consumers no matter which company you buy from: fact.

[Damascus]

Just now, H0R53 said:

I'd rather not.

The AMD chips? Yeah, but I think it was a derivitive of Moore's law that said computer speeds can never pass 5ghz.

To circle back to your topic, I honestly think that when we hit the boundaries of shrinkage, but before we go smaller there will be a time when GPU's are modular due to the minuscule size of components.  HBM2 and tiny GPU dies could lead to the ability to set up something like that with minimal performance drops.  Probably get ready to pay the premium though, I doubt it will be cheaper for modular if it ever exists

[Damascus]

2 minutes ago, tom_w141 said:

R7 platform is great and highly under rated imo. On the whole i see improvements with my 1700 over my 6700k especially in the smoothness, 1% and 0.1% frames and when streaming my 6700k used to drop frames like crazy whereas this 1700  is a beast. I couldn't recommend my cpu enough. I'm really happy AMD are back in the game and I hope they continue the forward momentum with Zen 2 and beyond. Competition is good for consumers no matter which company you buy from: fact.

lol, same CPU change right here!  How high did you manage to OC?

[tom_w141]

Just now, Damascus said:

lol, same CPU change right here!  How high did you manage to OC?

4 at 1.4V See my guide in my sig for how I did my p states if you haven't done so already. Really good to do, lets it downclock and downvolt under light loads/idle. Which is good for cpu life, power consumption and heat generation.

[H0R53]

Just now, Damascus said:

To circle back to your topic, I honestly think that when we hit the boundaries of shrinkage, but before we go smaller there will be a time when GPU's are modular due to the minuscule size of components.  HBM2 and tiny GPU dies could lead to the ability to set up something like that with minimal performance drops.  Probably get ready to pay the premium though, I doubt it will be cheaper for modular if it ever exists

Probably Quadro prices for GTX specs, amirite? Actually gonna be a bit more.

Honestly size isn't a huge deal for me, I can fit 4 GTX 580s in my case along with 7 HDDs and a Cooler Master d92 cooler, along with 7 120mm fans.

 

1 minute ago, Damascus said:

lol, same CPU change right here!  How high did you manage to OC?

No offense but off topic

[Damascus]

Just now, H0R53 said:

4 GTX 580s

Do you actually quad sli 580's?  Do you have a 2000W PSU???

[tom_w141]

1 minute ago, H0R53 said:

Probably Quadro prices for GTX specs, amirite? Actually gonna be a bit more.

Honestly size isn't a huge deal for me, I can fit 4 GTX 580s in my case along with 7 HDDs and a Cooler Master d92 cooler, along with 7 120mm fans.

 

No offense but off topic

Most of our dialogue in this thread has been gpu related and more meaningful than the actual topic which tbh is rather silly and unlikely to happen as others have said. He asked 1 cpu related question geez  

 

Please don't reply to me I have no interest in discussing the thread topic, I have only remained here to reply to people replying to my posts within this thread.

[H0R53]

Just now, Damascus said:

Do you actually quad sli 580's?  Do you have a 2000W PSU???

No, I only have 600W, but they fit. It's my end goal but with three of them as they only support 3 way I beleive. The fourth was an afterthought.