Vega 11/12

[Felaneous]

I'm thinking of getting a 4400g when it comes out. Can Vega 11 pull off most games at smooth framerrates on most games 1080 medim. After some time I will upgrade to Rx 5700.

[Felaneous]

Medium 1080p

[dizmo]

It won't be great.

[Felaneous]

Can it run crysis?

Also I'm just looking for something better than hd 520 that I can play a few games on before I get my hands on an Rx 5700

[dizmo]

You need to quote people if you're replying to them, or they won't be notified.

Crysis is an odd game to ask about; it's ancient.

You can check out YouTube, there's tons of reviews of the 3400g. It'll perform similar to the 4400g.

Honestly, though, it kind of seems pointless to buy the 4400g and then an RX5700 later. You'd likely still want a better CPU.

[Felaneous]

7 minutes ago, dizmo said:

You need to quote people if you're replying to them, or they won't be notified.

Crysis is an odd game to ask about; it's ancient.

You can check out YouTube, there's tons of reviews of the 3400g. It'll perform similar to the 4400g.

Honestly, though, it kind of seems pointless to buy the 4400g and then an RX5700 later. You'd likely still want a better CPU.

Okay, sorry.

[BTGbullseye]

6 hours ago, dizmo said:

Honestly, though, it kind of seems pointless to buy the 4400g and then an RX5700 later. You'd likely still want a better CPU.

Not really... Even now the 3400g is a capable CPU comparable to the i7-7700 when running at stock settings. There is the possibility that the 4400g will be a 6 core CPU, and with higher clock speeds and IPC, it could come out around the 3600's performance.

[BTGbullseye]

6 hours ago, Felaneous said:

Can Vega 11 pull off most games at smooth framerrates on most games 1080 medim.

If you get good RAM in dual channel, then yes. (3200 with 14-14-14 or 3600 with 16-16-16 timings)

[Felaneous]

1 hour ago, BTGbullseye said:

If you get good RAM in dual channel, then yes. (3200 with 14-14-14 or 3600 with 16-16-16 timings)

Tysm, also what about 3000 MHz BC ram prices are going up and up and up.

[BTGbullseye]

18 minutes ago, Felaneous said:

Tysm, also what about 3000 MHz BC ram prices are going up and up and up.

3000 will likely be the same price as 3200. (or at most $5 more for a 2x8GB pack) It's also much worse for an iGPU. If you want the Vega 11 to perform well, you have to get good RAM.

 

With mid-grade 3200 RAM (with 16-18-18 timings) I was able to push a Vega 11 into the low GTX 1050TI performance range. With good 3000 RAM (15-15-15 timings) I could barely get to low GTX 1050 range. (a difference of around 40% performance)

[Felaneous]

13 minutes ago, BTGbullseye said:

3000 will likely be the same price as 3200. (or at most $5 more for a 2x8GB pack) It's also much worse for an iGPU. If you want the Vega 11 to perform well, you have to get good RAM.

 

With mid-grade 3200 RAM (with 16-18-18 timings) I was able to push a Vega 11 into the low GTX 1050TI performance range. With good 3000 RAM (15-15-15 timings) I could barely get to low GTX 1050 range. (a difference of around 40% performance)

Cool to know, thanks.

[dizmo]

6 minutes ago, BTGbullseye said:

Not really... Even now the 3400g is a capable CPU comparable to the i7-7700 when running at stock settings. There is the possibility that the 4400g will be a 6 core CPU, and with higher clock speeds and IPC, it could come out around the 3600's performance.

It still doesn't make sense to keep a 4/8 CPU that gets similar or worse performance than a 6/12 that costs significantly less (1600AF).

Highly doubt the 4400g will be a 6 core.

3 minutes ago, BTGbullseye said:

If you get good RAM in dual channel, then yes. (3200 with 14-14-14 or 3600 with 16-16-16 timings)

Have proof? Most benchmarks will show that it gets around 50 fps....at 720p low on most titles.

[BTGbullseye]

3 hours ago, dizmo said:

It still doesn't make sense to keep a 4/8 CPU that gets similar or worse performance than a 6/12 that costs significantly less (1600AF).

What benchmarks are you looking at that tells you the 3400g is lower performance than the 1600? Whatever benchmark it is, stop using it immediately, because that's very wrong. (If it's Passmark, they are notorious for not letting you update the CPU benchmark unless the entire system has more than a 5% score boost, which never happens even going from an underclock of 2.9GHz to a 4.2GHz overclock on Ryzen, I've actually tried this exact scenario)

4 hours ago, dizmo said:

Highly doubt the 4400g will be a 6 core.

Why? There is every reason for AMD to leave only the X200g as the 4-core, and increase the cores on the X400g to 6. (not to mention bumping the X600 to 8 cores) Doing so would make them enormously more powerful than any Intel chip, and it wouldn't cost them any more to do it.

4 hours ago, dizmo said:

Have proof? Most benchmarks will show that it gets around 50 fps....at 720p low on most titles.

No, because the motherboard I used for it had a VRM explode on me, taking out the CPU. Fortunately it didn't kill my 5700 XT. AMD upgraded me to a 2600 for free when I returned the CPU. (they claimed to be low on 2400g stock)

[dizmo]

1 hour ago, BTGbullseye said:

What benchmarks are you looking at that tells you the 3400g is lower performance than the 1600? Whatever benchmark it is, stop using it immediately, because that's very wrong. (If it's Passmark, they are notorious for not letting you update the CPU benchmark unless the entire system has more than a 5% score boost, which never happens even going from an underclock of 2.9GHz to a 4.2GHz overclock on Ryzen, I've actually tried this exact scenario)

 

Why? There is every reason for AMD to leave only the X200g as the 4-core, and increase the cores on the X400g to 6. (not to mention bumping the X600 to 8 cores) Doing so would make them enormously more powerful than any Intel chip, and it wouldn't cost them any more to do it.

 

No, because the motherboard I used for it had a VRM explode on me, taking out the CPU. Fortunately it didn't kill my 5700 XT. AMD upgraded me to a 2600 for free when I returned the CPU. (they claimed to be low on 2400g stock)

If you're comparing it to a 1600 when used with a dGPU, that's not what's being discussed here, as it wasn't the question he asked.

Perhaps you're the one that needs to check the benchmarks, because there's no way the 3400g is getting decent frame rates at 1080p medium settings.

 

Not really. Few people are going to buy a 6 core processor with a dGPU. It might make sense for a mobile environment, but not for a desktop.

 

Not sure why you'd need your own hardware working in order to provide proof.

[BTGbullseye]

15 hours ago, dizmo said:

If you're comparing it to a 1600 when used with a dGPU, that's not what's being discussed here, as it wasn't the question he asked.

If you're only ever comparing when using the iGPU then the 3400g will always win, since it's the only one of the two that actually has an iGPU...

15 hours ago, dizmo said:

Perhaps you're the one that needs to check the benchmarks, because there's no way the 3400g is getting decent frame rates at 1080p medium settings.

I've done it on a 2400g, so why can't he on a 3400g that has a little extra overclocking room on the iGPU?

15 hours ago, dizmo said:

Not really. Few people are going to buy a 6 core processor with a dGPU.

Of course not if they aren't available... The moment they are available, they will sell well. They may only be $50 more than their iGPUless equivalent, but for budget builders that lets them get their system up and running so they can use it while saving up for their $400+ dGPU. (and not have to replace the CPU afterwards, plus have a backup if the dGPU fails)

15 hours ago, dizmo said:

It might make sense for a mobile environment, but not for a desktop.

You apparently have never actually built on a shoestring budget.

15 hours ago, dizmo said:

Not sure why you'd need your own hardware working in order to provide proof.

Because you asked for proof of my specific setup's capabilities, which I don't have records of due to the VRM failure.

[EL02]

On 2/3/2020 at 4:15 PM, BTGbullseye said:

If you get good RAM in dual channel, then yes. (3200 with 14-14-14 or 3600 with 16-16-16 timings)

No, it can do 720p medium, but not 1080p.

Also, while some games can perform the same with a 3400g and gpu// and 1600 and gpu, it is always better to get the latter.

[dizmo]

3 hours ago, BTGbullseye said:

If you're only ever comparing when using the iGPU then the 3400g will always win, since it's the only one of the two that actually has an iGPU...

 

I've done it on a 2400g, so why can't he on a 3400g that has a little extra overclocking room on the iGPU?

 

Of course not if they aren't available... The moment they are available, they will sell well. They may only be $50 more than their iGPUless equivalent, but for budget builders that lets them get their system up and running so they can use it while saving up for their $400+ dGPU. (and not have to replace the CPU afterwards, plus have a backup if the dGPU fails)

 

You apparently have never actually built on a shoestring budget.

 

Because you asked for proof of my specific setup's capabilities, which I don't have records of due to the VRM failure.

You clearly missed the entire point of what I said. The 3400g will play games poorly. There's no point in comparing it to the 3400g with the 5700XT, because that was not the question that was asked.

 

Here's a video showing what the 3400g gets when playing games.

So no, I don't believe you when you say you can get good frame rates at 1080p medium. The video clearly shows that only a handful of titles play above 50fps on high, most are tested at 1080p low at the highest.

 

Buying systems piece meal like that is a horrible way to build a system. You're better off to just save until you can get what you need, or buy used.

If you have that tight of a budget, you probably don't "need" a 6 core system. You can get away with something cheaper. Wants and needs are two entirely different things, and if your budget can't afford you a higher end system, that's simply too bad.

 

My entire current PC cost me $300, and my next one will make me money. Every PC I've purchased has been on a "budget", as I build as cheap as I can for the fun of it. So yes, I've built PCs on incredibly tight budgets.

 

I didn't actually, I merely asked for proof that the chip can get good frame rates at 1080p medium. Because it can't. Which is why you couldn't provide proof of such.

It doesn't have to be your own system, it can be any series of benchmarks, as I've provided.

[BTGbullseye]

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

You clearly missed the entire point of what I said. The 3400g will play games poorly. There's no point in comparing it to the 3400g with the 5700XT, because that was not the question that was asked.

I never compared it to the 5700 XT.

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

Here's a video showing what the 3400g gets when playing games.

So no, I don't believe you when you say you can get good frame rates at 1080p medium. The video clearly shows that only a handful of titles play above 50fps on high, most are tested at 1080p low at the highest.

That is at stock settings, not with the iGPU overclocked to where it definitely can go. (1600MHz puts it exactly on par with dedicated Vega cores, and with 3200 RAM it can get around 80% of the scaled performance) You most certainly can get 45+ FPS at 1080p medium with this GPU, even on modern titles.

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

Buying systems piece meal like that is a horrible way to build a system. You're better off to just save until you can get what you need, or buy used.

Seemed to work well for me.

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

If you have that tight of a budget, you probably don't "need" a 6 core system.

No one "needs" a gaming PC at all...

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

Wants and needs are two entirely different things, and if your budget can't afford you a higher end system, that's simply too bad.

Who are you to be the arbiter of how people are allowed to build their systems?

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

My entire current PC cost me $300, and my next one will make me money.

So you're not going to be gaming on it, you're going to use it for production work? Entirely different usage scenario dude.

1 hour ago, dizmo said:

I didn't actually, I merely asked for proof that the chip can get good frame rates at 1080p medium. Because it can't. Which is why you couldn't provide proof of such.

It doesn't have to be your own system, it can be any series of benchmarks, as I've provided.

And I already said that I lost all proof when my system crashed. No one else to my knowledge bothers testing the modern gaming performance on overclocked iGPUs. (there was one guy that tested the 2400g when it launched, but I can't find it in the sea of B.S. CPU-side overclocking and deliding results)

[dizmo]

5 minutes ago, BTGbullseye said:

That is at stock settings, not with the iGPU overclocked to where it definitely can go. (1600MHz puts it exactly on par with dedicated Vega cores, and with 3200 RAM it can get around 80% of the scaled performance) You most certainly can get 45+ FPS at 1080p medium with this GPU, even on modern titles.

 

Seemed to work well for me.

 

No one "needs" a gaming PC at all...

 

Who are you to be the arbiter of how people are allowed to build their systems?

 

So you're not going to be gaming on it, you're going to use it for production work? Entirely different usage scenario dude.

 

And I already said that I lost all proof when my system crashed. No one else to my knowledge bothers testing the modern gaming performance on overclocked iGPUs. (there was one guy that tested the 2400g when it launched, but I can't find it in the sea of B.S. CPU-side overclocking and deliding results)

Really? Interesting. This, again, goes against what you claim. Even at 900p, it doesn't do that great, especially with AAA titles.

BF5. 1080p. Lowest settings. 39fps.

It does ok with eSports titles, but that's not surprising. Worked well for you? You must have had some amazing, once in a life time chip.

 

People make poor decisions with their finances all the time. You don't need to be a genius to see that. It's logic.

 

No, I don't use it for production work, and yes, I game on it.

 

Well you clearly didn't look that hard, because a simple YouTube search pulled up many, many results.

[BTGbullseye]

3 hours ago, dizmo said:

It does ok with eSports titles, but that's not surprising. Worked well for you? You must have had some amazing, once in a life time chip.

I did, as I could get overclocked to 1650MHz (a 32% overclock on the 2400g, it would be an 18% overclock on the 3400g) at 1.275v stable in everything but Windows 10 desktop. Once I added the GAMMAXX 400 it was able to stabilize in everything until the VRMs fried. Here's what I got right before I got my 5700XT and the VRMs died: https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/17286868 (I also had the RAM running at 3266)

3 hours ago, dizmo said:

 

 

When the 1% lows at 1080p are still 30FPS even at stock, that seems very playable to me. Picking and choosing settings instead of using a preset allows for massive improvement in framerates while maintaining medium quality equivalent visual fidelity in MOST games.

3 hours ago, dizmo said:

People make poor decisions with their finances all the time. You don't need to be a genius to see that. It's logic.

On 2/3/2020 at 11:31 AM, dizmo said:

It still doesn't make sense to keep a 4/8 CPU that gets similar or worse performance than a 6/12

 

On 2/3/2020 at 5:22 PM, dizmo said:

Few people are going to buy a 6 core processor with a dGPU. It might make sense for a mobile environment, but not for a desktop.

 

You claim it's a poor decision to get a 4/8, then proceed to say that having a 6/12 isn't going the be a good decision either... I think you're the one that's making poor decisions.

3 hours ago, dizmo said:

No, I don't use it for production work, and yes, I game on it.

Then you're not making money off of it unless you're selling it afterwards to a mentally disabled person for more than you bought it for.

3 hours ago, dizmo said:

Well you clearly didn't look that hard, because a simple YouTube search pulled up many, many results.

And how many of them go into detail about all the system settings, hardware, and software, as well as include things like ambient temps and a video/pictures of the assembly process? (because all of those are important, and I couldn't find any that include all of that)

[dizmo]

2 hours ago, BTGbullseye said:

I did, as I could get overclocked to 1650MHz (a 32% overclock on the 2400g, it would be an 18% overclock on the 3400g) at 1.275v stable in everything but Windows 10 desktop. Once I added the GAMMAXX 400 it was able to stabilize in everything until the VRMs fried. Here's what I got right before I got my 5700XT and the VRMs died: https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/17286868 (I also had the RAM running at 3266)

 

When the 1% lows at 1080p are still 30FPS even at stock, that seems very playable to me. Picking and choosing settings instead of using a preset allows for massive improvement in framerates while maintaining medium quality equivalent visual fidelity in MOST games.

 

You claim it's a poor decision to get a 4/8, then proceed to say that having a 6/12 isn't going the be a good decision either... I think you're the one that's making poor decisions.

 

Then you're not making money off of it unless you're selling it afterwards to a mentally disabled person for more than you bought it for.

 

And how many of them go into detail about all the system settings, hardware, and software, as well as include things like ambient temps and a video/pictures of the assembly process? (because all of those are important, and I couldn't find any that include all of that)

I don't really believe you, and even if I did, saying you had a very rare, extremely high performing chip isn't indicative of what most people would get.

 

I wouldn't.

 

Right, and it's all about context. Not sure how you don't understand that.

 

Wrong, yet again. I have a method that results in me either paying very little for my builds, or making money on them.

 

Haha, riiiight. Keep thinking that.

[BTGbullseye]

4 hours ago, dizmo said:

Wrong, yet again. I have a method that results in me either paying very little for my builds, or making money on them.

Would that be theft, or do you have a "sugar daddy"?

[dizmo]

1 hour ago, BTGbullseye said:

Would that be theft, or do you have a "sugar daddy"?

Nope. I've laid it out before. It's quite simple. Buy a system, take the part I want, sell the rest. Repeat.