Parts are all here, pondering cooling.

[An0maly_76]

Budget (including currency): Way over LOL

Country: USA

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: American Truck Simulator, BeamNG, video rendering. Going for good to high detail at 4K.

Other details (existing parts lists, whether any peripherals are needed, what you're upgrading from, when you're going to buy, what resolution and refresh rate you want to play at, etc): 5900X, Asus B550M-K, Asus KO 3060ti 8GB, 1TB WD Black SN850 M.2 w/heatsink, 6TB WD Black HDD, Inatek PCIe USB 3.2 Gen2 card (6A, 2C, 10Gb/s per 3A / 1C), Crucial Ballistix DDR4-3200 2x16 RAM.

 

So, in my original thread, I was hoping to hold a budget of $500 and quickly found that this was completely unrealistic. Biggest factor being that my plan included reusing more parts from the existing rig, and research has revealed a lot.

 

I'd purchased a 5900X, planning to upgrade the 1700, until MSI said the BIOS update necessary for the 5900X would likely fry my board, as it was an older version. Seriously? Apparently the B450M I have doesn't even officially support the current GTX1650S in it. This made me rethink the whole works, especially in regard to MSI components. Just not impressed with that. Especially with GPU prices the way they are, if a new system board is necessary, I was never going to get desired results budgeting $500-$800 beyond the processor. So I scoured the net for deals, compared a lot of things through userbenchmark.com, and wound up with the following at what I felt were decent prices under the circumstances:

 

Ryzen 9 5900X - $613 (purchased Q4 2021)

6TB WD Black - $169 (purchased Q4 2022)

Asus KO 3060ti - $848 (purchased Q1 2022)

Asus B550M-K - $108 (purchased Q1 2022)

Corsair RM850x - $132 (purchased Q1 2022)

1TB SN850 M.2 - $187 (purchased Q1 2022)

 

Total to date: $2,057

 

The B550M-K has dual M.2 and supports PCIE 4.0. While it supports various RAM speeds, I opted to reuse my 2x16 DDR4-3200, as I don't see where faster RAM will make that much of a difference. Indeed, I only ordered the SN850 after seeing the SN850's 7000 MB/s vs the SN550's 2400-3200 (source-dependent) MB/s, feeling it might be money well spent. I also opted to reuse my current 1TB SN550 and 2TB WD Blue for auxiliary storage.

 

I feel I have compiled a rather well-rounded and matched component list, and it should do well, though I welcome any suggestions or input to that end, as nothing has been unboxed yet.

 

My concern is cooling. The upgrades will no doubt generate more heat, and as no cooler came with the 5900X, my plan was to reuse the 1700's cooler. I'd have to open up the machine to really look at it, but it is quite similar in appearance to AMD's Wraith, but perhaps with a larger heat sink. I am told air-cooling is just fine for the 5900X if not overclocked, but I thought I'd ask here. I have seen a few reviews and top picks for the 5900X / 5950X that are a bit more robust than what I currently have, and I don't want to risk cooking an expensive, hard-to-find processor by skimping on the cooling. I've already spent $2k, what's another $50 in cooling?

 

I plan to reuse the case as well to save money, as it is an okay-quality full ATX tower and my planned upgrades really don't warrant a new one. I'm pretty sure it is CyberPowerPC's "Onyxia" case, the one used on this machine, the CyberPowerPC GameMaster 1392A. It houses three fans, actual surface area four inches (101.6mm), two mounted sideways above the drive rack toward the front, the third facing the rear above the expansion slot covers. It has been adequate for the current setup, but I wonder if it is adequate for what I am about to put in it. There is one grille up top that I could fit another fan in. That said, I'm not big on flashy-blinky RGB stuff, the case cooling fans have RGB rings that I set to solid blue. Hopefully I can find one to match the existing ones if need be.

 

Thoughts?

[--SID--]

18 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

the B450M I have doesn't even officially support the current GTX1650S in it.

Who told you that?

18 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

My concern is cooling.

Mine too. Concerns about cooling of the VRM on the motherboard. Why such budget motherboard with poor VRM without any heatsink on it pairing with a high-end CPU?

 

[An0maly_76]

25 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

Apparently the B450M I have doesn't even officially support the current GTX1650S in it.

4 minutes ago, --SID-- said:

Who told you that?

No one told me per se, but it shut down on VGA POST error with the 1650S installed and would not boot until the GT1030 it came with was reinstalled. I'm told some prebuilts have a "GPU whitelist", and mine is originally a prebuilt, so this makes sense. Supported GPUs on userbenchmarks for this board don't include it either. After what I've seen, I won't even touch MSI components if I can help it now. OEM BIOS updates frying motherboards? Really?

6 minutes ago, --SID-- said:

Mine too. Concerns about cooling of the VRM on the motherboard. Why such budget motherboard with poor VRM without any heatsink on it pairing with a high-end CPU?

I selected the B550M-K for its dual M.2, 5000-series and PCIE4 support, assuming all other things being equal. I haven't unboxed anything yet, so if you have a suggestion for a more suitable motherboard (and cooler), I'm all ears. The B450M currently installed is a micro-ATX, but the case certainly seems to have room for a full ATX.

 

I hail from the days of MS-DOS, and haven't built a PC myself in years. Educate me on VRM and its cooling needs. My current rig was a prebuilt and its components were horribly mismatched - a GT1030 best suited for dual-core CPUs paired with an 8-core 1700? HDD primary storage when SSDs are the norm, especially when the machine is listed as having an SSD? This thing's been neurotic ever since MSI called themselves fixing whatever went wrong with the B450M regarding the 1650S upgrade. I decided if I wanted it right, I was going to have to do it myself.

[GeorgeMKane]

That case will likely not be adequate for your newer system. It looks like CyberPower trying to copy NZXT's H510 design, but in an even worse way. I would recommend a solid case upgrade, and a beast air cpu cooler. You'll need one for the 5900X.

 

If you can still return the motherboard, I would recommend a full ATX one too. The b550 tomahawk would support the 5900X MUCH better than that microATX motherboard would. Also the speeds of that SN850 aren't going to matter for gaming. At best, it may help A LITTLE with video rendering, but it's not worth the price.

 

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/BNw2Rv

[An0maly_76]

  

21 minutes ago, GeorgeMKane said:

That case will likely not be adequate for your newer system. It looks like CyberPower trying to copy NZXT's H510 design, but in an even worse way. I would recommend a solid case upgrade, and a beast air cpu cooler. You'll need one for the 5900X.

Not enough airflow?

21 minutes ago, GeorgeMKane said:

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/BNw2Rv

Thanks for the recommendations... This is a list I went with initially. I'd been considering the Cooler Master Hyper 212 cooler and the Phantex Enthoo Pro case at $139.99.

 

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/An0maly1976/saved/cJdDjX

 

Quite frankly, I'm a bit leery of MSI at this point. Here is an alternate board by Asus I'd considered on Amazon, very similar to the one you mentioned, I think. It's $20 below normal price of $170. Any potential issues with it?

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B088W57M4J/?coliid=I1JNTX3TAK5VF0&colid=2OK0DO3ED640D&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it

 

As for a CPU cooler, here is a page I found with recommendations the authors felt best suited to the 5900X...

 

https://www.perfecttechreviews.com/cpu-coolers/best-cpu-cooler-for-ryzen-9-5900x/

[GeorgeMKane]

14 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

  

Not enough airflow?

Thanks for the recommendations... This is a list I went with initially. I'd been considering the Cooler Master Hyper 212 cooler and the Phantex Enthoo Pro case at $139.99.

 

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/An0maly1976/saved/cJdDjX

 

Quite frankly, I'm a bit leery of MSI at this point. Here is an alternate board by Asus I'd considered on Amazon, very similar to the one you mentioned, I think. It's $20 below normal price of $170. Any potential issues with it?

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B088W57M4J/?coliid=I1JNTX3TAK5VF0&colid=2OK0DO3ED640D&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it

You can go with ASUS for sure. Just make sure the motherboard you select has enough headers for the front panel of the case. Definitely do NOT get something as small and inefficient as a hyper 212 for the 5900X. It will not cool the 5900X adequately at all. I would recommend the NH-U14S or Dark Rock 4, if you don't want to spend as much money on a NH-D15S or Dark Rock Pro 4.

 

EDIT: Yes, the airflow (or lack of) in your current case will really bad for the new system.

[An0maly_76]

So, the consensus is that I should return the SN850 and B550M-K for a full ATX B550 board and a better case, and invest in a heavy-duty cooler for the CPU?

[GeorgeMKane]

24 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

As for a CPU cooler, here is a page I found with recommendations the authors felt best suited to the 5900X...

 

https://www.perfecttechreviews.com/cpu-coolers/best-cpu-cooler-for-ryzen-9-5900x/

I've never used anything by Deepcool, but that cpu cooler seems to be reviewed okay. For only a little more, I would recommend the NH-U14S though. It's what I have installed my current rig. It's cooling my 3900X pretty nicely. https://pcpartpicker.com/product/DMjG3C/noctua-nh-u14s-8252-cfm-cpu-cooler-nh-u14s

 

EDIT: A lot of people have strongly stood by the Scythe FUMA 2 cpu cooler too btw. If you're in a pinch money wise, I would recommend that one too. I've seen it recommended in a lot of threads and across other forums as well. https://pcpartpicker.com/product/YsHRsY/scythe-fuma-2-5117-cfm-cpu-cooler-scfm-2000

Edited February 27, 2022 by GeorgeMKane

[An0maly_76]

17 minutes ago, GeorgeMKane said:

I've never used anything by Deepcool, but that cpu cooler seems to be reviewed okay. For only a little more, I would recommend the NH-U14S though. It's what I have installed my current rig. It's cooling my 3900X pretty nicely. https://pcpartpicker.com/product/DMjG3C/noctua-nh-u14s-8252-cfm-cpu-cooler-nh-u14s

Thanks for the recommendation. Typing in that model # on Amazon brought up some interesting options. I kind of like the NH-D15. I'm curious, these don't look to be liquid cooled (or are they)? If not, how exactly is the heat getting to the radiators? And might the extra size and mass put too much stress on the socket in a tower configuration?

 

As for the SN850, even compared to my current SN550, it isn't worth it?

Edited February 27, 2022 by An0maly_76

[GeorgeMKane]

15 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

Thanks for the recommendation. Typing in that model # on Amazon brought up some interesting options. I kind of like the NH-D15. I'm curious, these don't look to be liquid cooled (or are they)? If not, how exactly is the heat getting to the radiators? And might the extra size and mass put too much stress on the socket in a tower configuration?

 

As for the SN850, even compared to my current SN550, it isn't worth it?

Nope, they're high end air cpu coolers. Liquid cooling isn't required to cool a 5900X or 5950X even. You can look at the reviews on pcpartpicker for each cooler, to better get an idea of how they run and how well they run.

 

It'll be about the same for gaming. Gaming more depends on cpu, ram, and gpu. Not storage speed. As long as you don't have your games running on a regular HDD, then the games will load very well, so long as the other 3 I mentioned are great.

[An0maly_76]

9 minutes ago, GeorgeMKane said:

Nope, they're high end air cpu coolers. Liquid cooling isn't required to cool a 5900X or 5950X even. You can look at the reviews on pcpartpicker for each cooler, to better get an idea of how they run and how well they run.

 

It'll be about the same for gaming. Gaming more depends on cpu, ram, and gpu. Not storage speed. As long as you don't have your games running on a regular HDD, then the games will load very well, so long as the other 3 I mentioned are great.

I'm also seeing where the SN850s run a good bit hotter than an SN550 or SN570. Something else to consider, I guess. It sounds like I should stick with my SN550/SN570 (maybe buy a second), swap the microATX for a better full ATX, and return the SN850 for some 4000hz RAM and a better case?

[GeorgeMKane]

28 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

I'm also seeing where the SN850s run a good bit hotter than an SN550 or SN570. Something else to consider, I guess. It sounds like I should stick with my SN550/SN570 (maybe buy a second), swap the microATX for a better full ATX, and return the SN850 for some 4000hz RAM and a better case?

Yeah. Probably skip the RAM though. Your RAM is fast enough, so you can save money there. Maybe get double the RAM (exact same kit of RAM, or at least same speed and latency if you can't buy your RAM anymore), or put that money towards even more SSD storage.  

[Jeppes]

Thermalright PA120, Scythe Fuma 2 or Deepcool ak620 for cooler. PA120 best value for sure, AK620 best one of the bunch but still way under Noctua's bloated pricing.

[An0maly_76]

4 hours ago, GeorgeMKane said:

Yeah. Probably skip the RAM though. Your RAM is fast enough, so you can save money there. Maybe get double the RAM (exact same kit of RAM, or at least same speed and latency if you can't buy your RAM anymore).

 

Double the RAM?  I have 32GB now... Isn't 64GB overkill at this point?

  

4 hours ago, Jeppes said:

Thermalright PA120, Scythe Fuma 2 or Deepcool ak620 for cooler. PA120 best value for sure, AK620 best one of the bunch but still way under Noctua's bloated pricing.

 

Sometimes you get what you pay for, too, though, that's been my experience at times. Especially when I tried to boost performance on a $500 budget with the GTX1650S, SN550 M.2 and more RAM. The biggest Achilles Heel being the GTX1650S, of course. I'll just have to compare...

 

Returning the SN850 and B550M-K refunds me $294.48 from Amazon. Also ordered from Amazon...

 

$149.99 - Asus Tuf Gaming B550 Plus ATX

$  59.99 - Scythe Mugen 5

$209.98 Total

 

Just have to box things up and take them to UPS tomorrow.

 

Which brings me to my case in point (no pun intended), opinions on this case? Granted, it's not a tower, but lots of room for expansion. Not sure it would have enough room for the coolers mentioned, but plenty of room for airflow for sure.

 

I like this Corsair Obsidian 550D, but it's a bit pricey at $262... Looks like it will need additional fans as well... Another $100.

 

Here is a nice Corsair iCUE 4000X MidTower for $130.....

 

Can also get that Corsair 4000X bundled with a water cooler... I'd probably disable the RGB unless I could set it to solid blue, though. Thoughts?

Edited February 28, 2022 by An0maly_76
New info

[GeorgeMKane]

5 hours ago, An0maly_76 said:

 

Double the RAM?  I have 32GB now... Isn't 64GB overkill at this point?

 

 

Can also get that Corsair 4000X bundled with a water cooler... I'd probably disable the RGB unless I could set it to solid blue, though. Thoughts?

I saw 2x earlier, but forgot it was 2x16. Yeah, you're good then.  

 

RGB can set to a solid or pulsing color. Whatever you prefer.

[An0maly_76]

1 minute ago, GeorgeMKane said:

I saw 2x earlier, but forgot it was 2x16. Yeah, you're good then.  

 

RGB can set to a solid or pulsing color. Whatever you prefer.

So you think the Corsair 4000 is sufficient then?

[An0maly_76]

So now I'm approaching $2600 total, more than twice what I figured for high side of a budget (not because I couldn't afford it, but because I didn't want to go completely insane). The total disheartened me, and then I looked at a site my sister told me to check out. Similar build would run almost $3800. So I feel much better knowing I actually am saving money over what I could be spending. And I won't get the same mismatched, bottlenecked mess I got the first time. Agh. I really hope this thing doesn't make me regret this... Ordered the B550 Plus ATX, Corsair 4000 case, Scythe Mugen 5 cooler and fans tonight... Sending the M-K and SN850 back tomorrow.

[Somerandomtechyboi]

13 hours ago, An0maly_76 said:

Asus B550M-K

 

13 hours ago, An0maly_76 said:

Ryzen 9 5900X

 

[An0maly_76]

11 hours ago, Somerandomtechyboi said:

Especially with a WD Black SN850 M.2, given that a tester on YouBoobs noted their test unit hit 100 degrees.

Thanks for the heads-up. Sid and GMK alerted me to this earlier. I swapped the B550M-K  and SN850 for an Asus Tuf Gaming B550-Plus and Scythe Mugen 5 cooler last night and sending the fire hazards back to hell with Elmo where they belong. Thanks, folks, seriously, I almost made the same dumb-a** mistake whoever built my current rig did. Mismatched and under-engineered parts... I researched this as best I could, I swear. Seriously, though, thanks to all who have steered me clear of preventable potential problems.

 

I was really trying to hold to a $1500 max budget... I'm now at $2,350 before SSD and RAM, which I can pull from my current rig or buy new for another $300. After some more thought, I'm leaning towards swapping the Scythe Mugen 5 for a Noctua NH-D15, but I need some real-world comparison and performance figures. I've already seen the LTT video showing that air-cooling's advantage is lower temps, but is countered by liquid-cooling's consistency. I want to know what, if any, performance variations there are between these two models.
 

 

 

Edited February 28, 2022 by An0maly_76
More info added, more info needed.

[An0maly_76]

Started assembly last night. Here's some build porn for the hardcore. A few small snags aside, build is progressing nicely, methinks. Board, PSU, fans and controller are in. I stopped short of installing processor and cooler, as I'd like some input from others who have used such a cooler in a tower orientation like this. It will be cooling a Ryzen 5900X.

 

 

 

I'm starting to think I should have gotten a full tower rather than a mid-tower, especially after test-fitting the Scythe Mugen 5 I ordered. There is BARELY (and I MEAN BARELY) enough room for it, and I worry that it may intrude into space needed for the RTX3060ti I plan to install. I'm also not sure the fully assembled Mugen 5 will clear the case fans, or the case, once installed. But to me, there is a secondary issue. I know the board has a backing plate for mounting a cooler, but it's still mounted IN THE BOARD, and I really don't think it was designed to support the mass of this type of cooler in this orientation. Now that I feel its mass, I wonder how this thing hanging sideways doesn't literally break the CPU socket out of the board, and I'm considering swapping it for a Noctua if its design / mass puts less stress on the CPU socket area. I'd love to hear from anyone using such a massive cooler in a tower orientation.

 

There's another problem here as well, methinks. The case's top has a nice filter, so obviously, the top case fans should draw air IN. Tower orientation appears to put the Mugen's fans facing up and down. So if heat is being sucked away from the Mugen's core, this puts the topside cooler fan and topside case fans in a stalemate, hence little to no airflow. Can the Mugen's fans be rewired or reoriented to blow the same direction (i.e., both fans blowing downward)? Or can the cooler be turned 90 degrees to avoid this problem altogether?

 

I also thought about something. This case allows for vertical GPU risers. I could always do this if the CPU cooler takes up too much space, but if not necessary, I wonder if there are smaller fans I could populate this area of the case's rear to help exhaust hot air.

 

I know, I know, my fan controller wiring is a mess. Can't really be helped for now. This case is nice, but to me, doesn't really lend itself to hiding wiring as Corsair would have us believe, and doesn't offer many places to mount the controller. The PSU channel put its magnetic mount too close to my HDD cage for my liking. More reasons I think I should have opted for a full tower. Then again, the leads simply aren't long enough to run them where I'd like, something I suspect a larger case would compound. Hopefully I can tidy it up a bit more before it's finished.

 

I chose Corsair's iCUE Commander X on a recommendation. It has thermal inputs and came with thermal probes. I'm told they're not required for fan control, but would I have smarter, more effective fan control if I used them? Obviously higher temps would run them wide open, but seems to me it could make the machine quieter if the fans were slowed when less airflow was needed. I also think it would be nice if this gives me a way of viewing processor temp through iCUE if I can't otherwise view it. Also, do these thermal probes simply probe the GPU and CPU cooler / heat sink, or some other method?

 

A bit of a bummer -- it seems my board supports built-in 3.2 Gen 2, but has no 3.2 header. Simple adapter, no big deal, but I feel such an adapter should have come with the case or mobo. This also means the front-panel 3.2 Type C will be choked to 3.0 speeds. Rather minor annoyance, but as I don't use front-panel USB much anyway, not a deal-breaker.

 

Thanks in advance for any input on these issues, and a shout-out to Sid, jeppes, GeorgeMKane and srtb for their guidance thus far. Without their advice, I would have been building an incinerator instead of a computer.

Edited March 2, 2022 by An0maly_76
Revised, more info

[Jonathan Lee]

31 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

I'm starting to think I should have gotten a full tower rather than a mid-tower, especially after test-fitting the Scythe Mugen 5 I ordered.

Most good air coolers tend to be at the edge of the glass panel, so it's fine. Yea I would be concerned about the top fans as well. I have the scythe mugen 5 for my mid tower and it is fairly close to the top of the case. At worst, you can just remove the top fans.

 

38 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

I know the board has a backing plate for mounting a cooler, but it's still mounted IN THE BOARD, and I really don't think it was designed to support the mass of this type of cooler in this orientation.

You doubt all the engineers who put work into designing this? Okay. I have in my PC and it holds up just fine. Unless you constantly move it around it should be a problem

 

33 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

There's another problem here as well, methinks. The case's top has a nice filter, so obviously, the top case fans should draw air IN.

Typically, you want front to blow air in and top and back to blow air out. That way the fresh air flows in from the front of the case and the other fans exhaust the hot air from the system. This prevents hot air from recirculation in the PC and causing the components to heat up faster. 

[An0maly_76]

 

25 minutes ago, Jonathan Lee said:

Most good air coolers tend to be at the edge of the glass panel, so it's fine. Yea I would be concerned about the top fans as well. I have the scythe mugen 5 for my mid tower and it is fairly close to the top of the case. At worst, you can just remove the top fans.

 

You doubt all the engineers who put work into designing this? Okay. I have in my PC and it holds up just fine. Unless you constantly move it around it should be a problem

 

Typically, you want front to blow air in and top and back to blow air out. That way the fresh air flows in from the front of the case and the other fans exhaust the hot air from the system. This prevents hot air from recirculation in the PC and causing the components to heat up faster. 

Typically, I would agree with the airflow path. However, this case has filters front, top, bottom and rear, which to me suggests that more intakes are better. Of course, you have to exhaust somewhere. I get that removing the top fans is an option. I just think with this build, I need all the airflow into this case I can get. I am hoping that iCUE software can control fan direction, otherwise, I used an RGB fan for the rear for nothing. I'm not really into RGB per se, but it is nice to have a little color lighting for ambience.

 

And while I get your point about doubting the engineers, and that others probably have the same setup with no issue, it just seems to me that it would be far sturdier if case mobo trays were solid with built-in standoffs to screw the coolers into. Keep in mind, I don't know how long coolers of this size have been around, but if they haven't been around much longer than the 5000-series Ryzens, there could be issues down the road. Which begs the question, just how long have coolers of this size been around? I'm just saying, a cooler this massive could probably use a little support at the further extremities to reduce stress on the board. In this situation, perhaps some sort of hanger from the top case fan frames. Just a thought.

Edited March 2, 2022 by An0maly_76

[Jonathan Lee]

12 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

I need all the airflow into this case I can get. I am hoping that iCUE software can control fan direction

Yea understand your concern here. I run two intakes and exhaust fan with my set-up and thermals are in control. For fan direction, you would have to flip the fans around to change the airflow direction.

 

14 minutes ago, An0maly_76 said:

And while I get your point about doubting the engineers, and that others probably have the same setup with no issue, it just seems to me that it would be far sturdier if case mobo trays were solid with built-in standoffs to screw the coolers into.

I agree it would be sturdier for them to mount directly to the case. I believe the only reason they don't do this is because the mounting positions change with motherboards every couple of generations. So the case manufacturers would have to redesign their case depending on the socket. I.E. AM4 socket mounting is not the same as LGA1200 (10/11th gen intel). LGA1700 (12th gen intel) mounting is different from their older gen. Probably would end up being more confusing for the customer too XD

[An0maly_76]

 

14 minutes ago, Jonathan Lee said:

Yea understand your concern here. I run two intakes and exhaust fan with my set-up and thermals are in control. For fan direction, you would have to flip the fans around to change the airflow direction.

 

I agree it would be sturdier for them to mount directly to the case. I believe the only reason they don't do this is because the mounting positions change with motherboards every couple of generations. So the case manufacturers would have to redesign their case depending on the socket. I.E. AM4 socket mounting is not the same as LGA1200 (10/11th gen intel). LGA1700 (12th gen intel) mounting is different from their older gen. Probably would end up being more confusing for the customer too XD

 

What I would suggest to help that situation is to have a modular center plate for this area, with swappable plates to fit different processors required. Yeah, it might be a little confusing for some folks, but for most it's a one-time deal and would cure what I feel is a major design flaw while not forcing manufacturers into a major redesign so often. It certainly would be easier on the board.

 

Flipping a fan is no big deal if it's just a regular fan. But with RGB rings, that puts the lighting to the outside. I'd prefer to keep it in the case, but who knows, I might just like the effect. Guess I'll have to wait and see. I think if I didn't have a 5900X and RTX3060ti on top of each other and a planned M.2 with barely enough room for a sufficient cooler (and I still don't know that I won't have to use a vertical riser for the GPU), I wouldn't be so concerned. However, I already know that heat is an issue with my current rig's case, otherwise I would have reused it. I'm at $2350 and counting with this build, and with that kind of money invested, I'm not leaving ANYTHING to chance if I can help it.

Edited March 2, 2022 by An0maly_76
Revised, more info

[An0maly_76]

So, I figured on doing a test fit tonight to check clearance from CPU cooler to GPU, etc. I was just about to open the box for the GPU, when... HELLO! I noticed the box showed signs of having been opened before (it was listed as NEW condition on Amazon as purchased). I'll definitely be taking this up with Amazon in the morning. *more below*

 

 

 

This is enough of a pickle to find myself in. I don't even know for sure if I got what I paid for or I got scammed. But opening the box, everything appears legit. I perched the GPU on its slot, not actually inserting it, and balanced the Mugen 5 on the stock CPU cooler brackets. I don't like what I see.



It seems like I'll either be blasting the GPU with the CPU's heat, or slowly cooking it with the CPU heat sink. And that's assuming I can even get all this to fit in the same area. I noticed the Thermalright Peerless Assassin is oriented 90 degrees from the Scythe Mugen, blowing toward the rear exhaust fan, a better situation, methinks, but it might not fit widthwise. I could also get a vertical mount kit and completely remove the GPU from the equation by parking it on top of the power supply (the case appears to be designed for this). Thoughts?