980 Intel i5-4590 bottlenecking MSI GTX 980Ti

[Monarch]

9 minutes ago, Conan1600 said:

if you find a game that stutters based on a i5 ivy bridge or latter cpu i wanna know about it bub. so i can laugh at the moron that made it, in general you are talking 2 - 10 fps from i5 to i7 from equal generations in gaming

 

5 minutes ago, daniellearmouth said:

I'm not moving any goal posts here. I'm just making a point of how not every game is going to need or even use more than two logical processors in a game, and even fewer use four or more. It's hard to argue against that because multithreading in games is a relatively new thing, and only a relative handful of games do it.

Riiiiiiiight? Somehow I have my doubts regarding those words, so if you have a video showcasing this, then I might actually take your word for it.

I know you have an i5, so there is reason for me to take your word, but if you have a video that I can watch to see this, that'd be great.

1. 2500k at 4.6 GHz vs 6700K at 4 GHz:

 

 

 

2.  3570k vs 6700K:

 

https://youtu.be/GQJ9lnqZKhI?t=8m36s

40 vs 60 fps in with grass physics.

 

3. 3570k vs 6700K both at 4.2 GHz

https://youtu.be/WE0TaiTmr0w?t=3m36s

 

 

[daniellearmouth]

5 minutes ago, Monarch said:

-snip-

Aight, noted.

[Daedalus Apex]

Ugh, well, I dont even fuckking know. There is no clear answer here. Too many people assume and don't come with facts.

[Monarch]

50 minutes ago, Kobathor said:

Technically, there will be a bottleneck. There always is. You can have a 5960x and still have bottlenecks, since a computer simply is not perfect.

 

But, the fact of the matter is, he won't have any kind of crazy bottleneck where he will be losing 15+ FPS compared to an i7. In most games, the i5 vs an i7 are at most <5 FPS apart, I don't think that's a bottleneck that he would care about. Go watch some videos on YouTube comparing them. It's not a Pentium vs a 5960x. (oops, already used 5960x)

 

You seem to go on topics and say things like this all the time now. Show up, complain. You're really good at that. How about, if you hate LTT forums so much, you just stick to Reddit or Overclockers where nobody is opinionated or biased in any way?

This video disagrees:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WE0TaiTmr0w&feature=youtu.be&t=3m36s&ab_channel=ARTIS

And it's not even just fps that i7's are better at, frame times are much more consistent as well. 

 

[App4that]

8 minutes ago, Daedalus Apex said:

Ugh, well, I dont even fuckking know. There is no clear answer here. Too many people assume and don't come with facts.

There are facts, check out the evidence posted by those of us saying there will be a bottleneck. 

[Kobathor]

15 minutes ago, Monarch said:

This video disagrees:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WE0TaiTmr0w&feature=youtu.be&t=3m36s&ab_channel=ARTIS

And it's not even just fps that i7's are better at, frame times are much more consistent as well. 

 

Coolvidyo. Comparing a 2 gen old i5 vs Intel's fastest quad-core w/ hyper-threading ever. /s, that is. You must have dug around for a while finding the worst examples possible. You deserve an award.

[App4that]

Just now, Kobathor said:

Coolvidyo. Comparing a 2 gen old i5 vs Intel's fastest quad-core w/ hyper-threading ever. /s, that is. You must have dug around for a while finding the worst examples possible.

 

 

 

 

[Kobathor]

2 minutes ago, App4that said:

-vidyos-

And that proves an i5 will bottleneck a GTX 980 how, exactly? You just showed me that a $350 CPU beats a $220-250 CPU. Good job.

[SteveGrabowski0]

29 minutes ago, daniellearmouth said:

...Dude, I'm moving only my fingers and my eyelids right now. No goalposts have been moved in the making of any of these comments.

 

Multithreading is a new thing in games. Your average game made in Unity isn't going to care whether it runs on a Pentium or an i7 unless you coded it in such a way that it utilised more than two threads, like with Cities: Skylines. And unless they are made in such a way that makes them impossible to play on no fewer than four threads, it still won't care what it's running on.

 

And besides, that's only including AAA. Unless you exclusively play AAA games, it's unfair as far as I'm concerned to discount many indie titles given how they are very seldom technical showcases.

 

And before you tell me that I'm moving the goalposts again, allow me to demonstrate the fact that I'm not here.

 

There are several indie games that are tech showcases in some instances.

No Man's Sky. Star Citizen. The Talos Principle.

These are all indie games. And yet, they are all tech showcases in different ways, be they in terms of graphical fidelity or just sheer scale. No doubt those games use plenty of threads to do things. Especially given how one of the three currently supports Vulkan.

I do play mostly AAA games. The Pentium runs like garbage because the vast majority of them are designed to run on quadcore or better. The only ones aside from Bioshock Infinite that are any good on dual core are the old Fallout games from the late 90s to late 00s. It's a reasonable assumption to make that we'd talk about AAA games since no one would reasonably buy a GTX 980 just to play Cities Skylines or Kerbal Space Program.

[App4that]

Just now, Kobathor said:

And that proves an i5 will bottleneck a GTX 980 how, exactly?

Did you watch? I have no idea where the misconception came from that you don't have to match your CPU to the GPU to get the best performance, but here. More proof.

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-the-best-pc-hardware-for-fallout-4-4023

[App4that]

1 minute ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

I do play mostly AAA games. The Pentium runs like garbage because the vast majority of them are designed to run on quadcore or better. The only ones aside from Bioshock Infinite that are any good on dual core are the old Fallout games from the late 90s to late 00s. It's a reasonable assumption to make that we'd talk about AAA games since no one would reasonably buy a GTX 980 just to play Cities Skylines or Kerbal Space Program.

Actually, Cities Skylines takes a i7 if you want to go over a certain population.

[Kobathor]

Just now, App4that said:

Did you watch? I have no idea where the misconception came from that you don't have to match your CPU to the GPU to get the best performance, but here. More proof.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-the-best-pc-hardware-for-fallout-4-4023

Of course you match parts for best performance. Quote me right now where I said that it's not. You're arguing for the sole purpose of arguing, it's kinda pathetic.

 

The crappy thing is that sometimes it's much more expensive buying an i7 rather than an i5. There is the Xeon line on the LGA 1150 socket, but those aren't available in all countries or they're really expensive in other countries. That leads to buying an i5 to join with your 980. How horrible can that be? You obviously have money falling out of your pockets, picking up a 980ti and a 4790k. But guess what. Not everybody has the money to drop on an i7 just to get ~8-10 more FPS.

[SteveGrabowski0]

1 hour ago, daniellearmouth said:

It running like shit and it running playably are not one in the same.

 

What numbers are you getting? Are they above 60FPS in both cases? If yes, then I don't see what the problem is.

Nice to hear that game is pretty well threaded.

[App4that]

Just now, Kobathor said:

Of course you match parts for best performance. Quote me right now where I said that it's not. You're arguing for the sole purpose of arguing, it's kinda pathetic.

 

The crappy thing is that sometimes it's much more expensive buying an i7 rather than an i5. There is the Xeon line on the LGA 1150 socket, but those aren't available in all countries or they're really expensive in other countries. That leads to buying an i5 to join with your 980. How horrible can that be? You obviously have money falling out of your pockets, picking up a 980ti and a 4790k. But guess what. Not everybody has the money to drop on an i7 just to get ~8-10 more FPS.

Is it possible to have a discussion about the topic? But since you made the insult, let me reply.

 

I don't have a car, I don't live in my own place but rent a room. I'm a college student and as I can't afford to go out much and I don;t have the means to drive anywhere I spend a lot of time at my desk. I can't afford cable so don't have a TV. I only have my rig. I guess what? If I decide to stick what little I have in it, I'm going to fucking do it.

 

So can we get back to the topic or do you want to know my measurements too?

 

 

[Kobathor]

Just now, App4that said:

Is it possible to have a discussion about the topic? But since you made the insult, let me reply.

 

I don't have a car, I don't live in my own place but rent a room. I'm a college student and as I can't afford to go out much and I don;t have the means to drive anywhere I spend a lot of time at my desk. I can't afford cable so don't have a TV. I only have my rig. I guess what? If I decide to stick what little I have in it, I'm going to fucking do it.

 

So can we get back to the topic or do you want to know my measurements too?

Sorry, I have been proved wrong about your home living, spending every cent of your extra money on your PC.

[Starelementpoke]

5 minutes ago, App4that said:

Is it possible to have a discussion about the topic? But since you made the insult, let me reply.

 

I don't have a car, I don't live in my own place but rent a room. I'm a college student and as I can't afford to go out much and I don;t have the means to drive anywhere I spend a lot of time at my desk. I can't afford cable so don't have a TV. I only have my rig. I guess what? If I decide to stick what little I have in it, I'm going to fucking do it.

 

So can we get back to the topic or do you want to know my measurements too?

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, Kobathor said:

Sorry, I have been proved wrong about your home living, spending every cent of your extra money on your PC.

Should I start selling tickets for an @App4that vs @Kobathor war?

[App4that]

Just now, Kobathor said:

Sorry, I have been proved wrong about your home living, spending every cent of your extra money on your PC.

Like to the fucking penny my brother. Sold shit that hurt to get my 980ti, I earned it.

 

Back on topic.

 

I've repeatedly and not for the sake of argument but for the OP's sake said that the 980 and a locked i5 will work. not optimal but it will work. But why? Get the 4790k while since they plan to anyway and by the time the OP has money saved up for a card the new cards will at least be known specs wise. Wait to get the 4790k and in a few months they might have to go used or pay a premium because of demand overcoming supply. Read my post's, I've said this before.

[Starelementpoke]

6 minutes ago, Kobathor said:

Sorry, I have been proved wrong about your home living, spending every cent of your extra money on your PC.

I mean, I spent every cent I had on getting my new computer...

[Kobathor]

Just now, App4that said:

Like to the fucking penny my brother. Sold shit that hurt to get my 980ti, I earned it.

Back on topic.

I've repeatedly and not for the sake of argument but for the OP's sake said that the 980 and a locked i5 will work. not optimal but it will work. But why? Get the 4790k while since they plan to anyway and by the time the OP has money saved up for a card the new cards will at least be known specs wise. Wait to get the 4790k and in a few months they might have to go used or pay a premium because of demand overcoming supply. Read my post's, I've said this before.

Oh yeah, that "every penny" thing wasn't an insult, I myself spend all of my extra money on my PC. My dad freaked out when I bought my 7970 for $125. Sounded mean. I'll work on that.

 

Also, depending on what you prioritize computer-wise, I still think it would be better to buy a new GPU now, and a better CPU down the line. Why? Because, the way I think of it, I really just want better performance all the time. Buying a new GPU will help a whole lot more than buying a new CPU then saving up for a good GPU. The way his rig would be, he would be able to play most (if not all) AAA titles at 1080p 60FPS+. In some time, he'll upgrade to a shiny i7, then he can save up for GPU again- and the cycle goes on.

 

He's upgrading from a 960 to a 980, that performance boost will be way higher than an i5 to an i7  would be. That's the point I'm trying to make.

[App4that]

Just now, Kobathor said:

Oh yeah, that "every penny" thing wasn't an insult, I myself spend all of my extra money on my PC. My dad freaked out when I bought my 7970 for $125. Sounded mean. I'll work on that.

 

Also, depending on what you prioritize computer-wise, I still think it would be better to buy a new GPU now, and a better CPU down the line. Why? Because, the way I think of it, I really just want better performance all the time. Buying a new GPU will help a whole lot more than buying a new CPU then saving up for a good GPU. The way his rig would be, he would be able to play most (if not all) AAA titles at 1080p 60FPS+. In some time, he'll upgrade to a shiny i7, then he can save up for GPU again- and the cycle goes on.

 

He's upgrading from a 960 to a 980, that performance boost will be way higher than an i5 to an i7  would be. That's the point I'm trying to make.

100% accurate. And if Haswell was still being made or Polaris and Pascal weren't on the horizon I'd be saying they should get a 980. Maybe even a Fury since they seemed to have stabilized a bit. 

 

But it would suck balls to finally be able to get a 4790k and be faced with prices over 6700k's because of limited supply. Then they have to make the decision of going used or upgrading to Skylake that's already a dead end. 14nm confirmed this year and 10nm confirmed for 2017.

 

 

 

[Kobathor]

1 minute ago, App4that said:

100% accurate. And if Haswell was still being made or Polaris and Pascal weren't on the horizon I'd be saying they should get a 980. Maybe even a Fury since they seemed to have stabilized a bit. 

 

But it would suck balls to finally be able to get a 4790k and be faced with prices over 6700k's because of limited supply. Then they have to make the decision of going used or upgrading to Skylake that's already a dead end. 14nm confirmed this year and 10nm confirmed for 2017.

I agree about the stock thing. I bought a Z97 motherboard a few weeks ago in preparation for a platform upgrade- for the sole reason that they'll sell out then be way overpriced. I'm going CPU first right now (probably because I "need" it, loving 25FPS in Fallout 4 Boston) just because of stock, instead of switching out my 7970. It's a difficult decision, because we don't know how long it'll be before they upgrade to that 4790k. Maybe he could save up $150 and buy a 390x + Xeon E3-1231 V3.. but probably not.

 

[App4that]

Just now, Kobathor said:

I agree about the stock thing. I bought a Z97 motherboard a few weeks ago in preparation for a platform upgrade- for the sole reason that they'll sell out then be way overpriced. I'm going CPU first right now (probably because I "need" it, loving 25FPS in Fallout 4 Boston) just because of stock, instead of switching out my 7970. It's a difficult decision, because we don't know how long it'll be before they upgrade to that 4790k. Maybe he could save up $150 and buy a 390x + Xeon E3-1231 V3.. but probably not.

 

Agreed, I'd almost say 390x over the 980. It's going to be a beast once DX12 hits. I've been out my PC while I waited to sell a part, they might get lucky and if they sell the 960 and locked i5 throw that in with what they have and follow your plan. Those Xeons are no joke. Paired with a 390x, damn. I'd drive that.

[Kobathor]

4 minutes ago, App4that said:

Agreed, I'd almost say 390x over the 980. It's going to be a beast once DX12 hits. I've been out my PC while I waited to sell a part, they might get lucky and if they sell the 960 and locked i5 throw that in with what they have and follow your plan. Those Xeons are no joke. Paired with a 390x, damn. I'd drive that.

Selling is a really good idea! I plan to sell my CPU+mobo once I get (hopefully) an i7-4770k/4790k, or the Xeon ($209 walk-in at Micro Center, I love that store) it should get me around $150 or so (People are buying used 8350's on eBay for ~$120, and my mobo used for ~$70), that makes the blow from buying a $300 CPU a bit easier to handle.

 

Sorry for being rude earlier. I get steamed up sometimes.

[App4that]

Just now, Kobathor said:

Selling is a really good idea! I plan to sell my CPU+mobo once I get (hopefully) an i7-4770k/4790k, or the Xeon ($209 walk-in at Micro Center, I love that store) it should get me around $150 or so (People are buying used 8350's on eBay for ~$120, and my mobo used for ~$70), that makes the blow from buying a $300 CPU a bit easier to handle.

Yeah fuck you for having a Micro Center I have Fry's...

[Kobathor]

3 minutes ago, App4that said:

Yeah fuck you for having a Micro Center I have Fry's...

I have Fry's too  Living in the Dallas/Metroplex area gets you access to tons of big stores like that. Fry's sells lots of computer parts too, but things like CPU's and motherboards are cheaper at Micro Center. I bought my Z97S SLI Krait (I know, faulty RAM slots, if it's faulty I don't mind returning it) from Micro Center for $109+tax. Though, I get tons of stuff at Fry's, since their price match policy is so good. I got my 850 EVO 240GB there for $75, since it was on sale at Amazon and I price matched it.