Should I change school?

[h3rm3s]

Hello everyone!

 

I have been wondering about this for a long time. I'm currently 15 years old. I live in Antwerp, Belgium. And I'm in a high school called 'Steinerschool Antwerpen'. It's a special school. It focuses on giving balanced education, a balance between languages, science and physical activities. This year is my fourth year at the school. So only 2 to go after this, and I can go to college, or university.

 

After high school I'd like to go do something in science, computer science, math, economy or maybe even politics. This school has really helped my to deploy my talents, and find my true interests. It's also a very small school (it's a non government owned school), and everyone kinda knows everyone. I like the atmosphere, I like the people around me (they're not stupid "YEAH, I'M SO COOL, AND YOU'RE A NERD!!!!!" people).

 

But if I really want to do something in science later, this school really isn't my best option. The school also suffers from a small budget (everything, accept teachers wages are financed by the parents). Teachers have no dicipline. Teachers regularly just don't come to class. And because of the shitty teachers, and shitty coordination, the school is behind in a lot of classes.

 

And honestly, I don't feel comfortable letting my parents pay 6 times as much for a private school that doesn't do its job, while I could also just go to a public school, learn the stuff I should learn, and let my parents pay 20€ a month instead of 120€.

 

The problem is the following:

 

The school I'm in now, has really  great people. I'm not just talking about friends, but just the culture in general. Everyone accepts everyone. And the school is really different from public schools, in that teachers are much closer to the students (obviously the students can decide how close). It's a very personal school.

But it just doesn't preform as it should. I'm a year behind in French class (French is obligatory in Belgium), and I guess I behind in Math as well. Simply because teachers don't come to class.

 

The school I would be going to, would be a public school. It would be 10 times larger, and a VERY different culture. In my current school for example, there's literally no physical fighting. In the other school I'd be going to, fighting is 'fun', and 'playful', they seem to forget it also really hurts. I know about the other school, because my closest friends go to that school. The teaching is also very different. In some ways, it prepares you better for university. But in other ways, it really doesn't (like critical thinking is not present in that school).

 

 

So, I'll have to choose between, getting the classes I should get, but in a new, strange, less personal, way. Or staying in my current school, and not getting the classes I should, but staying inside the great environment, and deploying my personality in a friendly environment, and learning to think independently.

 

 

Also, I program in my free time. If I would change schools? I'd have much less time to program.

 

Any help is welcome!

[asim1999]

4 minutes ago, h3rm3s said:

Hello everyone!

 

I have been wondering about this for a long time. I'm currently 15 years old. I live in Antwerp, Belgium. And I'm in a high school called 'Steinerschool Antwerpen'. It's a special school. It focuses on giving balanced education, a balance between languages, science and physical activities. This year is my fourth year at the school. So only 2 to go after this, and I can go to college, or university.

 

After high school I'd like to go do something in science, computer science, math, economy or maybe even politics. This school has really helped my to deploy my talents, and find my true interests. It's also a very small school (it's a non government owned school), and everyone kinda knows everyone. I like the atmosphere, I like the people around me (they're not stupid "YEAH, I'M SO COOL, AND YOU'RE A NERD!!!!!" people).

 

But if I really want to do something in science later, this school really isn't my best option. The school also suffers from a small budget (everything, accept teachers wages are financed by the parents). Teachers have no dicipline. Teachers regularly just don't come to class. And because of the shitty teachers, and shitty coordination, the school is behind in a lot of classes.

 

And honestly, I don't feel comfortable letting my parents pay 6 times as much for a private school that doesn't do its job, while I could also just go to a public school, learn the stuff I should learn, and let my parents pay 20€ a month instead of 120€.

 

The problem is the following:

 

The school I'm in now, has really  great people. I'm not just talking about friends, but just the culture in general. Everyone accepts everyone. And the school is really different from public schools, in that teachers are much closer to the students (obviously the students can decide how close). It's a very personal school.

But it just doesn't preform as it should. I'm a year behind in French class (French is obligatory in Belgium), and I guess I behind in Math as well. Simply because teachers don't come to class.

 

The school I would be going to, would be a public school. It would be 10 times larger, and a VERY different culture. In my current school for example, there's literally no physical fighting. In the other school I'd be going to, fighting is 'fun', and 'playful', they seem to forget it also really hurts. I know about the other school, because my closest friends go to that school. The teaching is also very different. In some ways, it prepares you better for university. But in other ways, it really doesn't (like critical thinking is not present in that school).

 

 

So, I'll have to choose between, getting the classes I should get, but in a new, strange, less personal, way. Or staying in my current school, and not getting the classes I should, but staying inside the great environment, and deploying my personality in a friendly environment, and learning to think independently.

 

 

Also, I program in my free time. If I would change schools? I'd have much less time to program.

 

Any help is welcome!

Your parents considered getting you a tutor? If not, you can always self teach with online lessons and revision guides 

[Citadelen]

My school is like yours, it's called the Small School, apart from the teachers not caring. Everyone pulls together because of are extremely limited budget. The teachers have a good balance between discipline and appeal. Everything is friendly. If my parents decided to send me to a public school again, I would lock my self in my room, and refuse to come out until I was sent back.

 

[h3rm3s]

1 hour ago, asim1999 said:

Your parents considered getting you a tutor? If not, you can always self teach with online lessons and revision guides 

Well, I'm perfectly capable of teaching myself new things. I learned programming myself, pretty much only from some random PDFs online. It's not the learning that is a problem. It's that in my current school, I simply don't see the material I should see. And I can't learn about them myself, if I don't know of their existence. I don't know what the criteria are for certain courses in university. I don't know what knowledge I should have for studying Aerospace Engineering in TU Delft. But I do know my school doesn't give me enough of that knowledge.

 

I could look for it myself. But I still wouldn't know if I learned the right things, or enough things. I Want a school that can tell me with certainty that I have to knowledge to go to university. And my current school, really doesn't do this at all.

[h3rm3s]

1 hour ago, Citadelen said:

My school is like yours, it's called the Small School, apart from the teachers not caring. Everyone pulls together because of are extremely limited budget. The teachers have a good balance between discipline and appeal. Everything is friendly. If my parents decided to send me to a public school again, I would lock my self in my room, and refuse to come out until I was sent back.

 

I'm just curious. Why don't you want to go to a public school? What are your main arguments? By the way, the teachers not caring, is really a big problem for me. I freak out when people in a position of power, don't live up to their own rules, eg. teachers not coming to class, but punishing students that don't come to class. And no, the teachers are not sick, or legally absent. They just don't show up.

 

Any ways. What are your main reason not to go to a public school?

[asim1999]

4 minutes ago, h3rm3s said:

Well, I'm perfectly capable of teaching myself new things. I learned programming myself, pretty much only from some random PDFs online. It's not the learning that is a problem. It's that in my current school, I simply don't see the material I should see. And I can't learn about them myself, if I don't know of their existence. I don't know what the criteria are for certain courses in university. I don't know what knowledge I should have for studying Aerospace Engineering in TU Delft. But I do know my school doesn't give me enough of that knowledge.

 

I could look for it myself. But I still wouldn't know if I learned the right things, or enough things. I Want a school that can tell me with certainty that I have to knowledge to go to university. And my current school, really doesn't do this at all.

Check what exam boards you use and look at the exam specification to see what exactly you have to learn 

[Citadelen]

4 minutes ago, h3rm3s said:

-snip-

I used to live in London and went to a state school there for the whole of year 7. I was bullied for my whole time there, teaching, while not inadequate, couldn't be tailored specifically towards pupils. Lessons there lasted 50 minutes, with a class of thirty that leaves the teacher with less than two minutes of individual explanation for each student. My learning suffered, as I wasn't confident with what I was doing and needed to be told it was right. At my old school where I would get, say, around 60% on a maths test, I get 80-85% now. This was because I was constantly being told I was doing everything right, and could move on with my work and get onto the rest of the work set. The state school I would go to isn't very good as well (placed into special measures by OFSTED), the formality of it, the atmosphere and the people there aren't something I like either. At my school teachers are called by their first names, are placed on a near equal footing with pupils, we have debates and discussion in something called 'circle' in the mornings and evenings, where anyone can talk.

[h3rm3s]

1 hour ago, asim1999 said:

Check what exam boards you use and look at the exam specification to see what exactly you have to learn 

My school doesn't do exams. That's one of the main differences with public schools. My school uses a completely different structure. But I might check our curriculum.

[h3rm3s]

56 minutes ago, Citadelen said:

I used to live in London and went to a state school there for the whole of year 7. I was bullied for my whole time there, teaching, while not inadequate, couldn't be tailored specifically towards pupils. Lessons there lasted 50 minutes, with a class of thirty that leaves the teacher with less than two minutes of individual explanation for each student. My learning suffered, as I wasn't confident with what I was doing and needed to be told it was right. At my old school where I would get, say, around 60% on a maths test, I get 80-85% now. This was because I was constantly being told I was doing everything right, and could move on with my work and get onto the rest of the work set. The state school I would go to isn't very good as well (placed into special measures by OFSTED), the formality of it, the atmosphere and the people there aren't something I like either. At my school teachers are called by their first names, are placed on a near equal footing with pupils, we have debates and discussion in something called 'circle' in the mornings and evenings, where anyone can talk.

Yeah. The personality in small schools is great. But I don't think this level of personality is present in university. Isn't it better to get used to this non-personal way of teaching?

[Citadelen]

Just now, h3rm3s said:

Yeah. The personality in small schools is great. But I don't think this level of personality is present in university. Isn't it better to get used to this non-personal way of teaching?

I can function in both systems, of the two I prefer a personal approach.

[roman.sattler]

Hi,

I come from Switzerland and we have the Rudolf-Steiner schools here too. I did regular public schools and I'm studying computer science now but maybe some things I've observed and heard from steiner-students might help you.

Here, many people switch to public school (we call it gymnasium, I believe you do as well) when they are about 14 years old. Most say that it took them quite some time to get used to the regular school system with grades and exams. I would recommend to acclimatise before you go to university simply because uni can be very confusing and unguided in the beginning.

Besides the personal and emotional issues you might face, a simple advice: The higher the education the more theoretical and technical it's gonna be. It helps to know some math and to be prepared for a lot of abstract work and thinking. And that is, as you said, not the steiner schools biggest strength.

 

I hope that helps at least a little bit.

[maulemall]

I wish I could tell you that life gets easier but you will face things like this all your life and in everyday situations. Your commentary on your teachers is problematic in that these are the examples your parents have given you to learn from and at your age you are surely in need of stronger role models.

https://www.khanacademy.org/

Kahn academy and other online schooling is truly an advantageous thing here in the states.

Switching schools at this time will mean starting over in a whole new world basically and I think you will do yourself disservice to lose touch with those you have grown with.

Obviously money is a consideration but to be honest it's not your consideration it is your parents. As I tell my daughter (who is probably your age) Your only responsibility is to learn and  do it to the best of your ability.

That's it.

Now quit playing on the computer and get to studying.

[h3rm3s]

18 hours ago, roman.sattler said:

Hi,

I come from Switzerland and we have the Rudolf-Steiner schools here too. I did regular public schools and I'm studying computer science now but maybe some things I've observed and heard from steiner-students might help you.

Here, many people switch to public school (we call it gymnasium, I believe you do as well) when they are about 14 years old. Most say that it took them quite some time to get used to the regular school system with grades and exams. I would recommend to acclimatise before you go to university simply because uni can be very confusing and unguided in the beginning.

Besides the personal and emotional issues you might face, a simple advice: The higher the education the more theoretical and technical it's gonna be. It helps to know some math and to be prepared for a lot of abstract work and thinking. And that is, as you said, not the steiner schools biggest strength.

 

I hope that helps at least a little bit.

That really helps! Yeah, abstract and theoretical thinking is indeed not a strength from the Rudolf-Steiner Schools. I kinda make up for that by programming (and following the economy) as a hobby. But indeed, that math we see, is really not the same level as some of my friends see (they're in public school). Just out of curiosity, from which part in Switzerland are you, linguistically speaking? (that was a way too complicated sentence, just, what language do you speak? :))

 

So I assume you recommend going to a public school, to acclimatise, before going to university?

[roman.sattler]

35 minutes ago, h3rm3s said:

That really helps! Yeah, abstract and theoretical thinking is indeed not a strength from the Rudolf-Steiner Schools. I kinda make up for that by programming (and following the economy) as a hobby. But indeed, that math we see, is really not the same level as some of my friends see (they're in public school). Just out of curiosity, from which part in Switzerland are you, linguistically speaking? (that was a way too complicated sentence, just, what language do you speak? :))

 

So I assume you recommend going to a public school, to acclimatise, before going to university?

I do recommend it. But in the end it depends on your working morale, motivation and discipline. You know, even top universities give you at least a small chance to catch up if you haven't learned something before. It will be harder for you but it's not impossible.

Personally, I would prefer a more gentle passage.

 

I live in the German-speaking part of Switzerland, close to Zurich. I'm assuming you speak Dutch and not French since you're from Antwerpen, right? :-)

[AlTech]

On ‎3‎/‎22‎/‎2016 at 6:39 AM, maulemall said:

I wish I could tell you that life gets easier but you will face things like this all your life and in everyday situations. Your commentary on your teachers is problematic in that these are the examples your parents have given you to learn from and at your age you are surely in need of stronger role models.

https://www.khanacademy.org/

Kahn academy and other online schooling is truly an advantageous thing here in the states.

Switching schools at this time will mean starting over in a whole new world basically and I think you will do yourself disservice to lose touch with those you have grown with.

Obviously money is a consideration but to be honest it's not your consideration it is your parents. As I tell my daughter (who is probably your age) Your only responsibility is to learn and  do it to the best of your ability.

That's it.

Now quit playing on the computer and get to studying.

Sometime I agree with that last line but frankly students should also be having fun and enjoy their life.

 

I can't exactly sympathize since I do vocational courses and 2 subjects with exams (as opposed to having nothing but exams).

But it should still apply.

[maulemall]

18 minutes ago, AluminiumTech said:

Sometime I agree with that last line but frankly students should also be having fun and enjoy their life.

 

I can't exactly sympathize since I do vocational courses and 2 subjects with exams (as opposed to having nothing but exams).

But it should still apply.

 School only takes up so little time truthfully. American schools are WAY to easy. She gets the WHOLE summer off and 2 weeks off at Xmass and next week a week for Spring break.. Add in all the other national holidays and teacher work days kids barely do half a year.

The rest of the time she does what ever she enjoys and that is her payment for being an honor student and working hard.

 

 

 AND Bravo for taking Vocational studies...

Hands on is the best way to learn and find enjoyment in learning...

Sadly here we are doing way to little Voc. Ed.

[iTzPrime]

If the teachers don't come, go to the headmaster and tell him. If they still don't come, go to the official at your district. They are by law obligated to teach...

[Yoinkerman]

I would look into equivalency classes at your local college.  They should have some.

[AlTech]

2 hours ago, maulemall said:

 School only takes up so little time truthfully. American schools are WAY to easy. She gets the WHOLE summer off and 2 weeks off at Xmass and next week a week for Spring break.. Add in all the other national holidays and teacher work days kids barely do half a year.

The rest of the time she does what ever she enjoys and that is her payment for being an honor student and working hard.

 

 

 AND Bravo for taking Vocational studies...

Hands on is the best way to learn and find enjoyment in learning...

Sadly here we are doing way to little Voc. Ed.

Thank you

It comes from being not too good at exams. I find I understand and take away a lot more from each lesson than in subjects with exams. And I have a deeper appreciation of subjects and topics within them. IDK about you but my school has 5 hours a day but there are more school days during the year. Instead of 6 hours per day with less days per year.

 

It's unfortunate I could not do Vocational Computer Science stuff cos the IB course isn't very nice. Same with Maths.

 

And FYI I'm in an International school but I've spent most of my academic life in British schools despite being American. American education is weird IMO.

[maulemall]

Just now, AluminiumTech said:

Thank you

It comes from being not too good at exams. I find I understand and take away a lot more from each lesson than in subjects with exams. And I have a deeper appreciation of subjects and topics within them. IDK about you but my school has 5 hours a day but there are more school days during the year. Instead of 6 hours per day with less days per year.

 

It's unfortunate I could not do Vocational Computer Science stuff cos the IB course isn't very nice. Same with Maths.

 

And FYI I'm in an International school but I've spent most of my academic life in British schools despite being American. American education is weird IMO.

You have a good head and I think you will do fine. If I were younger and could do over my choices I would get into electronics repair Like Avionics and from there you can go and do whatever you want in the field of electronics... The fundamentals and formulas are the same no matter the sub field you do..

[h3rm3s]

On 23.3.2016 at 6:08 PM, roman.sattler said:

I do recommend it. But in the end it depends on your working morale, motivation and discipline. You know, even top universities give you at least a small chance to catch up if you haven't learned something before. It will be harder for you but it's not impossible.

Personally, I would prefer a more gentle passage.

 

I live in the German-speaking part of Switzerland, close to Zurich. I'm assuming you speak Dutch and not French since you're from Antwerpen, right? :-)

Honestly, I truly hate status symbols, or elite behaviour. But I can't help that I want to go to a top university. But I'm a realist, I will probably go to a normal university, study, get a job, and so on. But I'm going to try to break away from this system. I've noticed I'm pretty entrepreneurial.

 

By the way, Ich studiere in der Steiner Schule. Natürlich spreche ich auch (a little bit of) die Deutsche Sprache!

(I assume this sentence is full of mistakes )

 

But indeed, my first language is Dutch (Flemish, with an Antwerp accent, and I'm proud of it! jk Antverpian people are known for their extreme pride of Antwerp), second English, fourth French and fifth German. I love having to learn 4 languages at school! Do you have to learn German, French and Italian at school? Also, Isn't there some kind of Swiss language, which is a mix of German, French and Italian?

[roman.sattler]

1 hour ago, h3rm3s said:

Honestly, I truly hate status symbols, or elite behaviour. But I can't help that I want to go to a top university. But I'm a realist, I will probably go to a normal university, study, get a job, and so on. But I'm going to try to break away from this system. I've noticed I'm pretty entrepreneurial.

 

By the way, Ich studiere in der Steiner Schule. Natürlich spreche ich auch (a little bit of) die Deutsche Sprache!

(I assume this sentence is full of mistakes )

 

But indeed, my first language is Dutch (Flemish, with an Antwerp accent, and I'm proud of it! jk Antverpian people are known for their extreme pride of Antwerp), second English, fourth French and fifth German. I love having to learn 4 languages at school! Do you have to learn German, French and Italian at school? Also, Isn't there some kind of Swiss language, which is a mix of German, French and Italian?

It's not about status symbols whatsoever, it's about doing what you like the most in the best possible way. Always aim high!

 

That was quite good! Your choice of words was a bit unnatural but not too bad. :-)

I do sometimes understand a little bit of Dutch. Especially when I hear it while being able to read it at the same time. It has quite a few similarities to Swiss German.

We learn German, English and French in school. You can usually choose to learn Italian in high school. But not many people do it. Besides that, we've got like a million different accents of Swiss German. There are parts of Switzerland where they speak such a fucked up German that I don't even understand them.  And yes, we are all very proud of our accents too. 

The fourth national language of Switzerland is Romansh which sounds like a mix of Italian, Latin (oh, yeah, btw I had 2 years of Latin in school too) and German. It's honestly one of the coolest languages I've ever heard. Sadly, there are just 60'000 people left who speak it. There is a hip-hop act which raps in Romansh, Liricas Analas, I linked the video. (Not really my kind of music but I like those guys.)

Someone once told me that the French-speaking and the Flemish-speaking Belgians hate each other. Is that true? 

 

[CrackheadKyle]

As quoted from linus "YOU SHOULD"

[jibril]

I think you should think about the big picture, if you'd get better education at the public school then it's a no brainer, it's your future after all and you friends will still be your friends. As for fighting, I'm not sure how Belgium is but in my school it wasn't tolerated and it was enjoyable. It depends on if you feel like moving is what you really want to do, because I can't lie, being new is hard at first, especially when all the groups of kids are close and don't show interest in getting to know someone new. If you're very sociable, why not give it a shot, I mean if you don't like it do you have the option to return to your private school for the last year? 

[h3rm3s]

7 hours ago, roman.sattler said:

It's not about status symbols whatsoever, it's about doing what you like the most in the best possible way. Always aim high!

 

That was quite good! Your choice of words was a bit unnatural but not too bad. :-)

I do sometimes understand a little bit of Dutch. Especially when I hear it while being able to read it at the same time. It has quite a few similarities to Swiss German.

We learn German, English and French in school. You can usually choose to learn Italian in high school. But not many people do it. Besides that, we've got like a million different accents of Swiss German. There are parts of Switzerland where they speak such a fucked up German that I don't even understand them.  And yes, we are all very proud of our accents too. 

The fourth national language of Switzerland is Romansh which sounds like a mix of Italian, Latin (oh, yeah, btw I had 2 years of Latin in school too) and German. It's honestly one of the coolest languages I've ever heard. Sadly, there are just 60'000 people left who speak it. There is a hip-hop act which raps in Romansh, Liricas Analas, I linked the video. (Not really my kind of music but I like those guys.)

Someone once told me that the French-speaking and the Flemish-speaking Belgians hate each other. Is that true? 

 

Wow! That's a cool language! (Romansh). Also, it seems like Romansh is a more direct descent from Latin, it's cool that such a language is used for something modern like rap music. I hope this language won't die. But if you look worldwide, all sorts of accents and dialects are disappearing. It's sad.

 

Well, the story about Flanders (mainly Flemish speaking part) and Walloon region (mainly French speaking part, but also a bit of German) is very, I repeat VERY confusing. So in 1830 Belgium gained independence from the Netherlands. Since then, there has always been a French speaking minority. These people were mostly the rich people, and owned most of the factories in Belgium. So the Dutch speaking people were regarded as second-class citizens. Over the years, more and more people have started to speak French. Currently 49% I believe speaks French. But meanwhile, Flanders started becoming more prosperous. The coal mines in the Walloon region closed, and most economic activity was in Flanders. The life standard became higher in Flanders, and the richest people in Belgium were now mainly Flemish speaking. The Walloon region was/ is plagued by unemployment and the Flemish people had to give more and more money for the Walloon region to continue to function properly.

Today we have come to the point where we have a Flemish separatist party, which wants an independent Flanders, so that we don't have to pay for the poor French speaking people. The Walloon people on the other hand don't want independence, because they would probably be in a situation like Greece.

 

Now I'll explain or crazy, non-functioning, idiotic government structure.

 

So,

 

- We have a Federal government. This government has some competences, like national defence, and such.

 

- We have a Flemish government. This government controls Flanders, but this government has as much power over Flanders as the Federal government.

 

- We have a Walloon government. This government controls the Walloon region, but this government has as much power over Wallonia as the Federal government.

 

- We have a Brussels Capital government. This government is in control over SOME ASPECTS of the Brussels district.

 

But because Flanders is MAINLY Flemish speaking, and Wallonia is MAINLY French speaking, we created "linguistic communities"!

 

- The Dutch speaking community. This entity delivers specific services to the Dutch speaking people.

- The French speaking community. This entity delivers specific services to the French speaking people.

- The German speaking community. This entity delivers specific services to the German speaking people.

 

As you may not know, the Brussels district in officially bilingual (Dutch and French). In reality 80 to 90% speaks only French. But for some reason, the federal government allowed the Flanders and Walloon government to also have power in the Brussels district.

 

Since Brussels is mainly French speaking, they mainly elect French speaking politicians. But since Flanders is more prosperous, most of the money for Brussels, comes from Flanders. The French speaking politicians have Flemish money, but mainly help the French speaking people, because those are the people that vote them in the  government.

 

The Flemish people are tired of having to spend money on the French speaking people, while not being able to say how this money should be spent. Also, the Walloon people barely know Dutch, while we speak pretty ok French.

 

So that's pretty much how it works.

 

I don't hate the Walloon people. But we joke about them being lazy and stuff, you know