Need opinion on which upgrade should I go to.

[DND]

Hello LTT community, its been years since I've posted something or asked an advice/opinion here in LTT forums. I also just recently started following/updating myself on PC related news/advancements so please bear with me if I may ask some stupid/newbie questions.

So here's the deal, I am planning to upgrade my current rig right now and I'm thorn between going either Intel or AMD. Yes I've been watching reviews or comparisons regarding the "Mainstream Flagship" CPU's from both side but I just can't seem to get to a 100% conclusion on what to upgrade to. There are 3 CPU's that I'm thinking to upgrade to which are the 9900k from intel and the 3700x or 3900x from AMD. So far the only thing that I will do would be Gaming, stream on twitch and maybe in the future do some video editing if I get the urge to learn. Where would I benefit the most in the long run or where would I get the most out of without wasting $.

As of now this is the current specs of my rig:
CPU: i5-4690k stock
MOBO: Asus Z97-K
Cooler: NZXT Kraken x61
RAM: HyperX Fury 2x4GB DDR3 1866MHz
GPU: MSI GTX 1080 Gaming X
HDD: WD Black 2TB
SSD: Samsung 850 Evo 250
PSU: Seasonic M12II 620W 80+ Bronze Fully Modular
Case: NZXT H440 Razer Edt.

The parts that I would buy for the upgrade is:
AMD
CPU: 3700X or 3900X
MOBO: Aorus X570 Master
Cooler: BeQuiet Dark Rock Pro 4
RAM: Trident Z RGB 2x16GB DDR4 3600MHz CL17
SSD: Corasi MP600 1TB PCIE Gen.4
Total Cost(3900x): $1,532.66
Total Cost(3700x): $1,340.66
Intel
CPU: 9900K
MOBO: Aorus Z390 Xtreme
Cooler: BeQuiet Dark Rock Pro 4
RAM: Corsair Vengeance RGB 2x16GB DDR4 3200MHz CL16
SSD: Samsung 970 Evo Plus M.2 1TB
Total Cost: $1,605.14


I also wanna ask if Zen2 has gotten mature these past months after release or it still has some problems, wanna ask also if I would go with the 3700x/3900x if I would get more performance if i go with a lower frequency ram with a lower latency? Thanks in advance LTT community.



 

[SupaKomputa]

Zen2 FTW.

3200mhz vs 3600mhz won't be drastically different, 5% in a good day.

[mxk]

you don't need 3600mhz ram lol get zen 2

[DND]

1 minute ago, SupaKomputa said:

Zen2 FTW.

3200mhz vs 3600mhz won't be drastically different, 5% in a good day.

Thanks for your insight. So basically it won't be a difference whether I go with a 3200mhz low latency than going 3600mhz with a bit higher frequency? Do you think 5% more performance is worth it for an extra 20$ for the 3600Mhz? Also can you give an insight regarding the bios maturity and stuffs? That's one of the reason that's holding me back on going zen2 tbh. Since I'm not that knowledgeable regarding those stuffs and I might screw up when fiddling with those.

[mxk]

Just now, DND said:

Thanks for your insight. So basically it won't be a difference whether I go with a 3200mhz low latency than going 3600mhz with a bit higher frequency? Do you think 5% more performance is worth it for an extra 20$ for the 3600Mhz? Also can you give an insight regarding the bios maturity and stuffs? That's one of the reason that's holding me back on going zen2 tbh. Since I'm not that knowledgeable regarding those stuffs and I might screw up when fiddling with those.

no it's not worth the extra $20, he said on a good day meaning you'll basically never notice or see a difference so save your money

[GoldenLag]

5 minutes ago, DND said:

also wanna ask if Zen2 has gotten mature these past months after release

Problems seem motherboard specific.

 

Providing you get some of the good options, shouldnt run into anything.

 

7 minutes ago, DND said:

stream on twitch

How much and are you at some point getting a Turing GPU? Also are you enclined to do GPU encoding?

 

8 minutes ago, DND said:

RAM: Trident Z RGB 2x16GB DDR4 3600MHz CL17

How much does "looks" matter?

 

Are you memmory overclocking?

9 minutes ago, DND said:

PSU: Seasonic M12II 620W 80+ Bronze Fully Modular

Id suggest swapping this one out. Its getting old design wise and isnt super great. Tho its not end of the world to swap it out.

10 minutes ago, DND said:

MOBO: Aorus X570 Master

There is a lot to save on the motherboard if you can conpremise on looks and some features. 

11 minutes ago, DND said:

SSD: Corasi MP600 1TB PCIE Gen.4

Unneccasary. Grab something akin to the sabrent rocket.

[Rabel]

You said you want to stream. What do you think about the thought of reusing your i5 as decoding system, use the onboard graphic and throw in a 1080p capture card and go with a cheaper CPU and mobo (price/performance = 3600). But if you want to edit stuff in the future, I would say higher core count so 3700x or 3900x (depends on your budget) and I wouldn't go with a mobo at so high price points but if you like them go for it.

[DND]

Just now, mxk said:

no it's not worth the extra $20, he said on a good day meaning you'll basically never notice or see a difference so save your money

I see thanks then if I go zen2 I'll just change it to the 3200mhz to save some cash. Thank you for your insight.

[SupaKomputa]

8 minutes ago, DND said:

Thanks for your insight. So basically it won't be a difference whether I go with a 3200mhz low latency than going 3600mhz with a bit higher frequency? Do you think 5% more performance is worth it for an extra 20$ for the 3600Mhz? Also can you give an insight regarding the bios maturity and stuffs? That's one of the reason that's holding me back on going zen2 tbh. Since I'm not that knowledgeable regarding those stuffs and I might screw up when fiddling with those.

If $20 a big deal for you, then changing to 3700x will be a bigger deal, Instead of 3900x. It would be as good for gaming.

Bios is good enough, i don't see people complaining like back in the early days of Ryzen.

Intel not all superior now, Remember Intel has nasty bugs, which AMD doesn't.

https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/amd-intel-processor-security/

[DND]

5 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

Problems seem motherboard specific.

 

Providing you get some of the good options, shouldnt run into anything.

 

How much and are you at some point getting a Turing GPU? Also are you enclined to do GPU encoding?

 

How much does "looks" matter?

 

Are you memmory overclocking?

Id suggest swapping this one out. Its getting old design wise and isnt super great. Tho its not end of the world to swap it out.

There is a lot to save on the motherboard if you can conpremise on looks and some features. 

Unneccasary. Grab something akin to the sabrent rocket.

1st: I've watched gamersnexus/Buildzoid mobo reviews for the x570 and He recommended that the aorus master is one of the best so I chose that one,
2nd: As of now going for the rtx cards is still far away, but i'd done some bit of streaming in the past using my gtx 1080 and I have been using nvenc for those streams.
3rd: for the RAM looks doesn't matter i just want a good one and the ram options in the shops here in my country are quite limited. Haven't tried memory clocking yet so not sure.
4th: What Wattage should I look for would be something around 750W be enough any specific model/brand you recommend?
5th: Can you recommend some good cheaper alternatives without compromising quality? I think a mobo with decent features and excellent vrm would suffice right?
6th: I looked up the sabrent rocket unfortunately its not available here in my country. any other recommendations? Also not worth going gen4?

 

5 hours ago, Rabel said:

You said you want to stream. What do you think about the thought of reusing your i5 as decoding system, use the onboard graphic and throw in a 1080p capture card and go with a cheaper CPU and mobo (price/performance = 3600). But if you want to edit stuff in the future, I would say higher core count so 3700x or 3900x (depends on your budget) and I wouldn't go with a mobo at so high price points but if you like them go for it.

Hmmm would the 4690k be enough as a dedicated decoding system? If so that would be a good option i think. Yes I think I might try to learn some video editing in the future. Any cheaper alternatives that wouldn't compromise quality, features, and vrms?

 

5 hours ago, SupaKomputa said:

If $20 a big deal for you, then changing to 3700x will be a bigger deal, Instead of 3900x. It would be as good for gaming.

Bios is good enough, i don't see people complaining like back in the early days of Ryzen.

Intel not all superior now, Remember Intel has nasty bugs, which AMD doesn't.

https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/amd-intel-processor-security/

Welp 20% isn't really a big deal just wanted to ask if going higher frequency ram would give a good amount of performance. I'll read the link

[dizmo]

Honestly, I'd just get a 3600. It'll still do video editing perfectly fine, and since you're not even planning to do it right now, there's no point in spending the money on a "well maybe I'll do it someday if I feel like learning" fleeting thought.

 

 

[DND]

45 minutes ago, dizmo said:

Honestly, I'd just get a 3600. It'll still do video editing perfectly fine, and since you're not even planning to do it right now, there's no point in spending the money on a "well maybe I'll do it someday if I feel like learning" fleeting thought.

 

 

Haven't really considered the 3600, I only thought that the 3600 is the bang for the buck gaming only cpu.

[geo3]

The price difference is minimal, go with 3600Mhz Ram

[dizmo]

13 minutes ago, DND said:

Haven't really considered the 3600, I only thought that the 3600 is the bang for the buck gaming only cpu.

You can use anything to edit. The only difference is how long it takes.

[DND]

1 minute ago, dizmo said:

You can use anything to edit. The only difference is how long it takes.

Welp that's true I did one time used my current rig to edit one video for our school project and it was only about 2-3min long video and it took long before it finished.

[dizmo]

7 minutes ago, DND said:

Welp that's true I did one time used my current rig to edit one video for our school project and it was only about 2-3min long video and it took long before it finished.

Yeah, personally I think getting a 3700x or higher chip would be a complete waste of money.

[GoldenLag]

10 hours ago, DND said:

: What Wattage should I look for would be something around 750W be enough any specific model/brand you recommend?

You only need 550w PSU. Something akin to the Pure Power 11, 600w TX550m. MWE Gold 550w. Bitfenix Whisper M.

 

These are some models i recommend from the top of my head. 

 

10 hours ago, DND said:

Also not worth going gen4?

Minimal speed increase and almost twice the cost. 

10 hours ago, DND said:

6th: I looked up the sabrent rocket unfortunately its not available here in my country. any other recommendations?

Corsair MP510, or maybe step down to a P1 or 660p tho those wouldnt be suitable for scratch drives. 

10 hours ago, DND said:

5th: Can you recommend some good cheaper alternatives without compromising quality? I think a mobo with decent features and excellent vrm would suffice right?

The Asus Tuf at ~200$ is really good, same with the Gigabyte Auros Elite. Tho id probably avoid the latter. There were some issues with it. 

10 hours ago, DND said:

I have been using nvenc for those streams.

Thinking of switching to CPU encoding?

[DND]

13 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

You only need 550w PSU. Something akin to the Pure Power 11, 600w TX550m. MWE Gold 550w. Bitfenix Whisper M.

 

I've looked these up the pure power isn't available if i may ask this is from BeQuiet right? The TXM isn't fully modular, the MWE gold is available, the bitfinex isn't available also. If i also may ask can you recommend something from seasonic or other models from corsair?
 

 

13 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

 

 

Minimal speed increase and almost twice the cost. 

Corsair MP510, or maybe step down to a P1 or 660p tho those wouldnt be suitable for scratch drives. 

 

I've also looked these up the mp510 isn't available locally, the P1 is available though for around 100-120ish usd the 660p is only available at 512GB no 1tb variant. What do you mean by not suitable for scratch drives? I'm gonna use it as a storage for all of my games and make the my 2TB HDD as mass storage for documents,pictures, videos and etc.

 

 

13 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

The Asus Tuf at ~200$ is really good, same with the Gigabyte Auros Elite. Tho id probably avoid the latter. There were some issues with it. 

Oh yeah, the Asus tuf is one of buildzoid's recommendation on the gamers nexus vid. So the aorus elite has some problems? How about the aorus ultra though what are your thoughts?

 

13 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

Thinking of switching to CPU encoding?

Yes, somewhat wanna try to do cpu encoding strean. Though i'm perfectly fine with the quality of stream with using gpu encoding as of now with my gtx 1080

[GoldenLag]

6 minutes ago, DND said:

If i also may ask can you recommend something from seasonic or other models from corsair?

ï dont have anything in perticular to recommend from seasonic as their units have some issues worth avoiding untill you start paying quite a bit for their PSUs. 

 

if you must have from corsair, the rm550x is good same with the new RM units. 

8 minutes ago, DND said:

What do you mean by not suitable for scratch drives?

the P1 and 660p are QLC drives, and as such have bad write endurance. as such are not suited for intensive write applications. such as scratch drive that some applications use to pagefile to. 

10 minutes ago, DND said:

So the aorus elite has some problems?

early Bios issues or QC with launch boards. seem to have ended by now, but there is allways old stock laying around, so im, just being on the catious side. 

11 minutes ago, DND said:

How about the aorus ultra though what are your thoughts?

havent heard anything bad or good about the board. i know its decent, but 260$ is kinda an uninteresting price point for x570. or at least that is my impression of it. iirc the auros ultra is among the better at that pricepoint. 

13 minutes ago, DND said:

Yes, somewhat wanna try to do cpu encoding strean. Though i'm perfectly fine with the quality of stream with using gpu encoding as of now with my gtx 1080

you might be interested in the 3900x then. as the coreoverhead is rather significant. gameplay is unlikely to be affected when you have 2-4 cores available to do tasks. 

 

and really any of the Asus x570 boards and Gigabyte x570 elite and above have good enough VRM to do heavy overclocking with the 3900x or even 3950x. (yes this includes ITX boards). 

 

further note on Ram selection. you might save quite a bit by getting some cheaper 3200mhz crucial ballistics kits and doing a very simple Ram overclock on them . its E-die and it responds very nicely to voltage. 

[DND]

2 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

ï dont have anything in perticular to recommend from seasonic as their units have some issues worth avoiding untill you start paying quite a bit for their PSUs. 

 

if you must have from corsair, the rm550x is good same with the new RM units. 

Aight thanks for the recommendations. Maybe I'll choose between the MWE 550 gold or the RM550X. Oh btw another question sorry if im asking a lot, what are your thoughts on EVGA psus? I forgot there are some models available here.
 

2 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

the P1 and 660p are QLC drives, and as such have bad write endurance. as such are not suited for intensive write applications. such as scratch drive that some applications use to pagefile to. 

Hmm, I don't really understand much. But it would be just used as a mass storage for games would it be good enough? If i won't be going for gen4 I'm thinking of just getting the 970 evo plus m.2 though its somewhat expensive i think price is around 230-255$ depending on the retailer.

2 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

early Bios issues or QC with launch boards. seem to have ended by now, but there is allways old stock laying around, so im, just being on the catious side. 

 

I see, welp might as well avoid that board. Better to be safe than sorry.
 

 

2 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

havent heard anything bad or good about the board. i know its decent, but 260$ is kinda an uninteresting price point for x570. or at least that is my impression of it. iirc the auros ultra is among the better at that pricepoint. 

I see i might as well consider going the ultra rather than the elite if im going with a gigabyte board if i want a cheaper alternative to the master.

2 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

you might be interested in the 3900x then. as the coreoverhead is rather significant. gameplay is unlikely to be affected when you have 2-4 cores available to do tasks. 

 

and really any of the Asus x570 boards and Gigabyte x570 elite and above have good enough VRM to do heavy overclocking with the 3900x or even 3950x. (yes this includes ITX boards). 

I'm quite leaning on to just going AMD for my upgrade as of now, since it will be cheaper and the performance isn't that much different compared to going 9900k. The extra $ can go to other parts such as getting a better cooler or maybe get some better fans for my case since the H440 isn't really known to have good airflow. Though im still thorn if I would just go 3700x or 3900x but as you've said the coreoverhead would benefit me when streaming. As I tend to have other apps on while im streaming also one of the games i play which is Black Desert Online can be sent to tray when I want to just afk lifeskill in the game so it also gives the cpu some work while i play other games like dota and etc.
 

Quote

further note on Ram selection. you might save quite a bit by getting some cheaper 3200mhz crucial ballistics kits and doing a very simple Ram overclock on them . its E-die and it responds very nicely to voltage. 

 

Noted, I'll check out cheaper alternatives that is available. Though I do not have any experience in ram overclocking.

[GoldenLag]

8 hours ago, DND said:

what are your thoughts on EVGA psus? I forgot there are some models available here.

only model i know is worth considering is the G2. Superflower makes most of their units. G3 has issues and G5 has issues. bigger number sadly doesnt mean better. the G5 below 1000w (1000w model has issues) is ok, nothing great and worse than the other mentioned. 

8 hours ago, DND said:

I see i might as well consider going the ultra rather than the elite if im going with a gigabyte board if i want a cheaper alternative to the master.

might want to take a look at the X570 Taichi. its a decent "value", tho the chipset fan is apperantly inadequate on it and memmory overclocking apperantly isnt great. 

8 hours ago, DND said:

Noted, I'll check out cheaper alternatives that is available. Though I do not have any experience in ram overclocking.

you dont have to touch timings and subtimings. a simple frequency overclock on memmory is as straight forwards as CPU overclocking (simple CPU OC). as in, plug in a number and add some voltage (and by some i mean up to around 1,45 volts on the ram, no other voltage should be touched unless you know what you are doing). 

 

8 hours ago, DND said:

The extra $ can go to other parts such as getting a better cooler

would stick to aircoolers unless you really like the look of AIOs. their performance is identical and its just more reliable. 

8 hours ago, DND said:

If i won't be going for gen4 I'm thinking of just getting the 970 evo plus m.2 though its somewhat expensive i think price is around 230-255$ depending on the retailer.

samsung drives are usually overpriced, so im not surpriced. do you have a retailer i can look at?

8 hours ago, DND said:

But it would be just used as a mass storage for games would it be good enough?

yes, QLC drives are good enough for that. also they are good enough for OS drives. they should just be avoided in write intensive applications. 

[DND]

9 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

only model i know is worth considering is the G2. Superflower makes most of their units. G3 has issues and G5 has issues. bigger number sadly doesnt mean better. the G5 below 1000w (1000w model has issues) is ok, nothing great and worse than the other mentioned. 

Thanks, Maybe I'll just go with the Cooler master one or corsair that recommended btw the price of the both PSU's for the 550 vs the 650 is just like around 5-10$ for the MWE and 3-5$ for the RMx should I just go with the 650W? For some power overhead(Not sure if its the right term).
 

9 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

might want to take a look at the X570 Taichi. its a decent "value", tho the chipset fan is apperantly inadequate on it and memmory overclocking apperantly isnt great. 

I'll check it out thanks..

 

9 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

you dont have to touch timings and subtimings. a simple frequency overclock on memmory is as straight forwards as CPU overclocking (simple CPU OC). as in, plug in a number and add some voltage (and by some i mean up to around 1,45 volts on the ram, no other voltage should be touched unless you know what you are doing). 

I see so I just to dial in some numbers and voltages. So max voltages for the ram should just be 1.45V and I should not go past over that right? How do I see/check if the overclock is stable? Do it just not boot up to windows or do I need some application to test it out?
 

9 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

would stick to aircoolers unless you really like the look of AIOs. their performance is identical and its just more reliable. 

Well tbh I both like the looks of both as long as the AirCooler is somewhat big and beefy like the Dark rock Pro 4. So either is fine but if the DRP4 would be enough to give a decent OC if I may get the 3900X then I'll stick with it.
 

9 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

samsung drives are usually overpriced, so im not surpriced. do you have a retailer i can look at?

I see, here's a link to two retailers that i'm looking at https://dynaquestpc.com/ & https://awesome-table.com/-KrkkVbKZR_HZ2x8lsHk/view

 

9 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

yes, QLC drives are good enough for that. also they are good enough for OS drives. they should just be avoided in write intensive applications. 

I'm also quite leaning to just getting the Crucial P1 1TB I surprising came upon tech deals video regarding NVME drives and got a good grasp on how they perform. I am also quite sure that I don't really do some write intensive applications since I just mainly game on my PC and stream from time to time. Haven't really gotten into video editing yet but have done some video editing once in a blue moon. 

 

[GoldenLag]

2 hours ago, DND said:

Thanks, Maybe I'll just go with the Cooler master one or corsair that recommended btw the price of the both PSU's for the 550 vs the 650 is just like around 5-10$ for the MWE and 3-5$ for the RMx should I just go with the 650W? For some power overhead(Not sure if its the right term).

There isnt a major reason to do so. Id pocket the extra money. No consumer config will exceed 550w powerdraw regardless of what you do.

2 hours ago, DND said:

see so I just to dial in some numbers and voltages. So max voltages for the ram should just be 1.45V and I should not go past over that right?

Apperantly 1,5v is fine, but i suggest sticking to 1,45 on the Ram.

2 hours ago, DND said:

How do I see/check if the overclock is stable? Do it just not boot up to windows or do I need some application to test it out?

If it boots it probably fine. Due a mem test, you get those just by googling. And just do some general benchmarks. 

2 hours ago, DND said:

So either is fine but if the DRP4 would be enough to give a decent OC if I may get the 3900X then I'll stick with it.

No need to OC 3rd gen. Just enable PBO and set back. Most gains are through memmory overclocking and tuning. 

And DRP4 can handle the 3900x with ease. 

2 hours ago, DND said:

see, here's a link to two retailers that i'm looking at https://dynaquestpc.com/ & https://awesome-table.com/-KrkkVbKZR_HZ2x8lsHk/view

Crucial P1 seems like the best option.

2 hours ago, DND said:

I am also quite sure that I don't really do some write intensive applications since I just mainly game on my PC and stream from time to time.

Im pretty certain you wont have any issues. Just keep the drive at less than 80-85% capacity. You want that 15-20% overhead

[DND]

7 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

There isnt a major reason to do so. Id pocket the extra money. No consumer config will exceed 550w powerdraw regardless of what you do.

Thanks, I might just go with the RM550X then.

7 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

Apperantly 1,5v is fine, but i suggest sticking to 1,45 on the Ram.

I'll just stick with your recommended voltage to be safe won't go past 1.45V.

7 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

If it boots it probably fine. Due a mem test, you get those just by googling. And just do some general benchmarks. 

I see, is the memtest you are pertaining to is it those like memtest86 program? I have used it in the past and general benchmarks something like aid64,cinebench?

7 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

No need to OC 3rd gen. Just enable PBO and set back. Most gains are through memmory overclocking and tuning. 

So no need to adjust things like core clocks and voltages? The pbo and set back can be found in the bios?

7 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

And DRP4 can handle the 3900x with ease. 

I'll just stick with the DRP4 then AIO here are pretty pricey rn, I also like the look of the DRP4.

7 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

Crucial P1 seems like the best option.

I'll just go get the P1 then I'll save like 50% on ssd getting the P1 rather than the 970 evo plus.

7 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

Im pretty certain you wont have any issues. Just keep the drive at less than 80-85% capacity. You want that 15-20% overhead

Noted I think my games right now are just sitting below 500GB so the drive won't get full right away.

Edit note: BTW I'd also like to ask, do you recommend updating the x570 mobo bios right away after upgrading?

[GoldenLag]

4 hours ago, DND said:

I see, is the memtest you are pertaining to is it those like memtest86 program?

something along those lines yes. 

4 hours ago, DND said:

I have used it in the past and general benchmarks something like aid64,cinebench?

do some Aida, cinebench and a unigine superposition benchmark. that should be enough. not that sometimes benchmarks dont show its unstable. if it randomly crashes, it might be unstable. 

4 hours ago, DND said:

BTW I'd also like to ask, do you recommend updating the x570 mobo bios right away after upgrading?

depends on the age of the Bios, but id try to keep bios somewhat updated to the end of the year.