[NOOB here] New Gaming Laptop but cinebench score are very low and low fps on games

[Abdullah010]

Specifications

Acer Nitro 5 AN515-54

PROCESSOR: Intel® Core i7-9750H CPU @ 2.60GHz 6 cores 12 threads

RAM: 16 GB DDR4 SDRAM

Motherboard: CFL Octavia_CFS

GPU: Nvidia GTX 1660 ti 6GB

 

Everything was working fine, although the max temperature used to hit 90 degrees+, but I got decent fps on games, but recently the games started to lag, a lot, even on low I can't get 30 fps, so i ran some bench marks results

Cinebench r23 : 3079 pts and it should be around 6500+ pts

cinebench r20: 1325 where it should be 2653

 

I haven't faced any issues like this before... so don't know how to handle them and don't want to do something stupid

 

 

 

[MingLee420]

3 minutes ago, Abdullah010 said:

Specifications

Acer Nitro 5 AN515-54

PROCESSOR: Intel® Core i7-9750H CPU @ 2.60GHz 6 cores 12 threads

RAM: 16 GB DDR4 SDRAM

Motherboard: CFL Octavia_CFS

GPU: Nvidia GTX 1660 ti 6GB

 

Everything was working fine, although the max temperature used to hit 90 degrees+, but I got decent fps on games, but recently the games started to lag, a lot, even on low I can't get 30 fps, so i ran some bench marks results

Cinebench r23 : 3079 pts and it should be around 6500+ pts

cinebench r20: 1325 where it should be 2653

 

I haven't faced any issues like this before... so don't know how to handle them and don't want to do something stupid

 

 

 

make sure you're plugged in with power /otherwise it wont perform great somtimes it uses the intel uhd 630 when on battery mode

[Abdullah010]

3 minutes ago, MingLee420 said:

make sure you're plugged in with power /otherwise it wont perform great somtimes it uses the intel uhd 630 when on battery mode

always using it on plugged, but still can't get fps nor good bench results

[MingLee420]

3 minutes ago, Abdullah010 said:

always using it on plugged, but still can't get fps nor good bench results

hmmmm maybe try to edit power plan and choose the highest performance one

[MingLee420]

4 minutes ago, Abdullah010 said:

always using it on plugged, but still can't get fps nor good bench results

and check if nvidia control panel in the manage 3d settings check if the gpu selected is the 1660

[Snowarch]

Check control pannel. It could be set to use igpu. Some its in settings per game in windows or control pannel settings.

[unclewebb]

@Abdullah010 Your Cinebench score is way below where it should be. That is a sign of CPU throttling; either thermal throttling or power limit throttling. To understand what is going on try running ThrottleStop.

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-throttlestop/

 

Post a screenshot of ThrottleStop with the Limit Reasons window open while the CPU is loaded running Cinebench. Any boxes lighting up red in Limit Reasons will show you why your CPU is throttling. It is even better if you turn on the Log File option in ThrottleStop. That way you will have a record of your CPU performance. Any reasons for throttling will be recorded in the log file. When finished testing, exit ThrottleStop and attach a log file to your next post. The log file will be in your ThrottleStop / Logs folder. Post some screenshots of your tests including pictures of the FIVR and TPL windows so I can see what your power limits are set to. 

 

The Acer Nitro 5 enforces power limit throttling but your Nitro 5 is running a lot worse than it should be. When your computer is idle at the desktop, what does ThrottleStop report for C0%. This is a good way to find out if something is running in the background. Typical idle C0% should be around 1.0% or less. 

 

[Abdullah010]

17 hours ago, unclewebb said:

@Abdullah010 Your Cinebench score is way below where it should be. That is a sign of CPU throttling; either thermal throttling or power limit throttling. To understand what is going on try running ThrottleStop.

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-throttlestop/

 

Post a screenshot of ThrottleStop with the Limit Reasons window open while the CPU is loaded running Cinebench. Any boxes lighting up red in Limit Reasons will show you why your CPU is throttling. It is even better if you turn on the Log File option in ThrottleStop. That way you will have a record of your CPU performance. Any reasons for throttling will be recorded in the log file. When finished testing, exit ThrottleStop and attach a log file to your next post. The log file will be in your ThrottleStop / Logs folder. Post some screenshots of your tests including pictures of the FIVR and TPL windows so I can see what your power limits are set to. 

 

The Acer Nitro 5 enforces power limit throttling but your Nitro 5 is running a lot worse than it should be. When your computer is idle at the desktop, what does ThrottleStop report for C0%. This is a good way to find out if something is running in the background. Typical idle C0% should be around 1.0% or less. 

 

I did all the tests that you asked and here are results... 

[Abdullah010]

20 hours ago, unclewebb said:

@Abdullah010 Your Cinebench score is way below where it should be. That is a sign of CPU throttling; either thermal throttling or power limit throttling. To understand what is going on try running ThrottleStop.

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-throttlestop/

 

Post a screenshot of ThrottleStop with the Limit Reasons window open while the CPU is loaded running Cinebench. Any boxes lighting up red in Limit Reasons will show you why your CPU is throttling. It is even better if you turn on the Log File option in ThrottleStop. That way you will have a record of your CPU performance. Any reasons for throttling will be recorded in the log file. When finished testing, exit ThrottleStop and attach a log file to your next post. The log file will be in your ThrottleStop / Logs folder. Post some screenshots of your tests including pictures of the FIVR and TPL windows so I can see what your power limits are set to. 

 

The Acer Nitro 5 enforces power limit throttling but your Nitro 5 is running a lot worse than it should be. When your computer is idle at the desktop, what does ThrottleStop report for C0%. This is a good way to find out if something is running in the background. Typical idle C0% should be around 1.0% or less. 

 

the log file...the C0% is greater than 1 when idle

2021-09-12.txt

[unclewebb]

@Abdullah010 ThrottleStop makes it easy to see what the problem is. Look at all of your screenshots when the CPU is loaded. In Limit Reasons under the CORE column it shows THERMAL in red. Your CPU is over heating and constantly thermal throttling. It is so bad that your CPU when fully loaded is running at less than half of its rated speed. That is the main reason why your benchmark scores are so bad.

 

The far right column of the log file shows constant TEMP messages which indicates constant thermal throttling. A properly designed laptop should not be thermal throttling at all while running Cinebench. 

 

The first picture shows the maximum temperature for one core is 83°C and for another core it is 97°C. When there is a significant temperature difference between two fully loaded cores doing the exact same thing, that either means your heatsink is not sitting square to the cores or the thermal paste was not applied correctly. The laptop needs to be disassembled and the heatsink on the CPU needs to be closely examined to make sure it is perfectly flat so it covers the cores equally.  

 

Another problem is the Intel specified thermal throttling temperature for the 9750H is 100°C.

 

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/191045/intel-core-i7-9750h-processor-12m-cache-up-to-4-50-ghz.html

 

Acer has lowered the thermal throttling temperature to 92°C so your CPU starts slowing down way sooner compared to the competition's laptops. That is what PROCHOT 92°C means in ThrottleStop. The processor hot signal is being triggered at 92°C. On some laptops this can be adjusted but Acer usually locks this setting. Post a screenshot of the Options window. If you see a lock icon near PROCHOT Offset, the thermal throttling temperature is locked by Acer and it cannot be adjusted. 

 

 

2 hours ago, Abdullah010 said:

the C0% is greater than 1 when idle

That is not great but it is the least of your problems. You need to significantly improve the cooling to get maximum performance out of your computer. Use a top quality paste like Noctua NT-H2 or a similar paste that works well at temperatures that are continuously high. I think the real problem is an under designed cooling system in your Acer computer.  

 

 

[Abdullah010]

50 minutes ago, unclewebb said:

@Abdullah010 ThrottleStop makes it easy to see what the problem is. Look at all of your screenshots when the CPU is loaded. In Limit Reasons under the CORE column it shows THERMAL in red. Your CPU is over heating and constantly thermal throttling. It is so bad that your CPU when fully loaded is running at less than half of its rated speed. That is the main reason why your benchmark scores are so bad.

 

The far right column of the log file shows constant TEMP messages which indicates constant thermal throttling. A properly designed laptop should not be thermal throttling at all while running Cinebench. 

 

The first picture shows the maximum temperature for one core is 83°C and for another core it is 97°C. When there is a significant temperature difference between two fully loaded cores doing the exact same thing, that either means your heatsink is not sitting square to the cores or the thermal paste was not applied correctly. The laptop needs to be disassembled and the heatsink on the CPU needs to be closely examined to make sure it is perfectly flat so it covers the cores equally.  

 

Another problem is the Intel specified thermal throttling temperature for the 9750H is 100°C.

 

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/191045/intel-core-i7-9750h-processor-12m-cache-up-to-4-50-ghz.html

 

Acer has lowered the thermal throttling temperature to 92°C so your CPU starts slowing down way sooner compared to the competition's laptops. That is what PROCHOT 92°C means in ThrottleStop. The processor hot signal is being triggered at 92°C. On some laptops this can be adjusted but Acer usually locks this setting. Post a screenshot of the Options window. If you see a lock icon near PROCHOT Offset, the thermal throttling temperature is locked by Acer and it cannot be adjusted. 

 

 

That is not great but it is the least of your problems. You need to significantly improve the cooling to get maximum performance out of your computer. Use a top quality paste like Noctua NT-H2 or a similar paste that works well at temperatures that are continuously high. I think the real problem is an under designed cooling system in your Acer computer.  

 

 

I am currently not gaming or doing any heavy usage stuff, just regular college stuff, do i need to get it repasted immediately or can it wait, without causing any damage?  if it's necessary i can get it repasted by wednesday.

[unclewebb]

@Abdullah010 You can wait as long as you want. Intel says that any temperature under 100°C is a safe operating temperature. The thermal throttling temperature has been deliberately set low by Acer so it will always be at a safe temperature. 

 

Thermal throttling is slowing your computer down so it cannot reach maximum performance. This is a common problem. The 9750H needs 80W or 90W to run at its full rated speed. Your computer is thermal throttling at only 30W. The cooling system has to be almost perfect to deal with the heat a 9750H can put out. Most laptops are poorly engineered and far from perfect. 

 

You should learn how to replace the thermal paste yourself. Watch some YouTube videos. It is not that difficult to do. You might have to try doing this 2 or 3 times or more before you get it right. If you take it to the local shop and you still have problems, then what? 

[Abdullah010]

On 9/12/2021 at 9:45 PM, unclewebb said:

@Abdullah010 You can wait as long as you want. Intel says that any temperature under 100°C is a safe operating temperature. The thermal throttling temperature has been deliberately set low by Acer so it will always be at a safe temperature. 

 

Thermal throttling is slowing your computer down so it cannot reach maximum performance. This is a common problem. The 9750H needs 80W or 90W to run at its full rated speed. Your computer is thermal throttling at only 30W. The cooling system has to be almost perfect to deal with the heat a 9750H can put out. Most laptops are poorly engineered and far from perfect. 

 

You should learn how to replace the thermal paste yourself. Watch some YouTube videos. It is not that difficult to do. You might have to try doing this 2 or 3 times or more before you get it right. If you take it to the local shop and you still have problems, then what? 

Hello, sorry i had a really busy week, but i got my laptop repasted, i couldn't find noctua or thermal grizzly, but i managed to find a cooler master master gel regular, best i could find, my laptop is performing much better, giving avg 50+ fps on games, but the bench scores are still low.... i have uploaded the current stats, its giving me edp other and pl1, pl2 limiting, can you please guide me as to what should i do....

[Abdullah010]

On 9/12/2021 at 9:45 PM, unclewebb said:

@Abdullah010 You can wait as long as you want. Intel says that any temperature under 100°C is a safe operating temperature. The thermal throttling temperature has been deliberately set low by Acer so it will always be at a safe temperature. 

 

Thermal throttling is slowing your computer down so it cannot reach maximum performance. This is a common problem. The 9750H needs 80W or 90W to run at its full rated speed. Your computer is thermal throttling at only 30W. The cooling system has to be almost perfect to deal with the heat a 9750H can put out. Most laptops are poorly engineered and far from perfect. 

 

You should learn how to replace the thermal paste yourself. Watch some YouTube videos. It is not that difficult to do. You might have to try doing this 2 or 3 times or more before you get it right. If you take it to the local shop and you still have problems, then what? 

here is the throttlestop log file...

2021-09-18.txt

[unclewebb]

@Abdullah010 The 9750H has a 45W TDP rating.

 

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/191045/intel-core-i7-9750h-processor-12m-cache-up-to-4-50-ghz.html

 

To get maximum performance out of a 9750H, it needs 80W to 90W. Some manufacturers have unlocked power limits so the 9750H can run at its full rated speed when fully loaded. On most Acer laptops, they enforce the 45W TDP limit so their computers cannot compete with unlocked computers. You have significantly improved the cooling but you still have this 45W power limit that is holding you back when running Cinebench. When gaming, your CPU is not fully loaded so this is less of a problem.

 

You can try some adjustments but I do not think that you can use ThrottleStop to get beyond the 45W limitation. One thing that will help is undervolting your CPU. Less voltage equals less power consumption. This allows the CPU to run a little faster before it reaches the 45W power limit. In the FIVR window I would set the core offset to -125 mV and the cache offset to -100 mV. This is usually a good place to start testing. 

 

Open the TPL window and try setting both the PL1 and PL2 Turbo Power Limits to 60. Also check the MMIO Lock option. You can leave the PL1 Clamp option checked. On unlocked computers, these settings can be used to get beyond the 45W power limit. With your computer, even with these settings, I think it is still going to be power limited long term to 45W. After you make these adjustments, run Cinebench again and watch power consumption to see if it is power limit throttling at 60W or at 45W.

 

 

While in the TPL window I would check the Speed Shift box and I would set Power Limit 4 to 0. This tells the CPU to ignore this limit. 

 

In the FIVR window I would set IccMax for the core and the cache to the maximum value, 255.75. This can help with EDP OTHER throttling. 

 

Run Cinebench again and run another log file. Post a FIVR screenshot so I can make sure that your voltages are set correctly. Your computer is never going to set any Cinebench world records but hopefully for gaming it is much improved. 

 

Edit - If you apply the core and cache offset voltages correctly, these voltage values should show up in the FIVR monitoring table.

 

[Abdullah010]

3 hours ago, unclewebb said:

@Abdullah010 The 9750H has a 45W TDP rating.

 

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/191045/intel-core-i7-9750h-processor-12m-cache-up-to-4-50-ghz.html

 

To get maximum performance out of a 9750H, it needs 80W to 90W. Some manufacturers have unlocked power limits so the 9750H can run at its full rated speed when fully loaded. On most Acer laptops, they enforce the 45W TDP limit so their computers cannot compete with unlocked computers. You have significantly improved the cooling but you still have this 45W power limit that is holding you back when running Cinebench. When gaming, your CPU is not fully loaded so this is less of a problem.

 

You can try some adjustments but I do not think that you can use ThrottleStop to get beyond the 45W limitation. One thing that will help is undervolting your CPU. Less voltage equals less power consumption. This allows the CPU to run a little faster before it reaches the 45W power limit. In the FIVR window I would set the core offset to -125 mV and the cache offset to -100 mV. This is usually a good place to start testing. 

 

Open the TPL window and try setting both the PL1 and PL2 Turbo Power Limits to 60. Also check the MMIO Lock option. You can leave the PL1 Clamp option checked. On unlocked computers, these settings can be used to get beyond the 45W power limit. With your computer, even with these settings, I think it is still going to be power limited long term to 45W. After you make these adjustments, run Cinebench again and watch power consumption to see if it is power limit throttling at 60W or at 45W.

 

 

While in the TPL window I would check the Speed Shift box and I would set Power Limit 4 to 0. This tells the CPU to ignore this limit. 

 

In the FIVR window I would set IccMax for the core and the cache to the maximum value, 255.75. This can help with EDP OTHER throttling. 

 

Run Cinebench again and run another log file. Post a FIVR screenshot so I can make sure that your voltages are set correctly. Your computer is never going to set any Cinebench world records but hopefully for gaming it is much improved. 

 

Edit - If you apply the core and cache offset voltages correctly, these voltage values should show up in the FIVR monitoring table.

 

I did all the tweaks, couldn't understand Power Limit, so before repasting i was getting a score of 3300, after repasting i was getting a score of 4900, and after undervollting i am getting a score of 5400, i think that's a big upgrade for my pc, i am attaching the log file and screenshots down below, tell me if i can do something more without any kind of risk because i am kinda satisfied with these scores, and thank you very much for your help....

2021-09-19.txt

[unclewebb]

6 hours ago, unclewebb said:

set Power Limit 4 to 0

 

Do not check the PP0 Lock box in the picture above. Only the MMIO Lock box at the top of the TPL window should be checked. 

 

Intel CPUs have three different sets of turbo power limits. ThrottleStop only lets you adjust two sets of power limits. You can use ThrottleStop to control the MSR power limits and the MMIO power limits. There is still a third set of turbo power limits that only Acer has access to.

 

The first two power limits are set correctly.

 

 

The problem is that inside your computer, Acer has set the third set of power limits to 45W. That means when you run any benchmark program like Cinebench, long term your CPU will always throttle and slow down so it does not exceed 45W. That is what your testing is showing. Power throttling at 45.0W.

 

 

Even though your CPU is only at 76°C, Acer has decided to limit your CPU to exactly 45.0W. Your CPU is forced to slow down so power consumption does not exceed 45W. There is no way to fix this limitation. If you do not like this limitation, do not buy an Acer laptop next time. 

 

Lowering the voltage means the CPU can run faster before it reaches the 45W limit. That is why your benchmark scores are better. The new paste is helping your CPU run cooler and less voltage is helping your CPU run more efficiently. Your very first screenshot on this page shows the CPU overheating when power consumption is only 31.8W. That was terrible. The average multiplier when running Cinebench was only 18.38. The screenshot above now shows a CPU multiplier of 29.12. Power consumption is at 45.0W and the CPU is not over heating anymore. Your computer is definitely running a lot better. Your Cinebench scores have improved significantly.  

 

You can try to undervolt some more. There is still some room for improvement. If you undervolt too much, your computer will not be stable. If you see a blue screen (BSOD) when testing, that means your CPU needs more voltage. Games might randomly exit if the voltage is not enough.

 

Try testing with Cinebench with the core and the cache both at -125 mV. Leave the cache at -125 mV and do some more tests. Set the core to -150 mV, and then -175 mV and then -200 mV. Some people get their best Cinebench results at -125 mV cache and -200 mV core. If this setting is Cinebench stable, it might not be game stable. Games are more random compared to Cinebench so you might need to adjust the voltage so your games are stable.  

 

Your computer is not using the MSR power limits so if you want, you can set PL1 and PL2 back to their default values of 45W and 56W. You can also check the Disable Power Limit Control box. Setting these power limits to 60W did not help anything so it is OK to go back to default values. I would still check the MMIO Lock box. ThrottleStop is more efficient when power limits are locked. ThrottleStop does not have to constantly check for any changes if it knows that a power limit is locked.