Enable XMP for 2 RAMS of same model but slightly different CLs

[Avenger_0310]

Hey, so I recently bought a new PC for the first time, here's my CPU and Motherboard:

CPU: Ryzen 5 2600 @3.4GHz

Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-A320M-S2H

 

I need some ELI5 level help in setting up XMP for my following two RAMs:

XPG Spectrix D60G 3200MHz 16GB RAM (CL 16-18-18)

XPG Spectrix D60G 3200MHz 16GB RAM (CL 16-20-20)

 

When I try to set an XMP Profile 1 (3.2GHz) or Profile 2 (3GHz), nothing happens and on CPU-Z it just says my RAM frequency is stil ~1300MHz, so it's basically still running these sticks at 2.6GHz. NOT what I paid $200 for!

 

I'm very new to PC building. I'd known some basics, but memory timing and all the is completely new to me so I tried to understand as much as I could before i bought it, and ultimately got a single stick XPG Spectrix D60G 16GB along with the PC as I was out of cash, and I eventually wanted 32GB. The CAS Latency specified on its box was CL 16-18-18 and it runs @1.35V.

 

A month or so later, I brought the box of this RAM to another computer store, asked them to give me the exact same model "AX4U3200316G16A-ST60". They give it to me, I purchased it and went back home, opened it up, but right before installing it I re-verified the model number and sure enough, it's different! I screwed up! It's "AX4U3200316G16-ST60", and it has a CAS Latency of CL 16-20-20. My day was completely ruined, and when I tried to return it at the store they wouldn't agree because I had already opened it and in doing so took off the sticker on the package.

 

Now I've ended up with this mismatched set of RAMs, they're expensive as heck for me so I can't just get a new one and I don't want to spend more money anymore. Is it even possible to run these RAMs at 3.2 or even 3GHz together? Perhaps with settings to accommodate for the slower one of the two? I'd really love to be educated about this if you can spare the time.

 

EDIT: I've attached a screenshot of my CPU-Z. Can anyone explain what those values mean, and why it seems like my CAS latency seems to by higher than it should be?

 

[LIGISTX]

6 minutes ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Hey, so I recently bought a new PC for the first time, here's my CPU and Motherboard:

CPU: Ryzen 5 2600 @3.4GHz

Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-A320M-S2H

 

I need some ELI5 level help in setting up XMP for my following two RAMs:

XPG Spectrix D60G 3200MHz 16GB RAM (CL 16-18-18)

XPG Spectrix D60G 3200MHz 16GB RAM (CL 16-20-20)

I doubt XMP will work correctly as they have mismatched timings, but you should be able to run them at 3200-16-20-20 at 1.35v. The faster ram will run slower without any issues. I am just not sure this will work via XMP, you may have to manually set it up... problem is, without XMP, all of the secondary and tertiary timings will be all wrong...

 

Try and swap which stick is on which position. I am not sure how this works, but MAYBE the mobo reads XMP of the stick in for instance A_1, and if the slower stick is in that slot, when you try and load XMP it will load the slower sticks settings which will work on both. I am not sure if this works in this way though, but worth a shot. Just switch the two sticks.

 

If that doesn’t work, you can try and manually set all the settings, but that will be rather tedious.  

[Avenger_0310]

1 minute ago, LIGISTX said:

I doubt XMP will work correctly as they have mismatched timings, but you should be able to run them at 3200-16-20-20 at 1.35v. The faster ram will run slower without any issues. I am just not sure this will work via XMP, you may have to manually set it up... problem is, without XMP, all of the secondary and tertiary timings will be all wrong...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but by that you mean that XMP won't be able to set it automatically, but I wouldn't run into any issues if I set it up manually, right?

 

I've also attached a screenshot of CPU-Z to my original post. I actually just tried switching up the RAM positions to no avail.

I think my main issue might be completely different. Because in my BIOS' advanced memory settings, I've already tried manually setting the speed multiplier to "32.00", but it's just getting over-ridden to 2.6GHz when I reboot, both in CPU-Z and when I run a UserBenchMarks test. Before anyone asks, yes I saved before exiting.

[LIGISTX]

1 hour ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but by that you mean that XMP won't be able to set it automatically, but I wouldn't run into any issues if I set it up manually, right?

 

I've also attached a screenshot of CPU-Z to my original post. I actually just tried switching up the RAM positions to no avail.

I think my main issue might be completely different. Because in my BIOS' advanced memory settings, I've already tried manually setting the speed multiplier to "32.00", but it's just getting over-ridden to 2.6GHz when I reboot, both in CPU-Z and when I run a UserBenchMarks test. Before anyone asks, yes I saved before exiting.

If you set the memory speed, did you also adjust all the latencies and voltage? You would have to set lots and lots of settings to make it run as XMP would. The values in your screenshot are the secondary timings. There are many, many tertiary timings though... Which is likely why it’s applying. Who knows what all the timings are set at, and just changing the main speed without changing the others may not be stable. The reason the latencies are high is because without setting XMP, they default to default DDR4 values, which those likely are.

 

I am really not sure what is best.... you may want to just use the slow stick, enable XMP, go into all of the RAM settings menus in BIOS and note them down and then manually set all of that with both sticks on. 

[Avenger_0310]

2 hours ago, LIGISTX said:

If you set the memory speed, did you also adjust all the latencies and voltage? You would have to set lots and lots of settings to make it run as XMP would. The values in your screenshot are the secondary timings. There are many, many tertiary timings though... Which is likely why it’s applying. Who knows what all the timings are set at, and just changing the main speed without changing the others may not be stable. The reason the latencies are high is because without setting XMP, they default to default DDR4 values, which those likely are.

 

I am really not sure what is best.... you may want to just use the slow stick, enable XMP, go into all of the RAM settings menus in BIOS and note them down and then manually set all of that with both sticks on. 

Thanks a lot for the idea. I'll see if it states all of the timings so I can note them down.

 

In the BIOS there were standard and advanced timing settings, and I only adjusted the standard ones which included CAS, tRCD, tRP, and tRAS. Advanced settings contained numerous ones I didn't recognize. But I'll try to set them too if I figure out what they default to with only the slower RAM plugged in.

I did increase the voltage from 1.2v to 1.35v as specified for the RAMs, but like I said, it's clock speed remains the same and the multiplier has absolutely no effect as indicated by the BIOS itself and CPU-Z.

 

Is there any other way besides XMP to adjust my RAM clock?

[gloop]

52 minutes ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Is there any other way besides XMP to adjust my RAM clock?

There should be a ‘DRAM Speed’ option in the BIOS. Clicking on it brings up a list of all available speeds, select the one you want and voila. 

[LIGISTX]

2 hours ago, gloop said:

There should be a ‘DRAM Speed’ option in the BIOS. Clicking on it brings up a list of all available speeds, select the one you want and voila. 

This likely won't work as it looks like his RAM is running 1T command rate at stock speeds... which also means I bet a lot of tertiary timings are low which won't be stable at faster RAM speeds.

 

3 hours ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Thanks a lot for the idea. I'll see if it states all of the timings so I can note them down.

 

In the BIOS there were standard and advanced timing settings, and I only adjusted the standard ones which included CAS, tRCD, tRP, and tRAS. Advanced settings contained numerous ones I didn't recognize. But I'll try to set them too if I figure out what they default to with only the slower RAM plugged in.

I did increase the voltage from 1.2v to 1.35v as specified for the RAMs, but like I said, it's clock speed remains the same and the multiplier has absolutely no effect as indicated by the BIOS itself and CPU-Z.

 

Is there any other way besides XMP to adjust my RAM clock?

Let me ask a dumb question.... have you updated your BIOS? Its possible a newer BIOS will not have issues.

[Avenger_0310]

5 hours ago, LIGISTX said:

Let me ask a dumb question.... have you updated your BIOS? Its possible a newer BIOS will not have issues.

I actually haven't done it myself but the guy at the store updated it up to version F30. I've heard of all the things that can go wrong with BIOS updates so I want to leave that option as the last.

Can RAM not be adjusted manually by some Windows software the same way a GPU can be adjusted using MSI Afterburner?

[LIGISTX]

6 hours ago, Avenger_0310 said:

I actually haven't done it myself but the guy at the store updated it up to version F30. I've heard of all the things that can go wrong with BIOS updates so I want to leave that option as the last.

Can RAM not be adjusted manually by some Windows software the same way a GPU can be adjusted using MSI Afterburner?

As long as the power doesn’t go out while your going it, really not much to worry about. BIOS updating is easy. I’d try this, it may help...

 

No, RAM can’t be adjusted outside of the BIOS.

[Avenger_0310]

Well things took a turn for the worse. I switched the positions of the RAMs one more time back to the way they were, and now the PC will not even turn on with the faster RAM inside! It lights up, fans spinning but does not boot into the BIOS.

I've already tried doing seating and re-seating both RAMs multiple times, switching positions again and again. Seems like one of them just won't let the PC boot. Which seems so weird to me considering they're both brand new and all I did was take it out and re-install it.

 

I made sure the cables were disconnected and there was no power supply before I performed all this. Seems crazy to me that it would go bad just by taking it out. Hoping the warranty covers this.

 

With the single stick inside, at least XMP is working, if that's worth noting. Thanks for the responses.

[Xkillerpn]

SLower ram always on the primary slots , then put xpm and thats it. 

 

 

[gloop]

3 hours ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Well things took a turn for the worse. I switched the positions of the RAMs one more time back to the way they were, and now the PC will not even turn on with the faster RAM inside! It lights up, fans spinning but does not boot into the BIOS.

I've already tried doing seating and re-seating both RAMs multiple times, switching positions again and again. Seems like one of them just won't let the PC boot. Which seems so weird to me considering they're both brand new and all I did was take it out and re-install it.

 

I made sure the cables were disconnected and there was no power supply before I performed all this. Seems crazy to me that it would go bad just by taking it out. Hoping the warranty covers this.

 

With the single stick inside, at least XMP is working, if that's worth noting. Thanks for the responses.

Clear the CMOS of the machine.

[Avenger_0310]

1 hour ago, Xkillerpn said:

SLower ram always on the primary slots , then put xpm and thats it. 

 

 

Stupid question probably, how do I know which one is primary out of the two available slots?

 

2 minutes ago, gloop said:

Clear the CMOS of the machine.

Can you tell me how that relates to the RAM? Curious! I'll try that and update this message with the result.

[gloop]

16 minutes ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Can you tell me how that relates to the RAM? Curious! I'll try that and update this message with the result.

The CMOS battery is essentially the storage of the BIOS, containing all the properties like CPU speed, RAM speed, etc. 

 

Clearing the CMOS essentially resets the BIOS to defaults, which solves a lot of RAM and CPU related problems. 
 

If you need a guide I can provide one. 

[Xkillerpn]

2 hours ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Stupid question probably, how do I know which one is primary out of the two available slots?

 

Can you tell me how that relates to the RAM? Curious! I'll try that and update this message with the result.

Look on the board or manual normally says the primary slots

[Shlouski]

On 8/17/2020 at 6:49 PM, Avenger_0310 said:

XPG Spectrix D60G 3200MHz 16GB RAM (CL 16-18-18)

XPG Spectrix D60G 3200MHz 16GB RAM (CL 16-20-20)

What are the rest of your timings, you left out a couple of the main timings?

 

I'm guessing you have:

 

TCL 16 16

Trcdrd 18 20

Trcdwr 18 20

Trp  18 20

Tras unknown (guessing high 20s, low 30s)

 

Anything past 2666mhz on an a320 board is an overclock and isn't guaranteed, is your ram on the compatibility list?

 

I have found that the amount of ram can also be a factor in what clocks can be achieved. I have an msi b450 gaming pro, with 32gb installed it will clock to 3000mhz, but getting 64gb of ram getting over 2666mhz is impossible, all I could do was tighten the timings.

 

If I were you I would install the slower stick and manually set the timings and voltage, then gradually increase the memory frequency until it won't post. Go back to the highest frequency it will post at and install the second stick, and see if both sticks will now post together. You likely won't be able to push for more frequency at this point, but you can still try and tighten the timings.

[Avenger_0310]

On 8/19/2020 at 2:55 PM, gloop said:

Clear the CMOS of the machine.

Did that and initially the same thing happened but I turned the power off a couple times and then it booted on my 3rd attempt. No clue why. But I have both RAMs installed now. Thanks.

 

On 8/19/2020 at 6:09 PM, Shlouski said:

What are the rest of your timings, you left out a couple of the main timings?

 

...

 

If I were you I would install the slower stick and manually set the timings and voltage, then gradually increase the memory frequency until it won't post. Go back to the highest frequency it will post at and install the second stick, and see if both sticks will now post together. You likely won't be able to push for more frequency at this point, but you can still try and tighten the timings.

My timings for my single slower RAM:

 

                      3200MHz      3000MHz
CAS Latency    16                  16

tRCDRD            20                 18

tRCDWR           20                 18

tRP                    20                 18

tRAS                  38                 36

tRC                    58                 55

tWR                   24                 23

tCWL                 18                  -

tRRD_S              7                   6

RRD_L                8                   8

tWTR_S              3                   3

tWTR_L              9                   9

tRFC1                312              312

tRFC2                192              192

tRFC4                132              132

tRTP                    9                  9

tFAW                   36                33

tRCPAGE             -                  -

tRDWR                5                  5

tRDRDSC            1                  1

tRDRDSD            3                  3

tRDRDDD            3                  3

tRDRD_SCL        3                  3

tWRRD                1                  1

tWRWRSC           1                 1

tWRWRSD           3                 3

tWRWRDD           3                 3

tWRWR_SCL       3                 3

tCKE                    6                  6

 

After I plugged in the faster RAM in the 2nd slot I tried to override all the settings to these values at 3200 MHz, saved and exited. The PC then lit up, then off, then lit up, then off, then lit up again but didn't boot. Powered off directly, turned it on, booted it up. Went to the BIOS and my values seem to be there, but they did not have any effect as the readings for both RAMs were still different and distinct from each other, they're running at 2666MHz still, but the voltage is 1.35V, for some reason the voltage doesn't get overriden.

 

The new timings are abysmal as they're worse than either of the two RAMs' specs:

 

[Avenger_0310]

This keeps getting worse and worse. 

CPU-Z states what I showed above. 32GB RAM, but Task Manager and Windows is stating that I only have 15.9GB RAM. I investigated and checked my motherboard's memory support list (wasn't aware this existed) for my CPU which is of the Pinnacle Ridge architecture.

 

Here's the list: https://download.gigabyte.com/FileList/Memory/mb_memory_ga-a320m-s2h_pinnacle.pdf

 

Apparently A320M paired with Ryzen 5 2600 doesn't support 32GB of RAM according to the list as there is no such configuration to be found in it. Now this is severely disappointing.

 

I am not educated enough to know whether now it would be better to take one stick out and use a single channel 16GB RAM, or keep two installed. I have no idea how it's working right now.

 

Is it possible at all that I somehow configure it that it only uses 8GB of both RAMs and run in dual channel, and scrap the rest of the 16GB?

[Shlouski]

7 hours ago, Avenger_0310 said:

  3200MHz      3000MHz
CAS Latency    16                  16

tRCDRD            20                 18

tRCDWR           20                 18

tRP                    20                 18

tRAS                  38                 36

 

So these are the timings for both the sticks right?

 

As they are both from the same manufacturer they are most likely the same sticks just with different settings. This is a common practice in the computer industry, making one product into multiple, and can save on costs. I first noticed this with ddr2 as they often didn't have heatspreaders, I could clearly see many companies were using the same chips over and over again, increasing the frequencies but also the latencies to keep them stable. I have many kits of 2133mhz running over 3000mhz, because I increased the latencies.

 

I have found that the amount of memory installed can be a factor, I'm guessing more ram puts more stress on the controller.

 

The point of all this above is to show the potential for other factors that could cause your ram to not run at rated speeds.

 

You have low end a320 board, you are running a lot of ram, and I suspect that your ram is also not officially supported, which can occasionally be a problem.

 

What I would do

 

1. Clear the cmos

 

2. Install the slower kit.

 

3. Manually configure the voltage, the frequency to 3000, and these 5 timings

CAS Latency    16                  

tRCDRD            18                 

tRCDWR           18                

tRP                    18             

tRAS                  36

 

4. If it posts, install the faster kit.

 

5. If it won't post with both kits, remove the slower one and try to post with just the faster kit, this will tell you if this kit is ok with the slower settings.

 

6. If it does post then your ram isn't the issue. Your issue could be that your board just can't run 32gb at that speed, or that it just doesn't like the ram your using. 

 

 

 

[Shlouski]

6 hours ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Apparently A320M paired with Ryzen 5 2600 doesn't support 32GB of RAM according to the list as there is no such configuration to be found in it. Now this is severely disappointing.

 

Well they do say the board supports up to 32gb, its just the haven't validated any 32gb kits, but you have got to work at native speeds.

 

The best thing to do is manually put in the voltage, se the frequency to 2133mhz and set these timings:

CAS Latency    16                  

tRCDRD            18                 

tRCDWR           18                

tRP                    18             

tRAS                  36

 

Hopefully this should post, then try 2400, then 2666, and so on until no post. Once you have found your max frequency, you can look into lowering the latencies to try and claw back some of the frequency performance you have lost.

 

I have the same problem with my b450 3700x build, 32gb will do just over 3000, but 64gb will not go any higher than 2666, but I was able to tight up the timings from a rated cas of 16 down to cas 14, my sub timings are tighter too.

 

 

[Avenger_0310]

14 hours ago, Shlouski said:

 

Well they do say the board supports up to 32gb, its just the haven't validated any 32gb kits, but you have got to work at native speeds.

 

The best thing to do is manually put in the voltage, se the frequency to 2133mhz and set these timings:

CAS Latency    16                  

tRCDRD            18                 

tRCDWR           18                

tRP                    18             

tRAS                  36

 

Hopefully this should post, then try 2400, then 2666, and so on until no post. Once you have found your max frequency, you can look into lowering the latencies to try and claw back some of the frequency performance you have lost.

 

I have the same problem with my b450 3700x build, 32gb will do just over 3000, but 64gb will not go any higher than 2666, but I was able to tight up the timings from a rated cas of 16 down to cas 14, my sub timings are tighter too.

 

 

Ah, so I take that as implication that running dual channel at 2133MHz would still be better than running single channel at 3200MHz?

I'll try this solution. If it works, windows and task manager should be showing 32 GB of RAM (as opposed to 16 GB it's showing right now)?

[Shlouski]

3 hours ago, Avenger_0310 said:

Ah, so I take that as implication that running dual channel at 2133MHz would still be better than running single channel at 3200MHz?

 

Honestly I don't know, but losing dual channel will of course lower performance a little, but of sure 32gb would be better if you are going to be using more than 16gb.