IP Security Camera System

[PraisetheSun!]

I want to setup a Security Camera System from scratch. I need some advice, as I have no experience in this area. Here is what I am looking at:

 

-11 4K IP cameras recording 24/7 at 30fps

-Preferably no wifi access from the cameras although possibly from the DVR or software controlling the cameras

-Between 1 to 3 months of local on site storage (which looks to be between 80 and 160 TB depending on the storage calculator used)

 

I am less concerned about the security cameras themselves but more about the NVR/ camera software and the local storage for the data.

[Clarkius]

Whats your budget? Ubiquiti camera's are pretty good but costly

 

[PraisetheSun!]

Honestly budget isn't the biggest concern as long it is below 4000.

[Clarkius]

These are good for 1080p (if 4K isn't the biggest concern)

https://www.amazon.com/Ubiquiti-UVC-G3-DOME-Wide-Angle-Network-Infrared/dp/B01D2OOODY/ref=pd_sbs_421_t_2/142-9992934-1000118?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01D2OOODY&pd_rd_r=dad72808-4b7f-49c6-8170-75a8007022bf&pd_rd_w=YMR3u&pd_rd_wg=o5iTz&pf_rd_p=5cfcfe89-300f-47d2-b1ad-a4e27203a02a&pf_rd_r=6R9FA06QVC6YFYCS437J&psc=1&refRID=6R9FA06QVC6YFYCS437J

 

Then your 4k models

https://www.amazon.com/Ubiquiti-Networks-UVC-G4-PRO-Protect-G4-PRO/dp/B07R7F7KJM/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=ubiquiti+4k&qid=1572967877&s=electronics&sr=1-1

 

 

These are great camera's because they are easy to manage in their admin access and setting up network storage for them isn't too complex

[PraisetheSun!]

Looks interesting although do they have the support for the kind of local storage I need? It looks like they are limited to a max of 5 TB.

[Chrizl1990]

What about these from Meraki:

 

https://documentation.meraki.com/MV/MV_Smart_Camera_FAQ

[PraisetheSun!]

8 minutes ago, Chrizl1990 said:

What about these from Meraki:

 

https://documentation.meraki.com/MV/MV_Smart_Camera_FAQ

It's a bit hard to tell from their website but it looks like they have very limited local storage and otherwise you need cloud storage.

[Clarkius]

Most camera's now are cloud based, but yeah you can generally do local storage with them. The camera's themselves generally won't be storing anything so it's usually up to you to provide any sort of drive space for local storage. My company uses them and we have a few petabytes of storage.

[Velcade]

1 hour ago, PraisetheSun! said:

Looks interesting although do they have the support for the kind of local storage I need? It looks like they are limited to a max of 5 TB.

You're only limited if you use their Cloud Key Gen 2 as your NVR.  You can install UniFi Protect on your own NVR and the storage limitations are up to you at that point.

[PraisetheSun!]

Yeah I have found that out in all this. I am just trying to figure out how to hook up a bunch of drives (probably in some kind of raid) to a DVR or software like blue iris.

[PraisetheSun!]

1 hour ago, Velcade said:

You're only limited if you use their Cloud Key Gen 2 as your NVR.  You can install UniFi Protect on your own NVR and the storage limitations are up to you at that point.

Which NVR would you suggest? 

[Velcade]

15 minutes ago, PraisetheSun! said:

Which NVR would you suggest? 

Build one. Buy a case with a lot of 3.5" drive bays and build yourself a computer.

 

 

QNAP might have a solution for you if you're looking for something all in one with minimal input from yourself. QVR Pro Surveillance

[PraisetheSun!]

3 minutes ago, Velcade said:

Build one. Buy a case with a lot of 3.5" drive bays and build yourself a computer.

Ah okay thanks. That gives me a good point from which to research.

[Tristerin]

$4000 budget for that many 4k cameras? The facility I work in just redid their system with about the same as you describe and it cost more closely towards $80,000 with install.  (98,000 sq ft building)

[PraisetheSun!]

Just now, Tristerin said:

$4000 budget for that many 4k cameras? The facility I work in just redid their system with about the same as you describe and it cost more closely towards $80,000 with install.  (98,000 sq ft building)

wow. I mean why would it get anywhere near that high? The cameras should cost under 200 each although that can depend on the quality. My main concern was getting it hooked up to a NVR with enough storage.

[Tristerin]

29 minutes ago, PraisetheSun! said:

wow. I mean why would it get anywhere near that high? The cameras should cost under 200 each although that can depend on the quality. My main concern was getting it hooked up to a NVR with enough storage.

Im just letting you know what it cost us in a facility at that size with install - the main point is boom lifts on vaulted ceilings and running all of the lines behind the walls.  But this is a multi billion dollar business so they may have also got top of the line everything as well

[PraisetheSun!]

33 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

Im just letting you know what it cost us in a facility at that size with install - the main point is boom lifts on vaulted ceilings and running all of the lines behind the walls.  But this is a multi billion dollar business so they may have also got top of the line everything as well

Oh okay. That makes more sense. The place I want to install these cameras is only a 2600 sq ft building. Although I do recognize how easy it would be to run over the 4000 dollar limit. Thanks for the input.

[PraisetheSun!]

I am setting up a IP security Camera System for the first time wanted to see if anyone has advice on my setup. Here is what I had in mind (Nothing has been bought yet).

 

-11 4K IP poe Security Cameras recording 24/7 at 30 fps; H.264

-The cameras will be connected over either cat5e or cat6 to a gigabit POE switch. Amazon link to the switch I am looking at.

-The switch plugging into a PC running Windows 10 for Blue Iris to manage my cameras

 

-This is my main point of concern right now. I am looking for about 60 days of footage eventually and for this it seems I will need about 200 TB of storage. From what I could find storing 20 10TB drives in a PC case in raid isn't the best idea so I was looking into a DAS hooked up to the PC running Blue Iris. My question is this a good idea and if so what DAS should I get for that amount of storage?

 

Or is my setup horribly misguided?

 

 

 

[Electronics Wizardy]

How much power do your cameras use? Check if the switch can provide enough.

 

4 minutes ago, PraisetheSun! said:

-This is my main point of concern right now. I am looking for about 60 days of footage eventually and for this it seems I will need about 200 TB of storage. From what I could find storing 20 10TB drives in a PC case in raid isn't the best idea so I was looking into a DAS hooked up to the PC running Blue Iris. My question is this a good idea and if so what DAS should I get for that amount of storage?

Do you really need full quality 4k for 60 days? Id probably cut the bitrate a bit or 1080p and save a lot of money in storage.

 

Why get a DAS? Id just get a system that can hold that many drives. Something like a 24 bay 4u server would work well here.

[PraisetheSun!]

Just now, Electronics Wizardy said:

How much power do your cameras use? Check if the switch can provide enough.

 

Do you really need full quality 4k for 60 days? Id probably cut the bitrate a bit or 1080p and save a lot of money in storage.

 

Why get a DAS? Id just get a system that can hold that many drives. Something like a 24 bay 4u server would work well here.

Good thought on the power. I haven't decided on the cameras yet although most seem fairly similar.

 

It's not absolutely necessary to have 4K cameras but the cost is about the same for the cameras I saw so I would like to future proof if possible.

 

Would the server run or support raid by default or is that something I would need to add? I would like some redundancy regardless of the resolution of the cameras.

[Electronics Wizardy]

38 minutes ago, PraisetheSun! said:

Good thought on the power. I haven't decided on the cameras yet although most seem fairly similar.

 

It's not absolutely necessary to have 4K cameras but the cost is about the same for the cameras I saw so I would like to future proof if possible.

 

Would the server run or support raid by default or is that something I would need to add? I would like some redundancy regardless of the resolution of the cameras.

Well windows 10 has storage spaces, so that can work pretty well.

 

You can use something like zfs, and run windows in a vm.

 

Or you can get a hardware raid card.

 

Also what is the total bitrate that needs to be written to all the drives?

[WkdPaul]

* Threads merged *

[PraisetheSun!]

7 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Well windows 10 has storage spaces, so that can work pretty well.

 

You can use something like zfs, and run windows in a vm.

 

Or you can get a hardware raid card.

 

Also what is the total bitrate that needs to be written to all the drives?

I honestly don't know how to do that calculation on the total bitrate. How would that affect my hardware choices? 

[Electronics Wizardy]

2 minutes ago, PraisetheSun! said:

I honestly don't know how to do that calculation on the total bitrate. How would that affect my hardware choices? 

Well higher bitrate means the drives have to write faster, and you need a setup that can handle it.

 

Also might affect network if your getting near the 1gbit limit

 

 

[PraisetheSun!]

1 minute ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Well higher bitrate means the drives have to write faster, and you need a setup that can handle it.

 

Also might affect network if your getting near the 1gbit limit

 

 

Ah okay. Thanks I had no idea. So from what I could find out the bitrate should be below 500 Mbps as long as it is H.264 Average quality. Though I have no idea how fast the drives could record in a raid setup.