Xbox One explanations

[Artorias]

Okay, guys. Let's stop this or will be in another vicious cycle of debate here. :P

[Lyons]

You really want 4channers in a position of power to decide what your consoles will be like? Think about it.

 

>4channers

>on /b/

>position of power

 

nope.

 

This is like, the one avenue of figuring out what's going on, and you're reacting like this with all your comments? Stop looking into it so much. Don't like the Xbox One? Don't buy it. Simple.

[ericlee30]

Is it just me, or does anyone else feel like they just got yelled at by a Microsoft Xbox one engineer? Very Very unprofessional of you :(

[Bleedman0xx]

>4channers

>on /b/

>position of power

 

nope.

 

This is like, the one avenue of figuring out what's going on, and you're reacting like this with all your comments? Stop looking into it so much. Don't like the Xbox One? Don't buy it. Simple.

...

 

The one post that I made in this thread that I actually want people to respond to, practically hoping somebody would respond to so I can have a decent constructive conversation with, and everyone goes out of their way to respond to my other comments and turn the thread's subject matter into complete crap. But no, we can't have that. That's asking too much. People just seem to like to add to the tripe, I guess.

 

The post I'm referring to: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/26107-xbox-one-explanations/?p=332281

[Lyons]

...

 

The one post that I made in this thread that I actually want people to respond to, practically hoping somebody would respond to so I can have a decent constructive conversation with, and everyone goes out of their way to respond to my other comments and turn the thread's subject matter into complete crap. But no, we can't have that. That's asking too much. People just seem to like to add to the tripe, I guess.

 

The post I'm referring to: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/26107-xbox-one-explanations/?p=332281

 

Of course I read all of your responses, don't put words in my mouth. I agree with that post, and I don't have anything to contribute to it, there's no conversation to be had. I just don't think your other ones were very well though constructed. Don't make other silly posts if you want to get a real response.

[Artorias]

Seriously, guys? Wanna go down that road again? Going in another vicious circle of debate, arguing to each other, not making sense anymore? Come on, guys. Seriously? I mean seriously?

[Bleedman0xx]

Of course I read all of your responses, don't put words in my mouth. I agree with that post, and I don't have anything to contribute to it, there's no conversation to be had. I just don't think your other ones were very well though constructed. Don't make other silly posts if you want to get a real response.

The "..." part of my post was a response to your post. The rest was for the general reader. I should have clarified that but given that I was in an irritated mood, it just slipped my mind.

 

And my first response to ajoy39 was supposed to be exactly as you described it; a silly post. But he decided to take it seriously so I did as well.

 

Seriously, guys? Wanna go down that road again? Going in another vicious circle of debate, arguing to each other, not making sense anymore? Come on, guys. Seriously? I mean seriously?

Seriously seriously? Or just seriously?

[Artorias]

Seriously seriously? Or just seriously?

No, seriously, seriously. Alright, how about we all agree for this thread to be locked down to stop this quarreling? We're not making sense anymore.

[Lyons]

The "..." part of my post was a response to your post. The rest was for the general reader. I should have clarified that but given that I was in an irritated mood, it just slipped my mind.

 

And my first response to ajoy39 was supposed to be exactly as you described it; a silly post. But he decided to take it seriously so I did as well.

 

Seriously seriously? Or just seriously?

 

Well, sarcasm doesn't really work on the internet, so you can't blame anyone else.

 

 

No, seriously, seriously. Alright, how about we all agree for this thread to be locked down to stop this quarreling? We're not making sense anymore.

 

Don't like it, don't buy it. I don't understand why this is so hard for people to grasp.

[Artorias]

So, do we all agree to lock this thread down or simply leave it alone and never reply again?

[Bleedman0xx]

So, do we all agree to lock this thread down or simply leave it alone and never reply again?

It should have been locked or moved as soon as it was posted. Seeing as how the post content isn't Tech News at all. And it's source is coming from somebody who can easily just be a fake.

[HEXiT]

glad to see most of you aint running around with rose tinted specs. the drm is more than intrusive it breaks the whole experience.

personally i dont care about always on i have a decent internet connection that has only gone off 3 times in the last 4 years and each time for less than 8 hours mostly just 1-2. so thats not a biggy.

 

my main concern is the listening to, counting of and watching the people in the room via connect. 

microsoft have given devs and content providers more ways to limit the content by allowing them to count bodies in a room. so if some 1 walks in while your watching say a netflix movie the console will stop it and ask you to pay for another person there and then or will add another person to your bill at the end of the month.

or 

you and your family are sitting around and all of a sudden xbox starts advertising directly to you by showing you adverts for games you may have talked about in the room while it was on. yeah i know microsoft have said they wont do this but they have given the option to there 3rd parties if they want to use it... 

 

so no you would have to be low level dumb to allow this kind of privacy invasion into your living room...

[Lyons]

I think all console news threads (or threads on any sub forum if that's what it takes) should be banned until the consoles themselves actually come out.

[Ethnod]

I know this will be long so sorry but has to be done

 

    >The thing is we suck at telling the story. The whole point of the DRM switch from disc based to cloud based is to kill disc swapping, scratched discs, bringing discs to friends house, trade-ins for shit value with nothign going back to developers, and high game costs. If you want games cheaper then 59.99, you have to limit used games somehow. Steam's model requires a limited used game model.

 

And yet they have not dropped the price of games before, Its not like they did not have digital online sales before, no? 

Its not about that at all, its about piracy, what they are trying to do is kill off piracy completely on consoles (or at least their console) and this is their way but their way is simply the most intrusive and frustrating for gamers. Plus, since when do they control the price point at which publishers put out their games at?

 

 >The thing is, the DRM is really really similar to steam... You can login anywhere and play your games, anyone in your house can play with the family xbox. The only diff is steam you have to sign in before playing, and Xbox does it automatically at night for you (once per 24 hours)

 

Clearly this guy is a moron, he either has no clue what he is talking about or is simply lying in the interview hoping that most people have heard of steam but are not PC gamers and as such have no idea but will use this soundbyte to shout at others in forums in support of their beloved console. Either way he is wrong, due to ignorance or being a lyer and either way that makes him a moron.

Steam has an offline mode, plus if you have a disk you can install offline without any checks what so ever. With steam you can be offline for months with no issues

 

>It's a long tail strategy, just like steam. Steam had it's growing pains at the beginning with all it's drm shit as well. [...] For digital downloads steam had no real competition at the time, they were competing against boxed sales. At the time people were pretty irate about steam, (on 4chan too...) It was only once they had a digital marketplace with DRM that was locked down to prevent sharing that they could do super discounted shit.

 

And yet Sierra recognise that this is not what their customer base want and are currently looking in to giving players the ability to resell their games. If it will happen or not no one actually knows but hey, fingers crossed.

 

>Think about it, on steam you get a game for the true cost of the game, 5$-30$. On a console you have to pay for that PLUS any additional licenses for when you sell / trade / borrow / etc. If the developer / publisher can't get it on additional licenses (like steam), then they charge the first person more. [...] If we say "Hey publishers, you limit game to 39.99, we ensure every license transfer you get 10$, gamestop gets 20$" that is a decent model... Microsoft gets a license fee on first and subsequent game purchases, compared to just first now? That's a revenue increase.

 

I go back to my point about him being a moron, most AAA games start off at 60 on steam....  :angry:

Whats funny is that what they are missing is that while currently they get no money from that resale 99% of the time that money from the resale gets pumped back into another game  :rolleyes:

 

Competition is the best man, it helps drive both to new heights. See technology from the Cold War. If we had no USSR, we'd be way worse off today. TLDR: Bring it on Steam 

 

..................  :lol:  :lol:  :lol: ........... wtf?  :blink: .... Relevance to the gaming industry?  :unsure:

 

>Yeah we passed that around the office at Xbox. Most of us were like "Well played Sony, Well played". That being said they are just riding the hype train of ZOMG THEY ARE TRYING TO FUCK US FOR NO REASON. Without actually thinking about how convienent it would be for the majority of the time to not find that disc your brother didn't put back... [...] just simpleminded people not seeing the bigger picture. Some PS4 viral team made them all "U TOOK R DISCS" and they hiveminded.

 

... seriously? Actually its "hiveminded" to follow MS and say yea, its ok to make my life harder, make games more expensive and reduce the amount of working capital I have to invest and reinvest into games. Its ok to stop me from playing with my mates when ever I want the way I want, sure no probs.

Truth is that Sony listened to the shit storm and said wow, not messing with that one, let MS take that heat, and MS was too arrogant to realise they fucked up. People want to be able to resell their games so they can use that money to buy MORE GAMES!!! Allow gamers to do that on and offline and they will be happy. Hell, if you said an always online thing was so we could give you these cool features MS would have killed, no one would have complained and Sony would be shitting them selves

 

>Everyone and their mother complains about how gamestop fucks them on their trade ins, getting 5$ for their used games. We come in trying to find a way to take money out of gamestop, and put some in developers and get you possibly cheaper games and everyone bitches at MS. Well, if you want the @#$@ing from Gamestop, go play PS4.

 

Than fix the problem, make it easier for gamers to resell games. Make it easier for mom & Pop stores to resell games, make it easier for gamers and harder for Gamestop to rip gamers over. If you know about this issue why did you not move to solve it? Why did you move to re-enforce it?

 

>The goal is to move to digital downloads, but Gamestop, Walmart, Target, Amazon are KIND OF FUCKING ENTRENCHED in the industry. They have a lot of power, and the shift has to be gradual. Long term goal is steam for consoles. [...] If you always want to stay with what you have, then keep current consoles, or a PS4. We're TRYING to move the industry forwards towards digital distribution... it'sa bumpy road

 

Read my last comment

 

>Publishers have enourmous power. Microsoft is trying to balance between consumer delight, and publisher wishes. If we cave to far in either direction you have a non-starting product. WiiU goes too far to consumer, you have no 3rd party support to shake a stick at. PS4 is status-quo. XB1 is trying to push some things, at the expense of others. We have a vision, we'll see if it works in the coming years

 

Your vision does not include or even consider gamers. Its about profit and piracy. Yet piracy is around because people cant or dont want to pay crazy amounts for games they dont know are any good or have no real longevity. Someone once said, the best way to fight piracy is to produce a better product. Well then do that

 

>Living room transformation. We want to own the living room. Every living room TV with an XBox on input one. It's the thing that gives the signal to your TV, everything is secondary. The future, where games, TV, internet telephony, all that shit happens magically on some huge ass screen with hand / voice gestures... That's our goal.

 

Yip, one where you have a machine watching our every move and learning about our every small detail of our personal lives so you can sell that info to marketing companies so they can then brain wash us with more crap. FUCK OFF out of my house

 

[Ethnod]

>Google TV + PS4 + Minority report level gestures, that combined with a sick second screen experience (which is really hot for TV, I know I know.. tv tv tv tv tv... but it's fucking sick when you have it). Games will be the same, there are more exclusives to MS then PS atm, and Kinect 2 makes Kinect 1 look like a childs toy.

 

And yet no one wants to be watched in their home!!!

 

>By default it's on, listening for "Xbox On". You can turn it off tho, and turn the console like OFF off. OFF off is required for Germany / other countries that require it (no vampire appliances) [...] It has to be plugged in for the console to post. You can turn off everything it does from the settings. Think of it like airplane mode for the iPhone. You can't just unplug the cellular radio, but you can turn it off.

 

Actually I can remove the battery from my phone. I love the way he says OFF off. When I turn something off I want it off, not on off. Plus, I though the world was looking at ways to save electricity. How does a device that is on standby constantly with a camera watching and listening? To me that just sounds like on but I'm hiding the fact that I am on. What are the bets that when its "off" its still calling home with data for MS?

 

 

 >Instead of 10mins, is 24hrs for your console, and 1 or 2 at a friends house. Really the majority of people have a speck of internet at least once a day. And if you don't. Don't buy an Xbox 1. Just like if you didn't have a broadband connection don't get Live, and if you don't have an HDTV the 360 isn't that great for you either. New tech, new req. This allows us to do cool shit when we can assume things like you have a kinect, you have internet, etc.=

 

This is just another way for MS to give their fanboys ammunition when defending their console. So what happens when my internet goes down? What happens when I get fired and loose internet connection because I have no money? What happens when I am forced to spend a month or 2 without internet? What happens when someone lives in a rural area and they normally have internet and it goes down for a couple of days or a week? They have activated and confirmed their games, why cant they use them?

What happens when that person wants to go away for a couple of weeks with some friends and bring their Xbox?

 

 

>Current plan is basically you're fucked after 24 hours. Yeah... I know. Kind of sucks. I believe they will probably revist the time period and / or find a diff way to "call in" to ensure you haven't sold your license to gamestop or something... but there is no plan YET. I'm hoping the change it, but I don't work on that so I don't have much influence there /sigh

 

If the licences are held server side... why do they need to check? If I go to gamestop and sell a game off I loose that licence, good. But why does my machine need to be online? If I have access to the single player, what I can play for another 3-5 hours? Maybe I stretch it to get 8-10 hours of game play out of it but after a certain point single player games are boring and you have played them to death. Its the multiplayer game that keeps that game going for me and look, it requires be to be on  line and for you guys to do an online check for me to play online. So what the 24hr mandatory check?

 

 

>If the power goes out you ain't playing shit. I'm assuming you mean the internet goes out but you have power for TV and Xbox. Yes, You're fucked for single player games. Again, that's the PoR (Plan of record), but I expect it to change after the e3 clusterfuck

 

well see

 

 

>What fee? There is no fee to play your games at your friends house. Never has, never will. Even x360 digital downloads could do that.

 

You just wont allow it at all

 

 

>The cloud capabilities is the shit they like the most. We basically made a huge cloud compute shit and made it free. What people are doing with it is kind of cool. THe original intention was to get all the Multiplayer servers not requiring 3rd party costs (Like EA shutting down game servers to cut costs), as well as taking all the games that servers hosted by the clients (Halo, etc), and have all that compute done in the cloud allowing more CPU cycles for gameplay. That will really expand what developers can do. Anything that doesn't need per frame calculation and can handle 100ms delays can be shifted to the cloud. That's huge.

 

<_< Is this not some bullcrap to allow you to introduce crappy DRM?

 

 

>SmartGlass + IE is going to be pretty freaking sweet. 1 finger cursor, 2 finger direct manip. Basically if you think of a laptop trackpad where your phone/ slate is the trackpad and the monitor is your TV... it's that. The tech is there, just needs to be applied. There is some really cool shit going on with Petra + controllers that pairs people with controllers. So if person with controller two trades controlers with controller 1, their profiles magically switch. It's sick. What does this matter? Now if you lean left/right it knows which person is leaning, even if 4 people are all int he same room. It's awesome.

 

I'm sorry, you lost me after you said IE is going to be pretty freaking sweet. IE has been around for almost 20 years and its still shit. Even in 2003 when Firefox game out and trounced IE you did not get your act together, even in 2008 when Chrome came out and trounced both IE and FireFox you guys still had your hand up your ass. 

lol IE is going to be freaking sweet, I repeat, moron

 

 

>New service using Azure for cloud compute. Allows developers to not use clients for hosting multiplayer servers, or other tasks that do not require per frame calcuations. It's pretty sweet.

 

Hmm... its something owned and controlled by MS. You guys cant build an OS to save your lives, the only reason we still use Windows is because Bill Gates is a smart bastard and made a deal with IBM so all computers every where had Windows 3.1 (which was an actual good OS in fairness but that was built from Steve Wozniak hard work and not actual innovation by MS. Since then you have built crap OS's after crap OS and only the odd time by pure luck (and what seems to be a method of throwing shit at a wall to see what sticks) has there been a MS OS that was not a disaster, just not as bad when compares to the utter tripe you had been putting out before. 

AND need I remind you how MS's attempts at innovation have gone? Every OS you have released that is "innovative" has been a disaster, only after years of releasing service packs and releasing a new OS and another service pack or two has your OS not completely sucked. Whats to say Azure will be any different?

 

 

>Honestly, if you care about anything other then pure games AT ALL. Xbox 1 > PS4. If all you do is play games, and nothing else, PS4.

 

Nuff said, "other than pure games"   :rolleyes:

[arkon]

First off, this was an anonymous post on 4chan, so it's "off the books", so to speak, not official Microsoft information. Yes, it's pretty unprofessional, but at least it offers a glimpse at their intentions, and a bit of information.

 

 

Terrible point. Games like Borderlands 2 and Skyrim were sold at 59.99 on Steam at launch as well as consoles.

 

Except microsoft will never lower the game prices, will they? And why would they? Xbox/PS4 gamers are already content with the 59.99 price tag.

 

They do offer sales in the Xbox marketplace. If they do it more, they could attract a lot more business. Not sure about the whole $60 price tag, since that's in part up to the stores too.

 

GOOD! Next time get better PR and say things clear the first time.

 

I stopped reading after "IE"

 

Yeah, the PR was really unorganized. The woes of big companies and their big secrets. Also, don't be a sheep. IE10 isn't that bad, it renders things perfectly fine nowadays.

 

Me too, why pay for online services when on the other team it's free even without subscription? And also the Hourly-check and the "always-be-watching-listening-to-you" Kinect?

 

It's a 24-hour check. And a Kinect that can be turned off (the current Kinect also watches/listens to you, as does the PS4 Eye/PS3 EyeToy).

 

It's threads like this always igniting the fire. However, I'm not blaming the OP his just posting what that "So-Called" Microsoft Staff said. :P

 

Heh, sorry.

 

Also I guess this could be moved to Console Gaming?

[rashdanml]

When the XB1 was first announced, I raised some of these points myself. Steam on console is basically what they're attempting, but it won't work until they strike out the root of the problem: price. Console gamers are content with the $60, but only because they can sell it back to retailers; most console gamers I know wait specifically for a game to go down in price, or buy it used for a bit less, if not a lot less. While people are willing to pay $60 for a game, a lot more gamers will be willing to pay half of that without batting an eyelid. Sure, profit margin is reduced; however, the potential to make up for it through increased volume of sales is still there.

 

Which is why Steam works so well. The gamers who want a game at $50/60 will buy it at that price. Come steam sales, the volume of sales explodes. THQ was going bankrupt before the Humble bundle and last Winter sales, but the massive volume of sales due to the cheap prices helped them out a tiny bit.

 

What Microsoft, and in fact, Sony, should do is cut the price of games. More people think twice about a $60 price-tag, and the ones who don't simply buy it and trade it in later (sure, trade-in value is crap, but it's still money back in their pocket). $30 is something most people don't think twice about.

 

The other option is to make games truly worth the $60 price tag to the point where gamers wouldn't WANT to return the game.

[Vitalius]

What we need to realize is that we people here on Linus tech tips are pretty tech savvy and are in the loop with what is behind the xbox one and the bad things about it.  I personally think it is a nice thing simply because I have internet and I have been paying 60$ for games for years. (Not as much now since I mostly play on the pc) I also like that it is quite good at multitasking.  If you dont like the kinect, unplug it or cover up the damn thing with a rag :P.  As stated in the article, with the used game aspect out of the picture, MS can hopefully lower the prices of the games ,but back to my point. 

 

The majority of people buying the xbox one are just average joes who don't really know what they are buying and are getting it because they know the name and see that it is new.  My little brother is excited to no end for this thing and he is 11.  A common age group for the xbox and a very under informed group.  Along with him is my dad.  He is busy with his job and doesn't have the time to look into things.  He just has a brief idea of what it features: Better graphics, can multitask, can be hooked up to the tv signal, and most importantly, something NEW. 

 

Most people are like them, under informed and will still buy it.  Contrary to what many of you have said, I think the xbox one will be just as popular as the last one.

 

I'm trying to change that. Tell everyone the evils of this console. And yes, I consider the policies behind it to be evil. 

Hating on 24 hour DRM and forced Kinect?

I'm all for all digital games, but I'm not for always online. Steam isn't even always online, Origin isn't even always online.

 

And why am I forced to use a Kinect? It's like forcing you to use 3D on all the content you own. I don't want it, keep it as an option.

 

I'm hating on Microsoft for enforcing anti-consumer policies, they are the ones who need to stop.

 

This.^

You really want 4channers in a position of power to decide what your consoles will be like? Think about it.

Precisely.

[Vitalius]

First off, this was an anonymous post on 4chan, so it's "off the books", so to speak, not official Microsoft information. Yes, it's pretty unprofessional, but at least it offers a glimpse at their intentions, and a bit of information.

 

 

They do offer sales in the Xbox marketplace. If they do it more, they could attract a lot more business. Not sure about the whole $60 price tag, since that's in part up to the stores too.

 

 

Yeah, the PR was really unorganized. The woes of big companies and their big secrets. Also, don't be a sheep. IE10 isn't that bad, it renders things perfectly fine nowadays.

 

 

It's a 24-hour check. And a Kinect that can be turned off (the current Kinect also watches/listens to you, as does the PS4 Eye/PS3 EyeToy).

 

 

Heh, sorry.

 

Also I guess this could be moved to Console Gaming?

Well, their intentions are bull crap.

Digital games aren't in any "store" yet still cost $60 at release most of the time. The "sales" come after that in the marketplace.

That doesn't seem to be a problem with Sony. Or Nintendo. I'm nit-picking here, but that's not a good excuse for them.

Yes, it's a 24 hour check for *your* console. If you play your game on another console with your account, it's an hourly check.

Likely so.

[dyent10]

if u put the address he stated on the post, it brings u to home depot

[arkon]

if u put the address he stated on the post, it brings u to home depot

 

Studio A is at NE 40th Street.

 

Well, their intentions are bull crap.

Digital games aren't in any "store" yet still cost $60 at release most of the time. The "sales" come after that in the marketplace.

That doesn't seem to be a problem with Sony. Or Nintendo. I'm nit-picking here, but that's not a good excuse for them.

Yes, it's a 24 hour check for *your* console. If you play your game on another console with your account, it's an hourly check.

Likely so.

 

Yeah, just like Steam I guess. That's how business rolls. :\

[EChondo]

And a Kinect that can be turned off (the current Kinect also watches/listens to you, as does the PS4 Eye/PS3 EyeToy).

Yeah Kinect can be turned off, but why can't I unplug it? If I can't unplug it then that means it is still on, it's still listening. If you want to believe Microsoft isn't listening when the Kinect is "off" then I don't know what planet you live on.

 

At least the PS3/PS4's Eye is OPTIONAL.

[arkon]

Yeah Kinect can be turned off, but why can't I unplug it? If I can't unplug it then that means it is still on, it's still listening. If you want to believe Microsoft isn't listening when the Kinect is "off" then I don't know what planet you live on.

 

At least the PS3/PS4's Eye is OPTIONAL.

 

Well, it just has to be plugged in when the Xbox is on. You could unplug it when it's off if you want. You could unplug the Xbox too, if you REALLY wanted to...

[EChondo]

Well, it just has to be plugged in when the Xbox is on. You could unplug it when it's off if you want. You could unplug the Xbox too, if you REALLY wanted to...

That's not the point. If I can turn it off then I should be able to unplug it too, if I can't unplug it then it must still be on.

[arkon]

That's not the point. If I can turn it off then I should be able to unplug it too, if I can't unplug it then it must still be on.

 

I know what you mean, although it does need Kinect to designate controllers for players. Instead of having a controller for player 1 and another for player 2, it just assigns the controller depending on who's holding it, meaning you can swap it and whatnot.