HD7990 getting same performance as x2 TITANS?

[OlekKing]

I have an Asus DCUII OC GTX680 at the moment and i want to upgrade for BF4 and other future "next-gen" games, i run an ASUS VG248QE monitor in 120Hz with 2D Lighboost enabled.

 

First i was thinking about getting a second 680, that would be the cheapest solution for me because i wouldn't have to sell my current card and still have like 300€ (I live in Europe) to spend on other stuff...but the problem with that is that i don't have a large enough motherboard and case for that, if i added a 2nd one of these there would be about 2mm of space between the cards or something like that which scares me...

 

I've been looking at the HD7990 because it's dropped price and it's like only 100$ more expensive than a single GTX780.

 

Then i've been looking at 780s in SLI, now it's a bit more on the expensive side and i'd have to sell my current 680 and probably wouldn't make that much money from it because the used market here is nowhere near close to the American one...so there aren't that many people selling used hardware neither looking for it.

 

I plan on playing a LOT of Battlefield 4, and i want to be able to max out the game and mantain a smooth, constant 120fps, since i'm using a 120Hz monitor and 2D Lighboost on top of that whichmakes FPS stutter even more apparent.

 

Now i've been looking at some Guru3D benchmarks, usually my preferred site because they always specify what level they test in game and they always use the same one.

 

This is their HD7990 and 780/TITAN benchmarks, i'm using BF3 as a reference although you can also see it in other games.

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/radeon_hd_7990_review,20.html

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_780_sli_review,19.html

 

According to their tests, the 7990 is getting equal and even faster performance in some cases than 2 TITANS/780s in SLI. Now i don't know if this is some kind of mistake...

 

I know AMD is supposed to unveil the 9000 series at the end of the month but i'm scared that the longer i wait the lower value my 680 will have.

 

Will the high end cards like the 780 drop in price when AMD shows their new GPUs? Will even the 7990 drop down further?

 

I don't know if i should wait or if it's even worth waiting, the BF4 Beta starts at the end of the month and i'd love to be able to max out the game by then with 120 fps.

 

Thank you if you read this all the way though...i'm just really confused by this.

 

[ltguy]

I'd personally wait for the 9000 series but regardless i think most people would recommend 2 7970's over the 7990. It'll be cheaper and you'll have two heatsinks and two sets of fans to dissapate the heat instead of one. I do own the 5970 dual gpu ati card, amd's dual cards can be a headache.

[Face2Face]

I'd personally wait for the 9000 series but regardless i think most people would recommend 2 7970's over the 7990. It'll be cheaper and you'll have two heatsinks and two sets of fans to dissapate the heat instead of one. I do own the 5970 dual gpu ati card, amd's dual cards can be a headache.

 

+1  or even two 7950's.

[D3MON]

bf4 wont be any more demanding than bf3/moh wf are now so dont sweat it, nvidia WILL drop prices if 9k series is good, it wont if its not, seeing as amd have been working on 9000 series for a long time now my guess is it will be good and probably worth the upgrade but id wit to see first.

[Vitalius]

First i was thinking about getting a second 680, that would be the cheapest solution for me because i wouldn't have to sell my current card and still have like 300€ (I live in Europe) to spend on other stuff...but the problem with that is that i don't have a large enough motherboard and case for that, if i added a 2nd one of these there would be about 2mm of space between the cards or something like that which scares me...

 

I've been looking at the HD7990 because it's dropped price and it's like only 100$ more expensive than a single GTX780.

 

Then i've been looking at 780s in SLI, now it's a bit more on the expensive side and i'd have to sell my current 680 and probably wouldn't make that much money from it because the used market here is nowhere near close to the American one...so there aren't that many people selling used hardware neither looking for it.

 

I plan on playing a LOT of Battlefield 4, and i want to be able to max out the game and mantain a smooth, constant 120fps, since i'm using a 120Hz monitor and 2D Lighboost on top of that whichmakes FPS stutter even more apparent.

 

Now i've been looking at some Guru3D benchmarks, usually my preferred site because they always specify what level they test in game and they always use the same one.

 

This is their HD7990 and 780/TITAN benchmarks, i'm using BF3 as a reference although you can also see it in other games.

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/radeon_hd_7990_review,20.html

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_780_sli_review,19.html

 

According to their tests, the 7990 is getting equal and even faster performance in some cases than 2 TITANS/780s in SLI. Now i don't know if this is some kind of mistake...

 

I know AMD is supposed to unveil the 9000 series at the end of the month but i'm scared that the longer i wait the lower value my 680 will have.

 

Will the high end cards like the 780 drop in price when AMD shows their new GPUs? Will even the 7990 drop down further?

 

I don't know if i should wait or if it's even worth waiting, the BF4 Beta starts at the end of the month and i'd love to be able to max out the game by then with 120 fps.

 

Thank you if you read this all the way though...i'm just really confused by this.

Then do not get a second GPU.

It is not a mistake. AMD cards are more consistent, based on frame latency tests done by Anandtech and others, and because of this, often have higher FPS than GTX equivalent cards in certain situations (usually taxing ones, where the both sides are under 100% load). 

On average, Titans/780s > 7970's (aka a 7990). However, when it counts, and the extremes occur, the 7970's (or 7990) will often have higher FPS. Simply because they take heavy loads better. Average FPS is not everything.

Yes, the high end cards will drop in price when AMD's new GPUs come out. AMD is known for Price-performance and I fully expect them to undercut the Nvidia prices by quite a bit because the 780 is overpriced at $600. Add in the games (Never Settle Forever) and Nvidia will either need to release a new GPU or cut prices (or both).

I doubt the 7990 will further drop down though. It is pretty cheap as it is. Relatively speaking.

Your situation is complicated. I would just get the 7990 as you are worried about SLI/Crossfire in your case. That is the best case to use a Dual GPU card. I cannot see the 7990's price going down further, but it could still happen, so wait until after the 9XXX series comes out.

 

[Bluejay0]

SLI 680s will last some time. 

[ltguy]

Then do not get a second GPU.

It is not a mistake. AMD cards are more consistent, based on frame latency tests done by Anandtech and others, and because of this, often have higher FPS than GTX equivalent cards in certain situations (usually taxing ones, where the both sides are under 100% load). 

On average, Titans/780s > 7970's (aka a 7990). However, when it counts, and the extremes occur, the 7970's (or 7990) will often have higher FPS. Simply because they take heavy loads better. Average FPS is not everything.

Yes, the high end cards will drop in price when AMD's new GPUs come out. AMD is known for Price-performance and I fully expect them to undercut the Nvidia prices by quite a bit because the 780 is overpriced at $600. Add in the games (Never Settle Forever) and Nvidia will either need to release a new GPU or cut prices (or both).

I doubt the 7990 will further drop down though. It is pretty cheap as it is. Relatively speaking.

Your situation is complicated. I would just get the 7990 as you are worried about SLI/Crossfire in your case. That is the best case to use a Dual GPU card. I cannot see the 7990's price going down further, but it could still happen, so wait until after the 9XXX series comes out.

 

I'd say you mistaken. I just went from crossfire to sli and nvidia is much much smoother all around.  And read some of anandtech's articles, even with the new frame pacing drivers nvidia solution is still way ahead of amd.

[ltguy]

+1  or even two 7950's.

or even three 7950's. 

[I'm Batman]

wait for 9XXX series @CoolBeans

[OlekKing]

Then do not get a second GPU.

It is not a mistake. AMD cards are more consistent, based on frame latency tests done by Anandtech and others, and because of this, often have higher FPS than GTX equivalent cards in certain situations (usually taxing ones, where the both sides are under 100% load). 

On average, Titans/780s > 7970's (aka a 7990). However, when it counts, and the extremes occur, the 7970's (or 7990) will often have higher FPS. Simply because they take heavy loads better. Average FPS is not everything.

Yes, the high end cards will drop in price when AMD's new GPUs come out. AMD is known for Price-performance and I fully expect them to undercut the Nvidia prices by quite a bit because the 780 is overpriced at $600. Add in the games (Never Settle Forever) and Nvidia will either need to release a new GPU or cut prices (or both).

I doubt the 7990 will further drop down though. It is pretty cheap as it is. Relatively speaking.

Your situation is complicated. I would just get the 7990 as you are worried about SLI/Crossfire in your case. That is the best case to use a Dual GPU card. I cannot see the 7990's price going down further, but it could still happen, so wait until after the 9XXX series comes out.

 

I was just surprised that the 7990 which got a lot of FLAK, now has dropped in price so much, costing like 100$ more than a single 780 and outperforming 2 of those or even 2 Titans...i really don't prefer either manufacturer but i've only had Nvidia so far because i just happen to like them, i like Physx and that sort of crap but it's not a huge selling point for me.

 

I just hear horrible things about CrossFire all the time even with their constant driver patches it seems as it's still crappy.

 

I won't go for 7970s or 7950s, i either get a second 680 which again i'm not sure if it would be a good idea since the one i have right now is a triple slot card and if i add a second one they will have like 2mm of space between them so yeah...i didn't really pay attention that i wouldn't have much space left if i wanted to add another card...i should have bought a standard 680 but oh well...

 

7990 seems to be a good deal and it comes with those free games which i already played but free stuff is free stuff right? But again i hear about temperature problems and stuttering even with the newest drivers.

 

Either that or i get x2 780s or i wait to see the new AMD cards...i just hate waiting because like anyone i want the best performance ASAP and the further i wait the less valuable my 680 will be here...

[MrSuperb]

or don't listen to those AMD fanboys and get another 680 if you already have one ... probably will end up cheaper ...

[OlekKing]

or don't listen to those AMD fanboys and get another 680 if you already have one ... probably will end up cheaper ...

Well i'm not a fanboy myself and i'm intrigued by the upcoming AMD cards, i'm just looking for the best performance without throwing away money with Titans...

[Vitalius]

I'd say you mistaken. I just went from crossfire to sli and nvidia is much much smoother all around.  And read some of anandtech's articles, even with the new frame pacing drivers nvidia solution is still way ahead of amd.

And I would say you are mistaken as you do not understand what I am saying.

When both GPUs are under 100% load, AMD's will have higher FPS all of the time. At any other point in time (which is most of the time), Nvidia GPUs will have higher FPS. 

Here is an article from TechReport showing this in graphs.

 

Frame Latency graphs are kinda hard to understand if you are not used to thinking in terms of milliseconds. "Beyond 50ms" is another way to say "less than 15 FPS". "Beyond 16.7ms" is another way to say "Less than 60FPS". So, based on this graph:

The 7970 spends less time under 15 FPS than any GPU, even the Titan. Meaning that every other GPU takes a bigger FPS hit than the 7970.

However, according to this graph:

The GTX Titan, 780, and 770 spends the most time over 60 FPS. This means that, on average, those 3 cards have a higher average FPS than any other card, and that they will have smoother gameplay 90% of the time, except when the few instances where the 7970 is higher in FPS.

What that means for the OP is simple: If he chooses 7970's/7990, his average FPS will be lower, but when graphically intensive things happen (he will be maxing BF3 after all), his FPS will drop less, thus resulting in a smoother experience for those graphically intensive moments (which tend to be the ones that need to be smooth).

If he chooses GTX 680's or GTX [insert setup], he will have higher average FPS, but when graphically intensive moments happen, he will notice it, and badly. Especially since he wants 120FPS+ gameplay, dropping from >120 to <30 FPS (based on those graphs, dropping from >60 to <15FPS) will suck. A lot, imo.

I would notice those drops more than lower average FPS and so I would go with AMD.

 

I was just surprised that the 7990 which got a lot of FLAK, now has dropped in price so much, costing like 100$ more than a single 780 and outperforming 2 of those or even 2 Titans...i really don't prefer either manufacturer but i've only had Nvidia so far because i just happen to like them, i like Physx and that sort of crap but it's not a huge selling point for me.

 

I just hear horrible things about CrossFire all the time even with their constant driver patches it seems as it's still crappy.

 

I won't go for 7970s or 7950s, i either get a second 680 which again i'm not sure if it would be a good idea since the one i have right now is a triple slot card and if i add a second one they will have like 2mm of space between them so yeah...i didn't really pay attention that i wouldn't have much space left if i wanted to add another card...i should have bought a standard 680 but oh well...

 

7990 seems to be a good deal and it comes with those free games which i already played but free stuff is free stuff right? But again i hear about temperature problems and stuttering even with the newest drivers.

 

Either that or i get x2 780s or i wait to see the new AMD cards...i just hate waiting because like anyone i want the best performance ASAP and the further i wait the less valuable my 680 will be here...

You can use CPU PhysX if you like it, and I would just sell your 680 ASAP and just not game for a month. Think of it as a challenge to do something new or whatever. Not saying you need to, but that is what I would do. 

The RadeonPro patch apparently fixed frame rating on crossfire to the point that it is acceptable. Not perfect or optimized, but acceptable, to the point that it is a valid alternative to SLI.

[OlekKing]

And I would say you are mistaken as you do not understand what I am saying.

When both GPUs are under 100% load, AMD's will have higher FPS all of the time. At any other point in time (which is most of the time), Nvidia GPUs will have higher FPS. 

Here is an article from TechReport showing this in graphs.

 

Frame Latency graphs are kinda hard to understand if you are not used to thinking in terms of milliseconds. "Beyond 50ms" is another way to say "less than 15 FPS". "Beyond 16.7ms" is another way to say "Less than 60FPS". So, based on this graph:

The 7970 spends less time under 15 FPS than any GPU, even the Titan. Meaning that every other GPU takes a bigger FPS hit than the 7970.

However, according to this graph:

The GTX Titan, 780, and 770 spends the most time over 60 FPS. This means that, on average, those 3 cards have a higher average FPS than any other card, and that they will have smoother gameplay 90% of the time, except when the few instances where the 7970 is higher in FPS.

What that means for the OP is simple: If he chooses 7970's/7990, his average FPS will be lower, but when graphically intensive things happen (he will be maxing BF3 after all), his FPS will drop less, thus resulting in a smoother experience for those graphically intensive moments (which tend to be the ones that need to be smooth).

 

 

You can use CPU PhysX if you like it, and I would just sell your 680 ASAP and just not game for a month. Think of it as a challenge to do something new or whatever. Not saying you need to, but that is what I would do. 

The RadeonPro patch apparently fixed frame rating on crossfire to the point that it is acceptable. Not perfect or optimized, but acceptable, to the point that it is a valid alternative to SLI.

I'm not bothered by PhysX, like i said it's a nifty thing but not a product seller for me. By the way i still have an Inno3D 580 laying around, how much are those worth nowadays? I think i lost the box for it some time ago but still have the static proof bag and some accessories. You see, the problem is that the used market here is really small so it's hard to find people who are looking to buy this kind of stuff here. If i got on Amazon.com there's just tons of used stuff being sold and people buy it for decent prices.

[OlekKing]

I'm crazy about Battlefield, and i would hate to not be able to even play the BF4 Beta maxed out with an awesome framerate when that comes out at the start of October...maybe i'd get 2 780s or something like that but with the upcoming AMD series i feel like i'll regret spending money now because either they will have fucking awesome prices and performance or they'll make Nvidia prices come down.

 

Now i hear shit about Nvidia launching more GPUs at the end of this year...just damn...

[OlekKing]

I'm also wondering if you guys think that the 7990 would be a good purchase or maybe know someone who's had experience with it, i don't find that much about it online...also i know that the whole BF4 running better on AMD is mostly marketing but it was announced that BF4 will fully utilize DX11.1 and will be optimized for it and Nvidia only partially supports it...

[grayperview]

I'd say you mistaken. I just went from crossfire to sli and nvidia is much much smoother all around.  And read some of anandtech's articles, even with the new frame pacing drivers nvidia solution is still way ahead of amd.

yeah now they are only twice as bad, they where like 10 times as bad before the new drivers.

[OlekKing]

Would i get better performance with x2 680s in SLi versus a 7990? I don't want to go into 7970s in crossfire so don't mention those please.

[OlekKing]

HOHOHOHO

 

DICE just posted the BF4 system requirements and they recommend 3GB of video memory so goodbye to my 680.

 

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1175310_510048165747226_1761244024_n.png

[Bluejay0]

HOHOHOHO

 

DICE just posted the BF4 system requirements and they recommend 3GB of video memory so goodbye to my 680.

 

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1175310_510048165747226_1761244024_n.png

 

That's for optimal with EVERYTHING MAXED. Pretty much AA is taking that extra 1.5 GB

[OlekKing]

That's for optimal with EVERYTHING MAXED. Pretty much AA is taking that extra 1.5 GB

That's what i want  B)

[Vitalius]

That's for optimal with EVERYTHING MAXED. Pretty much AA is taking that extra 1.5 GB

Then you should read his first post in this thread. 

Where he says, 

 

That's what i want  B)

Pretty much.

I swear, if you want to help people, read their posts. Jesus. Sometimes I wonder why people even enter threads to help someone if they will not read what the person writes.

I want to point out that I am saying the above because this keeps happening and is progressively getting worse on LTT Forums. 

I admit sometimes I do not read the posts, but then I do not post in that thread. For, what I hope to be, obvious reasons.

[Bluejay0]

Then you should read his first post in this thread. 

Where he says, 

 

Pretty much.

I swear, if you want to help people, read their posts. Jesus. Sometimes I wonder why people even enter threads to help someone if they will not read what the person writes.

I want to point out that I am saying the above because this keeps happening and is progressively getting worse on LTT Forums. 

I admit sometimes I do not read the posts, but then I do not post in that thread. For, what I hope to be, obvious reasons.

 

I did read the post, but no one needs that much AA for a 1080p screen right?

[OlekKing]

I did read the post, but no one needs that much AA for a 1080p screen right?

In BF3 you certainly did, the only i do there is set the PostAA to Low because it's basically FXAA with no performance impac blurring everything in the distance, with 2xMSAA you definitely see jaggies.

[Vitalius]

I did read the post, but no one needs that much AA for a 1080p screen right?

I would say no. The OP says yes.

Part of helping people is understanding what they want. Even if you think it is not right.

 

In BF3 you certainly did, the only i do there is set the PostAA to Low because it's basically FXAA with no performance impac blurring everything in the distance, with 2xMSAA you definitely see jaggies.

This.