Worry of Directx12 performance from Nividia cards in the near future.

[byalexandr]

3 minutes ago, App4that said:

What problem did I list?

The one with Quantum Break or something?

 

Quote: "yet to run into a problem. The only game that is a problem is Quantum Break"

[Curufinwe_wins]

3 minutes ago, afyeung said:

The 770 classified was like $500 lol. 

Yer I know.

[App4that]

1 minute ago, byalexandr said:

The one with Quantum Break or something?

 

Quote: "yet to run into a problem. The only game that is a problem is Quantum Break"

Did you stop reading there?  The game is a train wreck for AMD as well. I never said it's only a problem for Nvidia  

[Curufinwe_wins]

2 minutes ago, byalexandr said:

The one with Quantum Break or something?

 

Quote: "yet to run into a problem. The only game that is a problem is Quantum Break"

Well quantum break is just a piece of shit from a code optimization standpoint. I thought everyone knew that. It doesn't run well on ANYTHING.

[Notional]

3 minutes ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

Well remember the 290 was billed as a titan killer, while the 780ti was just one step up.

 

The 780ti launched at 650, the 290x launched at 550. Not that much different. Don't get me wrong, it is a step up, but the 290 and 290x were like 3% perf different.

Pretty sure it was the 290x that was touted as a Titan killer. But then again the original Titan was like a 780 non ti. The difference between 290 and x is at least 10%. The 290 seems to have launched at 400$, so maybe not half of a 780ti, but equalling it now is a bit pathetic for the 780ti.

 

5 minutes ago, afyeung said:

The only real advantage I've seen AMD have API wise is in Hitman and Doom. And Doom is Vulkan which seems to hold much more promise than dx12 for AMD. If you're planning to drop a lot of money on a new card, go for the card that has better performance overall. Regular PC gamers don't care about one or two games for benchmark purposes. 

Well both DX12 and Vulkan will be equally great on AMD. The reason why you are seeing such a huge bump in Doom, is because OpenGL is fubar; especially in the AMD drivers. There's a long story behind that, but all you need to know is that OpenGL is basically dead for AAA games, and good riddance. Vulkan is so much better for everyone.

[afyeung]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

Did you stop reading there?  The game is a train wreck for AMD as well. I never said it's only a problem for Nvidia  

Game didn't even look good to begin with, bad performance just hammered the nail into the coffin. 

[Mira Yurizaki]

I wanted to add this to my post but the reply train kept rolling

 

You could ask if NVIDIA's solution is driver based, then how come DX12 support is crap to non-existent on older hardware? I don't know this, but I can tell you that drivers are system software. This is on the same level of importance as the OS kernel and firmware. NVIDIA built Kepler and Maxwell around DX11, and thus their drivers were built around using that and for gaming (NVIDIA didn't expect anyone to use the consumer cards as workstation cards). To add DX12 into the mix would require a huge architecture overhaul. This would require a lot of testing of not only the DX12 portion, but the DX11 portion as well to make sure nothing got borked.

 

Then you could think "well that was dumb." Yes, but NVIDIA seemed to plan for what was relevant now rather than an uncertain future. When Kepler was made, nobody was thinking about giving PC game developers "console level" control of their hardware. And also NVIDIA focused Kepler primarily for the consumer market. The only reason why AMD developed their asynchronous compute engines was they wanted to keep their cards as a jack-of-all-trades that could be used for gaming or compute. And even when Maxwell came out, it was still an uncertain future of whether or not anyone would have a DX12 or Vulkan game out for the foreseeable future.

 

But here's the other thing, API adoption rate tends to be slow. Sure there were a handful of DX11 games when it was introduced, but it took many years before DX11 was an required feature. Hell, it a couple of years after DX11's introduction to have DX9 finally shoved underneath a rug.

 

By the time DX12 is finally a required feature and enough games use its good features, whatever problems NVIDIA has now will be long gone.

[App4that]

4 minutes ago, afyeung said:

Game didn't even look good to begin with, bad performance just hammered the nail into the coffin. 

Nice to see you around again!

 

People get caught up in benchmarks that max out graphics settings, that's not right. Most of the time the solution to any fps issues has no observable effect on image quality. In the rare times it does it's nothing you notice when playing, only when looking for the difference. Another words nothings changed  

[Curufinwe_wins]

6 minutes ago, Notional said:

Pretty sure it was the 290x that was touted as a Titan killer. But then again the original Titan was like a 780 non ti. The difference between 290 and x is at least 10%. The 290 seems to have launched at 400$, so maybe not half of a 780ti, but equalling it now is a bit pathetic for the 780ti.

 

Well both DX12 and Vulkan will be equally great on AMD. The reason why you are seeing such a huge bump in Doom, is because OpenGL is fubar; especially in the AMD drivers. There's a long story behind that, but all you need to know is that OpenGL is basically dead for AAA games, and good riddance. Vulkan is so much better for everyone.

So, part of this is specific to the reference model, but if you remember LTT's 290 actually outperformed their 290x across the board (and they weren't the only ones to see this.)

 

Anyways, I think we agree on the principle, even if we assign it different value.

 

+1 on the OpenGL thing btw.

[afyeung]

9 minutes ago, App4that said:

Nice to see you around again!

 

People get caught up in benchmarks that max out graphics settings, that's not right. Most of the time the solution to any fps issues has no observable effect on image quality. In the rare times it does it's nothing you notice when playing, only when looking for the difference. Another words nothings changed  

Nice to see you too! I agree. For example in BF3 I was getting drops with HBAO so I just switched to SSAO and didn't notice a change in visual quality but no more drops  A lot of games I won't max out because I know there's no visual difference and performance is way more important.