240mm + 360mm, CPU overheating

[Simon771]

So once again I have problem with heat in my system.

360mm + 240mm rad, all fans to 100%. Air is moving trough rads a lot. It blows away paper if I put it on rad.

 

GPU is chilling at 37°C idle.

 

CPU however, is overheating. i7 4790k on stock settings gets to 80°C with AIDA 64 stress testing. Only CPU stress testing and not FPU or cache.

If I stress test cpu + cache + fpu, temps will get over 90°C and PC will crash.

 

I don't get it, what the hell is wrong with my PC again ... is 600mm of rad not enough to cool down my CPU?

I changed 2 thermal pastes and still the same thing. Every time I remove waterblock, I can see that thermal paste was covering 100% of CPU. And every time I change it, I clean CPU and waterblock to the point that becomes shiny.

 

When I change frequency to 3,8GHz on cores, temps will drop to 65°C. 

But it's i7 4790K cpu and I want to have it on 4,7GHz at all times.

 

At 4,2GHz, voltage goes from 1,1V to 1,25V automaticly. Does that 0,15V realy increase temps so much? In custom water lopp?

 

I'm this close to quit with watercooling and pull everything out of my system, throw it away and go for air cooling.

[SageOfSpice]

The 4790 is hot, but it isn't that hot. Are you sure your rad is working properly?

[Simon771]

Just now, SageOfSpice said:

The 4790 is hot, but it isn't that hot. Are you sure your rad is working properly?

I don't know how to test if my rad is working as it should, but air is going trough it, and water is moving around my loop.

Even if I set pump to 100%, temps will be still the same.

 

[Electronics Wizardy]

Just now, Simon771 said:

I don't know how to test if my rad is working as it should, but air is going trough it, and water is moving around my loop.

Even if I set pump to 100%, temps will be still the same.

 

Try remounting your cpu

[SageOfSpice]

Just now, Simon771 said:

I don't know how to test if my rad is working as it should, but air is going trough it, and water is moving around my loop.

Even if I set pump to 100%, temps will be still the same.

 

The temps are the same even at stock temperatures with the pump at 100%?

[Simon771]

Just now, Electronics Wizardy said:

Try remounting your cpu

How do you mean that? 

Like putting my case horizontaly or something?

 

Just now, SageOfSpice said:

The temps are the same even at stock temperatures with the pump at 100%?

Temperatures are always the same, regardless of pump speed.

[Electronics Wizardy]

Just now, Simon771 said:

How do you mean that? 

Like putting my case horizontaly or something?

 

Temperatures are always the same, regarding of pump speed.

Take the waterblock off and cleanoff the thermal compond. Then put it back on.

[SageOfSpice]

Just now, Simon771 said:

How do you mean that? 

Like putting my case horizontaly or something?

 

Temperatures are always the same, regarding of pump speed.

I'm thinking it's got to be your cooler, man. The 4790 should NOT be running that hot on water. Maybe try the stock cooler with stock clocks and see what temps you're looking at with that.

[Simon771]

1 minute ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Take the waterblock off and cleanoff the thermal compond. Then put it back on.

I did that 2 times already with differend thermal compunds.

One of them was somethim primium with nano technology just for water cooling and best performance bla bla bla.

 

I have no idea what I'm doing wrong.

[Electronics Wizardy]

Just now, Simon771 said:

I did that 2 times already with differend thermal compunds.

One of them was somethim primium with nano technology just for water cooling and best performance bla bla bla.

 

I have no idea what I'm doing wrong.

What waterblock?

[Simon771]

1 minute ago, SageOfSpice said:

I'm thinking it's got to be your cooler, man. The 4790 should NOT be running that hot on water. Maybe try the stock cooler with stock clocks and see what temps you're looking at with that.

But GPU is always under 45°C, even at full load.

Unless my CPU waterblock is somehow dammaged. But it's not leaking or anything ... it seems perfectly fine.

[SageOfSpice]

Just now, Simon771 said:

But GPU is always under 45°C, even at full load.

Unless my CPU waterblock is somehow dammaged. But it's not leaking or anything ... it seems perfectly fine.

Do your GPU temps rise when your stress testing the CPU?

[Simon771]

Just now, SageOfSpice said:

Do your GPU temps rise when your stress testing the CPU?

Maybe by like 1-2°C after 10minutes.

Not big difference.

[SeanAngelo]

Just now, Simon771 said:

Maybe by like 1-2°C after 10minutes.

Not big difference.

what waterblock do you have on your processor?

[SageOfSpice]

Just now, Simon771 said:

Maybe by like 1-2°C after 10minutes.

Not big difference.

Perhaps it has inadequate mounting pressure then. What unit do you have?

[Simon771]

11 minutes ago, SeanAngelo said:

what waterblock do you have on your processor?

I'm using EK - Supremacy EVO Nickel Plexi.

11 minutes ago, SageOfSpice said:

Perhaps it has inadequate mounting pressure then. What unit do you have?

That's what I was thinking also ... but during testing, I slowly screwed them even more. All of those 4 screws. But nothing changes.

 

 

I also just tried to unplug my GPU ... temps are exactly the same. So my GPU isn't the cause of CPU overheating .... that's for sure now.

I'm running out of ideas and thermal paste sadly.

[Simon771]

Okay I think I found the problem ... for some weird reason I need to use shim.

Waterblock isn't touching CPU as it should have.

 

Just need to find some local store that seels this copper shims.

[NoobCase]

Btw...  Easy on the overclocking on that motherboard.  Power delivery on it is not the best. 

 

How did you notice that the CPU and heatsink was not touching? 

[done12many2]

1 hour ago, Simon771 said:

Okay I think I found the problem ... for some weird reason I need to use shim.

Waterblock isn't touching CPU as it should have.

 

Just need to find some local store that seels this copper shims.

 

Why would you need shims?  Didn't you just go from a 4790 to a 4790k?  How are they physically different?

 

9 minutes ago, NoobCase said:

Btw...  Easy on the overclocking on that motherboard.  Power delivery on it is not the best. 

 

How did you notice that the CPU and heatsink was not touching? 

 

I used the same board board on my 4790k and never had issues related to the VRM.  Overclocked pretty well actually.

[Simon771]

1 hour ago, NoobCase said:

Btw...  Easy on the overclocking on that motherboard.  Power delivery on it is not the best. 

 

How did you notice that the CPU and heatsink was not touching? 

 

47 minutes ago, done12many2 said:

 

Why would you need shims?  Didn't you just go from a 4790 to a 4790k?  How are they physically different?

 

 

I used the same board board on my 4790k and never had issues related to the VRM.  Overclocked pretty well actually.

 

So after I removed waterblock so many times, I noticed something weird. No matter how much paste I was using, it was never 100% everywhere on CPU.

So I did simple test: applid very little thermal paste on CPU and spread it around so it was very thin. Then I applied waterblock on it. After I removed it, there was no mark of thermal paste on waterblock.

Then I took CPU out and gently put it on waterblock. Removed it, and waterblock was dirty from thermal paste.

I don't know how is that possible, but I need to try with shim. Already ordered one from EKWB and need to wait 2 days. Untill then my CPU is clocked to 3GHz, running on 60°C.

 

I have no idea why this happened, but I think that was also with my i7 4790 non K before. I had temps around 65°C on it. But with that colling I should have it around 50°C.

 

What is causing that waterblock isn't touching CPU directly, I can't say, I just know it's not touching it.

Another test I did: I put piece of paper on CPU, and then put on waterblock and tightten it down. After I lifted my PC to normal position, paper fell out.

 

I ordered this: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-vga-supreme-hf-hd7970-cu-adapter

Same dimension like my CPU (2,8cm x 2,8cm) and 0,5mm thick.

I ordered 2 of them just in case.

If I understand right, it should work, but will let you know after 2-3 days when I receive it

[NoobCase]

5 minutes ago, Simon771 said:

 

 

So after I removed waterblock so many times, I noticed something weird. No matter how much paste I was using, it was never 100% everywhere on CPU.

So I did simple test: applid very little thermal paste on CPU and spread it around so it was very thin. Then I applied waterblock on it. After I removed it, there was no mark of thermal paste on waterblock.

Then I took CPU out and gently put it on waterblock. Removed it, and waterblock was dirty from thermal paste.

I don't know how is that possible, but I need to try with shim. Already ordered one from EKWB and need to wait 2 days. Untill then my CPU is clocked to 3GHz, running on 60°C.

 

I have no idea why this happened, but I think that was also with my i7 4790 non K before. I had temps around 65°C on it. But with that colling I should have it around 50°C.

 

What is causing that waterblock isn't touching CPU directly, I can't say, I just know it's not touching it.

Another test I did: I put piece of paper on CPU, and then put on waterblock and tightten it down. After I lifted my PC to normal position, paper fell out.

 

I ordered this: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-vga-supreme-hf-hd7970-cu-adapter

Same dimension like my CPU (2,8cm x 2,8cm) and 0,5mm thick.

I ordered 2 of them just in case.

If I understand right, it should work, but will let you know after 2-3 days when I receive it

Thanks for the explanation. 

[done12many2]

6 minutes ago, Simon771 said:

 

 

So after I removed waterblock so many times, I noticed something weird. No matter how much paste I was using, it was never 100% everywhere on CPU.

So I did simple test: applid very little thermal paste on CPU and spread it around so it was very thin. Then I applied waterblock on it. After I removed it, there was no mark of thermal paste on waterblock.

Then I took CPU out and gently put it on waterblock. Removed it, and waterblock was dirty from thermal paste.

I don't know how is that possible, but I need to try with shim. Already ordered one from EKWB and need to wait 2 days. Untill then my CPU is clocked to 3GHz, running on 60°C.

 

I have no idea why this happened, but I think that was also with my i7 4790 non K before. I had temps around 65°C on it. But with that colling I should have it around 50°C.

 

What is causing that waterblock isn't touching CPU directly, I can't say, I just know it's not touching it.

Another test I did: I put piece of paper on CPU, and then put on waterblock and tightten it down. After I lifted my PC to normal position, paper fell out.

 

I ordered this: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-vga-supreme-hf-hd7970-cu-adapter

Same dimension like my CPU (2,8cm x 2,8cm) and 0,5mm thick.

I ordered 2 of them just in case.

If I understand right, it should work, but will let you know after 2-3 days when I receive it

Great job on trouble shooting, but you shouldn't need a shim at all with a stock 4790k and a EK water block.  Did you install washer between the mounting bolt and the board?  I'm talking about the bolts that screw into the backplate.

 

The shims will work, but they are a band aid to what's causing the problem.  

[Simon771]

Just now, done12many2 said:

Great job on trouble shooting, but you shouldn't need a shim at all with a stock 4790k and a EK water block.  Did you install washer between the mounting bolt and the board?  I'm talking about the bolts that screw into the backplate.

 

The shims will work, but they are a band aid to what's causing the problem.  

That's what I was thinking at first too. I was using washers before, and I removed them in hope that it would fix anything ... it didn't.

Screws that are going on another side of the motherboard to that bracket ... those are not blocking it. Something else is.

I think it must be something wrong with my CPU socket case or however you call it.

Nothing else seems to be in the way.

 

But then again ... stock cooler from CPU have that shim on it already. So that's what made me look into it further and found out this problem.

 

Band aid? Doesn't it work okay? I will apply thermal paste on both side of that shim and put waterblock on it. It should hold together, and that way it will be directly touching my CPU.

No idea how else I could solve this. Unless I take hammer I hit CPU socket a bit down. But I won't do that

 

[done12many2]

1 minute ago, Simon771 said:

That's what I was thinking at first too. I was using washers before, and I removed them in hope that it would fix anything ... it didn't.

Screws that are going on another side of the motherboard to that bracket ... those are not blocking it. Something else is.

I think it must be something wrong with my CPU socket case or however you call it.

Nothing else seems to be in the way.

 

But then again ... stock cooler from CPU have that shim on it already. So that's what made me look into it further and found out this problem.

 

Band aid? Doesn't it work okay? I will apply thermal paste on both side of that shim and put waterblock on it. It should hold together, and that way it will be directly touching my CPU.

No idea how else I could solve this. Unless I take hammer I hit CPU socket a bit down. But I won't do that

 

Hammers fix a lot of things so never completely rule that out as an option.  

 

I say that you spend more time finding out what it is that is stopping the block from making full contact.  It's either the bolts/screws themselves or something on the board.

[airdeano]

got a pic of the motherboard socket area?

could be the surrounding caps or plastics keeping the block from properly seating to the CPU.