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I need a defintiive answer on whether short power fluctuations can damage hardware.

benjiven
By benjiven
in Power Supplies
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Posted

Lately inside my house there have been sort of mini brownouts. What I mean by this is that my light will flicker occasionally and twice it has caused my monitor to flicker. 

 

I have problems with my PC such as stuttering and input lag. I read On the Nvidia forums that someone was having brownouts and he couldn't solve his input lag and he believed it was caused by brownouts.

 

I need to know from someone who knows.

 

How damaging can these be, why would they cause input lag or stuttering issues.Is it possible tiny capacitors or transistors are damaged but the system still works but minute parts are damaged causing issues.

 

I have tried any sort of troubleshooting you will throw at me, I pretty much guarantee that from registry changes to obscure tweaks.

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Don't wait for an answer.Definitively prevent any issues by getting a UPS for your PC and call it a day and have peace of mind.

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Yes, HOWEVER, if you have a power supply made within the last 10 years, it likely has built in protections to prevent damage to your PC such as:

  • SCP - Short circuit protection
  • OPP - Overpower (overload) protection
  • OCP - Overcurrent protection
  • OTP - Overtemperature protection
  • OVP - Overvoltage protection
  • UVP - Undervoltage protection

 If you're still worried get a UPS.

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Just now, NinJake said:

Don't wait for an answer.Definitively prevent any issues by getting a UPS for your PC and call it a day and have peace of mind.

I will be with a new build in July. Sadly I'm going to have to scrap all of this build as the stress of troubleshooting is too great and time consuming. I can only assume that the brownouts do some sort of damage consistently to components causing some longer interval of connection that increases input delay

 

I still want to know.

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Just now, rcmaehl said:

Yes, HOWEVER, if you have a power supply made within the last 10 years, it likely has built in protections to prevent damage to your PC. If you're still worried get a UPS.

Could you elaborate a bit more, what would cause damage. I have an Evga g2 which is a tier 1 PSU.

 

What causes damage and where does it happen.

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Yeah it's pretty bad for electronics. A simple surge protector is all you need. The UPS BS is spread by a single person on the Nvidia forum with no valid proof to backup what he is saying. Yes UPSes do condition the power but PCs have many stages before they get to the GPU core or CPU that condition the power. 

▓ƆԀ▓ S▓₱▓Ɇ▓c▓s▓: i7 6ʇɥפᴉƎ00K (4.4ghz), Asus DeLuxe X99A II, GT҉X҉1҉0҉8҉0 Zotac Amp ExTrꍟꎭe),Si6F4Gb D???????r PlatinUm, EVGA G2 Sǝʌǝᘉ5ᙣᙍᖇᓎᙎᗅᖶt, Phanteks Enthoo Primo, 3TB WD Black, 500gb 850 Evo, H100iGeeTeeX, Windows 10, K70 R̸̢̡̭͍͕̱̭̟̩̀̀̃́̃͒̈́̈́͑̑́̆͘͜ͅG̶̦̬͊́B̸͈̝̖͗̈́, G502, HyperX Cloud 2s, Asus MX34. פN∩SW∀S 960 EVO

Just keeping this here as a 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1 minute ago, benjiven said:

I will be with a new build in July. Sadly I'm going to have to scrap all of this build as the stress of troubleshooting is too great and time consuming. I can only assume that the brownouts do some sort of damage consistently to components causing some longer interval of connection that increases input delay

 

I still want to know.

@rcmaehl covered it. There's your answer. As for troubleshooting, have you tried re-formatting your drive and reinstalling windows fresh to see if the input lag still persists? Are you using a wired mouse and keyboard?

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8 minutes ago, benjiven said:

Could you elaborate a bit more, what would cause damage. I have an Evga g2 which is a tier 1 PSU.

 

What causes damage and where does it happen.

Too much voltage/amperage. Your PSU will prevent this from happening since EVGA lists

  • OVP (Over Voltage Protection)
  • UVP (Under Voltage Protection)
  • OPP (Over Power Protection)
  • SCP (Short Circuit Protection)
  • OCP (Over Current Protection)

Adding a surge protector will help minimize this and a UPS will help provide constant clean power, but is overkill.

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4 minutes ago, rcmaehl said:

Too much voltage/amperage. Your PSU will prevent this from happening since EVGA lists

  • OVP (Over Voltage Protection)
  • UVP (Under Voltage Protection)
  • OPP (Over Power Protection)
  • SCP (Short Circuit Protection)
  • OCP (Over Current Protection)

Adding a surge protector will help minimize this and a UPS will help provide constant clean power, but is overkill.

Definitely overkill, especially for lower-end budget computer systems. But when someone spends 2-3k on a computer, an extra 100-200 to ensure you have enough time to properly shut down the computer in the event of losing power is pretty reasonable.

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Buying a 15$ surge protecter is good. I have a small UPS, but only for my NAS & router (I need wifi man xd)

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Do you know if power fluctuations are because of your providers issues or not? If not, I would recommend getting real electrician to check your houses wiring.

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A good PSU will filter out any dirty power going into your PC.

None of your components will get damaged from brownouts.

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, Firewrath9 said:

Buying a 15$ surge protecter is good. I have a small UPS, but only for my NAS & router (I need wifi man xd)

A surge protector does literally nothing except act as a breaker when there is a power spike.

It would not change anything here.

It does not interfere with the power delivery.

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Yes

 

but that problem by itself wouldn't cause input lag

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9 minutes ago, benjiven said:

Lately inside my house there have been sort of mini brownouts. What I mean by this is that my light will flicker occasionally and twice it has caused my monitor to flicker. 

 

I have problems with my PC such as stuttering and input lag. I read On the Nvidia forums that someone was having brownouts and he couldn't solve his input lag and he believed it was caused by brownouts.

 

I need to know from someone who knows.

 

How damaging can these be, why would they cause input lag or stuttering issues.Is it possible tiny capacitors or transistors are damaged but the system still works but minute parts are damaged causing issues.

 

I have tried any sort of troubleshooting you will throw at me, I pretty much guarantee that from registry changes to obscure tweaks.

 

Most of the problem I can see with brownouts is undervoltage on the input side of the PSU, which for a constant power load means more current is required. That is, power is voltage multiplied by current. If power is constant and the voltage drops, then the current has to go up. If the AC side of the PSU receives more current than it was designed to handle, plus some change, for extended periods of time, this will cause overheating which does lead to component damage if not catastrophic failure. A good quality power supply will do its darnedest to make sure the output side is clean, so I don't see how brownouts would affect the output side.

 

The only way I can think that would cause stuttering is the power supply the increased current causing enough problems on the input side that the PSU's power output is lowered, so it can't handle spikes of power as well as it could've. However, you pretty much have to be driving the power supply hard to begin with outside of a brownout condition.

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15 minutes ago, Enderman said:

A good PSU will filter out any dirty power going into your PC.

None of your components will get damaged from brownouts.

 

 

 

A surge protector does literally nothing except act as a breaker when there is a power spike.

It would not change anything here.

It does not interfere with the power delivery.

That's re-assuring. I'm guessing my Evga g2 has enough protection as stated in it's specifications.

 

So I can pretty rule out the brownouts causing the issues with my system?

 

Twice while plugged into a large surge protector there was an electrical arcing noise form the back of the PC, which I can only assume was the PSU andmy monitor flickered, but since that time the inout latency had gone away and then came back.

 

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12 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

 

Most of the problem I can see with brownouts is undervoltage on the input side of the PSU, which for a constant power load means more current is required. That is, power is voltage multiplied by current. If power is constant and the voltage drops, then the current has to go up. If the AC side of the PSU receives more current than it was designed to handle, plus some change, for extended periods of time, this will cause overheating which does lead to component damage if not catastrophic failure. A good quality power supply will do its darnedest to make sure the output side is clean, so I don't see how brownouts would affect the output side.

 

The only way I can think that would cause stuttering is the power supply the increased current causing enough problems on the input side that the PSU's power output is lowered, so it can't handle spikes of power as well as it could've. However, you pretty much have to be driving the power supply hard to begin with outside of a brownout condition.

Thanks for the answer.

 

If there was component damage would it only be on the PSU side and would it be and "on and OFF" sort of situation or could it possibly be incremental?

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1 minute ago, benjiven said:

Thanks for the answer.

 

If there was component damage would it only be on the PSU side and would it be and "on and OFF" sort of situation or could it possibly be incremental?

It would most likely be on the PSU side.

 

As for damage, it depends on what was damaged. But for a rule of thumb, it will just not work or you won't be able to apply any decent load on the PSU.

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45 minutes ago, rcmaehl said:

Too much voltage/amperage. Your PSU will prevent this from happening since EVGA lists

  • OVP (Over Voltage Protection)
  • UVP (Under Voltage Protection)
  • OPP (Over Power Protection)
  • SCP (Short Circuit Protection)
  • OCP (Over Current Protection)

Adding a surge protector will help minimize this and a UPS will help provide constant clean power, but is overkill.

Thanks for your answer that has put my mind at peace.

 

Any idea what could be causing the input lag. I am receiving what feels like V-sync on top of my mouse in applications when V-sync is either turned off globally forced off in game or otherwise?

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