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Threadripper? Threadripper PRO? Threadripper Gen4? Future options?

Hello everyone,

 

I've been researching CPUs and I'm leaning towards AMD's Threadripper. I would appreciate your clarification, expertise, and/or advice on some of the thoughts and questions I've listed below, to help me decide on a CPU.

 

Extra/background info: recently sold my 2013 trashcan. I've been blind for so long and I'm choosing to step into the light with a new PC work/gaming station. Alas, the time has come for me to venture for an upgrade! More often than not, I would run heavy music sessions. As my rig grew, it incorporated running those sessions along with light designs and videos simultaneously for performances. The new station is also required to handle video production and other similar tasks. Lastly, I'd like for this PC to run games during off-hours. I've been doing as much research as I can on processors since it's the first element I'm looking at for the build. However, I'm not as well-read or experienced on some of the finer details when it comes to processors. I currently have a temporary set up that I'm surviving on, so I don't mind waiting, learning, and doing this build right.

 

I've realized this post is a lot longer than I intended as I went over it again. To hopefully lighten things up, you can listen to my music as you go over this post, should you choose to do so: https://song.link/ae/i/1490836770

 

1) Differences between Threadripper and Threadripper PRO? For example:

Besides their slight and obvious differences in:

  • Base clock speed,
  • Maybe the ability to overclock?
  • Socket Count (not really sure what this means), and;
  • Key features (saw some differences here in supported technologies)

Is there a clear and obvious winner between the two categories? Is one more suitable for my uses than the other? Is one better because of it's architecture/features or anything else like that?

 

2) Is the 4th Gen Threadripper going to be released soon..ish?

 

If I'm not mistaken, this is the 3rd gen of AMD's Threadripper? And I don't know how reliable this information is, but I keep seeing something about a leaked AMD roadmap and Gen 4 or the 4000 series of the Threadripper being released later this year or some time in Q1 next year? Not that the current offering is bad, but if it's out in the next few months I might as well wait. They keep talking about Zen 3 architecture, I don't know what kind of improvements I should expect? Here is one of those sources: https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-2020-2022-cpu-apu-roadmap-leak-zen-2-3-4-families-unveiled/

 

3) Are there any intel CPUs that I may have overlooked? Or more attractive releases that will compete with AMD? Should I wait?

 

The main reason I'm staying away from intel is because it feels like they are in the process of re-evaluating their line up. I've been reading something about new 10nm architecture and that there are either new Core or Xeon releases soon? For now, I'm mainly looking at the 24-core 3960X from AMD. The Intel offerings weren't as attractive compared to AMD. With Intel, I felt forced to have a workstation with their Xeon line, or a gaming/desktop rig with their Core line. The 3960X feels like a nice middle ground since it has nice clock speeds, high core count, along with ECC. I'm not entirely sure whether I really need ECC for my purposes, but the Threadripper has it anyway. From what I understand it's mainly meant for servers that are running 24/7. I doubt it helps with application stability or reducing crashes? Audio work usually involves lots of libraries and session data so it might help with keeping all that data safe from being corrupted or lost somehow?

 

In the end, I guess I can get any great CPU available today and move on with it. But, I only get to do this once... For the next 10 years or so at least lol... so I want to make sure that I'm 100% happy with the CPU I end up getting. Even if I have to wait a few months for it.

 

Feels nice to join this community; I look forward to hear your thoughts!

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3 minutes ago, malawar said:

1) Differences between Threadripper and Threadripper PRO? For example:

Besides their slight and obvious differences in:

  • Base clock speed,
  • Maybe the ability to overclock?
  • Socket Count (not really sure what this means), and;
  • Key features (saw some differences here in supported technologies)

Is there a clear and obvious winner between the two categories? Is one more suitable for my uses than the other? Is one better because of it's architecture/features or anything else like that?

do you want. prebuilt that is certified? If yes, get the pro, its only available in one workstation now, otherise, get the normal threadripper.

 

3 minutes ago, malawar said:

2) Is the 4th Gen Threadripper going to be released soon..ish?

 

If I'm not mistaken, this is the 3rd gen of AMD's Threadripper? And I don't know how reliable this information is, but I keep seeing something about a leaked AMD roadmap and Gen 4 or the 4000 series of the Threadripper being released later this year or some time in Q1 next year? Not that the current offering is bad, but if it's out in the next few months I might as well wait. They keep talking about Zen 3 architecture, I don't know what kind of improvements I should expect? Here is one of those sources: https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-2020-2022-cpu-apu-roadmap-leak-zen-2-3-4-families-unveiled/

 

No set dates, and no rumors for very soon, probably a few months atleast

 

 

4 minutes ago, malawar said:

3) Are there any intel CPUs that I may have overlooked? Or more attractive releases that will compete with AMD? Should I wait?

ID look at those 5900x/5950x when they come out, they should be plenty for your uses it seems, and a huge step up from your current system.

 

 

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16 minutes ago, malawar said:

1) Differences between Threadripper and Threadripper PRO? For example:

The PRO AMD parts are often OEM parts meaning that it's unlikely you'll find it easily available at retailers, of course they're also locked. There is a chance, but that's just me speculating, that the 3975WX is a lower binned chip, but that shouldn't matter anyway since you won't be able to overclock it to start with.

 

16 minutes ago, malawar said:

3) Are there any intel CPUs that I may have overlooked? Or more attractive releases that will compete with AMD? Should I wait?

Not really, though the 3970X is a little overkill, I'd personally suggest either a 5900X or 5950X from AMD the 5900X has 12 cores and the 5950X has 16 cores, both of these cpu's have better single threaded performance and multi threaded performance in some tasks and will most likely meet your needs.

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7 minutes ago, malawar said:

Hello everyone,

 

I've been researching CPUs and I'm leaning towards AMD's Threadripper. I would appreciate your clarification, expertise, and/or advice on some of the thoughts and questions I've listed below, to help me decide on a CPU.

 

Extra/background info: recently sold my 2013 trashcan. I've been blind for so long and I'm choosing to step into the light with a new PC work/gaming station. Alas, the time has come for me to venture for an upgrade! More often than not, I would run heavy music sessions. As my rig grew, it incorporated running those sessions along with light designs and videos simultaneously for performances. The new station is also required to handle video production and other similar tasks. Lastly, I'd like for this PC to run games during off-hours. I've been doing as much research as I can on processors since it's the first element I'm looking at for the build. However, I'm not as well-read or experienced on some of the finer details when it comes to processors. I currently have a temporary set up that I'm surviving on, so I don't mind waiting, learning, and doing this build right.

 

I've realized this post is a lot longer than I intended as I went over it again. To hopefully lighten things up, you can listen to my music as you go over this post, should you choose to do so: https://song.link/ae/i/1490836770

 

1) Differences between Threadripper and Threadripper PRO? For example:

Besides their slight and obvious differences in:

  • Base clock speed,
  • Maybe the ability to overclock?
  • Socket Count (not really sure what this means), and;
  • Key features (saw some differences here in supported technologies)

Is there a clear and obvious winner between the two categories? Is one more suitable for my uses than the other? Is one better because of it's architecture/features or anything else like that?

 

2) Is the 4th Gen Threadripper going to be released soon..ish?

 

If I'm not mistaken, this is the 3rd gen of AMD's Threadripper? And I don't know how reliable this information is, but I keep seeing something about a leaked AMD roadmap and Gen 4 or the 4000 series of the Threadripper being released later this year or some time in Q1 next year? Not that the current offering is bad, but if it's out in the next few months I might as well wait. They keep talking about Zen 3 architecture, I don't know what kind of improvements I should expect? Here is one of those sources: https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-2020-2022-cpu-apu-roadmap-leak-zen-2-3-4-families-unveiled/

 

3) Are there any intel CPUs that I may have overlooked? Or more attractive releases that will compete with AMD? Should I wait?

 

The main reason I'm staying away from intel is because it feels like they are in the process of re-evaluating their line up. I've been reading something about new 10nm architecture and that there are either new Core or Xeon releases soon? For now, I'm mainly looking at the 24-core 3960X from AMD. The Intel offerings weren't as attractive compared to AMD. With Intel, I felt forced to have a workstation with their Xeon line, or a gaming/desktop rig with their Core line. The 3960X feels like a nice middle ground since it has nice clock speeds, high core count, along with ECC. I'm not entirely sure whether I really need ECC for my purposes, but the Threadripper has it anyway. From what I understand it's mainly meant for servers that are running 24/7. I doubt it helps with application stability or reducing crashes? Audio work usually involves lots of libraries and session data so it might help with keeping all that data safe from being corrupted or lost somehow?

 

In the end, I guess I can get any great CPU available today and move on with it. But, I only get to do this once... For the next 10 years or so at least lol... so I want to make sure that I'm 100% happy with the CPU I end up getting. Even if I have to wait a few months for it.

 

Feels nice to join this community; I look forward to hear your thoughts!

1) Get a non-pro it is better with higher base/boost clocks

 

2) There might be but wait until mid 2021, also never trust wccftech when it comes to rumours

 

3) No hedt and servers are controlled by amd, get a threadripper, but if you don't need 24 cores get a 5950x will be much better

 

tldr:

don't get a pro, you must wait a long time for 4th gen, amd not intel, and 24 cores+ threadripper 16 cores 5950x tommorow

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1 minute ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

do you want. prebuilt that is certified? If yes, get the pro, its only available in one workstation now, otherise, get the normal threadripper.

Ah, so there's no other way to get PRO except for pre-built? I'll look into it to understand more about the differences I guess. But I still can't really figure why there's 2 versions of what seems to be the same processor?

 

5 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

ID look at those 5900x/5950x when they come out, they should be plenty for your uses it seems, and a huge step up from your current system.

Definitely eye-balled those a lot when I came across news of the release haha! I was going over the Intel lineup at the same time and it seemed like the main difference between their desktop/workstation chips was ECC. That's when I started leaning towards the 3960X since it was kind of like the best of both worlds. But then again, not entirely sure if ECC has any clear and evident results? The processor in my old trashcan had it. I'm not sure if I would have noticed any difference on data/application stability without it.

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4 minutes ago, malawar said:

Ah, so there's no other way to get PRO except for pre-built? I'll look into it to understand more about the differences I guess. But I still can't really figure why there's 2 versions of what seems to be the same processor?

 

Definitely eye-balled those a lot when I came across news of the release haha! I was going over the Intel lineup at the same time and it seemed like the main difference between their desktop/workstation chips was ECC. That's when I started leaning towards the 3960X since it was kind of like the best of both worlds. But then again, not entirely sure if ECC has any clear and evident results? The processor in my old trashcan had it. I'm not sure if I would have noticed any difference on data/application stability without it.

The differences between the 2 chips is just clockspeed and the fact that one is a oem non consumer part and the other is a consumer part that is the better of the 2 (the 3970x).

Ecc for your case is pointless.

 

What were the specs of the mac trashcan? The 16core 5950x might be a really good choice as most software does not scale that well beyond a set amount of cores and the fact the 5950x has better single core performance.

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3 minutes ago, jaslion said:

The differences between the 2 chips is just clockspeed and the fact that one is a oem non consumer part and the other is a consumer part that is the better of the 2 (the 3970x).

Makes sense, based on what I'm reading from the responses it seems like the PRO series might be a solution for businesses that want a pre-built system. Guess I don't need to know anything else about it. It has lower specs and I can't find anything else that puts it on the map with the other options at this point.

 

6 minutes ago, jaslion said:

Ecc for your case is pointless

Guess so! When you go over Intel stuff they make you feel like you won't be able to operate without it.

 

9 minutes ago, jaslion said:

What were the specs of the mac trashcan?

2.7 GHz - 12-core - upgraded to 64 GB ram back when I didn't know much about how all those components worked and affected each other. can't remember the ram speed. I run a Pro Tools HDX system. I had to connect the HDX PCIe card to the trashcan via a thunderbolt 2 chassis, so the data transfer wasn't at 100% capacity from what I understand now.

 

11 minutes ago, jaslion said:

The 16core 5950x might be a really good choice as most software does not scale that well beyond a set amount of cores and the fact the 5950x has better single core performance.

I read something about this too. Basically more cores are useful if you're running more tasks/applications at the same time, but not necessarily doing anything when running one single task/application. Which is where core speed would serve you better. If I'm not mistaken?

 

The 5950X is looking very attractive now with turbo boost to 4.9.


 

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32 minutes ago, Ankh tech tips said:

There might be but wait until mid 2021, also never trust wccftech when it comes to rumours

Yeah I noticed different websites saying different things. Those are leaks after all and don't guarantee that the company will stick to those plans. I don't know if i'll manage to wait till mid 2021 tbh haha! I was thinking end of Q1 2021 as the longest I'll wait. I'll run what I have now for as long as I can while I put this build together!

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7 minutes ago, malawar said:

2.7 GHz - 12-core - upgraded to 64 GB ram back when I didn't know much about how all those components worked

You could build an AM4 system that will be much more powerful, inexpensive and easy to use than what you are used too.

I would seriously consider the use case before jumping into Threadripper.

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40 minutes ago, AndreiArgeanu said:

The PRO AMD parts are often OEM parts meaning that it's unlikely you'll find it easily available at retailers, of course they're also locked. There is a chance, but that's just me speculating, that the 3975WX is a lower binned chip, but that shouldn't matter anyway since you won't be able to overclock it to start with.

 

Not really, though the 3970X is a little overkill, I'd personally suggest either a 5900X or 5950X from AMD the 5900X has 12 cores and the 5950X has 16 cores, both of these cpu's have better single threaded performance and multi threaded performance in some tasks and will most likely meet your needs.

No need to put myself through that mess and chase something that is likely going to perform lower than its counterpart I guess.

 

And yeah, the threadripper is looking like overkill now. I'll compare prices of the 5950X with 3960X before making my final decision.

 

Is there a good way to test whether or not I'll need anything over 16 cores?

 

The 3960X still can be boosted to 4.5. Is that a huge difference from 5950X's 4.9? Or are they roughly in the same neighborhood? I mean 0.4 doesn't seem like all that much on paper, but what does it mean in real life applications?

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13 minutes ago, malawar said:

No need to put myself through that mess and chase something that is likely going to perform lower than its counterpart I guess.

 

And yeah, the threadripper is looking like overkill now. I'll compare prices of the 5950X with 3960X before making my final decision.

 

Is there a good way to test whether or not I'll need anything over 16 cores?

 

The 3960X still can be boosted to 4.5. Is that a huge difference from 5950X's 4.9? Or are they roughly in the same neighborhood? I mean 0.4 doesn't seem like all that much on paper, but what does it mean in real life applications?

Could you specify the software and use case in more detail? The 4.5ghz and 4.9ghz boost is a single core boost. All core boost is different and will be lower on the threadripper as well it simply has more cores to feed power. That and you cannot compare the 2 chips with ghz as the 5950x is zen 3 and the 3960x is zen 2 so they are on different architectures.

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44 minutes ago, TheGlenlivet said:

You could build an AM4 system that will be much more powerful, inexpensive and easy to use than what you are used too.

Thanks! this is a great way of looking at it! I decided to have a quick look at the X570 motherboard for some rough ideas based on a 5950X system: https://www.amd.com/en/chipsets/x570

44 minutes ago, TheGlenlivet said:

I would seriously consider the use case before jumping into Threadripper.

Any suggestions or tests that could help determine whether the 3960X or the 5950X is the right fit?

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11 minutes ago, malawar said:

Any suggestions or tests that could help determine whether the 3960X or the 5950X is the right fit?

What software are you using, primarily?  For games, the higher clocks of the AM4 chips are a better fit.

Unless your application can leverage more than 16 threads or needs more than 128 GB of RAM, I would go with the appropriate 3600/3700/3800/3900 series chip.

 

EDIT - Or new 5000 series.

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23 minutes ago, jaslion said:

Could you specify the software and use case in more detail?

The heaviest use is when I run performances along with the light show. There are different programs running together to help me put together an audio-visual experience:

 

Live sound:
sound from instruments is fed into Pro Tools via the HDX PCIe card. In order for the musicians not to feel latency while playing, buffer size in Pro Tools has to be reduced. Though this makes playing your instrument latency-free; it puts more stress on the system to perform other tasks. It reduces the time it takes for your computer to process audio signals. So if you imagine needing to use more plugins and audio processing in that same live session, the more you are telling your computer to do, in a shorter period of time. More about buffer size can be read here: https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/articles/which-buffer-size-setting-should-i-use-in-my-daw/#:~:text=Buffer size is the amount,process any incoming audio signal.


Playback sound:
This is performed by Pro Tools as well. Those are pre-recorded sounds that are in sync with the performance (harmonies, extra synths, pads, etc). This is basically the system just playing back sounds. I don't know how much stress that puts on the system, but I know it becomes more of an issue if you decide to put processing on them - given everything else that's going on.

 

Light show:

This is run by a completely different software called SoundSwitch. It basically allows me to create light shows that usually include video playback, to play along and in sync with the audio performance running on Pro Tools.

Note - I have to use a 3rd software called Virtual DJ to kind of "link" Pro Tools and SoundSwitch together. So I'm basically running 3 different programs together. More musicians, sounds, processing, light ques = more pressure on the system

 

49 minutes ago, jaslion said:

That and you cannot compare the 2 chips with ghz as the 5950x is zen 3 and the 3960x is zen 2 so they are on different architectures.

Would you mind elaborating more on that or point me to something I can read? I don't fully understand what it means to have different architectures like ZEN 2 and 3 - so I didn't even know that you can't compare the two in the way I did.

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19 minutes ago, TheGlenlivet said:

Unless your application can leverage more than 16 threads or needs more than 128 GB of RAM

I wrote about one of the heaviest uses for my system in my response to @jaslion. I can't really tell how many cores or - basically computing power - I would need for things to run smoothly. I do remember the trashcan struggling on the bigger sessions.

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They aren't very forthcoming with hardware requirements are they...?

What have you been running this on since the trashcan went away?

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4 minutes ago, TheGlenlivet said:

They aren't very forthcoming with hardware requirements are they...?

Sorry not sure I'm following, could you elaborate?

2 minutes ago, TheGlenlivet said:

What have you been running this on since the trashcan went away?

I haven't been able to run anything close to what I mentioned since selling the trashcan. I have a laptop that I use to do very basic writing/mixing on Pro Tools. I mean it works, but not reliably. Crashes on the heavier sessions; especially when I reduce the buffer size. So recording becomes a bit of a hassle since I can't listen to the project while performing at the same time. There are ways to get around it but again, it's a bit of a hassle to keep doing that.

laptop specs:


ASUS G75
4-core i7-6820HK overclocked to run at close to 3.7
64 GB ram

Is there a way to benchmark that or my previous setup against what I'll build?

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16 hours ago, malawar said:

Sorry not sure I'm following, could you elaborate?

I haven't been able to run anything close to what I mentioned since selling the trashcan. I have a laptop that I use to do very basic writing/mixing on Pro Tools. I mean it works, but not reliably. Crashes on the heavier sessions; especially when I reduce the buffer size. So recording becomes a bit of a hassle since I can't listen to the project while performing at the same time. There are ways to get around it but again, it's a bit of a hassle to keep doing that.

laptop specs:


ASUS G75
4-core i7-6820HK overclocked to run at close to 3.7
64 GB ram

Is there a way to benchmark that or my previous setup against what I'll build?

Assuming the trashcan ran it fine then I'd say a 5900x or 5950x should be more than plenty.

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17 hours ago, malawar said:

Sorry not sure I'm following, could you elaborate?

Sorry I meant they aren't clear about a recommended spec.

I agree, a new 5900X and dedicated modern GPU would be a good build for these requirements.

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@Jaslion @TheGlenlivent

I agree, the 5950X is looking REALLY interesting to me right now. I was watching news about it and apparently it can be boosted beyond 5 GHz! I think AMD is literally just flexing on Intel now. It's way past "beating" them. I wonder if the new releases from Intel will be as exciting. I believe Alder lake is the next release? The new Threadripper seems to be coming out in the near future too if there's any truth to those leaked roadmaps.

I'm currently trying to figure out how and where I could get my hands on a 5950X in Dubai. Probably going to have to get it shipped in from somewhere if I can't find it here.

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20 hours ago, malawar said:

laptop specs:


ASUS G75
4-core i7-6820HK overclocked to run at close to 3.7
64 GB ram

Compared to that, a Zen+ CPU in a desktop would easily beat it.

 

Do you have a budget you'd like to stick to, or is this a "I can afford anything" build?

CPURyzen 7 5800X Cooler: Arctic Liquid Freezer II 120mm AIO with push-pull Arctic P12 PWM fans RAM: G.Skill Ripjaws V 4x8GB 3600 16-16-16-30

MotherboardASRock X570M Pro4 GPUASRock RX 5700 XT Reference with Eiswolf GPX-Pro 240 AIO Case: Antec P5 PSU: Rosewill Capstone 750M

Monitor: ASUS ROG Strix XG32VC Case Fans: 2x Arctic P12 PWM Storage: HP EX950 1TB NVMe, Mushkin Pilot-E 1TB NVMe, 2x Constellation ES 2TB in RAID1

https://hwbot.org/submission/4497882_btgbullseye_gpupi_v3.3___32b_radeon_rx_5700_xt_13min_37sec_848ms

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17 hours ago, BTGbullseye said:

Compared to that, a Zen+ CPU in a desktop would easily beat it.

 

Do you have a budget you'd like to stick to, or is this a "I can afford anything" build?

Certainly! I'm not in a rush either and though I really like the 5950X - I'd like to wait a bit longer and see if there would at least be any official news regarding the new Threadripper.

I'm going all in on this build, so I haven't really set a budget.

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4 hours ago, malawar said:

Certainly! I'm not in a rush either and though I really like the 5950X - I'd like to wait a bit longer and see if there would at least be any official news regarding the new Threadripper.

I'm going all in on this build, so I haven't really set a budget.

From the sounds of it, a 5800X CPU with an X570 motherboard, and a 64GB pack of G.Skill Trident Z Neo would be my recommendation. 

 

CPU: https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-7-5800x/p/N82E16819113665

Motherboard: https://www.newegg.com/asrock-x570-taichi/p/N82E16813157883?Item=N82E16813157883

RAM: https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-64gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232864

NVMe Storage: https://www.newegg.com/gigabyte-1tb-aorus-gen4/p/N82E16820009018 (you can fit up to 3 of them in the motherboard I recommended)

GPU: https://www.newegg.com/gigabyte-radeon-rx-5500-xt-gv-r55xtoc-4gd/p/N82E16814932239?Item=N82E16814932239

PSU: https://www.newegg.com/antec-neoeco-gold-zen-series-ne700g-zen-700w/p/N82E16817371128?Item=N82E16817371128

Choose whatever case you want that can fit a full ATX motherboard in it.

 

This system will cost between $1640 and $1960 depending on how many NVMe drives you get. Add the cost of the case to that for the total pre-tax and shipping.

CPURyzen 7 5800X Cooler: Arctic Liquid Freezer II 120mm AIO with push-pull Arctic P12 PWM fans RAM: G.Skill Ripjaws V 4x8GB 3600 16-16-16-30

MotherboardASRock X570M Pro4 GPUASRock RX 5700 XT Reference with Eiswolf GPX-Pro 240 AIO Case: Antec P5 PSU: Rosewill Capstone 750M

Monitor: ASUS ROG Strix XG32VC Case Fans: 2x Arctic P12 PWM Storage: HP EX950 1TB NVMe, Mushkin Pilot-E 1TB NVMe, 2x Constellation ES 2TB in RAID1

https://hwbot.org/submission/4497882_btgbullseye_gpupi_v3.3___32b_radeon_rx_5700_xt_13min_37sec_848ms

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